How long did it take for the g4 TiBook to come out after the g4 chip was released...was it about 9-12 months later? Just curious to when a possible g5 book could come out.
How long did it take for the g4 TiBook to come out after the g4 chip was released...was it about 9-12 months later? Just curious to when a possible g5 book could come out.
powermac G4 = september 1999
powerbook G4 = januari 2001 (about 16 months later)
i think apple will move heaven and earth to at least announce G5 powerbooks at mwsf2004 and earlier if they have to and can use a sort of "kanga" (pbG3/1997) workaround. but i doubt if that's technological possible...the fact that they just introduced (jan2003) new 12"/17"powerbooks is not a problem,
they introduce if they can.
the biggest problem is heat (and cooling)
but if apple needs a 0.09nm 970 processor too solve these problems PB could be right and we have to wait a whole year.
OK, so no new G5 PB's for a while it seems. But what if IBM have been working quietly on a smaller 970 chip that just hasn't been mentioned yet?
Meanwhile will Apple leave the 15" as it is for much longer or wait until G5 to update it? Reports say that 15.4" screen are on the way in the 2nd half of this year (anytime from now until christmas then), prices of the 12 and 15" are down and people are saying there aren't all that many 15" PB's around in the stores.
I can accept the reasoning for a delayed G5 PowerBook, but will they update the 15" soon, just to bring it in line with the rest of the range.
I need a new laptop, preferably before September, what should I do? I can't afford the 17", the 12" is a little too small for my liking and the 15" doesn't have bluetooth built-in or support for Airport Extreme among other things.
that 3ghz in 12 months is a subtle hint. It will take at least that long.
Obviously, power consumption, heat and price of the PPC970 were all not as favorable as we wanted to believe. Luckily, the performance is, and then some.
but if apple needs a 0.09nm 970 processor too solve these problems PB could be right and we have to wait a whole year.
I believe so. If the 0.13 micron chips need that much cooling, it's unlikely we'll ever see it in a notebook. What does this mean for the iBook? As long as PB is stuck with the G4, we'll be seeing the G3 iBook (the caboose of Apple hardware) for a long, long time.
that 3ghz in 12 months is a subtle hint. It will take at least that long.
Obviously, power consumption, heat and price of the PPC970 were all not as favorable as we wanted to believe. Luckily, the performance is, and then some.
The Chip itself is probably relatively cheap, its the rest that probably drive up the price along with fancy shmancy newness. New case with new cooling system (9 fans and a different controller), new Apple designed controller, New mobo, new memory... all these things add up and have to be amortized over the first 3 years at the longest.
We are forgetting that Mot are still lining up to deliver the .13 G4 with larger L2 cache sometime soon.
I would actually be quite happy with a machine with this in, giving a probable Hz boost, a drop in power, and a solid 10-15% speed boost from the L2 increase.
Perhaps this is just round the corner, but Apple doesn't want to colour the announcement of the G5 by announcing a new G4 laptop with similar timing.
If a 970 laptop was so far away, on the other hand, then you would have thought that Apple would have made an update to the 15" before announcing the g5 desktop, they can't leave the 15" in it's current form for another 6 months or more can they?
Like you say, there are lots of costs to recoup. For the first 3-6 months pros will buy the PM G5 in droves and help get back someof the costs. After that we'll see. The way it was explained to me you can't exactly down clock a chip and stick it in a laptop. You need to ge the best chips because they need to be able to switch at a lower voltage. Right now, and for the next little while, all the best chips will be finding their way into the PM G5 and turning a nice little profit on each machine.
9 fans.
It'll make it into a laptop. Price needed even be the issue as the top end config didn't budge regardless of the inclusion of the G5, but the engineering costs of the whole system probably will be, and the Powerbooks don't have the margin to spare that the PM's had. It will take a while and trickle down form the 17 to the 15 and mebbe eventually to the 12.
We are forgetting that Mot are still lining up to deliver the .13 G4 with larger L2 cache sometime soon.
I would actually be quite happy with a machine with this in, giving a probable Hz boost, a drop in power, and a solid 10-15% speed boost from the L2 increase.
I agree, I wouldn't mind a new G4 PowerBook in the mean time, trouble is would they sell? Everyone would probably be holding out for a G5 PowerBook.
Myself, I think I'd get one, although I would be dissapointed when the new signicantly faster laptops arrive. But as we know in computing, there's always a faster computer around the corner
1. Note how the 970's low-end was supposed to be 1.2Ghz, but the lowest 970 Apple uses now is 1.6Ghz.
2. The 970 is 19W at 1.2Ghz.
3. The current G4 is 21W at 1Ghz.
4. The next G4 is 7.5W at 1 Ghz.
It seems to me that the lower-end 970 is at least as good of a laptop chip as the current .18 G4 7455, and Apple certainly could do it now if they wanted to spend the bucks. The 7457 will be much better than the current 7455, though, and so they may go another round or two with those, especially because the new G4 will be a drop-in replacement for the current G4, compared to the 970 which obviously will not be.
