Apple releases new 15" MacBook Pro

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  • Reply 120 of 383
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Cut it out wilco, you been ok for a while, don't go back to your old self.



    You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.
  • Reply 122 of 383
    r0bwr0bw Posts: 3member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Despite what some of you think, matte is no answer.



    Despite what you think, your opinion is no answer. It is merely an opinion. Matte vs Glossy is a subjective argument. Ramming your opinion down the throats of others doesn't somehow make your opinion indisputable.
  • Reply 123 of 383
    I have a Penryn MBP 15 inch and ordered the "matte", although it really should be called "satin" rather than matte. It combines the best of both traditional matte and glossy and is far easier on the eyes than any glossy display I've seen so far, especially the fishbowl effect of the old Macbook and the Macbook Air. I had a Macbook and it was just ruining my eyes. The matte was like a tremendous relief, sharper and yet less reflective. And at the same time a better predictor of how photos are going to work. On any inkjet printer, the glossy overestimates the degree of saturation. The only output that's even close in my view is the very high gloss Fuji Crystal Archive paper now used for enlargements at, among other places, Costco. And Crystal Archive is still very close as well to the latest matte/satin displays.



    I guess if I had to replace my computer in a hurry I'd reluctantly have to go refurb or, failing that, 17 inch, but there's no doubt that I'd at least confer with my geekier friends about setting up OS X with a Lenovo. I am really not happy about this development at all because of the awful experience with the Macbook (and also because the Macbook Air visibly had the same effect on me despite the superior backlight).



    I also like my two FireWire ports, quite honestly. Although I'll concede one thing to Apple on this -- in order to make the hard drive accessible they had absolutely no choice but to move the DVD to the side, and that took away a lot of space for ports. You can't have an accessible hard drive AND a back-hinged display AND an optical drive without losing a lot of space for extra ports. I wish Apple would revisit their display hinge so they can use the back of the computer for ports once again, but I think overall the decision on the FireWire is probably the right one under the circumstances. No excuse for losing it altogether on the MacBook though, it isn't as though they had to rearrange the case on that computer.



    At the same time earlier this year I got an NEC 24 inch monitor. Again, a good move. Even though the new Apple display is marginally cheaper and has a superb backlight, it doesn't work with legacy hardware, it does not have multiple inputs, it's not height adjustable, and once again you have to put up with that glossy-only surface. Added to which NEC's warranty and tech support are better than Apple.



    I firmly expect the new MacBook to sell like hotcakes despite Apple's bloody-minded deletion of FireWire, for the simple reasons that it finally has acceptable graphics and finally has an acceptable case. But that loss of satin "matte" on the MBP 15 is a killer for me. Try as I might, I simply have not found a glossy as yet that my eyes can work with.
  • Reply 124 of 383
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Except that adjusting the angle of the glossy screen a few degrees away from the lamp would eliminate it completely, while the horrible glare on the matte screen behind, which is much worse overall, would not.



    How you missed the fact that the entire middle of the matte screen is completely white from your flash (or something else), while the glossy screen wasn't affected at all, is hard to understand.



    I guess it just shows what I've been saying all along, you see what you want to, and ignore the rest.



    I also gather that photography is not his bent.
  • Reply 125 of 383
    hattighattig Posts: 860member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    Ah, fair point.

    My mistake on that calculaiton.





    And you had a fair point about the cost of business being a bit higher in the UK. And maybe I'm annoyed that I have to buy a new bathroom before I can buy shiny toys again.
  • Reply 126 of 383
    Apple went down to a 50 watt-hour battery in this new version. So the result is that to maintain the battery life of the previous version, you have to use the integrated graphics chip. In practice, that wouldn't be a problem if it supported 8GB of RAM. But it only supports 4GB, amazingly enough. And so to maintain the battery life of the previous computer, you have to give up RAM. Not good.
  • Reply 127 of 383
    slewisslewis Posts: 2,081member
    Null.
  • Reply 128 of 383
    justflybobjustflybob Posts: 1,337member
    Geez Louise,



    What a bunch of freakin' WHINERS!



    What is really sad is that many of you don't have a clue that the supposedly slower CPU's will actually produce a faster machine due to other enhancements.



    It's really rather simple.



    If you don't like it - don't buy it!
  • Reply 129 of 383
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,565member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mrochester View Post


    Here are a couple more comparisons for those interested. Apologies for the bluriness, I turned flash off to get a fairer comparison.











