Apple responds to reports of worn batteries forcing iPhone CPU slowdowns

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 173
    foggyhill said:
    There is no
    tradeoff, the battery simply cannot provide the peek power the app requires without destroying the battery. Only solution is throttling or tripping up so physical protection on the battery circuit and shutting.
    this has all to do with docs in phone getting more and more powerful and bursty

    this is a false controversy as is usual when it comes to Apple 
    I like Rene Ritchie’s suggestion:

    2/2: Personally, I’d prefer a one-shot pop up when the battery hits an age that trips performance degradation, so you’re informed and can go get the battery swapped out if you prefer. (Maybe even ignore if you don’t mind bad battery life.)
  • Reply 42 of 173
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 5,008administrator
    foggyhill said:
    There is no
    tradeoff, the battery simply cannot provide the peek power the app requires without destroying the battery. Only solution is throttling or tripping up so physical protection on the battery circuit and shutting.
    this has all to do with docs in phone getting more and more powerful and bursty

    this is a false controversy as is usual when it comes to Apple 
    I like Rene Ritchie’s suggestion:

    2/2: Personally, I’d prefer a one-shot pop up when the battery hits an age that trips performance degradation, so you’re informed and can go get the battery swapped out if you prefer. (Maybe even ignore if you don’t mind bad battery life.)
    Substitute the word "wear" for "age" and yeah, that's what we suggested.
    netmage
  • Reply 43 of 173
    foggyhill said:
    There is no
    tradeoff, the battery simply cannot provide the peek power the app requires without destroying the battery. Only solution is throttling or tripping up so physical protection on the battery circuit and shutting.
    this has all to do with docs in phone getting more and more powerful and bursty

    this is a false controversy as is usual when it comes to Apple 
    I like Rene Ritchie’s suggestion:

    2/2: Personally, I’d prefer a one-shot pop up when the battery hits an age that trips performance degradation, so you’re informed and can go get the battery swapped out if you prefer. (Maybe even ignore if you don’t mind bad battery life.)
    Substitute the word "wear" for "age" and yeah, that's what we suggested.
    I wonder how many average consumers would think if their phone is slowing down that it’s the battery causing the problem? 
  • Reply 44 of 173
    ben20ben20 Posts: 122member
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 45 of 173
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 5,008administrator
    ben20 said:
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    Nope, they still don't. iPhones with good batteries are still literally the same speed as the day they were bought. The new software is more demanding of the older hardware, but the hardware is literally still just as fast.

    The battery-induced throttle here is because of an iOS 10 update. Again, it's either the throttle, or a random shutdown because of a depleted chemical process in the battery.
    StrangeDaystmayracerhomie3netmage
  • Reply 46 of 173
    ben20 said:
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    That’s still not the case buddy, the phone would be deader without this so I fact really “slow ».
    now most along with you “fanboy” shit
    edited December 2017 ben20StrangeDaystmaypscooter63netmage
  • Reply 47 of 173
    Seems to me the choice is allow for full-speed all the time and the iPhone to conk out when under load, possibly taking the hardware with it, or throttling down when the battery is old or depleted.

    More transparency would have been good, though.
    The throttling makes complete sense.  The lack of transparency doesn't.  I had this discussion with my wife.  She says if Apple would have disclosed what they're doing people would have complained.  Which is 100% correct.  People complain. But they wouldn't be complaining about a perceived deception and underhandedness.  The cover up is always worse than the original action.  Had they said "this is how we're solving this issue" when they devised the plain, it would be a non-issue by now.
    ben20netmage
  • Reply 48 of 173
    k2kw said:
    mazda 3s said:
    I don't have a problem with the methods that Apple took. I have a problem with it not being disclosed. If you're going to put a device in "limp home" mode, you need to inform the user either with a notification (i.e. when an iPhone kicks into Low Power mode). I don't think that it's fair to dramatically cripple system performance and not say SOMETHING about it.
    It doesn’t read that way to me, that system performance is being dramatically crippled. It says only during peak loads which to me is not all the time and likely rarely noticed. The statements that people had to run benchmarks to verify seems to bolster that. 
    And here I was blaming the slow system on upgrading to the latest version after all those annoying messages.   It was really the hardware.

    maybe they need to hire some Tesla battery engineers.
    How the hell would that resuscitate a depleted battery, and how do you know it’s not what they’re doing now when it hits thermal or battery usage limits.
    people just say things and care if it makes any sense. If you try pushing you accelerator to the max on a heavily depleted Tesla you won’t get the same peak power so you are getting some throttling right there you would not see in normal operations.

