Apple fires its return salvo as Microsoft issues misleading 5th ad

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  • Reply 221 of 320
    jpellinojpellino Posts: 697member
    If the attitude here is even a hint of the attitude at work, well then, there you go.



    Shocked, shocked I am to find that the Main Street or Mall Apple Stores are pandering to their largest segment of users! They have the temerity to actually try and sell, service and support what people want! Those cads - providing separate in-depth support divisions for PRO and EDU!



    Okey dokey. Yes, I used to be able to drive to the mall and get EDU pricing and support. But you know what? I don't need to buy EDU things on 20 minutes' notice, and I get better support from EDU staffers.



    As for MacBook, the latest white one is just dandy for most of what you're ranting about. And I predict the next iteration of the MacBook Alu will have FireWire back. The faithful are not applauding the loss, they're still decrying it. The only one I remember by name defending it was Steve in an uncharacteristically personal email response to an end-user, but he has a historically capricious streak when it comes to defending design decisions (remember how "perfect" the basketball iMac was supposed to be?)



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hiimamac View Post


    But he's right. I worked fir apple retail. You used to stay away from customers, now you have to approach them. Apple used to be about creative, graphics, avid, pro tools, then came fcp, avid was not pleased, and neither was divi when logic was scooped up. But then came the iPhone. And all the 1 to 1 trainers that knew motion, fcp, shake were gone, it became about baby strollers, barking dog, grandmothers that wanted to learn email attachments. Next time you visit an apple store, ask a trainer if they know final cut, 1 outof 10 might know it. Shake? Forget it. None will know. They even seperated pro care. Pro care and one to one was the same program. Now you need to dpesnd double to get both. It's all about iPhone and consumer joe. Meanwhile, when the MacBook could run fcp and motion while benchmarking at 171% in openGL, apple went out if their way to stop the .01% user base from using the cheap douriin for high end apps and the released a new gma that dropped the openGL from 171% all the way down to 70%. Nice way to reward us creatives fir sticking buy you/apple for all thoses years. Then the new nvidia gpu came out, you could run pro apps again only this time apple removed FireWire so now the pros could not attach video cameras and musicians could not use FireWire audio devices, and IT peeps could not boot to target disk, and all to stop a pro user from buying a cheap solution. The sad part is apple fails to realize the to would buy the cheap solution as a backup, not their man rig.



    Then all the fanboys argued apple knew what they were doing and that FireWire was no longer needed, obviously they were not pros, and have never benchmarked USB vs FireWire not to mention most high end audio used FireWire but then apple released the mini with FireWire and a decent GPU, the fanboys were speechless, they had no retort. For the pro, they realized they could now buy a backup system cheaply but apple would NOT allow the pro to have something portable which even at the apple site, most remote stories about us pros, had MacBook pros on location. You can't take a mini into the woods or on location. Plus apple reduced the CPU and made the machines slower.



  • Reply 222 of 320
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hiimamac View Post


    But he's right. I worked fir apple retail. You used to stay away from customers, now you have to approach them. Apple used to be about creative, graphics, avid, pro tools, then came fcp, avid was not pleased, and neither was divi when logic was scooped up. But then came the iPhone. And all the 1 to 1 trainers that knew motion, fcp, shake were gone, it became about baby strollers, barking dog, grandmothers that wanted to learn email attachments. Next time you visit an apple store, ask a trainer if they know final cut, 1 outof 10 might know it. Shake? Forget it. None will know. They even seperated pro care. Pro care and one to one was the same program. Now you need to dpesnd double to get both. It's all about iPhone and consumer joe. Meanwhile, when the MacBook could run fcp and motion while benchmarking at 171% in openGL, apple went out if their way to stop the .01% user base from using the cheap douriin for high end apps and the released a new gma that dropped the openGL from 171% all the way down to 70%. Nice way to reward us creatives fir sticking buy you/apple for all thoses years. Then the new nvidia gpu came out, you could run pro apps again only this time apple removed FireWire so now the pros could not attach video cameras and musicians could not use FireWire audio devices, and IT peeps could not boot to target disk, and all to stop a pro user from buying a cheap solution. The sad part is apple fails to realize the to would buy the cheap solution as a backup, not their man rig.



