I forgot to bring into attention this news. It is for PC laptops but it makes the need for progress in the performance sector of powerbooks even more imperative.
I forgot to bring into attention this news. It is for PC laptops but it makes the need for progress in the performance sector of powerbooks even more imperative.
From the article: "The chip will appear most often in consumer-oriented notebooks that weigh more than 7 pounds". Well, that rules out PowerBooks, doesn't it?
The Pentium 4M is a crippled, GHz-sells CPU anyway. As the article notes, the real performance monster "desknotes" use the desktop P4, and as long as it holds a real performance advantage over the 4M I don't see that changing.
The Pentium M (part of Centrino) is more of a threat IMO.
From the article: "The chip will appear most often in consumer-oriented notebooks that weigh more than 7 pounds". Well, that rules out PowerBooks, doesn't it?
Yeah, you will need some serious muscle to handle it
Driven by ever increasing requirements for additional networked bandwidth combined with the ability to handle new and even more complex software and services the PowerPC® architecture is changing. To meet these challenges, and provide the best price/performance solution, a variety of enhancements to the Embedded PowerPC architecture are being implemented and include an extension into 64 bit computing, highly scalable Multi-Gigahertz frequency capability, advanced power management, instruction level parallelism, thread level parallelism and SIMD acceleration. In this session, these enhancements to the PowerPC® architecture will be reviewed, highlighting the improved capabilities of PowerPC technology and the benefits to embedded solutions.
From the article: "The chip will appear most often in consumer-oriented notebooks that weigh more than 7 pounds". Well, that rules out PowerBooks, doesn't it?
That's too bad that Apple doesn't make a notebook that is over 7lbs, nor do i see a small chip changing that.
As much as I would like to see a 970 powerbook next week, it is not going to happen. First of all, I think that Apple will wait for the first die shrink of the 970 so that power consumption levels are better. Secondly, it seems to be too close to the unveiling of the 17 inch Al book to come out with a whole new motherboards. I think that having 970 powerbooks by Christmas is a reasonable guess.
I've read this over and over and can't figure out if it means these are in the current 970 or will be included in future versions.
That's all we know at the moment. It looks to me that this reference points to future generations, i.e. 980 or whatever else they call it. I believe that 6/23 will not bring 970 to powerbooks, although I would like to be surprised.
As much as I would like to see a 970 powerbook next week, it is not going to happen. First of all, I think that Apple will wait for the first die shrink of the 970 so that power consumption levels are better. Secondly, it seems to be too close to the unveiling of the 17 inch Al book to come out with a whole new motherboards. I think that having 970 powerbooks by Christmas is a reasonable guess.
The 17" model uses a logic board that is much more advanced than the old 15" model. Some examples; the 15" uses old sdram, which is now more costly than DDR, the 15? does not have FW800 and the 15? uses an older video chipset. To update the 15" to a new board with out the 970 would be stupid of apple because they would need to update it again when the 970s are out. That would be too costly. Would you like to buy a "new" 15" G4 PB only to see a 970 based BP roll out in the fallowing months?
By the time the 15 incher ships in volume (Late July? Hi, Apple...) then 970s will probably be out or imminent. What could have delayed the 15 incher from joining the 12 and 17 inchers? About 7 months over their original release at San Fran'. If was a case of an Aluminium shell and a 1 gig G4 processor then surely Apple would have had them out there already.
7 months to wind down Ti inventory?
7 months to tool up a 1 gig G4/Aluminium model?
7 months waiting for an Ati Mobility card when the 17 incher's graphic card would have done?
7 months to refine the production process that plagued the 12 and 17 Powerbooks?
Seems to me more like...
970s ahead of schedule and a that meant a shuffling of Apple's cards.
Hence, delay the 15 incher and re-tool and wait until sufficient 970s are in inventory to assemble said beast.
I think a 1 gig G4 Ti book is going to be very underwhelming for the 'Year of the Laptop'. More like 7 months TOO LATE! Speculation is rife that 970s are upon us. It would make more sense to delay the 15 inch 'Al' book until the 970 is in sufficient volume to do so. The 12 and 17 inch models will sell in the meantime. If they don't...that tells you alot about what Apple users are waiting for.
