Actually I've seen these things go for < $1,000 used at the local GC. They had two Conklin 7 strings for the longest time. I believe they aren't that unaffordable. In fact there are 2 Conklin 7 string basses for sale on Ebay right now and the bids are at $650 & 700 US.
Ummm... yeah. But I went to college 92-96. They were much less common back then. The used fretless 7-string I wanted was going for $1500, and that was insanely cheap. In today's dollars that's probably close to $3000. A little much for a college kid putting himself through school to spend on a hobby.
If I get back into playing, I might take a look at what's out there. But I came to love my 4-string (which needs new strings desperately now), and began to believe that, for most people, 6- and 7-strings were a way around lack of skill, and a way to impress people who didn't know better. Plus, I have like responsibilities and stuff now (family, mortage, car payment, bills, etc.), so $700 is not something I can just drop on a whim.
Totally dude (I'm WillPlay4Food over there)! I can't wait to plug my Schecter Stiletto Studio 4 into GB! I've only been playing for about 2 years but I totally love the low end!
A lot of people have misconceptions about extended range basses "oh they're not really a bass" "the player must really suck if he needs all those strings to get noticed" "he must be compensating for something"...etc.
but really, When you look at it, JT(the owner of those basses) has all the range of a 4 string bass in first position. for some people, that's reason enough to buy a 7 or 8 string. So that they can think vertically and not horizontally.
Totally dude (I'm WillPlay4Food over there)! I can't wait to plug my Schecter Stiletto Studio 4 into GB! I've only been playing for about 2 years but I totally love the low end!
yeah, I'm wrong robot, heh, in case you didn't guess
How much better is the Grand Piano in the Jam Pack than the on included with GarageBand?
Well, we won't know till we hear them(I wish apple had included sound bytes on their GB page) But on stage didn't steve say that the built-in one was a $50,000 grand and the jam pack one was a $150,000 grand?
eh...not that that really tells you anything, For all you know you might prefer the default one, just depends what you are going for and all that.
Yes! In addition to some sound samples on Apple's GarageBand page, I'd also like (even if only in the form of a downloadable PDF) a complete listing of the instruments included (as well as the additional ones in JamPack).
I've scrutinized those little icons in the GarageBand section of Apple's site half a bazillion times and I want to see some new instruments!
Although, the ones I've seen have been very exciting. Two in particular - bagpipes and a pedal steel - have me all torqued up for next Friday!
Oh, and here's a question that Wrong Robot or someone can answer (and again, I'm SO new to all this digital stuff, so forgive me if this is an idiotic question).
I don't doubt my ability to get some nice strings and keyboard types of sounds from playing keyboards (chording, held notes, backgrounds, etc.).
But, being a guitarist first and foremost, what I'd REALLY dig is the ability (with the guitar and amp samples) is to be able to plug in an electric guitar and "play" bass lines or sax solo parts or whatever.
In other words, my lead/solo abilities are MUCH better on a guitar, as is my bass playing. I'd love to be able to lay down a bass line using, say, that cool jazzy stand-up bass instrument, BUT play it on a guitar neck as opposed to a keyboard.
Is this possible? Would this, I'm guessing, require some sort of guitar with a MIDI interface or capability? THAT would be the best of both worlds! Strings, horns, choir, piano, organs, etc. played on the keyboards, accessing all those instrument sounds. Guitar, bass, single-note stuff, solos, etc. played on a guitar (and accessing all those instrument sounds).
yeah, see, with the Guitar audio, or any audio for that matter, all you can do is manipulate the audio feed. With MIDI, it is data and no audio and that is how you can make it into different instruments.
You are right, a Guitar that could translate the way you play into data, it would be great for you. I don't know if that exists.
Well, I'll say this: if this DOESN'T exist, them some company should step up and make a $99-149 guitar (like that m-audio e49 keyboard...no frills, simple and affordable) that is made to work with GarageBand.
Looks aren't important, nor is weight and - I'd imagine - pickups, body wood, etc. since, like the m-audio keyboard I'm getting, it's next to useless unless hooked to a computer or whatnot and accesses its sounds from the GarageBand instrument library.
How cool would it be to plug in a guitar like this AND in addition to dialing up a, say, "British Invasion" amp setting, you can also dial in, for example, "1960's Rickenbacker 12-string" or "1953 Fender Telecaster".
I know Line 6 makes a modeling guitar called Variax. I'm not sure how expensive they are. Probably quite a bit, since all the tech is onboard.
With GarageBand, it's all in the software, so you just need a fingerboard, strings, maybe a volume knob, decent bridge and tuners, 6 strings and a USB connection.
