AT&T: "Damn, we're going to charge an assload more for iPhone services than Apple is letting on! If only we weren't obliged to play ball because of being obliged to sell their damn phone, we'd be shouting that from the rooftops! We must continue to bit our tongues!"
AT&T: "Damn, we're going to charge an assload more for iPhone services than Apple is letting on! If only we weren't obliged to play ball because of being obliged to sell their damn phone, we'd be shouting that from the rooftops! We must continue to bit our tongues!"
Even if that was true, which I don't think it is, none of that explains why they would delay. ATT already allows cell phone users to tether their phone and there's no reason why iPhone users would use more data than other phone users when tethered. iPhone users will pay the same amount as other users to tether and will not use more data, so why would ATT care? It's all very profitable for ATT.
It isn't credible for AT&T to not want to offer tethering for the iPhone.
As has been said, they will charge for it.
Unless, for some reason, they won't.
We don't know. If they will charge, the reason why they aren't offering it could be some changes to their network as has also been mentioned, but it has also been written about this that they have to alter something in each account first, and that that will take time.
I would imagine that they would like to charge for this, and by waiting, they are just losing money. So I can't believe that they don't want to do it.
Of course, if they won't charge for it, possibly because of some deal with Apple, the situation could be different.
It isn't credible for AT&T to not want to offer tethering for the iPhone.
As has been said, they will charge for it.
Unless, for some reason, they won't.
We don't know. If they will charge, the reason why they aren't offering it could be some changes to their network as has also been mentioned, but it has also been written about this that they have to alter something in each account first, and that that will take time.
I would imagine that they would like to charge for this, and by waiting, they are just losing money. So I can't believe that they don't want to do it.
Of course, if they won't charge for it, possibly because of some deal with Apple, the situation could be different.
Not only are they losing money by not charging for the option, they have been losing money by having it function for free. I am now running iPhone OS X v3.0 GM and unfettered tethering is still active. If this is not plugged by next week then AT&T?s network may get a lot more business than it normally would and there will be plenty of upset customers when they finally pull the plug sometime in the future.
As I?ve stated before, AT&T is more reactive than proactive, but they?ve had so long to work on MMS and tethering issues and there other phones offer it so I have no idea what their issue is.
I don?t recall Apple jabbing AT&T at all. They mentioned that carriers will offer MMS next week and that AT&T will offer it later in the summer, people laughed as it?s funny but it wasn?t a jab. Then later they mentioned tethering and had a about 22 carriers on the board, people laughed when they noticed AT&T was not among them. Scott Forestall made no further mention of the situation.
h.
Well on the podcast MAC OS KEN. Ken and a Guest speaker who is a developer for app's and other software, talked about how great all the new iphone stuff is . Any way you have to play the podcast. I will try to get you a link. You will never undertand me i feel .
Your second paragraph I don?t follow. In what regard will they bring Verizon on board? subsidized notebooks with built-in 3G cards? While that sounds ideal I have a hard time thinking that Verizon will have bent so much to Apple?s demands, that Apple would make a CDMA-based-only notebook without it being GSM-based, and would want to make their lineup wonky by offering their iPhone on AT&T but have their customers also sign up for Verizon for their subsidized notebook. Overall, it?s not a big deal, but it?s certainly un-Apple-like.
.
Sorry, if i was not so clear. I was kinda DAY-dreaming like that apple is so fed up with ATT&T that verizon could back door there way in.
ATT has already announced that they won't have MMS in place in the US until their in-house data base work is completed to remove old legacy code from every single account and then add it fresh to each new iPhone account that is activating it. Every single account needs to have opt-out codes removed and rewritten. There are several releases on this already.
Those of us who have been with ATT for years, long before the iPhone, know that their older MMS system did not always work, and that they charge a hefty monthly fee for it (Yes, MMS is NOT free and it's not included on your text or data plans -- it will be an extra charge per month).
Second -- Tethering is also not free. Their current tethering data plans are in the 60 dollar range give or take a few bucks depending on your voice plan and phone. Current rumors state that the iPhone tethering plan will be 70.00. I've seen that on three or four different websites now.
The delay on tethering is most likely due to ATT not having updated their databases so that they can properly charge for tethering without letting accounts connect for free and bypass their billing system. Again, it's in-house data-base work. It involves making sure they have tested everything for data codes and IP address feedback. some of us from ATT will recall the threatening letter they sent out to early users of their HTC windows mobile phones that were able to tether for awhile for free, until ATT caught on and sent out cease and decist letters, down to indicating the number of minutes of tethering data on their databases via laptop IP codes. They closed that loop pretty fast but lost millions in the meantime. This one will be better planned out for sure before they launch something they aren't ready for.
In essence, ATT is not at all data-savvy --- Apple can create these amazing machines, but neither Apple, Rim, nor HTC phones are well understood by the phone company itself. That wouldn't make a difference if it were Verizon, Sprint, or any other provider (and heaven forbid, T-Mobile). But that results in all sorts of in-house problems for ATT. Those of us who had the original iPhone will remember talking to ATT Customer Service reps who didn't either understand the questions they were being asked, nor what the answers they were reading out of their prompt books even meant! Eventually, they switched all iPhone questions directly over to Apple support. This was also not helpful because Apple support doesn't understand the phone-company specific questions -- remember being switched back and forth from Customer service rep to Customer service rep, until you ultimately hung up in futility?
