Apple fires its return salvo as Microsoft issues misleading 5th ad

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  • Reply 121 of 320
    tomkctomkc Posts: 4member
    I've got an idea of how to address the latest MS ad campaign of "You find it, You keep it".



    But this time have two separate shoppers who are looking for a laptop.



    This time however don't just talk about screen size and speed but also talk about what to do with it; word processing, spreadsheets, edit photos, edit video, create a web page etc.



    (In 1979 the program "VisaCalc" is released as a spreadsheet for the Apple computers. This drives the the Apple computer beyond the 1 million mark in sales. VisaCalc (or Visible Calculator) was created by: Dan Bricklin with some help of his friend Dan Fylstra. The software program alone is responsible for more computer sales than can be guessed at. For the first time, software drives the computer industry, and the term "Killer App" is coined.)



    The one shopper goes online schedules a personal shopper at a Apple Store and takes straight to the MacBook Pro and gets quick personal service and schedules training while she's there.



    The other shopper searches and find the PC to find comparable hardware and then starts shopping for the software.



    (I'll assume the price is going to be close.)



    Finally leaving the PC buyer stops and says, "Oh shoot, I forget virus protection software" and returns back into the store.



    It might also be great if you could then show a "next day or days later" when the PC shopper at home installing the software on their own and looking through the manual to learn how to use it with some sense of frustration. Then go the Mac buyer at a training session at the Apple Store having a great time learning all the features and ease of use.



    You could use a tag with the narrator saying something like, "CHEAPER ISN'T ALWAYS BETTER AND APPLE/MAC PROVES IT".



    PLUS - If you wanted to keep along your I'm a Mac theme you could have the actors playing those rolls at the beginning with the two shoppers in the White Screen set then as a break from the norm going along with them on the shopping spree observing.



    I don't know that you could do it in a 30/60 second spot but it sure would be cool.
  • Reply 122 of 320
    mactrippermactripper Posts: 1,328member
    Apple has a problem with a limited product line.



    Glossy Screens are simply bad, especially for Pro's/long use.



    Apple should innovate, make any computer easily switch from



    glossy or matte by Apple Store techie before purchase.





    Will NOT buy a glossy Mac, Apple needs to fix that fast for all models.





    Now PC we have a choice, but then no OS X.



    I like my 15" matte Macbook Pro with Fusion, Vista, XP and Ubuntu.



    But I need new one, with no gloss.



    COME ON APPLE!!
  • Reply 123 of 320
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,423member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by imapcandmac View Post


    Really, I thought I was the first ever. Thank you for correcting me!



    A lot of Mac users aren't cognizant, just read the forums.



    New Macs do come with iLife but you must purchase every year to stay current. I wouldn't say this is absolutely free. iPhoto sucks as it is not a real photo editor and forces a directory structure on the user. Picasa is much better and free as an organizer and PhotoShop Elements is a great cheap editor. Too bad the Mac version is always a year behind. Windows Photo Gallery that comes with Vista is better than iPhoto IMO. iMovie is a joke anymore and not much better than Movie Maker. I would recommend buying a better video editor. iDVD is very limited and there are free alternatives for the PC. Likewise, there are several free Web creators for the PC with more capability. I personally have not used GarageBand much (nor do I know many that have) so I cannot comment.



    Oh they're cognizant they're just having fun at Windows expense. This is an Apple centric forum. Yes new Mac come with iLife which of course is free of charge their their plight is no different than the PC user who purchases the Adobe product knowing there will be future upgrades to better product. Picasa is horrible it was a good looking interface for managing photos like 4 years ago and Google pretty much added features bet let the UI languish. The Picasa fans talk about stuff that doesn't matter to people like "I want to be able to manage my file structure" Puhleeze. Picasa was left in the dust the minute Apple went Events and the new version is so much better than Picasa I downloaded the dmg for Picasa and then deleted it. No value whatsoever. Also keep in mind the photos in your iPhoto library show up in any application that supports the media browser. That's a cool feature.