Plug it, as with that e49 keyboard, right into your Mac and become Ace Frehley, George Benson or whoever.
pscates: you can buy special pickups that convert pitch into MIDI data, that can then go to the synthesizer and come out bagpipes or whatever. Or you can buy special guitars I think that have that built in. I'd be interested in the results of your research into how much it all costs.
msantti: No special guitar, and Apple says you can plug your guitar right into your Mac, but there's some debate about how good that will sound. If that doesn't work very well, and Apple marketing is just lying, then your, uh, "friend" can get an audio interface to go between the guitar and the Mac for about $50 and up.
Originally posted by BRussell pscates: you can buy special pickups that convert pitch into MIDI data, that can then go to the synthesizer and come out bagpipes or whatever. Or you can buy special guitars I think that have that built in. I'd be interested in the results of your research into how much it all costs.
Why the laugh? Do you know something I don't?
Are we talking gazillions of bucks involved here? I honestly don't know.
Roland has MIDI pickups for guitar / bass I believe. I saw a MIDI pickup for bass and it was around / over $1,000 USD. But that was at the beginning of 2003, they may have come down in price since then.
[edit]
I found two Roland bass pickups at musiciansfriend.com , one for $230, another for $1,000. Maybe there's one for a guitar but these are the only 2 that popped up in the search.
I had a friend in about 8th grade who was a rich kid and had a Roland guitar synthesizer (basically the same thing we're talking about here). That was in about 1984. So they've been around for a while.
I have to wonder about the quality of it though. With a keyboard, you just hit a particular key on the keyboard, and it can send it through to the synthesizer. With guitar, there are all kinds of in-between pitches with bends and being slightly out of tune, etc. You can even play the same note in lots of different places, and they can sound slightly different. I wonder how well it would really work.
Holy shit! I've never owned a guitar that costs anywhere NEAR $1000...much less the pickup!
Okay, Robot (and others), explain this to me: is there any technological or logistical reason a sub-$200 (even cheaper?) simple MIDI-based guitar can't be made or available? You see these keyboards for $99 (and less). I realize perhaps more attention has to be paid to the playability of a string-based instrument (compared to just laying out a keyboard), but still.
Is guitar-based MIDI and accompanying gear/gizmos simply pricier from the get-go?
[edit: just read BRussell's post above this one where he spoke to just what I was writing about: guitars/string instruments being a bit more fussy and more open to variations in tracking, attack, etc.]
A lot of people have misconceptions about extended range basses "oh they're not really a bass" "the player must really suck if he needs all those strings to get noticed" "he must be compensating for something"...etc.
but really, When you look at it, JT(the owner of those basses) has all the range of a 4 string bass in first position. for some people, that's reason enough to buy a 7 or 8 string. So that they can think vertically and not horizontally.
Oh, trust me. I know that good bassists can utilize the wider range. But I just think you have to be *really* good. It's hard enough to master a frikin 4-string.
And I knew a lot of (rich) posers that bought 5-, 6-, and 7-string basses just because they thought more strings meant better. About the same time, I saw Spinal Tap for the first time, and Nigel's schtick about his amp going to eleven ("But this is one higher") has had a special place in my heart.
My friend has a Midi pick-up on his guitar, and it requires, not only the pick up, but a special floorboard.
it's pretty complicated, basically the pick up, adds onto his guitar giving him 2 normal pickups and 1 midi pickup, he has 3 options, direct(by-pass) midi/normal or just midi.
Direct gives him just his normal guitar sound
midi/direct gives him both sounds at once
midi gives him only the midi sound
the output from the pickup is not a standard midi output, it's a weird proprietary output, then the midi floorboard unit, which stores all the sounds, has standard midi ins and outs.
the whole system cost him about $600 I think, you can get them for cheaper on ebay, but also you have to have a guitar already, to install the pick up.
I have never seen anything drastically cheaper, but I suppose in theory it would be possible to create a sound-less midi pick up just for plugging into a computer, this would likely be a lot cheaper, but it isn't very practical because the home computer recording market is currently fairly small, and the guitar midi systems are designed with live playing in mind.
The real expense comes from the sounds.
true you can find midi keyboards for $99 but they don't have sounds, and you would normally need a couple hundred dollars of software to provide them with a lot of high quality sounds.
Alternatively you can get midi keyboards that have sounds built in, these, on average cost a few hundred dollars more, to get the high quality, flexible, and useable sounds, not just cheap general midi.