A 1 gig G4 15incher is ludicrous at this moment in time. On with the 970 already. They've waited this long...wait a few more months and ship in the Fall fer cryin' out loud. I think we'll get 970 laptops.
Laptops aren't really my bag. It's irrelevant to me, personally. I wouldn't want a 1.2 970 when I could get a dual 1.8 Tower.
At this sort of time frame I maintain my belief that by now, based upon what we know about a 'low power' 970 and a ramped up production of 970s about now(?)...is there any real reason why we can't see a 'G5' Powerbook other than 'convential' wisdom that doesn't hold up?
A 1 gig G4 Powerbook...but in a an AL casing (yawn). Okay. Maybe an Apple thing to do (look at all the iMac and eMac updates. Hardly electric.) but I'd have thought that at some point this Summer Apple's 'power' line is on the verge of transition to all 970 line of cpus.
It doesn't make sense to me to be any other way.
A 1 gig G4 Al book is nothing 'new' in my eyes.
Can you think of any reason for a 7 month delay? They made too many of those Superdrive Ti Books?
Some Mac heads who like their 'power'Books may not worry about the growing disparity of cpus apple/wintel. They may buy now and not jump out the window when a Powerbook 970 is release now/in Fall/early 04. But we do 'know' they're coming... It's just a place yer bets. Many rumour sites are going to lose their shirt...or not. Heroes and zeroes.
With 3 gig Pentium 4 cpu laptops just released...you'd have to wonder why Apple doesn't have a more compelling performance answer...
I find myself wavering back and forth on this lately. And I came to this particular thread to ask a question, BUT I see that it got mentioned a few posts above: if Apple released just an expected 1-1.2GHz 15" aluminum PowerBook this month (or even July) to take us through the remainder of 2003 (and even into the first quarter, give or take, of 2004), WHEN they decided to put a 970 in it, would that require any sort of redesign?
In other words, would they take all this time (7 months, as mentioned by Lemon) to release what most would consider a fairly pedestrian, "THIS is what we waited for all these months?" update to the 15" PowerBook.
I don't know. Hell, the 12" and 17" models are coming up on their 6-month mark. I spoke to this in my "are our expectations too low" thread, but it kinda fits in nicely with this: we'd never expect a complete, jaw-dropping "razzle dazzle" announcement or unveiling ONLY because, during the past 4 years or so, we really haven't HAD one. We've had some minor gaspers and cheer inducers (Titanium PowerBook, G4 Cube, AirPort, Music Store, etc.), but we just take our measly 100MHz bumps twice (maybe even once) a year and consider that "cool" and hype-worthy.
Maybe we're about to get an attitude adjustment?
I wish.
I asked this in another thread and didn't really get much of an answer: is there any reason, physically or engineering-wise that these new chips COULDN'T be put into the PowerBook? Does a 970 chip (or board or whatever the hell it all comes with/on) fit into a current G4-based product?
I know nothing about this sort of stuff, so I ask. Physically, would all this stuff occupy the same amount of space as the G4 and its components?
Lemon is right on one front, hands down: this whole "year of the portable" business has meant, so far, a 12" and 17" PowerBook at the first of the year. A 100MHz bump to the iBooks and a price drop. And a price drop on the 12" and 15" PowerBook.
Surely that can't be all that constitutes "year of the portable"?
And, as stated above, will anyone really give two shits about waiting all this time for a new 15" aluminum PowerBook if it simply sports the expected 1-1.2GHz G4? Especially if we KNOW what's coming? I mean, would people buy this in any numbers?
Some, sure. But true powerheads and those "in the know" would probably make due for another 6 or so months...and Apple could go another half-a-year with hardware not up to full snuff.
I would REALLY love for them to just drop the 970 into everything they could. Marketing, product grids, expectations and past practices and product tiering be damned!
Just start making the hardware as kickass and amazing as your OS and software! Jeez...
I wonder just how many 17" PowerBooks have actually been sold. I know tons of foot-longs have been purchased. But in regards to dropping a 970 in the whole PowerBook line, I think Apple would do it in a heartbeat if they had the CPUs on hand to facilitate it.
