Suppliers hope Apple Newton pad boosts Flash orders

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  • Reply 61 of 106
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    I also don't see that it's impossible to come out with something that mimics the fingers electrical, er, fingerprint.



    In fact, I'm surprised that something hasn't already come out.



    Such products are already available from 3rd party accessory vendors.
  • Reply 62 of 106
    wigginwiggin Posts: 2,265member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    Ok, I will agree with that. But because Apple is not going to release a new type of device yet doesn't mean it doesn't exist. As you say its all about the timing. And I say that he will debut such a device this year...probably late this year. Come June when the firmware 2.0 hits there will be hundreds if not thousands of apps ready to launch at the WWDC 08. There is your critical mass. Very more than likely it will be the time when the 3g iphone hits. It would be nice if the mystery device also debuts (a "one more thing"?).

    But it could be that it will debut afterwards at perhaps a september ipod event?

    We will soon find out.



    I think that's a bit optimistic. Having 1000 programs is one thing...have a couple dozen really good ones is something else entirely. For years, Mac users pointed to the vast library of PC software and (rightly so) pointed out that 90% of it was crap. I think by the end of this year you will start to see a handfull of highly desirable applications that have been reviewed, vetted, and have a developed a good reputation. And once that has us all drooling, ready to sell our souls for this new device, THEN Apple will release it. My best guess is unveiling at MacWorld 2009 and availability a short time afterwards.



    Besides, Apple would never release something like that at an iPod event just before the holiday shopping season. They'd much rather we spend our money buying touches and iPhones as gifts after giving up on the Holy Grail. Then, right after they've taken our money, Steve unveils the new must-have and we take out a 3rd mortage to buy it. \
  • Reply 63 of 106
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mbene12 View Post


    I would imagine there would be massive cannibalization of the touch market









    Come on. Thats over the top. There is clear differentiation between notebook and desktop roles for one. A factor 9 difference in weight (not including keyboard mouse power cord). The touch/iPhone does/will do 80-90% of what you want in this tablet, and the MBA will cover the desired performance. Im not saying this FrankenTablet wouldnt be a nice device that many people would like, I am strongly of the opinion that there just isnt enough room between the touch/iPhone and MBA for such a device to be worthwhile.



    I



    I know there's a big difference between a notebook and a desktop, that was my point.

    If Apple builds an intermediate device placed between the Touch and the MBA..... it would be as different to both of those devices as a laptop to a desktop.



    A touch simply isn't what a bigger screen/bigger battery/bigger CPU device CAN be.

    (I defy you to run three applications at once on a Touch, even if you could you'd melt the CPU)
  • Reply 64 of 106
    gqbgqb Posts: 1,934member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trboyden View Post


    The next best option that is still available is the Lenovo X61 series tablet PC (link). At a price around $1500, that fits right in with the higher end of the MacBook line which is where Apple probably would position it.



    Ah... that's what I was clumsily trying to describe.

    But I'd still prefer not to have a keyboard built-in, and would rather have a dock-able keyboard.



    One thing tho'... having applauded the lack of a stylus on the touch/iPhone, iI now have to admit that there's probably a market for a stylus that simply emulates (generates?) capacitance.

    But I think a stylus would be more useful on a tablet than a touch/iPhone. I can see new van Goghs sitting in their corn fields with one now.



    As an aside, as a musician, I've seen lots of people building performance hubs on laptops that control everything from real-time sequencing to instrument effects and looping.

    I think that being able to mount a touch-based tablet on a music stand would make for one outstanding addition to a musical live performance arsenal.
  • Reply 65 of 106
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tofino View Post


    I still have my Newton MP 100, an MP 130, a screen busted MP 2000 (that hurt!) and a MP 2100. By the time the Newton got 'steved', it was just about ready to make a difference: The handwriting recognition worked, the battery life was measured in weeks, it had a built email that worked with CompuServe, AOL, the internet and there was even a version made by motorola that had a cell phone built in. It truly set the standard for functionality that still pops up ever time a new 'revolution' in mobile computing is upon us.



    At a thousand dollar it was certainly always going to be a niche market, but it certainly had the potential to take off. I believe that it got killed at least in part for personal reasons by our 'Dear Leader', and considering the lack of focus at Apple at the time, it was probably the right decision.



    That doesn't mean however that some of the concepts in the Newton OS are forgotten at Apple. Handwriting recognition is part of OSX, probably used by nobody, but available. The Newton's cut and paste system (drag an item into the margin of the screen to copy, drag it back out to paste) worked well in a touch environment and is likely going to come back to the iPhone/iPod Touch.



