Apple unveils faster iBooks

1234568

Comments

  • Reply 141 of 165
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    The other problem we have in figuring out what Apple is doing here is that they don't have, anywhere that I can find easily yet, which processor they're using.



    What happened to the 7448's? Of course Apple is in the position of not being able to put a newer, better cpu, in the iBook than it has in the Powerbook. I don't know if this is simply an Apple problem (desire), or a problem with Freescale ramping up their lines. Otherwise we could see a Powerbook using this as well about now, refresh or not.



    I suspect that it's both. Freescale is proving unable to have cpu's available that have been out for a year or more. An example:



    I decided to order an upgrade card from Powerlogix/OWC (who owns them now). I called to order the dual 1.33GHz 7457 card for one of my Digital Audio's. It was to be available in 25 days. So I told Chris fine; I would wait.



    Every few days I would go to the site and check the wait. It comes down to five days. Three days later I go again especting it to say three, but it says 26! I figure that maybe it came in and this number is for the next batch (I was told there is a wait list). I call Chris up. He checks, and says that they haven't come in. There's a problem getting the chips.



    Now, when I first called, almost a month ago, I was told that people from the company were with Freescale negotiating for the chips. I ordered when they said that they had gotten them.



    Instead I ordered the dual 1.8GHz board. I didn't really want that because it's slower than the dual 1.33 7447a board when doing Photoshop, etc.



    He said that they would swap it out if the 7457's came in within 30 days (they have a 30 day money-back garantee). I paid $729 plus shipping. They just lowered the price to $649. Sigh.



    I'm wondering if this means that a series of 7448 boards will be coming out.



    We'll see what happens, but this doesn't look good.
  • Reply 142 of 165
    inkswampinkswamp Posts: 337member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Relic

    Inkswamp, buy it already and stop seeking other peoples approval, lunging at a forum for bitching about a product your interested in is silly.



    Waitafrigginminute... I wasn't seeking anyone's approval. I never do. If I did, I sure as hell wouldn't have been using Macs for the last 15 years, would I?



    And second, I wasn't griping about needing approval, but rather the way some people feel the need to bitch about everything, and the way that can spread misinformation when they don't really know what they're talking about. I just don't get the desire to whine about imagined grievances. This caused me problems because I wanted to make sure the iBook was core video and image ready before buying and this site is generally full of knowledgeable people so I was following the (mostly misleading) posts about it. Nowhere on Apple's site until a couple days ago was there any indication about the iBook's compatibility with core image and video.



    So it has nothing to do at all with approval. I needed info and felt that this forum was valuable enough for that. Basically, people who gripe like that make these kinds of forums far less valuable and trustworthy. Everyone who posts knowledgeably here should frown on that.



    Quote:

    Originally posted by Relic

    We're mostly pissed off at the fact that the iBook hasn't gone anywhere spec-wise in the last two years.



    And that's perfectly legit. That's right. It hasn't gone much of anywhere in the last two years, but if people are going to gripe, they should at least know what they're griping about and stop causing confusion for those of us reading these threads. Those who complained specifically about the iBooks not being core image and video ready should be embarrassed for pulling complaints out of their ass. That's just childish.
  • Reply 143 of 165
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by inkswamp

    Waitafrigginminute... I wasn't seeking anyone's approval. I never do. If I did, I sure as hell wouldn't have been using Macs for the last 15 years, would I?



    And second, I wasn't griping about needing approval, but rather the way some people feel the need to bitch about everything, and the way that can spread misinformation when they don't really know what they're talking about. I just don't get the desire to whine about imagined grievances. This caused me problems because I wanted to make sure the iBook was core video and image ready before buying and this site is generally full of knowledgeable people so I was following the (mostly misleading) posts about it. Nowhere on Apple's site until a couple days ago was there any indication about the iBook's compatibility with core image and video.



    So it has nothing to do at all with approval. I needed info and felt that this forum was valuable enough for that. Basically, people who gripe like that make these kinds of forums far less valuable and trustworthy. Everyone who posts knowledgeably here should frown on that.







    And that's perfectly legit. That's right. It hasn't gone much of anywhere in the last two years, but if people are going to gripe, they should at least know what they're griping about and stop causing confusion for those of us reading these threads. Those who complained specifically about the iBooks not being core image and video ready should be embarrassed for pulling complaints out of their ass. That's just childish.




    You weren't seeking approval, but you were seeking confirmation.



