Just tried it. It's at the bottom of the page.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So it is... I tried to use the "find" function but it didn't find that text. Must have been searching the wrong frame or something.
I wonder if this guy knows something we don't? There certainly doesn't seem to be any evidence to back up his claim, and Motorola has been pretty blunt about getting out of the desktop processor business.
I wonder if this guy knows something we don't? There certainly doesn't seem to be any evidence to back up his claim, and Motorola has been pretty blunt about getting out of the desktop processor business.</strong><hr></blockquote>
This guy Peter Glaskowsky, who mentioned the G5 in the article, happens to be Microprocessor Report's editor in chief which is high enough up on the food chain for me. Note that I've also been told by someone that there is a G5 and the rumored specs (interger/floating) are close to how it actually performs. And so far, the confidential information I've got from this person has been right 100% of the time so I guess we'll know in a few months if he's right this time.
I remember reading somewhere about Motorola getting out of the desktop processor business. Maybe the G5 is the last one they're making?
I also read that Apple was one of their top ten PowerPC customers. Seems kind of odd to me that a company would throw away one of their top ten customers.
GPuL or not, Mot still has Apple by the balls unless IBM turns out something cool/cheap enough for Powerbooks, iMacs, eMacs, and even iBooks (g3 is just too slow, period).
If IBM supplies a GPuL to fill all these roles (excepting the iBook) or manages to add altivec to a Sahara to make an effective G4 replacement, then Moto just kissed away a big chunk of business. However, untill that time, Moto really only stands to lose their PM sales.
Apple still needs a chip for the rest of the line-up and Moto can take its sweet time supplying it.
<strong>GPuL or not, Mot still has Apple by the balls unless IBM turns out something cool/cheap enough for Powerbooks, iMacs, eMacs, and even iBooks (g3 is just too slow, period).
If IBM supplies a GPuL to fill all these roles (excepting the iBook) or manages to add altivec to a Sahara to make an effective G4 replacement, then Moto just kissed away a big chunk of business. However, untill that time, Moto really only stands to lose their PM sales.
Apple still needs a chip for the rest of the line-up and Moto can take its sweet time supplying it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Not if the rumors I've STILL be hearing about on the G3 front are true. I have been hearing stuff and the G3 isn't dead and while I keep hearing stuff I have always wondered WHY?! The only thing left (that I know of) that uses the G3 in any great volume is the iBook. So why is it that the Sahara and Sahara+ rumors keep turning up?!?!
Given MOT is a total bust and leaves Apple high and dry (BTW this isn't something I think would happen but to make the point lets go with it)
Apple Has 4 main lines umm eMac makes it 5.
1 PowerMac (could go DP 970's for all configs)
2 iMac (would be single 970's for all configs)
3 eMac (same as iMac)
4 iBook (is still a G3 so no harm no foul)
5 PowerBook (okay this could be a problem)
Only way to 'fix' the laptop issue would be to have some CPU that would have the following.
- Not come from MOT
- Speed range so PowerBook would have an advantage
- AltiVec can't move to a CPU that doesn't do it or PowerBook would look bad
- Laptop friendly
Well the G3 fits MOST of these already and if IBM is working on putting VMX (altivec) into the G3 and I mean REAL VMX not the stuff the put in for the GameCube and gave the Mhz a goose in the top end well the game is on.
The 970 shows us that IBM can do VMX and yes I still realize that it isn't 'confirmed' that IBMs VMX is a drop-in AltiVec replacemnt but lets say that it is. So putting it into a G3 could happen but it would only make sence if SOMEONE was gonna BUY the CPUs. Seeing that as of now iBook is they only thing that does... I just don't see it being worth it... If it were to be 'renamed' (can't keep the G3 name) and the changes I outlined above were made then BAM Apple doesn't have a problem and IBM has the volume it needs.
I'd say the bus of the PPC 970 is similar to the GX bus in the POWER4 only with a 2:1 ratio instead of 3:1. Doubt it is RapidIO or anything else. Apple might call is ApplePI but well...would you really want to go around marketing something called ApplePI?
Did anyone else notice that there was basically no mention of a SIMD unit in the press release? I guess it isn't that important but still...