    Oh please tell me what's a joke about iMovie 09. This should be fun....tell me what I'm missing out on so much. I have realtime effects and transitions. I have the ability to edit easily with a good degree of accuracy and fine control. If you need a timeline and plugins and the like you're better off with Final Cut Express or some other third party app. Someone give me a cogent argument as to why iMovie 09 isn't the "right" application to get the new video editor into the game? The people bitchin' about iMovie are the ones that should be using Final Cut Express Vegas or something. Champagne tastes on a beer budget.



    iDVD is dead. Apple doesn't care about optical formats anymore and that includes Blu-ray. Why would take the CPU time to to 2-pass DVD encoding when I can just export my video creation to a quicktime format and play on an Apple TV or put up on my website. DVD is passe but it's nice to be able to burn the DVD disc every now and then.



    You keep tossing out the FREE mantra ....you have a Mac but you don't even understand the benefits. Every cheap app you think you're gaining with you're losing if it doesn't have the type of integration Mac users expect. I expect my media to be available in other apps and thus if it's free but my files don't show up in Media Browsers in other apps it's a non starter.



    PC are great if you look at a computer as just another tool laying around. Macs are great when you see the touches that OS X to integrate apps via the services menu or media browsers or system wide calendar and address book along with data detectors.



    Keep digging....you have a Mac...but you don't understand it yet.







    Quote:
    Originally Posted by guinness View Post


    I can build my own PC, even throwing in an OEM copy of Windows, or free ISO of Ubuntu, and build it with better specs than just about any OEM PC, and and Apple (easily). DDR3, quad-core, Lian Li/Cooler Master case, etc.



    When I got my Mac (C2D Mini) about a year and a half ago, I was all geeked about iLife 08 too, but then I came to the conclusion, I don't make web pages, don't make music, and don't have a camcorder, and then I was basically left with only iPhoto, but I don't like that either.





    They work, I don't worry about it.



    Macs have always appealed to creative types. I love music and films and thus I fall right into their historically core market. If a person just does basic document creation and web stuff I don't think a Mac is going to appeal all that much to them





    I'll tell you my mother's ran her law practice on XP and now Vista and she's ready to be done. She's had to pay hundreds to fix problems here and she got bitten by the 64-bit Vista driver issue which caused her Scansnap to fail to work. Windows 7 could be her savior but right now a Mac and a few months and I think she's a convert. I gotta think she's not the only one. Should she know more about maintenance of her PC? Perhaps but she's got a huge case load and no IT staff...I don't think a PC is the ideal platform for her. All she needs is Office for compatibility and a few PC programs that she likes that would easily run in Parallels or Fusion.
  • Reply 124 of 320
    piotpiot Posts: 1,346member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


    Security is about technical measures......etc etc etc



    If you are going to quote people, Quad, then at least provide an attribution.
  • Reply 125 of 320
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,423member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post


    Apple has a problem with a limited product line.



    Glossy Screens are simply bad, especially for Pro's/long use.



    COME ON APPLE!!





    Consumers have by and large chosen glossy screens. I really don't buy the whole Pros don't use glossy screens because I've sold Pro monitors before and hey always come with hoods to block out relections and many come with calibration hardware.



    CRTs always had a bit of gloss and reflections because they weren't a flat surface.
  • Reply 126 of 320
    sesnirsesnir Posts: 4member
    Paying a little more for a Mac only stings for the first day... then it's 5 years of pure joy.



    Going the Windows route, you may pay less but the aggravation stays with you forever.
  • Reply 127 of 320
    avidfcpavidfcp Posts: 381member
    Would you like some kook aid with that statement??





    A few years ago you could by a g5 then save thousands upgrading your own memory. Apple saw an end to that. Bufoon. Are mac pros servers? Of course not. Could a mac pro been built with different CPU and regular memory? Of course it can but they didn't and this kept the price high, artificially too as a macpro with standar memory and i7 would be much cheaper but they didn't so now they are over priced server parts. Try comparing a mac pro to a pc workstation that's not server parts. The reason it high is due to server parts. Pass the Kool aid.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MFago View Post


    Sorry, it's not so simple.