Regarding heat, I'd wager most of it is being produced by other things like 7200rpm SATA drives and graphics cards. 9 fans is too keep it cool at a low dB level.
A 1GHz G5 would still scream along at under 19W, it has to be worth doing.
I agree, I wouldn't mind a new G4 PowerBook in the mean time, trouble is would they sell? Everyone would probably be holding out for a G5 PowerBook.
I'd buy one immediately (I'm in the market for a new PowerBook). If the 7457 arrived, I think we could make a guess that Apple would stick with the improved G4 in the PowerBook and iMac for a while.
I don't know. I'm no expert on what IBM or Motorola are working on. But they could have been working on a portable version alongside the version in the new G5 PowerMacs for some time meaning a new G5 chip for PB soon.
I know I'm being incredibly optimistic here and I myself would be supprised if this happened anytime soon. In the meantime I am in favour of a update to the G4 with the introduction of the 7457. But who knows!
Outright scream along performance, while nice, is not likely to be realistic in a laptop. Though the 970 looks to be downright frugal compared to the 64 bit offerings from AMD and intel, it's probably still a stretch. If a '57 from Mot can make the PB's fast enough for a laptop while giving a big boost to battery life and beinga relatively cheap drop in, I would be pretty happy with that for another 12 months.
Remember also that the 970 needs a companion chip (designed by Apple) and this may not be suitable to laptop demands ATM.
I would never say never, but I really think it's going to take at least untill '04, and even then, the PB line itself will use both chips.
My money is on the 17 getting it exclusively, if only for a little while. Then the 15, and I think ONLY @ .09, the 12.
Would designing a PowerBook motherboard to handle the faster FSB of the G5 (600MHz for a 1.2GHz G5) result in more power consumption by components other than the processor itself?
Asked another way, is comparing the 21W for a 1GHz G4 to the 19W of a 1.2GHz G5 sufficient for getting a reasonable picture of overall system power consumption?
The 980 is a derivative of the POWER5. The die-shrunk 970 will still be a 970, from what I understand.
Well, here's something from the horse's mouth, as it were: Greg Joswiak in Maccentral...
"Motorola is huge for us. Our partnership with Motorola is not going away, G4s are in every other part of our product line. As you can see, [the G5] is not going in a PowerBook anytime soon. Motorola remains very important to us, but IBM is the one that can take us to the next level."
That's exactly what I've thinking the past day or two. I'm not holding out for a G5 PowerBook because I just think it's a little ways down the road.
But good googley moogley, I wish they'd hurry up and wrap that 15" in the aluminum shell and give it all the updated goodies (Bluetooth, AirPort Extreme, FireWire 800, etc.) already!
Apple: "G5 not going in a PowerBook anytime soon."
Jun 24, 03 | 11:30 am ? MacCentral has published an interview with Greg Joswiak, Apple's vice president of Hardware Product Marketing: "Motorola is huge for us," said Joswiak. "Our partnership with Motorola is not going away, G4s are in every other part of our product line. As you can see, [the G5] is not going in a PowerBook anytime soon. Motorola remains very important to us...
Comments
Originally posted by marloe
Just curious to when a possible g5 book could come out.
12 months at least from now. I would be really surprised to see them in January.
Originally posted by marloe
How long did it take for the g4 TiBook to come out after the g4 chip was released...was it about 9-12 months later? Just curious to when a possible g5 book could come out.
powermac G4 = september 1999
powerbook G4 = januari 2001 (about 16 months later)
i think apple will move heaven and earth to at least announce G5 powerbooks at mwsf2004 and earlier if they have to and can use a sort of "kanga" (pbG3/1997) workaround. but i doubt if that's technological possible...the fact that they just introduced (jan2003) new 12"/17"powerbooks is not a problem,
they introduce if they can.
the biggest problem is heat (and cooling)
but if apple needs a 0.09nm 970 processor too solve these problems PB could be right and we have to wait a whole year.
Meanwhile will Apple leave the 15" as it is for much longer or wait until G5 to update it? Reports say that 15.4" screen are on the way in the 2nd half of this year (anytime from now until christmas then), prices of the 12 and 15" are down and people are saying there aren't all that many 15" PB's around in the stores.
I can accept the reasoning for a delayed G5 PowerBook, but will they update the 15" soon, just to bring it in line with the rest of the range.
I need a new laptop, preferably before September, what should I do? I can't afford the 17", the 12" is a little too small for my liking and the 15" doesn't have bluetooth built-in or support for Airport Extreme among other things.
Obviously, power consumption, heat and price of the PPC970 were all not as favorable as we wanted to believe. Luckily, the performance is, and then some.
Originally posted by gar
but if apple needs a 0.09nm 970 processor too solve these problems PB could be right and we have to wait a whole year.
I believe so. If the 0.13 micron chips need that much cooling, it's unlikely we'll ever see it in a notebook. What does this mean for the iBook? As long as PB is stuck with the G4, we'll be seeing the G3 iBook (the caboose of Apple hardware) for a long, long time.
Originally posted by Matsu
that 3ghz in 12 months is a subtle hint. It will take at least that long.