    Then all the fanboys argued apple knew what they were doing and that FireWire was no longer needed, obviously they were not pros, and have never benchmarked USB vs FireWire not to mention most high end audio used FireWire but then apple released the mini with FireWire and a decent GPU, the fanboys were speechless, they had no retort. For the pro, they realized they could now buy a backup system cheaply but apple would NOT allow the pro to have something portable which even at the apple site, most remote stories about us pros, had MacBook pros on location. You can't take a mini into the woods or on location. Plus apple reduced the CPU and made the machines slower.







    I am really surprised how much the pro has been dumped on and how apple only cares about iPhone and iLife users. Amazing. New fcp and logic rumored to be coming but if you want portable FireWire you need to spend $2000 minium. And one to one trainers? Theyare mostly ilife specialists.



    Aple used to be about creatives and the mac pro used to be a affordable solution, the iMac used to have matte screens and were in many graphic departments but they are so powerful CPU wise, apple decides to make you buy the pro. To make sure, not only did the iMac come in glossy, they reduced the GPU power.



    The segment that stuck with apple through thick and thin are the users apple hurt the most. Stunning. It's become all about barking dog, crying baby, how do I send an email attachment. The good news though is that there is a silent, growing crowd of switchers who know what a front side bus is, how fast 1066 vs 667 is, that opengl can be used to help the CPU rendering process, and more importantly, price to performance and while their voice may be silent now, not making a difference, it's only a matter of time before they, combined with the to users and a small portion of 2 year expired iphone users, made thief voices heard. Apple will have no choice but to respond.



    Godspeed all, may you reach your dreams.



    they took out fire wire ??? why ??? i heard it was a room thing ???i love fire wire .



    is usb 2 fast ???

    i will buy the last fire wire mac before it goes away forever .
  • Reply 223 of 320
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post


    Now, you finally make sense to me.



    You used to work for Apple as a genius and got fired (for your obvious bad attitude and poor interpersonal skills), and thus are a bitter, ex-Apple employee with an axe to grind.



    Now, the fact that you totally rage-out every day about every little detail of everything related to Apple makes perfect sense. Nothing Apple can ever do will fix the hurt when they fired you eh?



    LOL!



    PS - Don't bother arguing you weren't fired. I have ten years retail experience and 15 as a computer tech. A guy with your attitude would be fired in a week tops no matter what his technical skills.



    hey no kicking when down ..ok



    maybe he needs a hug ??
  • Reply 224 of 320
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 20,401member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post


    It is also Economics 101. I wonder if anyone troubles themselves as much about why people will happily pay three times more for a cup of coffee at Starbucks than they will at Dunkin' Doughnuts.



    It's Donuts, Doctor, Donuts.



    British, huh?
  • Reply 225 of 320
    rfrmacrfrmac Posts: 89member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by imapcandmac View Post


    Picasa is available on the Mac and I use it often



    I have Photoshop Elements and Premiere Elements on Windows ($99 for the package) which are light years ahead of iPhoto, iMovie, and iDVD.



    I liked iMovie 6 much better than the current version. The encoding used in iDVD is poor and pixelated and choppy compared to Premiere Elements.



    Light years ahead of iMovie - I use FCP myself (Final Cut Pro) but, iMovie has some great features in it that should be in FCP not to mention Premiere - As for Elements, yes it has some things iPhoto does not have but you can do a lot i iPhoto.



    This one thing is not about whether you use the iLife suit or not. I don't care. What it is about is the operating system and the integration of hardware. I don't want to use the 8 generation of DOS with troublesome hardware integration of hardware with a copy cat front end (yes, most of the ideas that come from Redmond in the PC market came from either Apple or someone else first. Now argue with that!
  • Reply 226 of 320
    istinkistink Posts: 250member
    LOL look at all the comments.



    Guys, are you happy with your computers? Yes? Then who gives a shit?



    Let Apple and Microsoft make whatever ads they want. Hell, let the companies claim buyer's of the competitor's products will catch the plague. It makes no difference. I've NEVER heard a person, or even heard OF a person that says "I bought this because of the commercial."