    However... I think that Apple will do ANYTHING to avoid bringing out a device that draws more comparison to the Newton than the iPhone already did. I remember reading about at a shareholder meeting where Mr. Jobs got asked: "What about the Newton?". It was reported (rumored?) that his response was something like "I'll tell you what you can do with your Newton..."



    So I for one would not hold my breath.



    And yes, I'd be buying one.



    Yes and he would say that the iphone is the new newton. After he said to me "I'll tell you what you can do with your Newton..." I would yell back, "But the iphone's screen is too bloody small for it to be a newton you dolt!"

    Then he would reply, "Who the hell are you to come up in my domain and tell me I'm a dolt?". "SECURITY!!!!"

    And I would reply, "Who am I? I'm your friendly neighborhood freaking Apple consumer!" "Your sooooo concerned about who would replace you at Apple when your gone and if this place would run without you. But 10 years ago the newton,which didn't get your official stamp of approval, your holy blessing, had Apple written ALLLL OVER IT! So maybe Apple had lost its focus while you was gone and that is why the newton ultimately failed. But now your here. And I don't give a damn if its your vision or someone elses we just want a modern version of that great product.

    So do it already! And buy a new mock turtleneck while your at it!! At least get one in another color for the love of gawd!!!!

    Then, as two apple security commandos burst through the meeting room's door I would proceed to drop kick the first one and roundhouse kick the other. Everyone in the meeting (including Steve) would stand there throughly astonished as I crashed through the window and rappel myself down the cupertino campus building side (with my trusty grappling hook) batman style.

    So flustered over what just happened Steve, truly humbled by the experience, finally realized what I was saying made sense.

    In the June WWDC Steve proudly presented the mactouch.
  • Reply 66 of 106
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post


    I think that's a bit optimistic. Having 1000 programs is one thing...have a couple dozen really good ones is something else entirely. For years, Mac users pointed to the vast library of PC software and (rightly so) pointed out that 90% of it was crap. I think by the end of this year you will start to see a handfull of highly desirable applications that have been reviewed, vetted, and have a developed a good reputation. And once that has us all drooling, ready to sell our souls for this new device, THEN Apple will release it. My best guess is unveiling at MacWorld 2009 and availability a short time afterwards.



    Besides, Apple would never release something like that at an iPod event just before the holiday shopping season. They'd much rather we spend our money buying touches and iPhones as gifts after giving up on the Holy Grail. Then, right after they've taken our money, Steve unveils the new must-have and we take out a 3rd mortage to buy it. \



    Your make an excellent argument. I now hate you.
  • Reply 67 of 106
    zunxzunx Posts: 620member
    The new Apple super-portable should run a full Mac OS X 10.5.2, being a pocket handheld device at the same time. With full quality video out, both wired and wirereless, for Keynote and PowerPoint preentations.



    Just make the presentation on the Mac, move the native file to the super-portable, carry it on your pocket and use it as the ultimate presentation remote. We need thousands for our University.



    Something like this, but with Mac OS X inside and Intel Atom (Silverthorne) inside:



    OQO model e2

    http://www.oqo.com
  • Reply 68 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by trboyden View Post


    All this talk about Newtons and tablet PCs has me wishing Apple would just make the MacBook line into convertible tablet PCs. The best ones I've tried to date were - the now discontinued - Acer Travelmate series tablet PCs. They had the best mix of features, and were light-weight (for a tablet PC). The next best option that is still available is the Lenovo X61 series tablet PC (link). At a price around $1500, that fits right in with the higher end of the MacBook line which is where Apple probably would position it.



    Please! None of that. They would be heavier, bulkier, and the hinge, as on all of those models, would break more often.
  • Reply 69 of 106
    qpnqpn Posts: 1member
    I still don't understand if it is like the Mac OS

    http://blogs.computerworld.com/clues...se_a_mac_touch



    or like the iPhone?
  • Reply 70 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    Such products are already available from 3rd party accessory vendors.



    I haven't seen any advertised. Which ones? Could you provide a link?



    If they are out, hopefully with some form of case that would hold the stylus, as i've been calling for for months now, it would alleviate some problems.
  • Reply 71 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tofino View Post


    I still have my Newton MP 100, an MP 130, a screen busted MP 2000 (that hurt!) and a MP 2100. By the time the Newton got 'steved', it was just about ready to make a difference: The handwriting recognition worked, the battery life was measured in weeks, it had a built email that worked with CompuServe, AOL, the internet and there was even a version made by motorola that had a cell phone built in. It truly set the standard for functionality that still pops up ever time a new 'revolution' in mobile computing is upon us.



    At a thousand dollar it was certainly always going to be a niche market, but it certainly had the potential to take off. I believe that it got killed at least in part for personal reasons by our 'Dear Leader', and considering the lack of focus at Apple at the time, it was probably the right decision.