<strong>Did anyone else notice that there was basically no mention of a SIMD unit in the press release?</strong><hr></blockquote>They actually did mention the SIMD unit, but I concur in the conclusion that they didn't seem to think much of it. That can be due to the fact that might be Motorola's baby? In the <a href="http://www.eetimes.com/semi/news/OEG20021014S0059"; target="_blank">EE Times artichle</a> they flat out state that it's AltiVec inside 970.
I don't see any problems here, Intel is already making pentium 4 mobile chips and they are not using SOI just 0,13 fab process. And pentium 4 chips have nearly the same numbers of transistors.
I guess that SOI 0,13 ppc 970 will have a lower watt consumption than the P4M, and nearly the same watt consomption than the current G4 of the ti book.
I guess also that the sahara 2 will coming soon for the i book. IBM has already the altivec technology : he will put it in the sahara 2 , a chip that appear in the roadmap long time before we eard of the GPUL (now called the PPC 970).
Hmm GX is 32bit... but is doesn't scale nearly as well in the Power4 (1.3GHz Power4 has a 433MHz bus). I would think it is dual Rapid IO buses (16+16bit) connecting to a single point controller. The 2 buses could be distanced enough to get to 900MHz without crosstalk in the lines.
<strong>They actually did mention the SIMD unit</strong><hr></blockquote>
As it turns out I am just blind. Long day I guess. I know from other insiders that Apple has no intention of leaving Altivec behind so I would be surprised if it was something completely new. Anyway not long now and technical details should appear.
Edit: I really can't spell, think or do anything right now.
Apple still needs a chip for the rest of the line-up and Moto can take its sweet time supplying it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
<speculation>
It seems unlikely to me that Apple would introduce two new and different chip architectures with one intended only for the low end. The R&D cost isn't justified when the g4 could easily replace the current G3 lineup. While its a good idea to audition next generation CPUs, the final 5% of QA testing and iteration are generally the most expensive. There are plenty of prototypes that never see the light of day.
Recent news makes it seem likely that the GPUL is the one that will make it out of the testing lab, while the others will probably not be pursued.
<strong>The only thing left (that I know of) that uses the G3 in any great volume is the iBook. So why is it that the Sahara and Sahara+ rumors keep turning up?!?!
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Just a note, technically, the processor inside the Nintendo Gamecube is a modified G3 and rumours are abundant that Nintendo and Hitachi are teaming up on some next generation entertainment device. Is it possible the G4 rumours you've heard don't relate to the mac world?
I'm Valerie G. Mallinson and I'm Bill Gates's hired PR writer."
Why am I posting this here? Light relief.
That and the fact I just found out that the GPUL is going to dish out a whole can of whoop ass 900mhz bus speed on Mr. Gates 'XP to Mac' non-switch campaign.
I hope Billy Boy likes it served hot...one GPUL coming up...
This retort was served up on Macweeks reply to article area...it was hilarious!
Lemon Bon Bon
(YEesh. And M$ can get away with this kinda boll*cks and still have 95% of the computer market? Shakes head...)
<strong>The current G4 has a FSB bandwidth of 1GB/sec. How about Rapio IO compared to IBM PPC 970</strong><hr></blockquote>
RapidIO in its current incarnation can do about 2 GB/sec, although it has room to grow. The 970 has aggregate bandwidth of 6.4 GB/sec (3.2 in each direction) at 1.8 GHz, and more as the clock rate climbs.
Comments
<strong>
Programmer,
Just tried it. It's at the bottom of the page.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So it is... I tried to use the "find" function but it didn't find that text. Must have been searching the wrong frame or something.
I wonder if this guy knows something we don't? There certainly doesn't seem to be any evidence to back up his claim, and Motorola has been pretty blunt about getting out of the desktop processor business.
<strong> Motorola has been pretty blunt about getting out of the desktop processor business.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Really? Were they ever really in the desktop business? After all, Motorola considers the G4 to be a "32-bit Embedded Processor."