    Try to price out a Dell similar to a top-of-the line Mac Pro with 8x 2.93 GHz Xeon 5570, 12 GB Memory:



    Apple: $6300

    Dell: $9000



    The only way to get a PC with specs similar to the Apple is to buy from lesser-known brands (i.e. AVADirect) or build it yourself. The only limitation of the Apple is 8 memory slots versus 12.



    Macs certainly can be more expensive because there are fewer models available so Apple cannot (and does not want to) hit every price point. Apple tries not to make crap. There are plenty of crappy PCs available, such as the ones Microsoft points to in their ads. Apple's prices are usually pretty comparable at the high-end. It's the low-end that needs some help.



  • Reply 128 of 320
    cjd2112cjd2112 Posts: 83member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    Consumers have by and large chosen glossy screens. I really don't buy the whole Pros don't use glossy screens because I've sold Pro monitors before and hey always come with hoods to block out relections and many come with calibration hardware.



    CRTs always had a bit of gloss and reflections because they weren't a flat surface.



    Here is my response to such a comment on another forum (copy and pasted so excuse the dialog):



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nick9191 View Post


    So do that then. The big difference between the two panels is that glossy reflects light back whilst matte disperses the light over it's surface. So if your working in a lit room, it is negatively effecting your work in some way or another, however little. The difference, again as the article states, is that most people can "look through" reflections, no one can "look through" a washed out display.



    Incorrect. Again, please reread my explanation(s). The glossy display OVER-SATURATES images, making it much more difficult to photoshop or image edit. They may certainly look pretty and bright, but the Apple GLOSSY LED LCD is "pumping up" the image to above normal levels. Therefore, when other displays view the image it is nothing similar to what the Apple glossy display outputs. Secondly, prints from the Apple high gloss LED LCD displays will almost certainly be much darker than what the glossy LED LCD outputs. NO ONE, and I mean, NO SERIOUS photography or graphics PROFESSIONAL EVER uses a high gloss screen. Not if they want to keep their clients happy and producing quality work. The article is merely speaking in terms of consumer use and does not address actual professional quality usage. As such, in order to be certain that the display does not have a reflection, adjusting the brightness of the screen to the brightness of the room is essential. In doing so, actual image quality, consistency and brightness is sacrificed. (calibrating does not take this into effect, especially for image/photoshop editing)



    Quote:

    Why at night? Thats like saying look at a glossy display when it's off, you don't look at it when it's off, you look at it when it's on. Try looking out your window in the middle of the day, and turning your light on and off, no difference.



    Again,

    "... in order to be certain that the display does not have a reflection, adjusting the brightness of the screen to the brightness of the room is essential. In doing so, actual image quality, consistency and brightness is sacrificed." My example of turning the lights on and off was to demonstrate what happens when interior light ambience does not match the brightness/light of the glossy LED LCD. In order to be certain that no reflection is shown on the glossy screen, the high gloss screen and room have to have the same brightness level (basic physics). In doing so, actual image brightness and quality is NOT taken into account, and as such quality of image is sacrificed.



    If you need to understand how that matters than there really isn't any way I can explain it better for you. Either you are a professional graphic designer/editor/photographer or you're not, either way, the new Apple LED LCD's are NOT PRO-sumer grade hardware.



    Quote:

    There are many photographers and graphics designers on here that use glossy displays. The 24" LED costs $899, meaning that professionals are buying it, consumers don't pay $899 for a display.



    Ok, so by this logic if it IS expensive than it must certainly be PRO quality??? No. As such, a true graphics professional (and by this I am referring to the Liebovitz's, Ive's, etc of the world) buy EIZO or higher grade displays that start out at $1500 and go from there.



    (NOTE: It is important to realize that the Apple LED LCD's are not simply "glossy" but rather "high gloss" displays)
  • Reply 129 of 320
    quadra 610quadra 610 Posts: 6,757member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by italiankid View Post


    These Microsoft Ads are really hurting Mac for them to revolt.



    lol



    There is no evidence to suggest this. Apple has posted a record non-holiday quater recently . . . in a recession! Apple is virtually recession-proof (so far.)