So that's a big issue, also it's similar to buying an AIO computer, since the monitor is included, the price is going to be more than a computer without a monitor, but, the convenience of having a built in monitor is worth a lot of the price.
Comments
Originally posted by PBG4 Dude
Actually I've seen these things go for < $1,000 used at the local GC. They had two Conklin 7 strings for the longest time. I believe they aren't that unaffordable. In fact there are 2 Conklin 7 string basses for sale on Ebay right now and the bids are at $650 & 700 US.
Ummm... yeah. But I went to college 92-96. They were much less common back then. The used fretless 7-string I wanted was going for $1500, and that was insanely cheap. In today's dollars that's probably close to $3000. A little much for a college kid putting himself through school to spend on a hobby.
If I get back into playing, I might take a look at what's out there. But I came to love my 4-string (which needs new strings desperately now), and began to believe that, for most people, 6- and 7-strings were a way around lack of skill, and a way to impress people who didn't know better. Plus, I have like responsibilities and stuff now (family, mortage, car payment, bills, etc.), so $700 is not something I can just drop on a whim.
DCQ
Totally dude (I'm WillPlay4Food over there)! I can't wait to plug my Schecter Stiletto Studio 4 into GB!
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
How about this 8)
Note, the world's only double neck fretted/fretless 7 string bass
Oh yeah, these aren't mine, I'm a 4 string purist, but I still think that 7 strings are pretty neat.
lol
...and is that a dead cat under the corner seat?
but really, When you look at it, JT(the owner of those basses) has all the range of a 4 string bass in first position. for some people, that's reason enough to buy a 7 or 8 string. So that they can think vertically and not horizontally.
Originally posted by PBG4 Dude
Wrong Robot,
Totally dude (I'm WillPlay4Food over there)! I can't wait to plug my Schecter Stiletto Studio 4 into GB!
yeah, I'm wrong robot, heh, in case you didn't guess
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
yeah, I'm wrong robot, heh, in case you didn't guess
I had wondered but I kinda guessed you were the same when I saw the GB topic on TB.
Originally posted by Nebagakid
How much better is the Grand Piano in the Jam Pack than the on included with GarageBand?
Well, we won't know till we hear them(I wish apple had included sound bytes on their GB page) But on stage didn't steve say that the built-in one was a $50,000 grand and the jam pack one was a $150,000 grand?
eh...not that that really tells you anything, For all you know you might prefer the default one, just depends what you are going for and all that.
I've scrutinized those little icons in the GarageBand section of Apple's site half a bazillion times and I want to see some new instruments!
Although, the ones I've seen have been very exciting. Two in particular - bagpipes and a pedal steel - have me all torqued up for next Friday!
Oh, and here's a question that Wrong Robot or someone can answer (and again, I'm SO new to all this digital stuff, so forgive me if this is an idiotic question).
I don't doubt my ability to get some nice strings and keyboard types of sounds from playing keyboards (chording, held notes, backgrounds, etc.).
But, being a guitarist first and foremost, what I'd REALLY dig is the ability (with the guitar and amp samples) is to be able to plug in an electric guitar and "play" bass lines or sax solo parts or whatever.
In other words, my lead/solo abilities are MUCH better on a guitar, as is my bass playing. I'd love to be able to lay down a bass line using, say, that cool jazzy stand-up bass instrument, BUT play it on a guitar neck as opposed to a keyboard.
Is this possible? Would this, I'm guessing, require some sort of guitar with a MIDI interface or capability? THAT would be the best of both worlds! Strings, horns, choir, piano, organs, etc. played on the keyboards, accessing all those instrument sounds. Guitar, bass, single-note stuff, solos, etc. played on a guitar (and accessing all those instrument sounds).
Does this make sense? Did I explain myself right?
What kind of interfaces and cables would one need.
Trying to find out for a buddy of mine.
Thanks.
You are right, a Guitar that could translate the way you play into data, it would be great for you. I don't know if that exists.
Looks aren't important, nor is weight and - I'd imagine - pickups, body wood, etc. since, like the m-audio keyboard I'm getting, it's next to useless unless hooked to a computer or whatnot and accesses its sounds from the GarageBand instrument library.
How cool would it be to plug in a guitar like this AND in addition to dialing up a, say, "British Invasion" amp setting, you can also dial in, for example, "1960's Rickenbacker 12-string" or "1953 Fender Telecaster".
I know Line 6 makes a modeling guitar called Variax. I'm not sure how expensive they are. Probably quite a bit, since all the tech is onboard.