<strong>
I wonder if this guy knows something we don't? There certainly doesn't seem to be any evidence to back up his claim, and Motorola has been pretty blunt about getting out of the desktop processor business.</strong><hr></blockquote>
This guy Peter Glaskowsky, who mentioned the G5 in the article, happens to be Microprocessor Report's editor in chief which is high enough up on the food chain for me. Note that I've also been told by someone that there is a G5 and the rumored specs (interger/floating) are close to how it actually performs. And so far, the confidential information I've got from this person has been right 100% of the time so I guess we'll know in a few months if he's right this time.
I remember reading somewhere about Motorola getting out of the desktop processor business. Maybe the G5 is the last one they're making?
I also read that Apple was one of their top ten PowerPC customers. Seems kind of odd to me that a company would throw away one of their top ten customers.
If IBM supplies a GPuL to fill all these roles (excepting the iBook) or manages to add altivec to a Sahara to make an effective G4 replacement, then Moto just kissed away a big chunk of business. However, untill that time, Moto really only stands to lose their PM sales.
Apple still needs a chip for the rest of the line-up and Moto can take its sweet time supplying it.
<strong>GPuL or not, Mot still has Apple by the balls unless IBM turns out something cool/cheap enough for Powerbooks, iMacs, eMacs, and even iBooks (g3 is just too slow, period).
If IBM supplies a GPuL to fill all these roles (excepting the iBook) or manages to add altivec to a Sahara to make an effective G4 replacement, then Moto just kissed away a big chunk of business. However, untill that time, Moto really only stands to lose their PM sales.
Apple still needs a chip for the rest of the line-up and Moto can take its sweet time supplying it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Not if the rumors I've STILL be hearing about on the G3 front are true. I have been hearing stuff and the G3 isn't dead and while I keep hearing stuff I have always wondered WHY?! The only thing left (that I know of) that uses the G3 in any great volume is the iBook. So why is it that the Sahara and Sahara+ rumors keep turning up?!?!
Given MOT is a total bust and leaves Apple high and dry (BTW this isn't something I think would happen but to make the point lets go with it)
Apple Has 4 main lines umm eMac makes it 5.
1 PowerMac (could go DP 970's for all configs)
2 iMac (would be single 970's for all configs)
3 eMac (same as iMac)
4 iBook (is still a G3 so no harm no foul)
5 PowerBook (okay this could be a problem)
Only way to 'fix' the laptop issue would be to have some CPU that would have the following.
- Not come from MOT
- Speed range so PowerBook would have an advantage
- AltiVec can't move to a CPU that doesn't do it or PowerBook would look bad
- Laptop friendly
Well the G3 fits MOST of these already and if IBM is working on putting VMX (altivec) into the G3 and I mean REAL VMX not the stuff the put in for the GameCube and gave the Mhz a goose in the top end well the game is on.
The 970 shows us that IBM can do VMX and yes I still realize that it isn't 'confirmed' that IBMs VMX is a drop-in AltiVec replacemnt but lets say that it is. So putting it into a G3 could happen but it would only make sence if SOMEONE was gonna BUY the CPUs. Seeing that as of now iBook is they only thing that does... I just don't see it being worth it... If it were to be 'renamed' (can't keep the G3 name) and the changes I outlined above were made then BAM Apple doesn't have a problem and IBM has the volume it needs.
Dave
Did anyone else notice that there was basically no mention of a SIMD unit in the press release? I guess it isn't that important but still...
<strong>Did anyone else notice that there was basically no mention of a SIMD unit in the press release?</strong><hr></blockquote>They actually did mention the SIMD unit, but I concur in the conclusion that they didn't seem to think much of it. That can be due to the fact that might be Motorola's baby? In the <a href="http://www.eetimes.com/semi/news/OEG20021014S0059"; target="_blank">EE Times artichle</a> they flat out state that it's AltiVec inside 970.
<strong>
5 PowerBook (okay this could be a problem)
Dave</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't see any problems here, Intel is already making pentium 4 mobile chips and they are not using SOI just 0,13 fab process. And pentium 4 chips have nearly the same numbers of transistors.
I guess that SOI 0,13 ppc 970 will have a lower watt consumption than the P4M, and nearly the same watt consomption than the current G4 of the ti book.
