I can probably understand not visiting spymac if that multiplied 4 or 5 times but I only see maybe 10 threads in the entire forum in Chinese. Plus the people to offer translation. And don't go about telling people, keep it to yourself.
Quote:
Originally posted by jwri004
This has got nothing to do with Chinese people, but more about following the language that allows discussion with the majority of the users.
Problem with that comment is, the forums majority of users may just be Chinese some day. Looking at the Chinese characters is pretty cool though..
Please cool down. It is not your place to attack the thread starter. I understand why you would be upset with some of his comments but they are not ment to be taken in a racist fashion. I am sure the topic starter does not view chinese as "scum". Besides if AI was swamped by German (non-english) speaking members that flood every forum with threads that you don't understand and don't think relate to anything Apple, I would not be surprised if you had something to say about it. You are taking this for something it is not. So cool down man, life is too short for misunderstandings. 8)
Don't make me pull some reverse-racism on your ass!
One of the Chinese gave links to this BBS. Not sure what context. I think to tell fellow Chinese about a native language forum.
It is a courtesy thing, to speak the language the forum is predominantly in. But unless its a stead fast rule of the forum, I see no problems with posting in ones native tongue. Especially now that there are other around to help answer (at spymac).
That's pretty cool, how in the heck to Chinese keyboards work?
There are a couple of input methods. The fastest one is the one where you make words by combining the different brush strokes (parts that make up the character) the speed of typing is so incredibly fast. remember that each character = a word and the rate of typing in chinese if you're good with this system is really fast (faster than typing in any alphabetical language)
The one that most people use is by pronunciation. They type in how the word or phrases would be pronounced and selecte the words from a list. It's not as fast as the aforementioned, but even so it's not slow compared to typing in lettering system.
I think it's pretty awesome.
Try putting on the chinese keyboard layout and have a go!
One of the Chinese gave links to this BBS. Not sure what context. I think to tell fellow Chinese about a native language forum.
Well, I think you can tell by the number of threads that it's not very big and not going so well. That's why they want to come to a big and active community like spymac.
Steve, there was *nothing* inflammatory about China, or Chinese people, in any message before your first reactionary post. You're *highly* over-reacting and seeing a problem where there isn't one. (SilentEchoes, you're not helping the matter.)
When one joins a community - *any* community, politeness and manners (not to mention basic common sense) dictate that one interacts with the other members of the community on *their* terms. Here, and many other forums, part of that is that, for the benefit of all, communication take place in a common (to the members) and established language. Spymac the community has that language, as do we, as English. Why? Because we all read/write it. It's just that simple.
No one ever advocated banning the Chinese from spymac. Just expressed what I think is a valid point - there *are* a huge number of Chinese in China for whom the Internet is highly proscribed. For them, finding a free forum to post about anything they want is probably wondrous... but that doesn't mean that anyone has the right to hijack a community resource for their own means. Spymac's forums are a community, as are we. It we started seeing a massive influx of non-English threads intermixed with the English ones, as a moderator, I'd attempt to tell the posters that English *is* the preferred language simply for the sake of everyone who is already in the established community, that they're welcome to post, but it would benefit everyone the most if they did it in a common language. If that didn't work, I'd try and help them establish their own forum where a varied-linguistic community could flourish. If that didn't work, and the resources of this forum were being diverted to a subcommunity that didn't reflect the needs of the AI community as a whole, I'd start locking and banning.
It's no different than crashing a party and refusing to talk to the host and their friends. It's really pretty rude. From anyone.
Now, to get this back on topic...
I think this *is* an interesting event, and it could indeed be the beginning of a new cultural trend, as more and more non-English speakers come on board the Internet and find public resources geared towards English speakers. Traditional resources (books, etc) are consumer-oriented... if you don't speak the language, you can't use it. This media, however, provides publishing as part of the resource... what happens when subcommunities carve out resources that are used for their own singular benefit? Could be interesting.
Well, I think you can tell by the number of threads that it's not very big and not going so well. That's why they want to come to a big and active community like spymac.
If they're not participating in the community, then aren't they just using the resources for whatever they want?* Unless the mods speak Chinese, they have no way of knowing whether the posts are on topic, or if the resources are being used for whatever else.
If I went to spymac and started a thread on overhauling a Jeep transmission... and then another one for fixing a Subaru fuel injector, and another car thread, and another and another and another, essentially trying to turn it into a car forum, don't you think the mods would be within their rights to say "Hey, this isn't a car board... there are other resources you can use for that."?
Now, realize that they can't even make that decision because they can't read the post. Not good.
Communities are established for purposes. They need to be respected.
And, communities need to learn to adapt. If it turns out that the majority of a community shifts in a particular direction, then that community needs to decide how to accommodate that shift.
