Uh - did they also explain their 3G connectivity was going to be CRAP around the world? I'm looking for it now in their published literature. If you find it first then let us know, OK?
I am thinking that, in such a case, claiming misrepresentation (being induced to enter into a contract by false statements not amounting to a term of the contract) is probably more efficient than claiming a breach of 'express warranty'? ... I fail to see any warranty here, express or implied.
Or is this just 'advertising puff', in which case misrep cannot be claimed on that basis? Any lawyers take on this?
I have two other 3G phones. Nokia N82 and Nokia E61. I will concede that the iPhone has a better browser, but if I go to the same web page with the iPhone (BBC, CNN, MSNBC), the Nokia's simply get there first. This is not a scientific test by any means but I bet her suit gets traction because her claims will for the most part be verifiable. The iPhone is not slow but it is not as fast as other 3G phones. Apple better shit a solution and fast.
Perhaps those other phones are loading specially made Mobile Websites. You know the really simplified versions they have to make for 'smart phones' unable to run real browsers.
I am thinking that, in such a case, claiming misrepresentation (being induced to enter into a contract by false statements not amounting to a term of the contract) is probably more efficient than claiming a breach of 'express warranty'? ... Or is this just 'advertising puff', in which case misrep cannot be claimed on that basis? Any lawyers take on this?
Win or lose what do you think will be the reputation hit that Apple suffers. People will hardly remember that the case was dismissed or even care if Apple wins. They will remember how a perception was created that Apple sold a defective product. This is the real damage.
Perhaps those other phones are loading specially made Mobile Websites. You know the really simplified versions they have to make for 'smart phones' unable to run real browsers.
Not sure what you are talking about and it appears you don't either but so that now you will have a clue, take a peek at these links and read the specs that you missed. By the way, they run Flash.
Win or lose what do you think will be the reputation hit that Apple suffers. People will hardly remember that the case was dismissed or even care if Apple wins. They will remember how a perception was created that Apple sold a defective product. This is the real damage.
I think they'll be fine. Virtually every consumer product has problems and most of educated america realizes that filing a law suit is like going to grocery store - it seems like everyone is doing it. Ya know, the economy is down so the only real way to make money is to take it from people/businesses who are successful
Ya know - re-distribution of wealth and all of that :-D
Not sure what you are talking about and it appears you don't either but so that now you will have a clue, take a peek at these links and read the specs that you missed. By the way, they run Flash.
Given the same connection the iPhone is going to load the page faster as it's engine is faster than any other mobile on the market. Your real problem is with the connection not with how fast the iPhone can render the page.
In rural areas with 3G and fewer users, I get 400-900 kbps download speeds on 3G. It is fantastic and much faster than the 90-160 kbps I am getting on EDGE.
However, in urban areas with 3G and many more users, I am getting 300-600 kbps downloads speeds on 3G. This is still faster than the 90-160 kbps I am getting on EDGE.
There are more problems with urban areas since there are more users.
I believe AT&T has a lot of blame for not anticipating and building more bandwidth into the system with the large number of people who are buying the iPhone 3G and using their data capabilities. This is shown by how much more trouble there is with 3G in urban areas.
AT&T got its wish - more higher paying customers for its data services.
But now AT&T has to continue to build a better network.
And I believe that there should be a law that lawyers who file frivolous lawsuits should get the death penalty. They are a waste.
Am I missing something here? When you go to Apple's website the first thing to appear states "Twice as fast. Half the price." -without any asterisk stating exceptions. Now I'm not saying Apple is being deceptive- but that is what they state in all their advertising. Just being devil's advocate- pleez don't get mad people.
That's true but if you click on the iPhone (or go to purchase it) the asterisk shows up. I mean, I think the big problem here is people who are impulse buying and not realizing what they are getting into. The "masses" never complained about Treo's or BB's because the masses didn't buy them but now we're introducing smartphones to an entirely new demographic of people who aren't the traditional smartphone type and are unwilling to accept any problems (mainly because their old phone was so crappy it "just worked" because it didn't have to do much, well, work).
The Birmingham lawyer should be fried for filing a frivolous lawsuit.
Apple was smart to put in a disclaimer.
It is standard practice.
Always put "Your mileage may vary" on any claim to keep you safe from all but the dumbest of dumbass lawyers.
The disclaimer kills the lawsuit. It is frivolous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz
Funnily enough Apple have placed a disclaimer on all of their advertising regarding 'twice as fast'
* Comparisons between iPhone 3G (8GB) and first-generation iPhone (8GB) running on EDGE. Actual speeds vary by site conditions. Requires new two-year AT&T rate plan, sold separately to qualified customers.