Screw people that complain; computers CHANGE! Stop moaning every time something better comes around and you're stuck with a lower product. Do you expect the company you bought your last car from to refund your money towards the new model? No. So I just wish people'd stop accusing Apple of ripping them off if a better proc were to appear in the PowerBooks sooner than later, especially owners of sought-after LapZillas.
I find myself waivering on this too. Not sure how to interpret it either.
WE've had this Ti for a long time now. And there really isn't much room to do a whole lot to it without also doing the same thing to the 17.
So, mebbe, in the interest of having one "classic" OS9x bootable pro-laptop Apple just kept the Ti around rather than debut a 15.4Al of essentially the same spec. The 12 and 17 are more like to "additions" to the PB line, rather than updates. I would imagine that it could be perfectly acceptable to put an Al style case (with the snazzy keyboard), totally revamped I/O, better battery tech, and a slight bump 1-1.33/1.4 depending on .13u G4's, and really that would make a pretty decent update, netting a cooler faster CPU with better battery life and better I/O and case design. I wouldn't even call it a redesign, just a matter of fitting a 17" Mobo into the 15" case and dropping in the 7457 (which is designed to drop into the 7455 slot)
In that sense, Apple saves a little design work, they could have well planned the 15.4 and 17 this way. We're really only talking a 1.6" difference in dimensions. If they knew from the outset, both machines could have been designed around a common motherboard.
Then there's this 970 that we hear so much about, and just mebbe it's possible to get some mobile grade CPU's out of IBM straight off the bat. NOT cheap though as some would imply -- it seems you just can't take a CPU and down clock it for mobile duty. You have to take the best of the bunch and own clock them beause they have to be able to switch at lower voltages than a slow desktop grade part. So, initially, it may be possible, but two questions arise.
1.)
Will there be enough to satiate (what I imagine will be a voracious) first quarter demand for PM's AND also a PB ??? These would have to be the very best off the fab, numbers may not be as high as we would like at first, even if the fab has been going for abit now.
2.)
How much would this mobile beast cost? It mightn't be possible to do at 1999-2599. Not for an initial roll out of a pick of the litter, 64 bit, laptop grade part. But at the 3299 price that a 17" demands that's another 700-1200USD to play with and certainly within the realm of possibility.
I would look for a G4 based 15.4" Al. Don't think of it as a minor update, Apple will sell it as, "all the goodness of the 17 at a new affordable price!" Then, the 17" inherits a 970 because its premium price can more easily absorb the new chip/motherboard costs, and sell it as "the first, 64bit, 17", widescreen, workstation, you're gonna so want one!"
Would it really be so bad to have
1-1.33(or more) Ghz .13u G4's in the 12 and 15Al and a 970 in the 17" ???
If the 970 shows up in a PB anytime soon, then the above is the most likely scenario.
I have a strange feeling they are going to do something across the board with everything when they do... 'this'
such as new ibooks with g4's new 15inch powerbook and new powermac. I bet they'll have both a g4 powerbook and a 970 variant. Possibly only in the 15 and 17inch? maybe only in the 17.
I asked this in another thread and didn't really get much of an answer: is there any reason, physically or engineering-wise that these new chips COULDN'T be put into the PowerBook?
Based on the information available, it's hard to say. I'd say that the low-voltage 970s could go into at least the 15" and 17" without too much work. The CPUs in there now aren't exactly frugal.
Quote:
Does a 970 chip (or board or whatever the hell it all comes with/on) fit into a current G4-based product?
No. The 970 means a new motherboard. The case, GPU and drives can be recycled, and possibly the RAM (if Apple wants a bottleneck there, or if the heat profile or battery life require one).
Quote:
I know nothing about this sort of stuff, so I ask. Physically, would all this stuff occupy the same amount of space as the G4 and its components?
The 970 is physically larger than the G4, and it requires a companion chip, where the G4 doesn't. There isn't a whole lot of space on the 15" 's current motherboard. On the other hand, Apple engineers are a clever bunch, and they've proven to be quite good at stuffing machines into unlikely spaces.