    I don't know why you'd assume MS' ads are "hurting" Apple. Apple sells on margin, not volume. The bulk of MS' market has nothing to do with Apple beyond the iPod.



    MS seems to be the one forced to eat losses and lay employees off. MS stock has been sliding for a few years now. They've gone from 96%+ market share to 88.9% over the span of 2-3 years, which is substantial. And IE's share has been in a steady nosedive for a while now.



    These Mac ads are simply part of the ebb and flow of the yearly Mac ads. There have been many, with many different themes. If one of the most recent ones is an answer to MS ads, it's purely because Apple has an opportunity to do so. But the message has been the same since 2006, and it's been quite successful. This new ad is really no different.
  • Reply 130 of 320
    eldernormeldernorm Posts: 232member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by imapcandmac View Post


    It is funny to see Apple feel the need to respond to the Microsoft ads. I would think Apple would be above this if they were not worried about the ads.



    If Apple does not respond, then only one side of an arguement is shown. :-)



    Quote:

    I use own a PC and a Macbook Pro and run Windows, Mac OS X, and Linux regularly. I love my Macbook Pro but I have had Mac OS X lock up and have had to do 'Forced Quits' more on the Mac than the PC (running Vista and Windows 7). I have found the the Mac vs. PC ads filled with lies and half truths for a long time. It is funny that as soon as Microsoft plays this deception game that the Apple cult following gets their panties in a bunch.

    ,,,



    My MacBook locks up too occasionally, usually when running Windows Word.... :-( And by the way, Force Quit allows me to dump MS Word and yet keep everything else running. I cannot do that in windows where a crash is a total crash. PERIOD.. Just a thought. :-)



    Trolling for hits here??? The Mac vs PC ads actually say very little. They have only made true claims backed by fact. Or funny comments. ie PC hiding in a pizza box trying to capture a college student.. LOL Windows pays someone to buy a computer and yet the keep getting the cheap version. You know, cheap crap is always best. :-)



    Just a thought,

    en
  • Reply 131 of 320
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


    I don't know why you'd assume MS' ads are "hurting" Apple. Apple sells on margin, not volume.



    He always postes anti-Apple stuff. Never any attempt at a balanced post. If anything, these MS adds have helped Apple find more material for their long running "Get A Mac" ads.



    I predict we'll see an uptick in Windows sales (even excluding netbooks) and an increase in Windows marketshare and s light slowing of IE's drop in marketshare after Windows 7 hits the shelves.
  • Reply 132 of 320
    eldernormeldernorm Posts: 232member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Avidfcp View Post


    Seriously I don't know what planet some of you are on.



    Vista us not cheap. Yes it's a dud but windows 7 won't be .....Really some if you have fan boy glasses that are way to thick.



    XP is on more computers than anything else and have you see mobile 6.5?? It's a huge advacemen........, stop calling windows cheap, they are not,yes, some hardware is but not all, eg Sony.



    One big sale and windows owns any hardware they want but then all the whiners cry foul so grow up. Microsoft can do almost anything and ... Really. Some if the posts in here are so juvinile and misinformed. Unbelievable.



    Speaking of growing up.... I think Avidfcp needs to get out of his mothers basement once in a while. :-)



    And he makes a great case.... Just look at all the great things M$ is ...... going..... to ...... have.....:

    Windows mobile 6.5

    Windows mobile 7.0

    Windows 7



    And behave or M$ will buy you... They are so powerful, they can own the world and be its ruler.... if they wanted to. :-(



    PS. I think Steve Ballmer talked to this guy directly. And made many many promises. LOL



    Just a thought.

    en
  • Reply 133 of 320
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Virgil-TB2 View Post


    For someone calling others out about "lies and half truths" this statement is pretty hilarious.



    You're either telling some half truths and lies yourself, or you don't know what you're doing.