    Forums are NEVER the place for that. Call Apple up for that information if you can't find it on their site.
  • Reply 144 of 165
    pbpb Posts: 4,255member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross



    What happened to the 7448's?





    You will find them in the next Powerbook update .



    Quote:



    I suspect that it's both. Freescale is proving unable to have cpu's available that have been out for a year or more. An example:



    I decided to order an upgrade card from Powerlogix/OWC (who owns them now). I called to order the dual 1.33GHz 7457 card for one of my Digital Audio's. It was to be available in 25 days. So I told Chris fine; I would wait.





    I think that you are looking at the wrong side of the universe. It could be Apple the Freescale chip sink, since from the time that Motorola let the microprocessor division act on its own, the G4 was always supplied to Apple in time or slightly ahead of schedule and in sufficient quantities. Perhaps Freescale was unable to substantially advance the G4 until now, but at least there was not with them a supply issue like in the old Motorola days.



    Quote:



    I'm wondering if this means that a series of 7448 boards will be coming out.



    We'll see what happens, but this doesn't look good.




    Last year's Freescale roadmap said that the 7448 should be available in 2H-2005. About one month ago, the company announced the 7448 will be available this October. That means as scheduled one year before. To my eyes, this looks pretty good and we can confidently wait the new chips in the announced time frame. Unless the announcement of the Intel switch from Apple changed something in the meantime.
  • Reply 145 of 165
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by PB

    You will find them in the next Powerbook update .





    I think that you are looking at the wrong side of the universe. It could be Apple the Freescale chip sink, since from the time that Motorola let the microprocessor division act on its own, the G4 was always supplied to Apple in time or slightly ahead of schedule and in sufficient quantities. Perhaps Freescale was unable to substantially advance the G4 until now, but at least there was not with them a supply issue like in the old Motorola days.





    Last year's Freescale roadmap said that the 7448 should be available in 2H-2005. About one month ago, the company announced the 7448 will be available this October. That means as scheduled one year before. To my eyes, this looks pretty good and we can confidently wait the new chips in the announced time frame. Unless the announcement of the Intel switch from Apple changed something in the meantime.




    I'm assuming that the chips will be out for the Powerbook update, whenever that will be.



    I don't know what you mean by "Apple the Freescale chip sink", unless you mean that Apple uses most of their chips. As Freescale hasn't been any more successful than Motorola has been in supplying faster or newer designs, I can't agree with you here. It should be easy to supply the same chips for a year at a time. No big deal there. If you were correct about Freescale then the 7447a would be at 2GHZ by now. The 7448 should certainly be coming out above 2GHz, but that isn't either.



    It's all highly unimpressive. No wonder Apple is leaving.



    I brought up the 7457 because this was a much superior chip to the 7455b's. 40% less power usage, 512MB L2 cache rather than 256, as well as the 2MB L3 cache. It's been out for a year now. So why can't Freescale get the slightly faster version out the door? the 1.2GHZ is around.



    It concerns me that it could be indicative of what to expect with the 7448's.
  • Reply 146 of 165
    pbpb Posts: 4,255member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross



    I don't know what you mean by "Apple the Freescale chip sink", unless you mean that Apple uses most of their chips.





    Yes, that's what I mean.



    Quote:



    As Freescale hasn't been any more successful than Motorola has been in supplying faster or newer designs, I can't agree with you here. It should be easy to supply the same chips for a year at a time. No big deal there. If you were correct about Freescale then the 7447a would be at 2GHZ by now. The 7448 should certainly be coming out above 2GHz, but that isn't either.



    It's all highly unimpressive. No wonder Apple is leaving.





    You are right in what you say and I am not trying to prove the opposite. My point is that Freescale always provided incremental G4 updates to Apple in time. Furthermore, we have strong evidence (see the roadmap argument in my previous post) that the significant 7448 update will come without delays.



    Quote:



    I brought up the 7457 because this was a much superior chip to the 7455b's. 40% less power usage, 512MB L2 cache rather than 256, as well as the 2MB L3 cache. It's been out for a year now. So why can't Freescale get the slightly faster version out the door? the 1.2GHZ is around.



    It concerns me that it could be indicative of what to expect with the 7448's.




    The 7448 is the next G4, the 745x family is not in use at Apple anymore (and I doubt the 7457 was ever). So I am not sure how much interested Freescale is to push that line. This should had nothing to do with the 7448 going into production.
  • Reply 147 of 165
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by PB

    The 7448 is the next G4, the 745x family is not in use at Apple anymore (and I doubt the 7457 was ever). So I am not sure how much interested Freescale is to push that line. This should had nothing to do with the 7448 going into production.