Quote:
I would REALLY love for them to just drop the 970 into everything they could. Marketing, product grids, expectations and past practices and product tiering be damned!
Historically speaking, the iMac follows the PowerBook pretty closely, and the PowerBook is not so far from the PowerMac - the engineering issues are basically the same, and from a "product tiering" perspective equating a pro laptop to a high-end consumer desktop is about right anyway. The exceptions as far as the PowerBook and iMac go were major redesigns (the first TiBook and the LCD iMac). The iMac was introduced as "this year's technology," back in the halcyon days of 1998. Even if Apple doesn't come roaring out of the starting gate with 970s everywhere, I maintain that there will be a fairly optimistic timetable for the iMac getting the 970 - if not, it will truly have fallen into a lower tier than it has generally occupied (the one exception being the stagnation while Apple tried to come up with the next generation machine).
I'd expect one no later than next MWSF, and that's being fairly pessimistic. The 7457 will be well suited to iBook / eMac duty, and if we see it anywhere in Apple's lineup it'll be there (and it'll be in the eMac only if Apple gets really aggressive about pushing it into the low end).
Hey, I'd buy the 12" PowerBook TOMORROW (G4 included) IF it had DVI, L3 cache, more than 640MB max RAM and other PowerBook-esque features (FireWire 800 and lit keyboard are sweet icing on the cake). Doesn't HAVE to be a 970, but I just want to know SOMETHING so I can attempt to plan/save halfway smart!
Right now I'm bouncing between 12" iBook, Rev. B 12" PowerBook (maybe), definitely aluminum 15" PowerBook (but maybe not because I'd rather sink that much money into the next-gen chip), etc. Do I just get an affordable iBook to take me through 2003? Get a 12" PowerBook and have a snazzy 12" G4 to last me well into 2004. Continue as is and just keep saving for a 15" 970 PowerBook (MWSF 2004?).
Basically, I'm in a sweet position that I'm going to be able to sock back some serious cash from now until December or so...enough to EASILY buy whatever the hell I wanted, come MWSF. Barring any jaw-dropping 970 PowerBook 15" unveilings in the next month or two, maybe I'll just do that? Hell, I'll have over $4000 come January...maybe I'll just treat myself to a 17" 970 PowerBook and paint flames on it.
Comments
Originally posted by neutrino23
Really? I looked through there and couldn't find anything like that?
Look here. They also mention SIMD acceleration.
Originally posted by PB
I forgot to bring into attention this news. It is for PC laptops but it makes the need for progress in the performance sector of powerbooks even more imperative.
From the article: "The chip will appear most often in consumer-oriented notebooks that weigh more than 7 pounds". Well, that rules out PowerBooks, doesn't it?
The Pentium 4M is a crippled, GHz-sells CPU anyway. As the article notes, the real performance monster "desknotes" use the desktop P4, and as long as it holds a real performance advantage over the 4M I don't see that changing.
The Pentium M (part of Centrino) is more of a threat IMO.
Originally posted by Amorph
From the article: "The chip will appear most often in consumer-oriented notebooks that weigh more than 7 pounds". Well, that rules out PowerBooks, doesn't it?
Yeah, you will need some serious muscle to handle it
Originally posted by neutrino23
Really? I looked through there and couldn't find anything like that? Can you be more specific?
Future Directions, 64-bit Multi-Gigahertz Embedded PowerPC's
by Jim Rogers, Senior Engineer PowerPC Products
Driven by ever increasing requirements for additional networked bandwidth combined with the ability to handle new and even more complex software and services the PowerPC® architecture is changing. To meet these challenges, and provide the best price/performance solution, a variety of enhancements to the Embedded PowerPC architecture are being implemented and include an extension into 64 bit computing, highly scalable Multi-Gigahertz frequency capability, advanced power management, instruction level parallelism, thread level parallelism and SIMD acceleration. In this session, these enhancements to the PowerPC® architecture will be reviewed, highlighting the improved capabilities of PowerPC technology and the benefits to embedded solutions.