Some features, applications, and services are not available in all areas. See your carrier for details.
Some applications are not available in all areas. Application availability and pricing are subject to change.
this is nothing more than "vulture" litigation, ITS ALL ABOUT GETTING MONEY from you, me, whoever, that's why ladders cost more, and they have to have warning stickers about being stupid. apple is making it right, no one did a lawsuit when MS stuff opens the door for virus, or when my moto keeps crashing and not even making a call.
Win or lose what do you think will be the reputation hit that Apple suffers. People will hardly remember that the case was dismissed or even care if Apple wins. They will remember how a perception was created that Apple sold a defective product. This is the real damage.
But does that damage actually happen? Apple gets sued practically every week. Most people won't ever hear about it, and most of those that do will assume it's a BS suit, which is the default reaction to a lawsuit by most people in the US.
I have two other 3G phones. Nokia N82 and Nokia E61. I will concede that the iPhone has a better browser, but if I go to the same web page with the iPhone (BBC, CNN, MSNBC), the Nokia's simply get there first. This is not a scientific test by any means but I bet her suit gets traction because her claims will for the most part be verifiable. The iPhone is not slow but it is not as fast as other 3G phones. Apple better shit a solution and fast.
I am an iphone user. Both original and 3g. yes there are various software issues. Yes 3g kicks off more and goes to 2g. Yes I do get dropped calls from time to time. I dont care if the 3g speed is not the fastest among other 3g devices. And i had exactly 2 weeks to return it without penalty and i chose to stick with the frustration because quite simply other phones would bore me now. I do hope apple comes up with these patches quickly. This is still a very young product and future iphones will obviously have their OS rock solid. Apple is new to the phone game that it wont get it perfectly right. Other phones have a simple os this is a computer.
I guess you have to weigh it out. Is it the best phone. No. Its the best mobile device. Its a decent phone but everything else is top notch. And eventually apple have their software right. I have been waiting for it for a year. But I have a feeling Jobs is sick of all this apple bashing. He will fix everything this year. Apple might be a secretive company but they are prideful. Their products arent hard to use for buggy. So this is an abberation that will be corrected sooner rather then later.
September will probably have some significant updates and will all these units out there. Hopefully apple is getting error logs from the phones when we sync to itunes and sending it to itself. I do remember iphone asking if you want to send data to apple sometime when i first connected the device.
The ipod was a new device so whatever we got we were happy with. Unfortunately cell phone isnt a new thing. None of us woud have been complaining if cell phones didnt exist and apple came up with this. We just have other devices to compare it to so we can say this sucks or this is better on another model. But I digress. I love apple but yes it does get frustrating at times. But i am happier with their stuff then without if it comes down to it.
It is ridiculous money grabbing. The Iphone 3G can do things "twice" as fast, if the At&t network was good then, there would be no weak signals or need for the iPhone to downgrade to EDGE. Apple will be doing all they can to fix this problem behind the scenes.
With mobile me, I was a .mac user, with the balls up they gave us weeks of extra contract for free. I wasn't even very pissed off, it was a pain for a week after the launch, but that has to be expected with any new software. Apple do fix things and there is no such thing as a perfect device that uses software. The difference between Apple and other manufacturers is that Apple is going to fix it as soon as they can.
I am thinking that, in such a case, claiming misrepresentation (being induced to enter into a contract by false statements not amounting to a term of the contract) is probably more efficient than claiming a breach of 'express warranty'? ... I fail to see any warranty here, express or implied.
Or is this just 'advertising puff', in which case misrep cannot be claimed on that basis? Any lawyers take on this?
I believe (my contracts class was a year ago, but I did write the top exam in my class ) the advantage would be that breach of warranty brings up the possibility of delicious, tort-like damages, where a regular contract claim will only allow expectation damages.
I'd have to go review some notes to give a more accurate response.
Since it's a specific, quantitative thing (twice as fast!) that's probably beyond "advertising puff" which is why they have the disclaimer irnchriz mentions.
I think they'll be fine. Virtually every consumer product has problems and most of educated america realizes that filing a law suit is like going to grocery store - it seems like everyone is doing it. Ya know, the economy is down so the only real way to make money is to take it from people/businesses who are successful
Ya know - re-distribution of wealth and all of that :-D
But does that damage actually happen? Apple gets sued practically every week. Most people won't ever hear about it, and most of those that do will assume it's a BS suit, which is the default reaction to a lawsuit by most people in the US.
Good question. I have no idea. I am looking at the longer term damage in the reputation for Apple than just the iPhone.