    No, the 7457 came out after Apple stopped using G4's for the iMac's, Powermac's, and XServes.



    The point is that Freescale is selling the 7457's for embedded use. That's a much larger market that Apple's has been. If they can't get these out the door, what's to expect that they will get the 7448's on time?



    Remember that Motorola had no problems with the G3. When I bought my daughter her G4 450, it was the fastest machine on the planet, but the problems were already there. Jobs tried to downgrade the line by 50MHz because Motorola couldn't make the fastest chips in quantity, and so everything slipped away.



    Freescale has no better facilities, or staff than Motorola had. They also lack the backing of a much larger entity. What happened to their dual 600 line, and others?



    At this point, I can't wait until the first x86 machine comes out.



    Remember that Apple could have put a 1.7GHz in the iBook. They didn't for political reasons, not technical.



    Apple will probablt put an x86 in the Powerbook first, or at the same time as the iBook. So this might be the last refresh of the iBook until that occurs.
  • Reply 148 of 165
    pbpb Posts: 4,255member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross



    Freescale has no better facilities, or staff than Motorola had. They also lack the backing of a much larger entity.





    Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that the Crolles fab, where Freescale collaborates with Philips and STMicroelectronics, is way better than anything Motorola had in the past.



    Quote:



    What happened to their dual 600 line, and others?





    Again according to last year's roadmap, it would go into production in 1H-2006. I am confident that we will hear about that this winter. So:



    7448 production: 2H-2005

    8641D production: 1H-2006



    Here is a resume of the upcoming chips. And this presentation has the production schedule (page 41).



    Quote:



    Remember that Apple could have put a 1.7GHz in the iBook. They didn't for political reasons, not technical.



    Apple will probablt put an x86 in the Powerbook first, or at the same time as the iBook. So this might be the last refresh of the iBook until that occurs.




    We will see.
  • Reply 149 of 165
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by PB

    Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that the Crolles fab, where Freescale collaborates with Philips and STMicroelectronics, is way better than anything Motorola had in the past.





    Again according to last year's roadmap, it would go into production in 1H-2006. I am confident that we will hear about that this winter. So:



    7448 production: 2H-2005

    8641D production: 1H-2006



    Here is a resume of the upcoming chips. And this presentation has the production schedule (page 41).





    We will see.




    It's a good lab, though it's not really set up for cpu work. It's the financial backing that they lack now.



    I'm not too sure about the 8641D. There doesn't seem to be demand for it.
  • Reply 150 of 165
    inkswampinkswamp Posts: 337member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross

    You weren't seeking approval, but you were seeking confirmation.



    Wrong. I didn't specifically seek out AI for confirmation of that fact or any other specific fact, but rather was thrown off when I saw so many inaccurate comments about the graphics card from people who seemed like they knew what they were talking about.



    Quote:

    Originally posted by melgross

    Forums are NEVER the place for that.



    I disagree. The better forums can be a place for that which is part of my point: the value of the AI forums to me has just dropped off considerably. And that's too bad really. I have enjoyed browsing the comments here but likely won't bother with it so often in the near-future.
  • Reply 151 of 165
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    just to jump in here, i wanted to say that if you look at Freescale CEO comments, i don't think Apple is a major customer, IIRC Freescale CEO said Apple were only 5% of their market?? warning to inkswamp: i may be pulling this out of my ass



    anyway, freescale and g4 is EOL in 1 year's time (in regards to Apple Macs). i have confidence that they will be able to supply whatever Apple can do with for that 1 year.



    beyond that, fuck freescale.



    and i pity the fools that depend on freescale for their g4 upgrade cards. i admire and respect the g4 upgrade card manufacturers and i'm sure as long as freescale makes 7447s and the like (which they will do for the embedded PowerPC market), they should survive a while more, hell, maybe even figure out MacIntel upgrades when the time comes. MacAMD upgrades ??? heh....



    but, and this is the venting part, fuck Freescale. good riddance to bad rubbish. fuck IBM. as Steve Jobs says, it's time to stop "going through the orifices of Fortune 500" [wankers] just to deliver a great experience for the consumer. Fuck these retard executives that are jealous of apple and don't know a good thing when they see it (hello HP???) retards.



    phew. time for my morning medication
  • Reply 152 of 165
    dhagan4755dhagan4755 Posts: 2,152member
    Geez, Sunilraman, watch your fucking language!