That hasn't improved. But people have gotten more knowlegeble about using the iPhones now - and the forums are the first place people head for questions and feedback. Look at the Apple iPhone discussion forum -- there are tens of thousands of iPhone threads...
By the way, speaking of Moderators (As mentioned earlier above) - ATT's discussion forums moderators once used to DELETE any thread that referred any users to Apple's iPhone Discussion forum. What we have here is a failure to communicate.
This makes a good point and it's why, if I'm going to get really crabby and reactionary, it's likely going to be in response to a new poster who leads off with "Wow, what a bunch of fanboys you guys are really lame", etc.
It has nothing to do with defending the honor of Apple or some nonsense, it's simple manners. If you were hanging out with a loose circle of friends at the neighborhood pub, and someone you'd never seen before came in and sat down at your table and the first thing they said was "Wow, you guys are totally posers I couldn't help but overhear your conversation and let me tell you, you sound like a bunch of idiots", that person would not be warmly welcomed.
Apparently on the internet the proper response is "you make an interesting point, indeed some of our crowd are useless twits, but stick around, I think you'll find that at least some of us are worthy of your attention". Not really feeling that, unless we just agree that being a Mac user is sort of shameful and we have to adopt an attitude of obsequious deference to our betters, or some fucked up notion such as that.
The trouble is, when enough people start coming and going, and enough of those are expending a lot of energy loudly decrying the general shabbiness and stupidity of our metaphorical pub, it's unlikely your going to have much of a sense of community or comity.
Myself, I can't see the point of hanging out in a Mac enthusiast forum so that you can tell everybody how stupid their enthusiasm is, over and over again. It strikes me as a mental illness, and I think such people should be banned just because the sourness and bitterness that apparently is a symptom of such illness is toxic to any sense of community.
That's a fair sight from demanding everyone toe the Apple line, or only speak well of the platform, or whatever other straw man might leap to mind. But constant, sneering references to "fan boys" and meeting every appreciation of any particular thing Apple might do with the same, tedious sarcasm about "worshipping at Jobs feet" and "flipping out if anyone questions your precious Apple" are, to my mind, a kind of sludge that ever drags down the forum into ugliness. It's a freaking Mac enthusiast site. Why do I have to worry about coming off as "enthusiastic"?
Lots of people here, myself included, are perfectly capable of calling Apple out for boneheaded moves or wondering what the hell they were thinking when they did whatever without relying on the lazy, braindead "fanboy" chant to knock down anyone who disagrees.
Since at this point the very use of the term "fanboy" is such a clear indicator of having nothing to contribute beyond tribal hostility I would ban a member for using it, every time. That alone would probably clear about about 75% of the pointless snark that's infesting the forum.
Dude you have 8000 posts. You must love apple a little.
If you slam apple for no reason everytime you post and i defend apple each time // am i a fan boy ??
Apple is a company. People getting all upset either way is stupid . I just hate people who come here to fight or start fights. Trolls I guess is the term. And feeding the trolls sucks too. I do take pride in apple and all they have done. I took my life saving's and bought apple when they were at 8. I lost tons of cash every where else.
Yes, I was talking to an Apple Tech on the store chat because I wanted to switch from a reservation to just getting it shipped to me and she said the following.
•\tYou are chatting with Yolanda, an Apple Expert
•\tHi, my name is Yolanda. Welcome to Apple!
•\tYou: Hello, Earlier in the week I preordered an iPhone and decided to reserve it at the store, unfortunately I won’t be able to pick it up at the store. Can I now just re-preorder it and have it shipped to me? Or will there be a problem?
•\tYolanda: Good evening.
•\tYolanda: How may I help you today?
•\tYolanda: You can call Customer Service to cancel the order.
•\tYolanda: If you don't show up on the 19th, that is okay acutally.
•\tYolanda: The numbers of orders has exceeded the first shipments to the stores.
•\tYolanda: Meaning we are expected to not have enough on the 19th to give out anyway.
•\tYolanda: its okay if you go in a day or two later for pickup.
•\tYou: Okay, thank you very much
Yes, but we all know that Yolanda skipped off with security programmer, made you shave off your beard, and left you in the desert naked. All because you tricked into getting an iPhone early. Apple service I think not!
Order Status on the Apple Store shows prepared for shipment. So I'm hopeful.
I also ordered two--a 32 for me and a 16 for the wife. Mine says "prepared for shipment" while hers still says "not yet shipped." I sure hope her delivery date doesn't slip--especially if mine ships ontime...
I also ordered two--a 32 for me and a 16 for the wife. Mine says "prepared for shipment" while hers still says "not yet shipped." I sure hope her delivery date doesn't slip--especially if mine ships ontime...
Yeah! Not only will she be ticked that you bought the 32 for yourself while getting her the cheaper 16, but that yours came first.