    Man, you fanboys are sensitive! I never said OS X had 'forced quits' a lot, just more than Windows in more recent experience. Seriously, since I have been running Vista, I cannot recall one lock up. Under OS X, I get one about every two weeks or a month, mostly in Safari or Firefox.



    It is also funny how people are saying I must not know what I am doing. It is pretty easy to run an app that came on the computer. When someone says their PC locked up, it is obviously MSFT's problem. However, when a Mac locks up, it is because the person is an idiot or bad third party software. You guys are too funny!



    For the record, I love my Macbook Pro because I can run OS X, Windows, and Linux on one box. I also like Windows and have had very good luck running many applications for years. There are good parts of both. I am just tired of Mac users and Apple claiming that Windows sucks, locks up all the time, and you get viruses within 30 seconds of turning your computer on. It is simply not true.



    The fact is that many people are very satisfied with a cheaper computer that runs the basics just fine. What is wrong with that?
  • Reply 134 of 320
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by eldernorm View Post


    My MacBook locks up too occasionally, usually when running Windows Word.... :-( And by the way, Force Quit allows me to dump MS Word and yet keep everything else running. I cannot do that in windows where a crash is a total crash. PERIOD.. Just a thought. :-)



    You ever hear of task manager?
  • Reply 135 of 320
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by imapcandmac View Post


    You ever hear of task manager?



    He did say, total crash. If he is running XP, like most people are still using then an app crash can bring down the whole system. I know Vista and Win7 have it and I think XP included something like it, but I don't think it was true protected memory.
  • Reply 136 of 320
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    He did say, total crash. If he is running XP, like most people are still using then an app crash can bring down the whole system. I know Vista and Win7 have it and I think XP included something like it, but I don't think it was true protected memory.



    I used XP for years and an app crash hardly ever caused a total crash. Have you ever used Windows?
  • Reply 137 of 320
    mactelmactel Posts: 1,275member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    These MS ads are getting better each time. They aren't as enjoyable as the Mac ads but I think MS is effective in conveying its point. I love healthy rivalry!





    PS: Thank you AI for using an iPhone compatible codec for the video.



    If it makes Apple lower their price points then I'm all for the ads.



    Keep them coming MS. I need another Mac!



    If anyone can direct me to a better PC app than iMovie then I might be tempted to get a PC. Nah, not really.
  • Reply 138 of 320
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by imapcandmac View Post


    I used XP for years and an app crash hardly ever caused a total crash. Have you ever used Windows?



    Your "Have you ever..." comments are wearing thin. Your anecdotal experience has nothing to do with various versions of Windows being to prevent a systemwide crash.



    Have you ever heard of Blue Screen of Death? Do you have any idea why it was named as such and how it often was not caused by a Windows app or directly by the OS but by a 3rd-party app being able to take down the entire machine and why protected memory was needed to begin with?
  • Reply 139 of 320
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTel View Post


    If anyone can direct me to a better PC app than iMovie then I might be tempted to get a PC. Nah, not really.



    Here are couple:
    There is always Final Cut Pro for Mac and the Mac version of Avid, which are better than iMovie, but for the consumer, iMovie should more than fit their needs.



    But if you really a sweet setup for Windows I'd go with this one.
  • Reply 140 of 320
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    If he is running XP, like most people are still using then an app crash can bring down the whole system.



    Not true. It is not possible in XP for an application crash to affect the entire system. User space and kernel space are cleanly separated just the same as in OS X.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Have you ever heard of Blue Screen of Death? Do you have any idea why it was named as such and how it often was not caused by a Windows app or directly by the OS but by a 3rd-party app being able to take down the entire machine and why protected memory was needed to begin with?



    That may have been the case with Windows 9x systems, but a BSoD in NT (including 2000, XP, Vista, etc.) is no different than a kernel panic in Unix (including Mac OS X): a crash that happens in kernel space, rather than user space. And that brings us right back on topic: if you do follow Microsoft's advice and "save" money by buying some cheapo laptop based purely on specs, chances are the manufacturer skimped on driver quality. So when a driver has a bug, it can cause a crash, and since drivers tend to be in kernel space, there's your BSoD.
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