    I am starting to back off the fact that the PowerBook would be the first to go Intel. I am now sorta leaning to the iMac. It seems like Apple is having some heat issues with the current crop of iMac G5s (from hard drives that go poof to 'midplane assembly issues'). If the Engadget blurb is true, I think it has major implications for the 7448. I don't think Apple is going to ever use the G5 in a portable, so that may indeed be where PowerBooks will be headed in the short term.



    Arrghhh, no one really knows. But I think we will get a better hint of the direction of the hardware lineup by what is introduced (or not introduced) at the Paris Expo on Tuesday, September 20th.
  • Reply 153 of 165
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by DHagan4755

    ..... at the Paris Expo on Tuesday, September 20th.



    do you know that's my fucking birthday? free powerBook 7448's for all those faithful mac users born on Sep 20th
  • Reply 154 of 165
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by inkswamp

    Wrong. I didn't specifically seek out AI for confirmation of that fact or any other specific fact, but rather was thrown off when I saw so many inaccurate comments about the graphics card from people who seemed like they knew what they were talking about.







    I disagree. The better forums can be a place for that which is part of my point: the value of the AI forums to me has just dropped off considerably. And that's too bad really. I have enjoyed browsing the comments here but likely won't bother with it so often in the near-future.




    " I was a little bummed out because I had been planning to buy an iBook but so many people here were griping that the video card did not support Core Image and Video which is something that I wanted."



    That sounds like you were seeking confirmation, and didn't get it.



    You then got it elsewhere, and were pissed off because you were frustrated that the wrong info was provided here, possibly changing your mind about buying it, which was changed back when you went to the site.



    And you ARE wrong. These forums are NEVER to be relied upon for product info. I'm on a lot of forums, and none of them are consistantly correct.



    As I said, if you want product info, go the the company site, or call them up. Even they may not know!
  • Reply 155 of 165
    aegisdesignaegisdesign Posts: 2,914member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Relic

    That's very true; however once you connect that iBook to a second monitor all bets are off. So I to will go down in books as saying, "32 MB isn't enough VRAM", Apple just squeaked by with the bare minimum lets all rejoice.





    Unless you've hacked your iBook to allow a second monitor, it's just a mirror of the built in screen and 32MB for a 1024x768 screen is plenty for the OS and Quartz. It's an iBook, not a PowerMac.
  • Reply 156 of 165
    relicrelic Posts: 4,735member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by aegisdesign

    Unless you've hacked your iBook to allow a second monitor, it's just a mirror of the built in screen and 32MB for a 1024x768 screen is plenty for the OS and Quartz. It's an iBook, not a PowerMac.



    Then let the masses have their neutered iBook, I for one find the lack of built in video spanning a feeble attempt to show superiority in the more expensive Powerbook models. Plus with tiger already limping on the current iBook I would of thought a minuscule upgrade to 64MB of video ram obvious. Apple in all its greedy wisdom said no, so I say no.
  • Reply 157 of 165
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Relic

    Then let the masses have their neutered iBook, I for one find the lack of built in video spanning a feeble attempt to show superiority in the more expensive Powerbook models. Plus with tiger already limping on the current iBook I would of thought a minuscule upgrade to 64MB of video ram obvious. Apple in all its greedy wisdom said no, so I say no.



    apple store US is down
  • Reply 158 of 165
    relicrelic Posts: 4,735member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by sunilraman

    apple store US is down



    Yep for a new mouse.
  • Reply 159 of 165
    sunilramansunilraman Posts: 8,133member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Relic

    Yep for a new mouse.



    not just ANY new mouse, a MIGHTY mouse

    i need to get a life \
  • Reply 160 of 165
    reidreid Posts: 190member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Relic

    Then let the masses have their neutered iBook, I for one find the lack of built in video spanning a feeble attempt to show superiority in the more expensive Powerbook models. Plus with tiger already limping on the current iBook I would of thought a minuscule upgrade to 64MB of video ram obvious. Apple in all its greedy wisdom said no, so I say no.



    Can you point to a similarly-priced Wintel laptop with more than 32MB of dedicated VRAM? Or one that offers screen spanning? Most I've seen use "Integrated Intel Graphics" with no dedicated VRAM at all.



    I'd say the iBook stacks up quite nicely (processor questions aside) compared with Dell's most competitive offering:



    Mac vs. PC System Shootouts



    Is it really Apple who's being greedy, or is it you?
Sign In or Register to comment.