    You've done a good job of angling it for the worst effect.



    I also find that unless you like your monitor up high, which is a holdoever from the bad old days of putting monitors on top of the computer, or later, on top of something else, when you sit in front of it, it cuts down on a lot of the light entering.



    Tilting the screen down a few degrees also make reflections bounce towards the desk instead of your eyes.
  • Reply 130 of 383
    where to start...

    no one has mentioend the LIE about HDMI...it can drive a 58" Plasma but not a 30" display - sham! Then they charge you for the industry standard (DVI) adapter



    Where's the eSATA? Nobody uses freaking Firewire any more



    Where's the GD docking connector - time for another POS Book Enz dock - and another $300



    WTF with the case - who cares that you're making a more expensive case - it not LIGHTER



    Where's the longer battery life!!!!



    It's the same size, same weight, same CPU, same battery life, with a constantly glared screen!!!!
  • Reply 131 of 383
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Except that adjusting the angle of the glossy screen a few degrees away from the lamp would eliminate it completely, while the horrible glare on the matte screen behind, which is much worse overall, would not.



    The black on the glossy screen is black, while the black on the matte screen is grey.



    How you missed the fact that the entire middle of the matte screen is completely white from your flash (or something else), while the glossy screen wasn't affected at all, is hard to understand.



    I guess it just shows what I've been saying all along, you see what you want to, and ignore the rest.



    Trouble with that is to get the glossy screen to an angle where it doesn't reflect the light means putting it at a totally unsuable angle and/or contorting my sitting position to fit in with it, which is far from ideal if you are sitting for extended periods.



    It was simply the angle the photo was taken at that meant the glossy screen has no flash reflection.



    What the glossy screen gives you is a more focussed reflection of any light source, but also reflects a lot more than the matte screen to begin with.







    Quote:

    You've done a good job of angling it for the worst effect.



    They're actually both at about the same angle with the notebook held up in front of the TFT to take its photo.
  • Reply 132 of 383
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,565member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bread View Post


    This is exactly right... glossy screens oversaturate and provide too much contrast... that leads to washed out images when they are output to print and I don't know any pros who would touch one...



    ... then again I don't know anyone who would work extensively on a laptop for high quality photographic work (unless it's hooked up to a decent screen)...



    ...and as far as the issue of reflection goes it drives me mad and it seems I'm not the only one Apple!



    that's my 2p



    Again, have you heard of calibrating your monitor?



    I'm amazed at how some people here who claim to be graphics professionals in some capacity or another, fail to know even the most basic of requirements.



    If you do what you are supposed to do, which is calibrate your monitor, the color, saturation, and black levels, will be where they are supposed to be.



    If you don't, then you can't claim to have anything like a correct monitor.



    Glossy monitors calibrate better than do matte models.
  • Reply 133 of 383
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by YipYipYipee View Post


    But I have to agree the omission of a FireWire is not a good idea. Not a show-stopper mind you, but it does mean you'll have to purchase a CardBus FireWire adapter which Apple or some third-party supplier will gladly sell you.

    -YipYipYipee



    MB does not have an express card slot... what now



    I sold my older 17" just yesterday in hopes of a new 17". I guess I'll go refurb for now!
  • Reply 134 of 383
    anyone have a previous gen. glossy macbook pro and a glass-glossy imac to compare the level of glare & reflection?

    i am interested in how the last model with plastic-glossy compares to the new model with glassy-glossy
  • Reply 135 of 383
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by photoeditor View Post


    I have a Penryn MBP 15 inch and ordered the "matte", although it really should be called "satin" rather than matte. It combines the best of both traditional matte and glossy and is far easier on the eyes than any glossy display I've seen so far, especially the fishbowl effect of the old Macbook and the Macbook Air. I had a Macbook and it was just ruining my eyes. The matte was like a tremendous relief, sharper and yet less reflective. And at the same time a better predictor of how photos are going to work. On any inkjet printer, the glossy overestimates the degree of saturation. The only output that's even close in my view is the very high gloss Fuji Crystal Archive paper now used for enlargements at, among other places, Costco. And Crystal Archive is still very close as well to the latest matte/satin displays.