Originally posted by Amorph
From the article: "The chip will appear most often in consumer-oriented notebooks that weigh more than 7 pounds". Well, that rules out PowerBooks, doesn't it?
That's too bad that Apple doesn't make a notebook that is over 7lbs, nor do i see a small chip changing that.
Originally posted by Bigc
Future Directions, 64-bit Multi-Gigahertz Embedded PowerPC's
by Jim Rogers, Senior Engineer PowerPC Products
... a variety of enhancements to the Embedded PowerPC architecture are being implemented and include ...advanced power management
I've read this over and over and can't figure out if it means these are in the current 970 or will be included in future versions.
As to whether or not Steve will announce 970 based PBs 6/23, at this point I'm kind of numb and will just wait and see (but I hope it happens).
Originally posted by neutrino23
I've read this over and over and can't figure out if it means these are in the current 970 or will be included in future versions.
That's all we know at the moment. It looks to me that this reference points to future generations, i.e. 980 or whatever else they call it. I believe that 6/23 will not bring 970 to powerbooks, although I would like to be surprised.
Originally posted by Yevgeny
As much as I would like to see a 970 powerbook next week, it is not going to happen. First of all, I think that Apple will wait for the first die shrink of the 970 so that power consumption levels are better. Secondly, it seems to be too close to the unveiling of the 17 inch Al book to come out with a whole new motherboards. I think that having 970 powerbooks by Christmas is a reasonable guess.
The 17" model uses a logic board that is much more advanced than the old 15" model. Some examples; the 15" uses old sdram, which is now more costly than DDR, the 15? does not have FW800 and the 15? uses an older video chipset. To update the 15" to a new board with out the 970 would be stupid of apple because they would need to update it again when the 970s are out. That would be too costly. Would you like to buy a "new" 15" G4 PB only to see a 970 based BP roll out in the fallowing months?
7 months to wind down Ti inventory?
7 months to tool up a 1 gig G4/Aluminium model?
7 months waiting for an Ati Mobility card when the 17 incher's graphic card would have done?
7 months to refine the production process that plagued the 12 and 17 Powerbooks?
Seems to me more like...
970s ahead of schedule and a that meant a shuffling of Apple's cards.
Hence, delay the 15 incher and re-tool and wait until sufficient 970s are in inventory to assemble said beast.
I think a 1 gig G4 Ti book is going to be very underwhelming for the 'Year of the Laptop'. More like 7 months TOO LATE! Speculation is rife that 970s are upon us. It would make more sense to delay the 15 inch 'Al' book until the 970 is in sufficient volume to do so. The 12 and 17 inch models will sell in the meantime. If they don't...that tells you alot about what Apple users are waiting for.
A 1 gig G4 15incher is ludicrous at this moment in time. On with the 970 already. They've waited this long...wait a few more months and ship in the Fall fer cryin' out loud. I think we'll get 970 laptops.
Lemon Bon Bon
Originally posted by Lemon Bon Bon
I think we'll get 970 laptops.
Lemon Bon Bon [/B]
I think you'll be crying into your tea.
w
I think you'll be crying into your tea.
I don't think so.
Laptops aren't really my bag. It's irrelevant to me, personally. I wouldn't want a 1.2 970 when I could get a dual 1.8 Tower.
At this sort of time frame I maintain my belief that by now, based upon what we know about a 'low power' 970 and a ramped up production of 970s about now(?)...is there any real reason why we can't see a 'G5' Powerbook other than 'convential' wisdom that doesn't hold up?
A 1 gig G4 Powerbook...but in a an AL casing (yawn). Okay. Maybe an Apple thing to do (look at all the iMac and eMac updates. Hardly electric.) but I'd have thought that at some point this Summer Apple's 'power' line is on the verge of transition to all 970 line of cpus.
It doesn't make sense to me to be any other way.
A 1 gig G4 Al book is nothing 'new' in my eyes.
Can you think of any reason for a 7 month delay? They made too many of those Superdrive Ti Books?