Obviously, power consumption, heat and price of the PPC970 were all not as favorable as we wanted to believe. Luckily, the performance is, and then some.
The Chip itself is probably relatively cheap, its the rest that probably drive up the price along with fancy shmancy newness. New case with new cooling system (9 fans and a different controller), new Apple designed controller, New mobo, new memory... all these things add up and have to be amortized over the first 3 years at the longest.
I would actually be quite happy with a machine with this in, giving a probable Hz boost, a drop in power, and a solid 10-15% speed boost from the L2 increase.
Perhaps this is just round the corner, but Apple doesn't want to colour the announcement of the G5 by announcing a new G4 laptop with similar timing.
If a 970 laptop was so far away, on the other hand, then you would have thought that Apple would have made an update to the 15" before announcing the g5 desktop, they can't leave the 15" in it's current form for another 6 months or more can they?
9 fans.
It'll make it into a laptop. Price needed even be the issue as the top end config didn't budge regardless of the inclusion of the G5, but the engineering costs of the whole system probably will be, and the Powerbooks don't have the margin to spare that the PM's had. It will take a while and trickle down form the 17 to the 15 and mebbe eventually to the 12.
Originally posted by danmanix
We are forgetting that Mot are still lining up to deliver the .13 G4 with larger L2 cache sometime soon.
I would actually be quite happy with a machine with this in, giving a probable Hz boost, a drop in power, and a solid 10-15% speed boost from the L2 increase.
I agree, I wouldn't mind a new G4 PowerBook in the mean time, trouble is would they sell? Everyone would probably be holding out for a G5 PowerBook.
Myself, I think I'd get one, although I would be dissapointed when the new signicantly faster laptops arrive. But as we know in computing, there's always a faster computer around the corner
2. The 970 is 19W at 1.2Ghz.
3. The current G4 is 21W at 1Ghz.
4. The next G4 is 7.5W at 1 Ghz.
It seems to me that the lower-end 970 is at least as good of a laptop chip as the current .18 G4 7455, and Apple certainly could do it now if they wanted to spend the bucks. The 7457 will be much better than the current 7455, though, and so they may go another round or two with those, especially because the new G4 will be a drop-in replacement for the current G4, compared to the 970 which obviously will not be.
A 1GHz G5 would still scream along at under 19W, it has to be worth doing.
Originally posted by dnisbet
I agree, I wouldn't mind a new G4 PowerBook in the mean time, trouble is would they sell? Everyone would probably be holding out for a G5 PowerBook.
I'd buy one immediately (I'm in the market for a new PowerBook). If the 7457 arrived, I think we could make a guess that Apple would stick with the improved G4 in the PowerBook and iMac for a while.
Originally posted by dnisbet
OK, so no new G5 PB's for a while it seems. But what if IBM have been working quietly on a smaller 970 chip that just hasn't been mentioned yet?
Isn't that the 980, or am I mixed up?
Originally posted by Clive
Isn't that the 980, or am I mixed up?
I don't know. I'm no expert on what IBM or Motorola are working on. But they could have been working on a portable version alongside the version in the new G5 PowerMacs for some time meaning a new G5 chip for PB soon.
I know I'm being incredibly optimistic here and I myself would be supprised if this happened anytime soon. In the meantime I am in favour of a update to the G4 with the introduction of the 7457. But who knows!
Remember also that the 970 needs a companion chip (designed by Apple) and this may not be suitable to laptop demands ATM.
I would never say never, but I really think it's going to take at least untill '04, and even then, the PB line itself will use both chips.
My money is on the 17 getting it exclusively, if only for a little while. Then the 15, and I think ONLY @ .09, the 12.
Asked another way, is comparing the 21W for a 1GHz G4 to the 19W of a 1.2GHz G5 sufficient for getting a reasonable picture of overall system power consumption?
Originally posted by Clive
Isn't that the 980, or am I mixed up?
The 980 is a derivative of the POWER5. The die-shrunk 970 will still be a 970, from what I understand.
Well, here's something from the horse's mouth, as it were: Greg Joswiak in Maccentral...
"Motorola is huge for us. Our partnership with Motorola is not going away, G4s are in every other part of our product line. As you can see, [the G5] is not going in a PowerBook anytime soon. Motorola remains very important to us, but IBM is the one that can take us to the next level."
But good googley moogley, I wish they'd hurry up and wrap that 15" in the aluminum shell and give it all the updated goodies (Bluetooth, AirPort Extreme, FireWire 800, etc.) already!
I is gettin' IMPATIENT!
Apple: "G5 not going in a PowerBook anytime soon."
Jun 24, 03 | 11:30 am ? MacCentral has published an interview with Greg Joswiak, Apple's vice president of Hardware Product Marketing: "Motorola is huge for us," said Joswiak. "Our partnership with Motorola is not going away, G4s are in every other part of our product line. As you can see, [the G5] is not going in a PowerBook anytime soon. Motorola remains very important to us...
http://maccentral.macworld.com/news/2003/06/24/future/