    I guess if I had to replace my computer in a hurry I'd reluctantly have to go refurb or, failing that, 17 inch, but there's no doubt that I'd at least confer with my geekier friends about setting up OS X with a Lenovo. I am really not happy about this development at all because of the awful experience with the Macbook (and also because the Macbook Air visibly had the same effect on me despite the superior backlight).



    I also like my two FireWire ports, quite honestly. Although I'll concede one thing to Apple on this -- in order to make the hard drive accessible they had absolutely no choice but to move the DVD to the side, and that took away a lot of space for ports. You can't have an accessible hard drive AND a back-hinged display AND an optical drive without losing a lot of space for extra ports. I wish Apple would revisit their display hinge so they can use the back of the computer for ports once again, but I think overall the decision on the FireWire is probably the right one under the circumstances. No excuse for losing it altogether on the MacBook though, it isn't as though they had to rearrange the case on that computer.



    At the same time earlier this year I got an NEC 24 inch monitor. Again, a good move. Even though the new Apple display is marginally cheaper and has a superb backlight, it doesn't work with legacy hardware, it does not have multiple inputs, it's not height adjustable, and once again you have to put up with that glossy-only surface. Added to which NEC's warranty and tech support are better than Apple.



    I firmly expect the new MacBook to sell like hotcakes despite Apple's bloody-minded deletion of FireWire, for the simple reasons that it finally has acceptable graphics and finally has an acceptable case. But that loss of satin "matte" on the MBP 15 is a killer for me. Try as I might, I simply have not found a glossy as yet that my eyes can work with.



    My previous agency/graphic design house had both matte and gloss at the beginning. Then we got smart and just bought gloss, but also pre-cut matte film for those that wanted it. However, making the proper lighting adjustments re intensity and positioning, gloss became the norm. Main reason: the crew just loved showing off their work more.



    My biggest mistake last year was getting a Macbook Pro 'matte'. Can't wait to pass it down now and get the new display as well.



    As for Firewire, can't think of any reason to have two or more ports that I can't do with one.
  • Reply 136 of 383
    hattighattig Posts: 860member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by treymaier View Post


    where to start...

    no one has mentioend the LIE about HDMI...it can drive a 58" Plasma but not a 30" display - sham! Then they charge you for the industry standard (DVI) adapter



    HDMI can drive a 1920x1080 display at 60Hz unless you have a HDMI 1.3 compliant device.



    DisplayPort can drive a 2560x1600 display at 60Hz. It can tunnel HDMI and DVI protocols.



    Quote:

    Where's the eSATA? Nobody uses freaking Firewire any more



    Audio and Video professionals use Firewire, and they use MacBook Pros.
  • Reply 137 of 383
    Every update will have their pros/cons.



    Overall I really like the new MBP and while I am neutral on the glossy/matte screen issue I look at the graphics architecture as a very significant upgrade, not as incremental as some suggest.



    This is easily more important than the usual speed bumps in processor speed which will inevitably follow soon. The change in RAM indicates a Mobo upgrade should already be in place.



    Re. BluRay I feel that licensing was a lame response though. No reason not to offer it as a BTO option and have people decide if it's worth the price. They had no problems doing that with solid state drives in the Air which offer less value than a BD upgrade...
  • Reply 138 of 383
    e1618978e1618978 Posts: 6,075member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by treymaier View Post


    where to start...

    no one has mentioend the LIE about HDMI...it can drive a 58" Plasma but not a 30" display - sham! Then they charge you for the industry standard (DVI) adapter



    Displayport supports higher resolutions that either HDMI 1.1, HDMI 1.3 or dual-link DVI, and it also has the advantage of longer transmission distances and no royalties. Your 58" plasma has a very low resolution compared to a 30" LCD monitor.
  • Reply 139 of 383
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,565member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by r0bw View Post


    Despite what you think, your opinion is no answer. It is merely an opinion. Matte vs Glossy is a subjective argument. Ramming your opinion down the throats of others doesn't somehow make your opinion indisputable.



    I suppose that those against glossy "ramming" their sometimes outsize opinions are ok?



    It's more than an opinion on my part. I've been in this business a long time, and have studied this issue in my own company with over 30 Macs there at any one time. I've worked with other companies on this as well If you have been around the commercial graphics industry for any time, you would know of the frustration amongst graphics professionals when glossy monitors began to disappear.



    Like it or not.
  • Reply 140 of 383
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,565member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post


    I also gather that photoraphy is not his bent.



    So I gather.
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