If you say so but I did not think it work this way as my understanding is that it is a full HTML browser. I thought that the Nokia borwsers were using a similar webkit that the iPhone is using. This was mentioned here in another thread a while back. If you got the info let it flow, and no, I did not try to make it rhyme. Well the last no part I did.
Comments
Uh - did they also explain their 3G connectivity was going to be CRAP around the world? I'm looking for it now in their published literature. If you find it first then let us know, OK?
Troll much?
Or is this just 'advertising puff', in which case misrep cannot be claimed on that basis? Any lawyers take on this?
Exactamundo. Right on the money.
I have two other 3G phones. Nokia N82 and Nokia E61. I will concede that the iPhone has a better browser, but if I go to the same web page with the iPhone (BBC, CNN, MSNBC), the Nokia's simply get there first. This is not a scientific test by any means but I bet her suit gets traction because her claims will for the most part be verifiable. The iPhone is not slow but it is not as fast as other 3G phones. Apple better shit a solution and fast.
Perhaps those other phones are loading specially made Mobile Websites. You know the really simplified versions they have to make for 'smart phones' unable to run real browsers.
I am thinking that, in such a case, claiming misrepresentation (being induced to enter into a contract by false statements not amounting to a term of the contract) is probably more efficient than claiming a breach of 'express warranty'? ... Or is this just 'advertising puff', in which case misrep cannot be claimed on that basis? Any lawyers take on this?
Win or lose what do you think will be the reputation hit that Apple suffers. People will hardly remember that the case was dismissed or even care if Apple wins. They will remember how a perception was created that Apple sold a defective product. This is the real damage.
Perhaps those other phones are loading specially made Mobile Websites. You know the really simplified versions they have to make for 'smart phones' unable to run real browsers.
Not sure what you are talking about and it appears you don't either but so that now you will have a clue, take a peek at these links and read the specs that you missed. By the way, they run Flash.
http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4688582 (N82)
http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4221032 (E61i)
Win or lose what do you think will be the reputation hit that Apple suffers. People will hardly remember that the case was dismissed or even care if Apple wins. They will remember how a perception was created that Apple sold a defective product. This is the real damage.
I think they'll be fine. Virtually every consumer product has problems and most of educated america realizes that filing a law suit is like going to grocery store - it seems like everyone is doing it. Ya know, the economy is down so the only real way to make money is to take it from people/businesses who are successful
Ya know - re-distribution of wealth and all of that :-D
Not sure what you are talking about and it appears you don't either but so that now you will have a clue, take a peek at these links and read the specs that you missed. By the way, they run Flash.
http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4688582 (N82)
http://www.nokia.co.uk/A4221032 (E61i)
Given the same connection the iPhone is going to load the page faster as it's engine is faster than any other mobile on the market. Your real problem is with the connection not with how fast the iPhone can render the page.
In rural areas with 3G and fewer users, I get 400-900 kbps download speeds on 3G. It is fantastic and much faster than the 90-160 kbps I am getting on EDGE.
However, in urban areas with 3G and many more users, I am getting 300-600 kbps downloads speeds on 3G. This is still faster than the 90-160 kbps I am getting on EDGE.
There are more problems with urban areas since there are more users.
I believe AT&T has a lot of blame for not anticipating and building more bandwidth into the system with the large number of people who are buying the iPhone 3G and using their data capabilities. This is shown by how much more trouble there is with 3G in urban areas.
AT&T got its wish - more higher paying customers for its data services.
But now AT&T has to continue to build a better network.
And I believe that there should be a law that lawyers who file frivolous lawsuits should get the death penalty. They are a waste.
Am I missing something here? When you go to Apple's website the first thing to appear states "Twice as fast. Half the price." -without any asterisk stating exceptions. Now I'm not saying Apple is being deceptive- but that is what they state in all their advertising. Just being devil's advocate- pleez don't get mad people.
That's true but if you click on the iPhone (or go to purchase it) the asterisk shows up. I mean, I think the big problem here is people who are impulse buying and not realizing what they are getting into. The "masses" never complained about Treo's or BB's because the masses didn't buy them but now we're introducing smartphones to an entirely new demographic of people who aren't the traditional smartphone type and are unwilling to accept any problems (mainly because their old phone was so crappy it "just worked" because it didn't have to do much, well, work).
Apple was smart to put in a disclaimer.
It is standard practice.
Always put "Your mileage may vary" on any claim to keep you safe from all but the dumbest of dumbass lawyers.
The disclaimer kills the lawsuit. It is frivolous.