    tesla doesn’t even make the core of the battery, so it’s not like they have access to a unique chemistry.
    edited December 2017 StrangeDaysmacxpressracerhomie3
  • Reply 49 of 173
    ben20 said:
    foggyhill said:
    ben20 said:
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    That’s still not the case buddy, the phone would be deader without this so I fact really “slow ».
    now most along with you “fanboy” shit
    I know facts are hard to take for Apple Fan boys. Look, Apple screwed up here. Big time. It's all over the news. I bet some lawyer is already coming up with a class action lawsuit.
     No, it’s not a “big time” screw up. Having your product set cars on fire and down aircraft is a big-time screwup, and so far that’s only been from the knockoffs. 
    edited December 2017 netmage
  • Reply 50 of 173
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 5,008administrator
    ben20 said:
    foggyhill said:
    ben20 said:
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    That’s still not the case buddy, the phone would be deader without this so I fact really “slow ».
    now most along with you “fanboy” shit
    I know facts are hard to take for Apple Fan boys. Look, Apple screwed up here. Big time. It's all over the news. I bet some lawyer is already coming up with a class action lawsuit.
    Since you're so concerned about facts, read the article again. But, this time for comprehension.

    Yeah, Apple screwed up, but not with the throttling. They screwed up because of a lack of transparency. The choices Apple had were deal with devices shutting down because the USER depleted the battery, or execute the throttling.

    What they should have done is told the user that the device was being throttled because the battery was chemically depleted. Also, I do agree that some lawyer is going to come up with a class action suit, but they'll lose, and lose big time, in the name of device management and user safety.

    Oh, and if you're going to report other users for their behavior -- you'd better mind your own.
    edited December 2017 macxpresstmayracerhomie3netmage
  • Reply 51 of 173
    ben20ben20 Posts: 122member
    ben20 said:
    foggyhill said:
    ben20 said:
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    That’s still not the case buddy, the phone would be deader without this so I fact really “slow ».
    now most along with you “fanboy” shit
    I know facts are hard to take for Apple Fan boys. Look, Apple screwed up here. Big time. It's all over the news. I bet some lawyer is already coming up with a class action lawsuit.
    Since you're so concerned about facts, read the article again. But, this time for comprehension.

    Yeah, Apple screwed up, but not with the throttling. They screwed up because of a lack of transparency. The choices Apple had were deal with devices shutting down because the USER depleted the battery, or execute the throttling.

    What they should have done is told the user that the device was being throttled because the battery was chemically depleted. Also, I do agree that some lawyer is going to come up with a class action suit, but they'll lose, and lose big time, in the name of device management and user safety.

    Oh, and if you're going to report other users for their behavior -- you'd better mind your own.
    Let's agree to disagree here, Mike. Name calling is not part of a open conversation and I will report it. 
  • Reply 52 of 173
    mazda 3s said:
    I don't have a problem with the methods that Apple took. I have a problem with it not being disclosed. If you're going to put a device in "limp home" mode, you need to inform the user either with a notification (i.e. when an iPhone kicks into Low Power mode). I don't think that it's fair to dramatically cripple system performance and not say SOMETHING about it.
    It doesn’t read that way to me, that system performance is being dramatically crippled. It says only during peak loads which to me is not all the time and likely rarely noticed. The statements that people had to run benchmarks to verify seems to bolster that. 
    this is also the likely driver of putting more 'low power' cores vs 'high-perf' cores in the latest A11 chip.  As the battery degrades, you only tweak the Hi-Perf Cores, leaving the 'every day' performance at a consistent level.
  • Reply 53 of 173
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 5,008administrator
    ben20 said:
    ben20 said:
    foggyhill said:
    ben20 said:
    macxpress said:
    jungmark said:
    The issue is Apple should’ve been for forthcoming on decisions like this. But it wouldn’t stop the conspiracy theories. 
    We all know Apple is doing this to make people upgrade to either an iPhone 8 or iPhone X. /s

    I bet there will soon be a lawsuit over this with some dipshit and some scumbag lawyer claiming this is what Apple is doing with no real proof what so ever. 

    Apple is damned if they do and damned if they don't. 
    They could at least let us know what they are doing. It's no secret for years that IOS updates slow down older device! There are plenty of Apple Fan boy who didn't want to here that, until now they get it from Apple LOL
    That’s still not the case buddy, the phone would be deader without this so I fact really “slow ».
    now most along with you “fanboy” shit
    I know facts are hard to take for Apple Fan boys. Look, Apple screwed up here. Big time. It's all over the news. I bet some lawyer is already coming up with a class action lawsuit.
    Since you're so concerned about facts, read the article again. But, this time for comprehension.