I think it'd be spiffy keen if someone from the new influx would step up to the moderators and say "Hey, we'd love to participate, and you have a huge untapped market here... let's work together." Perhaps a Chinese room could be created. Perhaps a pool of posters fluent in both could offer up translation services for those that want them - *both* ways. Maybe English and Chinese could be cross-learned for those that want it, so everyone benefits. There are lots of opportunities.
But it's not the moderators responsibility to ensure that some sub-community has access to community resources that others don't... it's their responsibility to make sure that the resources are used most effectively for the benefit of all. It is the sub-community's responsibility to be good community citizens... or they need to find another community. It's just that simple.
* I just thought of another analogy. On Orcas Island, up in Washington state, tour biking is very common. One bed and breakfast puts out a big container of cold water and some paper cups every morning with a sign: "Bikers, free water!" It's a resource intended for a community, to help them out. Would you think it was correct and right for a neighbor to simply come down every day, empty the container, and take the water home for doing the dishes? I mean, it's freely available... but it's still wrong. It quickly moves over the line into stealing, in my book, and most people's.
Communities such as spymac, and this one, are freely available resources... but they aren't to be abused.
It is courtesy to speak the language that is predominant. As stated above Spymac is a ENGLISH SPEAKING FORUM SO IT IS COMMON COURTESY TO USE ENGLISH. Why is this concept so hard to understand?
If you can't read it, either learn it, or find another forum. Simple as that.
so we're expected to adjust to the level of dialogue on a given site in order to play?
I always wondered why posters on other computer boards seemed so immature at times.
They're not poorly informed teenagers leaping to unsupported conclusions, they're just working hard to fit in!
It's not a lack of intelligence or wisdom that's responsible for wingnut opinion, it's clever adaptation of camouflage to blend in with the other trolls and tinfoilhats.
They're not allergic to factual research, they're self-lobotomizing in a struggle to seem LEET.
and to hear criticism about use of foreign terms is surreal when you think about all the LOL OMFG acronyms and geekspeak, to say nothing of the hardware alphabet soup that dominates spec whore disputes here and elsewhere
one of the marks of a community worth joining is tolerance and mutual respect
Excuse me for overreacting. I misinterpreted his thread to be derogatory towards Chinese because of his use of the word flooding, which is a negative term (a flood is a disaster). His tone also seemed negative to me, but that's subjective.
You know guys, I am not trying to elevate China in any way.
In fact, I critisise China so much that you'd think I'm anti-Chinese.
I opened this thread with my Chinese identity.
If I had been in my european identity and saw the community myself I would probably be annoyed.
Though I examined their posts. A lot of the chinese posters do make an effort to post in English. There are some exceptions that only post in Chinese and I wolud frown upon that too.
What can I say? I'm a person who cannot identify with any country and I can't identify with any one nationality.
But I think the mods over there should have it known that everyone should make an effort to put it in dual languages should they find it indispensable to write in CHinese. There is definitely a solution.
but what I will not tolerate is someone dissing my country...(hmm...which one?)
Excuse me for overreacting. I misinterpreted his thread to be derogatory towards Chinese because of his use of the word flooding, which is a negative term (a flood is a disaster). His tone also seemed negative to me, but that's subjective.
Fair enough.
I took 'Chinese' to mean 'the Chinese language', where I can see you may have taken it as 'Chinese people'. Also, 'flooding' may not have quite the extreme negative connotations here as it does for you. It's just a term used for 'a fast and rapid increase' in many cases.
also ich verstahne eui alli nöd? wiso mached er au so es gschiss? nehmeds locker. heieieiei.
Schwyzerdeutsch? Einige Leute kann ich aber nicht verstehen! Was bedeutet das denn?
Yep, that was 'Schwiizerdütsch'. Or 'Schweizerdeutsch'. Basically I just said that I thought that you (the people) were making a big fuss out of nothing, and that you should chill. Now you all did.
Quote:
Originally posted by curiousuburb
Defiant/some of our members from Yurrop occasionally drop into German and nobody freaks, they go babelfishing (and it's sometimes fun and/or educational)
I know. I do that sometimes. Hehehe . But it's also clear that I only do this occasionally, not always. Oder?
stevegongrui, take these chips. And that beer here too. Relax. Kickaha, do you want one too? Well, I have enough for everyone anyways. Take what you want!
Comments
Originally posted by jwri004
This has got nothing to do with Chinese people, but more about following the language that allows discussion with the majority of the users.
Problem with that comment is, the forums majority of users may just be Chinese some day. Looking at the Chinese characters is pretty cool though..
Originally posted by stevegongrui
http://www.spymac.com/forums/showthr...threadid=72266
That's pretty cool, how in the heck to Chinese keyboards work?