Some Mac heads who like their 'power'Books may not worry about the growing disparity of cpus apple/wintel. They may buy now and not jump out the window when a Powerbook 970 is release now/in Fall/early 04. But we do 'know' they're coming... It's just a place yer bets. Many rumour sites are going to lose their shirt...or not. Heroes and zeroes.
With 3 gig Pentium 4 cpu laptops just released...you'd have to wonder why Apple doesn't have a more compelling performance answer...
Lemon Bon Bon
In other words, would they take all this time (7 months, as mentioned by Lemon) to release what most would consider a fairly pedestrian, "THIS is what we waited for all these months?" update to the 15" PowerBook.
I don't know. Hell, the 12" and 17" models are coming up on their 6-month mark. I spoke to this in my "are our expectations too low" thread, but it kinda fits in nicely with this: we'd never expect a complete, jaw-dropping "razzle dazzle" announcement or unveiling ONLY because, during the past 4 years or so, we really haven't HAD one. We've had some minor gaspers and cheer inducers (Titanium PowerBook, G4 Cube, AirPort, Music Store, etc.), but we just take our measly 100MHz bumps twice (maybe even once) a year and consider that "cool" and hype-worthy.
Maybe we're about to get an attitude adjustment?
I wish.
I asked this in another thread and didn't really get much of an answer: is there any reason, physically or engineering-wise that these new chips COULDN'T be put into the PowerBook? Does a 970 chip (or board or whatever the hell it all comes with/on) fit into a current G4-based product?
I know nothing about this sort of stuff, so I ask. Physically, would all this stuff occupy the same amount of space as the G4 and its components?
Lemon is right on one front, hands down: this whole "year of the portable" business has meant, so far, a 12" and 17" PowerBook at the first of the year. A 100MHz bump to the iBooks and a price drop. And a price drop on the 12" and 15" PowerBook.
Surely that can't be all that constitutes "year of the portable"?
And, as stated above, will anyone really give two shits about waiting all this time for a new 15" aluminum PowerBook if it simply sports the expected 1-1.2GHz G4? Especially if we KNOW what's coming? I mean, would people buy this in any numbers?
Some, sure. But true powerheads and those "in the know" would probably make due for another 6 or so months...and Apple could go another half-a-year with hardware not up to full snuff.
I would REALLY love for them to just drop the 970 into everything they could. Marketing, product grids, expectations and past practices and product tiering be damned!
Just start making the hardware as kickass and amazing as your OS and software! Jeez...
Screw people that complain; computers CHANGE! Stop moaning every time something better comes around and you're stuck with a lower product. Do you expect the company you bought your last car from to refund your money towards the new model? No. So I just wish people'd stop accusing Apple of ripping them off if a better proc were to appear in the PowerBooks sooner than later, especially owners of sought-after LapZillas.
My rant is over.
WE've had this Ti for a long time now. And there really isn't much room to do a whole lot to it without also doing the same thing to the 17.
So, mebbe, in the interest of having one "classic" OS9x bootable pro-laptop Apple just kept the Ti around rather than debut a 15.4Al of essentially the same spec. The 12 and 17 are more like to "additions" to the PB line, rather than updates. I would imagine that it could be perfectly acceptable to put an Al style case (with the snazzy keyboard), totally revamped I/O, better battery tech, and a slight bump 1-1.33/1.4 depending on .13u G4's, and really that would make a pretty decent update, netting a cooler faster CPU with better battery life and better I/O and case design. I wouldn't even call it a redesign, just a matter of fitting a 17" Mobo into the 15" case and dropping in the 7457 (which is designed to drop into the 7455 slot)
In that sense, Apple saves a little design work, they could have well planned the 15.4 and 17 this way. We're really only talking a 1.6" difference in dimensions. If they knew from the outset, both machines could have been designed around a common motherboard.
Then there's this 970 that we hear so much about, and just mebbe it's possible to get some mobile grade CPU's out of IBM straight off the bat. NOT cheap though as some would imply -- it seems you just can't take a CPU and down clock it for mobile duty. You have to take the best of the bunch and own clock them beause they have to be able to switch at lower voltages than a slow desktop grade part. So, initially, it may be possible, but two questions arise.
1.)