    That doesn't mean however that some of the concepts in the Newton OS are forgotten at Apple. Handwriting recognition is part of OSX, probably used by nobody, but available. The Newton's cut and paste system (drag an item into the margin of the screen to copy, drag it back out to paste) worked well in a touch environment and is likely going to come back to the iPhone/iPod Touch.



    However... I think that Apple will do ANYTHING to avoid bringing out a device that draws more comparison to the Newton than the iPhone already did. I remember reading about at a shareholder meeting where Mr. Jobs got asked: "What about the Newton?". It was reported (rumored?) that his response was something like "I'll tell you what you can do with your Newton..."



    So I for one would not hold my breath.



    And yes, I'd be buying one.



    Yup!



    Jobs got rid of it just after all the major problems were solved, and sales started to rise significantly.
  • Reply 72 of 106
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    I haven't seen any advertised. Which ones? Could you provide a link?



    If they are out, hopefully with some form of case that would hold the stylus, as i've been calling for for months now, it would alleviate some problems.



    They have been out for a little bit already. Here is one I know of: http://www.tenonedesign.com/stylus.php

    You might want to also google tapright. I can't bring it up on my computer at work. Its probably an activex control or some such thing. The IT department here stinks. There are others I'm sure. You just have to google the topic.



    EDIT: Personally, I don't need a stylus or a keyboard. I love the multitouch. In fact, I have the original multitouch fingerworks touchpad as my input device at home. I cursed Steve at first for buying up the company preventing them from coming out with new products. If my original unit ever finally fails.....I dunno what I will do. But I think I eventually forgave Steve.
  • Reply 73 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post


    I think that's a bit optimistic. Having 1000 programs is one thing...have a couple dozen really good ones is something else entirely. For years, Mac users pointed to the vast library of PC software and (rightly so) pointed out that 90% of it was crap. I think by the end of this year you will start to see a handfull of highly desirable applications that have been reviewed, vetted, and have a developed a good reputation. And once that has us all drooling, ready to sell our souls for this new device, THEN Apple will release it. My best guess is unveiling at MacWorld 2009 and availability a short time afterwards.



    Besides, Apple would never release something like that at an iPod event just before the holiday shopping season. They'd much rather we spend our money buying touches and iPhones as gifts after giving up on the Holy Grail. Then, right after they've taken our money, Steve unveils the new must-have and we take out a 3rd mortage to buy it. \



    I don't agree with your characterization of the importance of lots of programs. I believe that we'll see a good number by the time, or shortly after, the ver 2 upgrade comes out.



    We don't need several dozen programs, we need hundreds, thousands. It doesn't even matter if a number aren't that good. I don't want one program of each type. I want to be able to choose from a dozen of each type. What's good for one person, isn't good for another, and sometimes it just takes one feature to make the program better for one person over the other.



    These programs, for the most part, will, like their Palm, Windows Mobile, etc. versions, be pretty cheap. I don't mind buying one program, and when a better one comes along, buying that one too.



    I know I'm not alone in this.
  • Reply 74 of 106
    quinneyquinney Posts: 2,528member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    Yes and he would say that the iphone is the new newton. After he said to me "I'll tell you what you can do with your Newton..." I would yell back, "But the screen is too bloody small you dolt!"

    Then he would reply, "Who the hell are you to come up in my domain and tell me I'm a dolt?". "SECURITY!!!!"

    And I would reply, "Who am I? I'm your friendly neighborhood freaking Apple consumer!" "Your sooooo concerned about who would replace you at Apple when your gone and if this place would run without you. But 10 years ago the newton, which which didn't get your official stamp of approval, your holy blessing, had Apple written ALLLL OVER IT! So maybe Apple had lost its focus while you was gone and that is why the newton ultimately failed. But now your here. And I don't give a damn if its your vision or someone elses we just want a modern version of that great product.

    So do it already! And buy a new mock turtleneck while your at it!! At least get one in another color for the love of gawd!!!!

    Then, as two apple security commandos burst through the meeting room's door I would proceed to drop kick the first one and roundhouse kick the other. Everyone in the meeting (including Steve) would stand there throughly astonished as I crashed through the window and rappel myself down the cupertino campus building side (with my trusty grappling hook) batman style.

    So flustered over what just happened Steve, truly humbled by the experience, finally realized what I was saying made sense.

    In the June WWDC Steve proudly presented the mactouch.



    Wait a minute. melgross says absinthe doesn't work!
  • Reply 75 of 106
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by quinney View Post


    Wait a minute. melgross says absinthe doesn't work!



    Then it must be the rat poison. \

    Our office is infested with them so we've been forced to lay rat poison pellets....everywhere.