    This whole thing seems mind bogglingly retarded on so many levels.
  • Reply 227 of 320
    dr millmossdr millmoss Posts: 5,403member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    It's Donuts, Doctor, Donuts.



    British, huh?



    Ha-ha, no. I don't much eat or drink either one as it happens.
  • Reply 228 of 320
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    It's Donuts, Doctor, Donuts.



    I see "Donuts" as Do Nots. I'm on a diet.



    just kiddin' y'all. I'm not on a diet at all, but I should be though. I'm not obese, but overweight, lol.
  • Reply 229 of 320
    lakorailakorai Posts: 34member
    I would like to know when Apple will make an ExpressCard slot standard on ALL portable macs. I would also like to know when they will attempt to put eSATA onto their machines, as many pros now use eSATA as it is far superior in performance to Firewire and especially USB.



    EFI-X forever. Apple can't have their stranglehold on their hardware forever.
  • Reply 230 of 320
    ebrunnebrunn Posts: 75member
    I object.....
  • Reply 231 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


    Sure, for most people. That's why Windows has such a high share. It doesn't take a genius to figure that out.



    But for enough people, perhaps between 5% and 8% (but growing fairly rapidly, and in my view, a share that will level off at 10% or so globally), it's also about a far better OS, no malware, no spyware, no techie-BS, the integration of the computer with their personal lives (iLife, iPod, iPhone, @tv) and so forth. There is a sufficient group out there - and it's not Lauren and her mom - that are happy with that situation. No one has a gun to their heads.



    Btw, if anyone is signaling panic and desperation with these ads, it surely must be MSFT: they must be seeing something happening in their customer/channel pipeline about switching behavior that we don't yet.



    Or they got pissed of with years of Apple making fun of them.



    I can see how annoying that might feel for MS - like having a mosquito buzzing around your ears, each time with just a bit different frequency
  • Reply 232 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    How long did it take PC vendors to get rid of parallel ports for chrissake?



    For Christ and all other sakes... why would you want to get rid of parallel port if you still have good printer based on that port..? Because it doesn't look good at the back of your desktop..? Too big? Too many pins inside..?



    As printer manufacturers moved away from good old Centronics, so did PC manufacturers.



    If I happened to have printer with parallel port that I want to keep, I'd be hilariously happy to see my new rig still having such port... if not, at least I can still get PCI card with parallel port, thanks God.
  • Reply 233 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by imapcandmac View Post


    Two of the recent ads for the Mac talked about the PC locking up all the time. As I mentioned above, I have had more issues with OS X than Vista or Windows 7. We have a lot of Windows users at work and lockups are not common at all in the past several years with XP and Vista.



    Additionaly, in "Elimination" ad no one chopped off Justin Long's arms and legs when small screen computers were asked to leave. I'd guess 13" Macbooks are considered to be small screen nowadays, right?



    I'm still wondering about Justin's head, too... not having quad core CPU in any Mac (but Pro tower), Justin should have lost something when slow CPU's were dismissed



    Oh, man. Funny ad, but so useless; so much more bullshit there than in MS ads, IMHO.
  • Reply 234 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by evilcnboy View Post


    Lol, do you even know what you talking about??? Have you really used iLife. iPhoto, like Picasa and Photoshop, is meant to be more of a organizer and presentation of your photos with some editing features. For real editor, you have to go things like PS or after effect, which most ppl won't used. iPhoto is "light years" ahead, Picasa is the best alternative on the windows for such basic app. Why do you think google doesn't have a mac version of it (as they already going to have chrome for mac soon), cuz they know they won't get any share there. iMovie only a lil bit better than movie make? tat's a joke rite? really funny. Movie maker is worthless piece of junk while iMovie is sufficient to make gorgeous home movies for a lot of great features. For professional, you could need such thing as Final Cut Pro (which is arguable the best) or Premiere. Garageband vs. songsmith, lol, no need to test which is way superior.



    For basic "fun" with music, photos, videos, iLife (which target basic users) beats same categorical apps on windows. For professional, most creative prof will tell you they prefer software to be on a mac.



    just my 2 cent, no offense



    After Effects..? For photo editing..?