With GarageBand, it's all in the software, so you just need a fingerboard, strings, maybe a volume knob, decent bridge and tuners, 6 strings and a USB connection.
Plug it, as with that e49 keyboard, right into your Mac and become Ace Frehley, George Benson or whoever.
msantti: No special guitar, and Apple says you can plug your guitar right into your Mac, but there's some debate about how good that will sound. If that doesn't work very well, and Apple marketing is just lying, then your, uh, "friend" can get an audio interface to go between the guitar and the Mac for about $50 and up.
Originally posted by BRussell pscates: you can buy special pickups that convert pitch into MIDI data, that can then go to the synthesizer and come out bagpipes or whatever. Or you can buy special guitars I think that have that built in. I'd be interested in the results of your research into how much it all costs.
Why the laugh? Do you know something I don't?
Are we talking gazillions of bucks involved here? I honestly don't know.
[edit]
I found two Roland bass pickups at musiciansfriend.com , one for $230, another for $1,000. Maybe there's one for a guitar but these are the only 2 that popped up in the search.
Originally posted by pscates
Why the laugh? Do you know something I don't?
Are we talking gazillions of bucks involved here? I honestly don't know.
No no no. I was just smiling because I was telling you to go do research on it. I did find this page:
MIDI Guitar information.
I had a friend in about 8th grade who was a rich kid and had a Roland guitar synthesizer (basically the same thing we're talking about here). That was in about 1984. So they've been around for a while.
I have to wonder about the quality of it though. With a keyboard, you just hit a particular key on the keyboard, and it can send it through to the synthesizer. With guitar, there are all kinds of in-between pitches with bends and being slightly out of tune, etc. You can even play the same note in lots of different places, and they can sound slightly different. I wonder how well it would really work.
Okay, Robot (and others), explain this to me: is there any technological or logistical reason a sub-$200 (even cheaper?) simple MIDI-based guitar can't be made or available? You see these keyboards for $99 (and less). I realize perhaps more attention has to be paid to the playability of a string-based instrument (compared to just laying out a keyboard), but still.
Is guitar-based MIDI and accompanying gear/gizmos simply pricier from the get-go?
[edit: just read BRussell's post above this one where he spoke to just what I was writing about: guitars/string instruments being a bit more fussy and more open to variations in tracking, attack, etc.]
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
A lot of people have misconceptions about extended range basses "oh they're not really a bass" "the player must really suck if he needs all those strings to get noticed" "he must be compensating for something"...etc.
but really, When you look at it, JT(the owner of those basses) has all the range of a 4 string bass in first position. for some people, that's reason enough to buy a 7 or 8 string. So that they can think vertically and not horizontally.
Oh, trust me. I know that good bassists can utilize the wider range. But I just think you have to be *really* good. It's hard enough to master a frikin 4-string.
And I knew a lot of (rich) posers that bought 5-, 6-, and 7-string basses just because they thought more strings meant better. About the same time, I saw Spinal Tap for the first time, and Nigel's schtick about his amp going to eleven ("But this is one higher") has had a special place in my heart.
it's pretty complicated, basically the pick up, adds onto his guitar giving him 2 normal pickups and 1 midi pickup, he has 3 options, direct(by-pass) midi/normal or just midi.
Direct gives him just his normal guitar sound
midi/direct gives him both sounds at once
midi gives him only the midi sound
the output from the pickup is not a standard midi output, it's a weird proprietary output, then the midi floorboard unit, which stores all the sounds, has standard midi ins and outs.
the whole system cost him about $600 I think, you can get them for cheaper on ebay, but also you have to have a guitar already, to install the pick up.
I have never seen anything drastically cheaper, but I suppose in theory it would be possible to create a sound-less midi pick up just for plugging into a computer, this would likely be a lot cheaper, but it isn't very practical because the home computer recording market is currently fairly small, and the guitar midi systems are designed with live playing in mind.
The real expense comes from the sounds.
true you can find midi keyboards for $99 but they don't have sounds, and you would normally need a couple hundred dollars of software to provide them with a lot of high quality sounds.
Alternatively you can get midi keyboards that have sounds built in, these, on average cost a few hundred dollars more, to get the high quality, flexible, and useable sounds, not just cheap general midi.
So that's a big issue, also it's similar to buying an AIO computer, since the monitor is included, the price is going to be more than a computer without a monitor, but, the convenience of having a built in monitor is worth a lot of the price.
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
How about this 8)
Note, the world's only double neck fretted/fretless 7 string bass
Doesn't Claypool have one? I could've sworn I saw him using a fat double-neck in some video or concert footage once. Could be wrong though...