    On a side note: Hey melgross you read my reply concerning a iphone stylus? Check them out.
  • Reply 76 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    They have been out for a little bit already. Here is one I know of: http://www.tenonedesign.com/stylus.php

    You might want to also google tapright. I can't bring it up on my computer at work. Its probably an activex control or some such thing. The IT department here stinks. There are others I'm sure. You just have to google the topic.



    EDIT: Personally, I don't need a stylus or a keyboard. I love the multitouch. In fact, I have the original multitouch fingerworks touchpad as my input device at home. I cursed Steve at first for buying up the company preventing them from coming out with new products. If my original unit ever finally fails.....I dunno what I will do. But I think I eventually forgave Steve.



    Very good. Thanks. I'll check out others. This one is cheap enough to be something easy to buy, though I think it's a bit too big, and the holder is very clumsy.



    Just thought of some other types. How about two that fit the end of the thumbs, so that two fingered typing would be easier? Or one that would be short, and fit a forefinger, just to make it easier to point and touch?



    Something with a smaller tip would help for drawing and painting programs.
  • Reply 77 of 106
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Very good. Thanks. I'll check out others. This one is cheap enough to be something easy to buy, though I think it's a bit too big, and the holder is very clumsy.



    At least it works. Check out the others. I'm curious to see what form they take and how they perform. Not curious enough to buy of course.
  • Reply 78 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    At least it works. Check out the others. I'm curious to see what form they take and how they perform. Not curious enough to buy of course.



    I went to Tapright, but other than the games DVD and software how to create your own stylus, i'm not quite sure what this is.



    http://tapright.com/iPhone_Stylus.html



    They also have this, but no actual photo of the device, just the drawing.



    http://tapright.igiki.com/iPhone_Stylus_TapRight.html



    As far as my search goes, this and the Pogo are the only ones that are out right now. I don't have an iPhone yet (waiting for the 3G), so I can't experiment, but something negatively charged (low voltage please!) should trigger the screen.
  • Reply 79 of 106
    wigginwiggin Posts: 2,265member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    I don't agree with your characterization of the importance of lots of programs. I believe that we'll see a good number by the time, or shortly after, the ver 2 upgrade comes out.



    We don't need several dozen programs, we need hundreds, thousands. It doesn't even matter if a number aren't that good. I don't want one program of each type. I want to be able to choose from a dozen of each type. What's good for one person, isn't good for another, and sometimes it just takes one feature to make the program better for one person over the other.



    These programs, for the most part, will, like their Palm, Windows Mobile, etc. versions, be pretty cheap. I don't mind buying one program, and when a better one comes along, buying that one too.



    I know I'm not alone in this.



    I wasn't trying to dismiss the importance of having lots of programs and lots of choices. I'm just saying that it will take time for the value of those programs to be realized outside of those of us hanging out on Apple message boards all day.



    There will be some great apps come June, no doubt. But many of them will need some tweaking and polishing. Once they are available and people start using them, they'll get improved. It will be the wild west at first as people try all the different programs, figuring out which ones work the best. A few of them will float to the surface as best-of-the-best and will start to get broader attention for the touch platform, get in a few trade magazines, MacWorld, PCWorld, newspapers. Then you'll start to get the critical mass Apple looks for to release a new product. I don't think all that will happen soon enough to make the cut for holiday shopping. But by then, we'll all know what applications we'd install...IF ONLY Apple would make a larger size iPod touch!



    Then come January, we'll all be eager to drink the Kool-Aid, Steve will unveil the new iDevice, and all will be right in the world again!
  • Reply 80 of 106
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,335member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post


    I wasn't trying to dismiss the importance of having lots of programs and lots of choices. I'm just saying that it will take time for the value of those programs to be realized outside of those of us hanging out on Apple message boards all day.



    No, don't be silly. We don't do that. Do we?



    Quote:

    There will be some great apps come June, no doubt. But many of them will need some tweaking and polishing. Once they are available and people start using them, they'll get improved. It will be the wild west at first as people try all the different programs, figuring out which ones work the best. A few of them will float to the surface as best-of-the-best and will start to get broader attention for the touch platform, get in a few trade magazines, MacWorld, PCWorld, newspapers. Then you'll start to get the critical mass Apple looks for to release a new product. I don't think all that will happen soon enough to make the cut for holiday shopping. But by then, we'll all know what applications we'd install...IF ONLY Apple would make a larger size iPod touch!



    Then come January, we'll all be eager to drink the Kool-Aid, Steve will unveil the new iDevice, and all will be right in the world again!



    No doubt about the tweaking. The SDK may still be in beta by then, and ver 2 will have its own teething pains.



    But, I wouldn't be surprised to see 100 programs by then. There's a lot of pent up desire to write for these things, and the smaller developers, with smaller programs, will be all over it.
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