    Yeah, Apple screwed up, but not with the throttling. They screwed up because of a lack of transparency. The choices Apple had were deal with devices shutting down because the USER depleted the battery, or execute the throttling.

    What they should have done is told the user that the device was being throttled because the battery was chemically depleted. Also, I do agree that some lawyer is going to come up with a class action suit, but they'll lose, and lose big time, in the name of device management and user safety.

    Oh, and if you're going to report other users for their behavior -- you'd better mind your own.
    Let's agree to disagree here, Mike. Name calling is not part of a open conversation and I will report it. 
    And you should continue to report! 

    However, I expect many here suspect you aren't using the term "fanboy" as a term of endearment.
    muthuk_vanalingamnetmage
  • Reply 54 of 173

    macbootx said:
    I don't know how anyone can criticize Apple for doing this. I do think that they should have disclosed when this feature was added and how it works. But I would much rather my device slow down than shut down. If anyone is concerned about their phone slowing down, step-up and spend $79 for a new battery!
    I think the issue is "How do I know it's a battery issue?"   They could have built this a 'battery status' (and even hedged a bit and forced it 'green' until Year One Warranty is up;-) ) and given us a:
    -  'green' (all systems go)
    - 'yellow' (we're starting to occasionally limit your speed - maybe you want to sell this to a non-family member who doesn't know to check this setting)
    - 'red' (we governing your speed all the time... go get a new battery)
    idiot gauge in the Settings App 
  • Reply 55 of 173
    ivanhivanh Posts: 404member
    The article said "Apple is not slowing down older devices to convince users to buy a new one. If it did, the throttling would be permanent, and a new battery would not solve the issue."  I cannot confirm the first sentence, but I disagree with the assumption that "the throttling would be permanent", because it could be controlled simply by one or more parameters.  The fact is: Apple has admitted that the iOS coding has the ability to throttle down performance of older iPhones.

    My evidence and  personal experience has a proof:

    1. My iPhone 6 Plus was replaced by Apple on April 2017 due to a battery problem.  So, I could have assumed that the battery ageing not related to my iPhone 6 Plus.

    2. The iPhone was working fine, until 2 weeks before the launch of iPhone 8 and 8 Plus.  It was slowed down obviously, but not significantly.  Then after a week of 8 & 8 Plus on the shelf, the speediness returned.  

    3. The same story repeated when iPhone X was launched.

    4. My wife holds her iPhone 6 Plus on the day it was available in the Apple Store.  Her iPhone 6 Plus was the original, not encountering battery issue till now.  But her iPhone 6 Plus "coincidently" have had same slowing-down issues as mine.  I compared them side-by-side.  The Geekbench 4 results on both iPhone 6 Pluses did not have more than 3% variations over the period.

    5.  On 10 December 2017, we flied from Sydney to Brisbane.  A few hours after arrival, I noticed that both of our iPhone 6 Plus were consuming batteries much faster,  mine was at least 4 times faster!  it couldn't survive more than 3 hours from a fully-charged, even turned to battery-saving mode. The Geekbench 4 didn't show a hint.  BUT, a screenshot that usually took less than a second, needed 6 to 10 seconds from 10th-14th December during my stay in Brisbane.  (I missed many precious moments my daughter receiving her medical degree in the award conferring ceremony!)  

    6. Aftermath: After going back to Sydney, the battery consumption returned to normal, giving my iPhone 6 Plus over 8 hours of use before dropping below 30%.  And after I imported ALL the photos on the iPhone 6 Plus to the Mac, the Screenshot also returned to nornmal, i.e. within 1 second after I pressed the Power button and Home button together.

    Thus, my conclusion includes:
    I.  Whenever I go to a new city (the replaced iPhone 6 Plus had never travelled to Brisbane) the battery drains like waterfall.
    II.  The location services may contribute to the terrifying battery drainage, in new locations, seemingly collecting environmental data around.
    III. The more photos resided in the iPhone, the slower is the camera taking a new picture and the slower is the screenshot.
    V. The "Machine Learning" / "Artificial Intelligent" / Face Recognition algorithms might have very very big impact on the battery usage and UI resposiveness of older iPhones, e.g. iPhone 6 Plus. 
    V.  It could not be merely co-incidence that every launch of a new iPhone model, the 2+ years older iPhones models would slow down (on knee).  
    VI. Geekbench is not an effective benchmarking tools to explain the slowness and battery drainage.  Simply stop-watching time requiring to perform a screenshot (an iOS system function) can give iPhone users a better idea.
    VII. iPhone 6s was not affected.  There was no battery issue, no slowing down during my family trip.   The throttling drew a line to slow down iPhone 6 Plus, not 6s.