    Now that would be something new for me. I used to live in belief AE is for video post-production, mostly..?
  • Reply 235 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 8CoreWhore View Post


    One can't talk about "price to specs" comparisons without talking about the OS and over-all user experience. A Hyundai is not an Acura, etc. I want the best user experience I can afford, and that's a Mac. Period. The Microsoft ads don't mention MS products for a reason, just Dell and Intel. The Apple ads emphasize the OS.



    Do they? I had impression Apple ads emphasize that PCs are crashing, freezing and virus-ing all the time.
  • Reply 236 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dorotea View Post


    One thing - After 3.5 years how much would you be able to sell your home brew PC for? I traded my iMac G5 for $500.00 to the local dealer in town for a brand new iMac.



    My Mom is still using my 2003 iBook for basic computing.



    And I'm typing this on late 2001 Toshiba Satellite 1000, P3, 15GB HDD, upgrade to huge 512MB of RAM. So... what?
  • Reply 237 of 320
    hiimamachiimamac Posts: 584member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post


    It is also Economics 101. I wonder if anyone troubles themselves as much about why people will happily pay three times more for a cup of coffee at Starbucks than they will at Dunkin' Doughnuts.



    Ever hear the phrase, the lighter the bean, the more caffine? Strong caffinated coffee will taste like tea. Seattles Best has a green roast. Vey mild yet packs a punch. Also why breakfast coffee tastes mild, it has more caffine. Starbucks over roasts their coffee, every type is burnt. Will take an Italian esspresso or capacinno any day over starbucks and Duncan Doughnuts, founded in England, has been around for ever. While it has a stereo type police type client base, they do make a better cup of coffee. It's the doughnut smell I could do without. Never understood people that considered doughnuts breakfast nor pancakes for that matter. The French know a good breakfast.
  • Reply 238 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sesnir View Post


    Paying a little more for a Mac only stings for the first day... then it's 5 years of pure joy.



    Going the Windows route, you may pay less but the aggravation stays with you forever.



    No idea what you're talking about.



    No aggravation here, just joy.



    Came home from work, did some photos for my Picassa Web album. Breezed through one chapter of my last travel video (Quad core and 8 GB of RAM do miracles). Relaxed with 2 missions in GTAIV. Now I'm pretending to be a company to my wife watching "Brothers and Sisters" while typing this on prehistoric Toshiba Satellite 1000. After that, probably a game or two of Battlefield Heroes before bedtime.



    Maybe I'm blessed, but with 8 PCs functional in my house today, number of problems I had in last decade was really irrelevant. All the fun with games, photos, videos, LAN parties with friends and colleagues - priceless.



    But Apple keep saying my PCs are crashing and getting viruses all the time. Ooooh, they must be right!
  • Reply 239 of 320
    nikon133nikon133 Posts: 2,600member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by eldernorm View Post


    You know, cheap crap is always best. :-)



    Just a thought,

    en



    That thought is worth pretty much as the following one: It must be good because it is so expensive!
  • Reply 240 of 320
    hiimamachiimamac Posts: 584member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MadisonTate View Post


    Try pricing a Dell T7500 against a Mac Pro Nehalem (be sure to use 55xx Xeon processors for both). Apple is actually a good bit cheaper!



    I know and you made my point. When people say macs are over priced and bring up the mac pro, most compare a dell and point out that the mac is cheaper and it is.



    What users are really trying to say is that there is no mid range or desktop Mac that's not an iMac and that the Mac Pro is designed to have higher margins when Apple could have built a 8 Core non server processor and used regular ram. By building it the way they did, they keep price comparisons on par with pcs. What's really needed is to benchmark a hackntosh 8 core i7 machine against a mac pro. This will tell the real story as desktops rarely break down. This the low price for apple care. The desktops dell sells in that price range are not geared toward the consume, they, and all other of makers have mid range, high end, ie not the top of the line yet powerful, desktops wheras apple does not. Even their iMac, if you consider it a desktop, runs on mobile parts. Frankly, I bet if apple released a i7 8 core machine for $1100, you would never hear about over priced anymore. Maybe once in a while on the mac book pros, but not nearly as much as we hear now.



    Peace.
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