Funnily enough Apple have placed a disclaimer on all of their advertising regarding 'twice as fast'
* Comparisons between iPhone 3G (8GB) and first-generation iPhone (8GB) running on EDGE. Actual speeds vary by site conditions. Requires new two-year AT&T rate plan, sold separately to qualified customers.
Some features, applications, and services are not available in all areas. See your carrier for details.
Some applications are not available in all areas. Application availability and pricing are subject to change.
Just another example of a stupid illiterate cow.
vulture frivilous, money hungry greedy bastards.
Win or lose what do you think will be the reputation hit that Apple suffers. People will hardly remember that the case was dismissed or even care if Apple wins. They will remember how a perception was created that Apple sold a defective product. This is the real damage.
But does that damage actually happen? Apple gets sued practically every week. Most people won't ever hear about it, and most of those that do will assume it's a BS suit, which is the default reaction to a lawsuit by most people in the US.
Exactamundo. Right on the money.
I have two other 3G phones. Nokia N82 and Nokia E61. I will concede that the iPhone has a better browser, but if I go to the same web page with the iPhone (BBC, CNN, MSNBC), the Nokia's simply get there first. This is not a scientific test by any means but I bet her suit gets traction because her claims will for the most part be verifiable. The iPhone is not slow but it is not as fast as other 3G phones. Apple better shit a solution and fast.
I am an iphone user. Both original and 3g. yes there are various software issues. Yes 3g kicks off more and goes to 2g. Yes I do get dropped calls from time to time. I dont care if the 3g speed is not the fastest among other 3g devices. And i had exactly 2 weeks to return it without penalty and i chose to stick with the frustration because quite simply other phones would bore me now. I do hope apple comes up with these patches quickly. This is still a very young product and future iphones will obviously have their OS rock solid. Apple is new to the phone game that it wont get it perfectly right. Other phones have a simple os this is a computer.
I guess you have to weigh it out. Is it the best phone. No. Its the best mobile device. Its a decent phone but everything else is top notch. And eventually apple have their software right. I have been waiting for it for a year. But I have a feeling Jobs is sick of all this apple bashing. He will fix everything this year. Apple might be a secretive company but they are prideful. Their products arent hard to use for buggy. So this is an abberation that will be corrected sooner rather then later.
September will probably have some significant updates and will all these units out there. Hopefully apple is getting error logs from the phones when we sync to itunes and sending it to itself. I do remember iphone asking if you want to send data to apple sometime when i first connected the device.
The ipod was a new device so whatever we got we were happy with. Unfortunately cell phone isnt a new thing. None of us woud have been complaining if cell phones didnt exist and apple came up with this. We just have other devices to compare it to so we can say this sucks or this is better on another model. But I digress. I love apple but yes it does get frustrating at times. But i am happier with their stuff then without if it comes down to it.
With mobile me, I was a .mac user, with the balls up they gave us weeks of extra contract for free. I wasn't even very pissed off, it was a pain for a week after the launch, but that has to be expected with any new software. Apple do fix things and there is no such thing as a perfect device that uses software. The difference between Apple and other manufacturers is that Apple is going to fix it as soon as they can.
I am thinking that, in such a case, claiming misrepresentation (being induced to enter into a contract by false statements not amounting to a term of the contract) is probably more efficient than claiming a breach of 'express warranty'? ... I fail to see any warranty here, express or implied.
Or is this just 'advertising puff', in which case misrep cannot be claimed on that basis? Any lawyers take on this?
I believe (my contracts class was a year ago, but I did write the top exam in my class
I'd have to go review some notes to give a more accurate response.
Since it's a specific, quantitative thing (twice as fast!) that's probably beyond "advertising puff" which is why they have the disclaimer irnchriz mentions.
I think they'll be fine. Virtually every consumer product has problems and most of educated america realizes that filing a law suit is like going to grocery store - it seems like everyone is doing it. Ya know, the economy is down so the only real way to make money is to take it from people/businesses who are successful
Ya know - re-distribution of wealth and all of that :-D
I could go for a bit of the old wealth re-disto.
But does that damage actually happen? Apple gets sued practically every week. Most people won't ever hear about it, and most of those that do will assume it's a BS suit, which is the default reaction to a lawsuit by most people in the US.
Good question. I have no idea. I am looking at the longer term damage in the reputation for Apple than just the iPhone.
edited
If you say so but I did not think it work this way as my understanding is that it is a full HTML browser. I thought that the Nokia borwsers were using a similar webkit that the iPhone is using. This was mentioned here in another thread a while back. If you got the info let it flow, and no, I did not try to make it rhyme. Well the last no part I did.
Good question. I have no idea. I am looking at the longer term damage in the reputation for Apple than just the iPhone.
So am I. My point is the same.