Please cool down. It is not your place to attack the thread starter. I understand why you would be upset with some of his comments but they are not ment to be taken in a racist fashion. I am sure the topic starter does not view chinese as "scum". Besides if AI was swamped by German (non-english) speaking members that flood every forum with threads that you don't understand and don't think relate to anything Apple, I would not be surprised if you had something to say about it. You are taking this for something it is not. So cool down man, life is too short for misunderstandings. 8)
Don't make me pull some reverse-racism on your ass!
Breathe slowly and count to 100. It helps.
Originally posted by jwri004
Yes I know rules are a little stricter in China, but not every Chinese person lives in China.
I marvel at how you make such a generalisation without even realising it and tying in a completely irrelevant point with this.
It is a courtesy thing, to speak the language the forum is predominantly in. But unless its a stead fast rule of the forum, I see no problems with posting in ones native tongue. Especially now that there are other around to help answer (at spymac).
Originally posted by the cool gut
That's pretty cool, how in the heck to Chinese keyboards work?
There are a couple of input methods. The fastest one is the one where you make words by combining the different brush strokes (parts that make up the character) the speed of typing is so incredibly fast. remember that each character = a word and the rate of typing in chinese if you're good with this system is really fast (faster than typing in any alphabetical language)
The one that most people use is by pronunciation. They type in how the word or phrases would be pronounced and selecte the words from a list. It's not as fast as the aforementioned, but even so it's not slow compared to typing in lettering system.
I think it's pretty awesome.
Try putting on the chinese keyboard layout and have a go!
Originally posted by IonYz
One of the Chinese gave links to this BBS. Not sure what context. I think to tell fellow Chinese about a native language forum.
Well, I think you can tell by the number of threads that it's not very big and not going so well. That's why they want to come to a big and active community like spymac.
Steve, there was *nothing* inflammatory about China, or Chinese people, in any message before your first reactionary post. You're *highly* over-reacting and seeing a problem where there isn't one. (SilentEchoes, you're not helping the matter.)
When one joins a community - *any* community, politeness and manners (not to mention basic common sense) dictate that one interacts with the other members of the community on *their* terms. Here, and many other forums, part of that is that, for the benefit of all, communication take place in a common (to the members) and established language. Spymac the community has that language, as do we, as English. Why? Because we all read/write it. It's just that simple.
No one ever advocated banning the Chinese from spymac. Just expressed what I think is a valid point - there *are* a huge number of Chinese in China for whom the Internet is highly proscribed. For them, finding a free forum to post about anything they want is probably wondrous... but that doesn't mean that anyone has the right to hijack a community resource for their own means. Spymac's forums are a community, as are we. It we started seeing a massive influx of non-English threads intermixed with the English ones, as a moderator, I'd attempt to tell the posters that English *is* the preferred language simply for the sake of everyone who is already in the established community, that they're welcome to post, but it would benefit everyone the most if they did it in a common language. If that didn't work, I'd try and help them establish their own forum where a varied-linguistic community could flourish. If that didn't work, and the resources of this forum were being diverted to a subcommunity that didn't reflect the needs of the AI community as a whole, I'd start locking and banning.
It's no different than crashing a party and refusing to talk to the host and their friends. It's really pretty rude. From anyone.
Now, to get this back on topic...
I think this *is* an interesting event, and it could indeed be the beginning of a new cultural trend, as more and more non-English speakers come on board the Internet and find public resources geared towards English speakers. Traditional resources (books, etc) are consumer-oriented... if you don't speak the language, you can't use it. This media, however, provides publishing as part of the resource... what happens when subcommunities carve out resources that are used for their own singular benefit? Could be interesting.
Originally posted by stevegongrui
Well, I think you can tell by the number of threads that it's not very big and not going so well. That's why they want to come to a big and active community like spymac.
If they're not participating in the community, then aren't they just using the resources for whatever they want?* Unless the mods speak Chinese, they have no way of knowing whether the posts are on topic, or if the resources are being used for whatever else.
If I went to spymac and started a thread on overhauling a Jeep transmission... and then another one for fixing a Subaru fuel injector, and another car thread, and another and another and another, essentially trying to turn it into a car forum, don't you think the mods would be within their rights to say "Hey, this isn't a car board... there are other resources you can use for that."?
Now, realize that they can't even make that decision because they can't read the post. Not good.
Communities are established for purposes. They need to be respected.
And, communities need to learn to adapt. If it turns out that the majority of a community shifts in a particular direction, then that community needs to decide how to accommodate that shift.
I think it'd be spiffy keen if someone from the new influx would step up to the moderators and say "Hey, we'd love to participate, and you have a huge untapped market here... let's work together." Perhaps a Chinese room could be created. Perhaps a pool of posters fluent in both could offer up translation services for those that want them - *both* ways. Maybe English and Chinese could be cross-learned for those that want it, so everyone benefits. There are lots of opportunities.