Will there be enough to satiate (what I imagine will be a voracious) first quarter demand for PM's AND also a PB ??? These would have to be the very best off the fab, numbers may not be as high as we would like at first, even if the fab has been going for abit now.
2.)
How much would this mobile beast cost? It mightn't be possible to do at 1999-2599. Not for an initial roll out of a pick of the litter, 64 bit, laptop grade part. But at the 3299 price that a 17" demands that's another 700-1200USD to play with and certainly within the realm of possibility.
I would look for a G4 based 15.4" Al. Don't think of it as a minor update, Apple will sell it as, "all the goodness of the 17 at a new affordable price!" Then, the 17" inherits a 970 because its premium price can more easily absorb the new chip/motherboard costs, and sell it as "the first, 64bit, 17", widescreen, workstation, you're gonna so want one!"
Would it really be so bad to have
1-1.33(or more) Ghz .13u G4's in the 12 and 15Al and a 970 in the 17" ???
If the 970 shows up in a PB anytime soon, then the above is the most likely scenario.
such as new ibooks with g4's new 15inch powerbook and new powermac. I bet they'll have both a g4 powerbook and a 970 variant. Possibly only in the 15 and 17inch? maybe only in the 17.
Originally posted by pscates
I asked this in another thread and didn't really get much of an answer: is there any reason, physically or engineering-wise that these new chips COULDN'T be put into the PowerBook?
Based on the information available, it's hard to say. I'd say that the low-voltage 970s could go into at least the 15" and 17" without too much work. The CPUs in there now aren't exactly frugal.
Does a 970 chip (or board or whatever the hell it all comes with/on) fit into a current G4-based product?
No. The 970 means a new motherboard. The case, GPU and drives can be recycled, and possibly the RAM (if Apple wants a bottleneck there, or if the heat profile or battery life require one).
I know nothing about this sort of stuff, so I ask. Physically, would all this stuff occupy the same amount of space as the G4 and its components?
The 970 is physically larger than the G4, and it requires a companion chip, where the G4 doesn't. There isn't a whole lot of space on the 15" 's current motherboard. On the other hand, Apple engineers are a clever bunch, and they've proven to be quite good at stuffing machines into unlikely spaces.
I would REALLY love for them to just drop the 970 into everything they could. Marketing, product grids, expectations and past practices and product tiering be damned!
Historically speaking, the iMac follows the PowerBook pretty closely, and the PowerBook is not so far from the PowerMac - the engineering issues are basically the same, and from a "product tiering" perspective equating a pro laptop to a high-end consumer desktop is about right anyway. The exceptions as far as the PowerBook and iMac go were major redesigns (the first TiBook and the LCD iMac). The iMac was introduced as "this year's technology," back in the halcyon days of 1998. Even if Apple doesn't come roaring out of the starting gate with 970s everywhere, I maintain that there will be a fairly optimistic timetable for the iMac getting the 970 - if not, it will truly have fallen into a lower tier than it has generally occupied (the one exception being the stagnation while Apple tried to come up with the next generation machine).
I'd expect one no later than next MWSF, and that's being fairly pessimistic. The 7457 will be well suited to iBook / eMac duty, and if we see it anywhere in Apple's lineup it'll be there (and it'll be in the eMac only if Apple gets really aggressive about pushing it into the low end).
Right now I'm bouncing between 12" iBook, Rev. B 12" PowerBook (maybe), definitely aluminum 15" PowerBook (but maybe not because I'd rather sink that much money into the next-gen chip), etc. Do I just get an affordable iBook to take me through 2003? Get a 12" PowerBook and have a snazzy 12" G4 to last me well into 2004. Continue as is and just keep saving for a 15" 970 PowerBook (MWSF 2004?).
Basically, I'm in a sweet position that I'm going to be able to sock back some serious cash from now until December or so...enough to EASILY buy whatever the hell I wanted, come MWSF. Barring any jaw-dropping 970 PowerBook 15" unveilings in the next month or two, maybe I'll just do that? Hell, I'll have over $4000 come January...maybe I'll just treat myself to a 17" 970 PowerBook and paint flames on it.
I need a drink...