    I bought 2 iPhone Xs for my daughter and ... but just keeping the parents of her using the older iPhones.  What do Apple wants from us?   Apple needs to give me a better explanation.  


  • Reply 56 of 173
    I believe that regardless of the technical reasons, the reason that Apple secretly implemented it in this way  is simply to encourage you to buy a new iPhone. The business case for spending loads of time on this feature and not letting users know was approved, as it's good for revenue. Always follow the money. Apple cares more about shareholders.

    Apple should, if they cared about the users, should of had a toggle switch with a full and clear explanation.
    ZooMigo
  • Reply 57 of 173
    mike54 said:
    I believe that regardless of the technical reasons, the reason that Apple secretly implemented it in this way  is simply to encourage you to buy a new iPhone. The business case for spending loads of time on this feature and not letting users know was approved, as it's good for revenue. Always follow the money. Apple cares more about shareholders.

    Apple should, if they cared about the users, should of had a toggle switch with a full and clear explanation.
    If existing customers feel they are getting burned by Apple then that is not good for shareholders. Apple has no motivation to do this that would result in a positive outcome for the company.
    netmage
  • Reply 58 of 173
    Bacillus3 said:
    Why do GPS dependent apps like Waze perform worse in iOS11 ? I have no time for research / survey's, but wouldn't be surprised with some anti-competitive measure to have been taken "in the interest of he UX" "the customer", "the integration level" and alike objectives
    Anti-competitive?  You mean like apple not allowing Waze or Google maps on CarPlay?  Or like only Apple Music and no Spotify on CarPlay?  Years ago Microsoft got destroyed by FTC for monopolistic behavior like this.  When do they start looking at apple?

    I have an iPhone X but also bought a Pixel 2 XL because I want Waze and google maps on my car along with other features that Apple shuts down out of self interest vs customer centric strategy.  

    Would any of you apple fans here complain that apple has allowed you to use whatever apps you want on CarPlay?  Maybe you like  Waze, Google Maps or some other favorite third party app.  
    ZooMigo
  • Reply 59 of 173
    mvigodmvigod Posts: 172member
    mazda 3s said:
    I don't have a problem with the methods that Apple took. I have a problem with it not being disclosed. If you're going to put a device in "limp home" mode, you need to inform the user either with a notification (i.e. when an iPhone kicks into Low Power mode). I don't think that it's fair to dramatically cripple system performance and not say SOMETHING about it.

    Totally agree.  I had to buy a new iphone on the spot for my son after visiting the genius bar as his iphone 6 was shutting down at 40%.  I said his phone was slowing down and shutting down and being out of warranty my only option was a new phone.  

    Later our other two iphones had same shutdown problem which eventually got resolved with the throttling patch.  The phones were so slow though at around 2 years we had no choice but to replace both of those.  Had I known a battery would have fixed it I would have replaced that to buy at least another year on all 3 of our phones.

    I wish apple was more transparent about this.  This theory has been out there for so long now.  I've told people a year I was convinced they put sleep timers in the code to slow things down to force upgrades.  I think the throttling was to stop the shutdowns as they claim but they weren't exactly upset the side effect was a very slow unusable iphone forcing users to upgrade every 1 to 2 years for another $800

    I gotta think some class action lawyers mouths are watering tonight.
    cornchipmuthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 60 of 173
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 2,353member
    "It has been conclusively proven that older iPhone hardware with an adequately functioning battery is no slower than it was at launch."
    Stop promoting that PR article. The issue was never whether the CPU was being slowed. The issue was that the performance of the device under newer OS versions was lousy compared to the OS version the phone originally started with. The complaint is that iOS is growing more bloated and that adding questionable features helps sell more phones both by being carrot AND stick. The complaint is that Apple doesn't optimize iOS performance for prior devices (or at all, even, just relying on faster hardware).

    That PR piece defending Apple sets up a straw man to knock down complaints without ever addressing the real issue of iOS being increasingly bloated, version after version.
    r2d2larryamuthuk_vanalingamzimmermann
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