But it's not the moderators responsibility to ensure that some sub-community has access to community resources that others don't... it's their responsibility to make sure that the resources are used most effectively for the benefit of all. It is the sub-community's responsibility to be good community citizens... or they need to find another community. It's just that simple.
* I just thought of another analogy. On Orcas Island, up in Washington state, tour biking is very common. One bed and breakfast puts out a big container of cold water and some paper cups every morning with a sign: "Bikers, free water!" It's a resource intended for a community, to help them out. Would you think it was correct and right for a neighbor to simply come down every day, empty the container, and take the water home for doing the dishes? I mean, it's freely available... but it's still wrong. It quickly moves over the line into stealing, in my book, and most people's.
Communities such as spymac, and this one, are freely available resources... but they aren't to be abused.
also ich verstahne eui alli nöd? wiso mached er au so es gschiss? nehmeds locker. heieieiei.
Schwyzerdeutsch? Einige Leute kann ich aber nicht verstehen!
Originally posted by jwri004
It is courtesy to speak the language that is predominant. As stated above Spymac is a ENGLISH SPEAKING FORUM SO IT IS COMMON COURTESY TO USE ENGLISH. Why is this concept so hard to understand?
If you can't read it, either learn it, or find another forum. Simple as that.
so we're expected to adjust to the level of dialogue on a given site in order to play?
I always wondered why posters on other computer boards seemed so immature at times.
They're not poorly informed teenagers leaping to unsupported conclusions, they're just working hard to fit in!
It's not a lack of intelligence or wisdom that's responsible for wingnut opinion, it's clever adaptation of camouflage to blend in with the other trolls and tinfoilhats.
They're not allergic to factual research, they're self-lobotomizing in a struggle to seem LEET.
and to hear criticism about use of foreign terms is surreal when you think about all the LOL OMFG acronyms and geekspeak, to say nothing of the hardware alphabet soup that dominates spec whore disputes here and elsewhere
one of the marks of a community worth joining is tolerance and mutual respect
Originally posted by curiousuburb
so we're expected to adjust to the level of dialogue on a given site in order to play?
To a degree, absolutely. Using the same language is a *bare minimum* in my book... the entire *POINT* of boards such as these is *communication*.
one of the marks of a community worth joining is tolerance and mutual respect
Note the word 'mutual'. That's important.
lots of people here (myself included) beefed about the illegibility of those posts
Defiant/some of our members from Yurrop occasionally drop into German and nobody freaks,
they go babelfishing (and it's sometimes fun and/or educational)
maybe it's partly because translating in and out of chinese is harder,
and the character sets aren't as widely installed or understood.
if only we all spoke esperanto
NOT!
You know guys, I am not trying to elevate China in any way.
In fact, I critisise China so much that you'd think I'm anti-Chinese.
I opened this thread with my Chinese identity.
If I had been in my european identity and saw the community myself I would probably be annoyed.
Though I examined their posts. A lot of the chinese posters do make an effort to post in English. There are some exceptions that only post in Chinese and I wolud frown upon that too.
What can I say? I'm a person who cannot identify with any country and I can't identify with any one nationality.
But I think the mods over there should have it known that everyone should make an effort to put it in dual languages should they find it indispensable to write in CHinese. There is definitely a solution.
but what I will not tolerate is someone dissing my country...(hmm...which one?)
Originally posted by stevegongrui
Excuse me for overreacting. I misinterpreted his thread to be derogatory towards Chinese because of his use of the word flooding, which is a negative term (a flood is a disaster). His tone also seemed negative to me, but that's subjective.
Fair enough.
I took 'Chinese' to mean 'the Chinese language', where I can see you may have taken it as 'Chinese people'. Also, 'flooding' may not have quite the extreme negative connotations here as it does for you. It's just a term used for 'a fast and rapid increase' in many cases.
Glad to see we all F*CKIN CHILLED OUT!
Sheesh.
Originally posted by Mac The Fork
also ich verstahne eui alli nöd? wiso mached er au so es gschiss? nehmeds locker. heieieiei.
Schwyzerdeutsch? Einige Leute kann ich aber nicht verstehen!
Yep, that was 'Schwiizerdütsch'. Or 'Schweizerdeutsch'. Basically I just said that I thought that you (the people) were making a big fuss out of nothing, and that you should chill. Now you all did.
Originally posted by curiousuburb
Defiant/some of our members from Yurrop occasionally drop into German and nobody freaks, they go babelfishing (and it's sometimes fun and/or educational)
I know. I do that sometimes. Hehehe
stevegongrui, take these chips. And that beer here too. Relax. Kickaha, do you want one too? Well, I have enough for everyone anyways. Take what you want!
I opened this thread with my Chinese identity.
If I had been in my european identity and saw the community myself I would probably be annoyed.
so you have mutliple identities that you switch between?