I guess also that the sahara 2 will coming soon for the i book. IBM has already the altivec technology : he will put it in the sahara 2 , a chip that appear in the roadmap long time before we eard of the GPUL (now called the PPC 970).
<strong>would you really want to go around marketing something called ApplePI? </strong><hr></blockquote>
"Anyone care for a piece of hot Apple Pi, good just like mama used to make..." sounds good to me
<strong>They actually did mention the SIMD unit</strong><hr></blockquote>
As it turns out I am just blind. Long day I guess. I know from other insiders that Apple has no intention of leaving Altivec behind so I would be surprised if it was something completely new. Anyway not long now and technical details should appear.
Edit: I really can't spell, think or do anything right now.
[ 10-15-2002: Message edited by: Telomar ]</p>
<strong>...
Apple still needs a chip for the rest of the line-up and Moto can take its sweet time supplying it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
<speculation>
It seems unlikely to me that Apple would introduce two new and different chip architectures with one intended only for the low end. The R&D cost isn't justified when the g4 could easily replace the current G3 lineup. While its a good idea to audition next generation CPUs, the final 5% of QA testing and iteration are generally the most expensive. There are plenty of prototypes that never see the light of day.
Recent news makes it seem likely that the GPUL is the one that will make it out of the testing lab, while the others will probably not be pursued.
</speculation>
<strong>The only thing left (that I know of) that uses the G3 in any great volume is the iBook. So why is it that the Sahara and Sahara+ rumors keep turning up?!?!
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Just a note, technically, the processor inside the Nintendo Gamecube is a modified G3 and rumours are abundant that Nintendo and Hitachi are teaming up on some next generation entertainment device. Is it possible the G4 rumours you've heard don't relate to the mac world?
mactivist.
(Microsoft's version of Ellen Feiss's switch ad)
I was writing a poseur switch ad on the PC. And then it was like...Beep Beep Beep Beep Beep Beep Beep! And then like half of my credibility was gone.
And I was like...huh?
It devoured my testimonial. It was REALLY a good testimonial. Then I had to write it again and I had to do it fast...so it wasn't as good.
It's kind of...a bummer.
(switched logo appears with this address)
<a href="http://216.239.39.100/search?q=cache:JmwQcVoG-ucJ:www.microsoft.com/insider/opsystems/windowsxp_setup.asp"; target="_blank">http://216.239.39.100/search?q=cache:JmwQcVoG-ucJ:www.microsoft.com/insider/opsystems/windowsxp_setup.asp</a>;
I'm Valerie G. Mallinson and I'm Bill Gates's hired PR writer."
Why am I posting this here? Light relief.
That and the fact I just found out that the GPUL is going to dish out a whole can of whoop ass 900mhz bus speed on Mr. Gates 'XP to Mac' non-switch campaign.
I hope Billy Boy likes it served hot...one GPUL coming up...
This retort was served up on Macweeks reply to article area...it was hilarious!
Lemon Bon Bon
(YEesh. And M$ can get away with this kinda boll*cks and still have 95% of the computer market? Shakes head...)
YES the apple g5 will come from IBM.
now let this abomination of a thread DIE!!!!!!!!!
<strong>ok ppl its confirmed now.
YES the apple g5 will come from IBM.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think it is quite clear that Apple will not use any chips from IBM; they are sticking with MOT for the long haul.
<strong>
I think it is quite clear that Apple will not use any chips from IBM; they are sticking with MOT for the long haul.
<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> You're a funny funny person.
<strong>ok ppl its confirmed now.
YES the apple g5 will come from IBM.
now let this abomination of a thread DIE!!!!!!!!!</strong><hr></blockquote>
There has been no confirmation by Apple, nor an official yea by IBM. So I guess that we have to keep this thread going until early 2004
<strong>The current G4 has a FSB bandwidth of 1GB/sec. How about Rapio IO compared to IBM PPC 970</strong><hr></blockquote>
RapidIO in its current incarnation can do about 2 GB/sec, although it has room to grow. The 970 has aggregate bandwidth of 6.4 GB/sec (3.2 in each direction) at 1.8 GHz, and more as the clock rate climbs.