This makes a good point and it's why, if I'm going to get really crabby and reactionary, it's likely going to be in response to a new poster who leads off with "Wow, what a bunch of fanboys you guys are really lame", etc.
It has nothing to do with defending the honor of Apple or some nonsense, it's simple manners. If you were hanging out with a loose circle of friends at the neighborhood pub, and someone you'd never seen before came in and sat down at your table and the first thing they said was "Wow, you guys are totally posers I couldn't help but overhear your conversation and let me tell you, you sound like a bunch of idiots", that person would not be warmly welcomed.
Apparently on the internet the proper response is "you make an interesting point, indeed some of our crowd are useless twits, but stick around, I think you'll find that at least some of us are worthy of your attention". Not really feeling that, unless we just agree that being a Mac user is sort of shameful and we have to adopt an attitude of obsequious deference to our betters, or some fucked up notion such as that.
The trouble is, when enough people start coming and going, and enough of those are expending a lot of energy loudly decrying the general shabbiness and stupidity of our metaphorical pub, it's unlikely your going to have much of a sense of community or comity.
Myself, I can't see the point of hanging out in a Mac enthusiast forum so that you can tell everybody how stupid their enthusiasm is, over and over again. It strikes me as a mental illness, and I think such people should be banned just because the sourness and bitterness that apparently is a symptom of such illness is toxic to any sense of community.
That's a fair sight from demanding everyone toe the Apple line, or only speak well of the platform, or whatever other straw man might leap to mind. But constant, sneering references to "fan boys" and meeting every appreciation of any particular thing Apple might do with the same, tedious sarcasm about "worshipping at Jobs feet" and "flipping out if anyone questions your precious Apple" are, to my mind, a kind of sludge that ever drags down the forum into ugliness. It's a freaking Mac enthusiast site. Why do I have to worry about coming off as "enthusiastic"?
Lots of people here, myself included, are perfectly capable of calling Apple out for boneheaded moves or wondering what the hell they were thinking when they did whatever without relying on the lazy, braindead "fanboy" chant to knock down anyone who disagrees.
Since at this point the very use of the term "fanboy" is such a clear indicator of having nothing to contribute beyond tribal hostility I would ban a member for using it, every time. That alone would probably clear about about 75% of the pointless snark that's infesting the forum.
You make some outstanding points here. But it is inherent to the nature of the beast, and it seems to me that one has no choice but to deal with it. The continued success of sites like AI requires revenue, revenue requires ads, ads require eyeballs, and eyeballs are drawn to controversy and bomb-throwers.
If folks were banned for the criteria recommended above, there'd be very few left here, and AI would not survive.
I think a deeper - and more interesting - challenge is to focus on how people can be brought around to a point of view that, over time and by dint of persuasive arguments, espouses some of the important attributes you mention, such as manners, community, and comity.
Yes, but we all know that Yolanda skipped off with security programmer, made you shave off your beard, and left you in the desert naked. All because you tricked into getting an iPhone early. Apple service I think not!
To those who get this, thank you.
(and I have been waiting for an excuse!)
Alas, if Steve understood this reference, we'd have another big damn movie.
Even if the last big damn movie didn't actually turn out to be too big. But I'd pay $50 to buy a direct to iTunes mini series.
I also ordered two--a 32 for me and a 16 for the wife. Mine says "prepared for shipment" while hers still says "not yet shipped." I sure hope her delivery date doesn't slip--especially if mine ships ontime...
In our household there would be some discussion about whether or not the one of us that got it first would even be able to crack open the box.
Yeah! Not only will she be ticked that you bought the 32 for yourself while getting her the cheaper 16, but that yours came first.
I know--I'm in dangerous territory now. I was counting on the iPhone in her hand to dazzle her so as to not notice the storage differential, but if mine arrives first, who knows what details she will see.
My best option (assuming an asymetrical delay) would be to sit on mine unopened in the package until hers arrived. Yeah, I see that happening...
In our household there would be some discussion about whether or not the one of us that got it first would even be able to crack open the box.
Well, they are coming to my place of work so as to avoid the dreaded delivery-slip-left-on-the-door angst. I suppose I could crack it to poke at it and such. Activating it, on the other hand, could rock the boat...
I'm just kidding, of course. I married right--12 year Mac user and all, no conversion necessary--but she knows her iPhone lust is not in the same ball park as mine. She would not hold me back (assuming she did not know about the extra 16 gigs of storage)...
You make some outstanding points here. But it is inherent to the nature of the beast, and it seems to me that one has no choice but to deal with it. The continued success of sites like AI requires revenue, revenue requires ads, ads require eyeballs, and eyeballs are drawn to controversy and bomb-throwers.
If folks were banned for the criteria recommended above, there'd be very few left here, and AI would not survive.
I think a deeper - and more interesting - challenge is to focus on how people can be brought around to a point of view that, over time and by dint of persuasive arguments, espouses some of the important attributes you mention, such as manners, community, and comity.
I think you make a point we often try to ignore--AI is not just a free service for the regular users, it is a business and if it came to a choice between numbers and community...well, you know.
But still. While a few pernicious trolls may have driven up the post count on some threads lately, I can't imagine they do much for the long term numbers. I have felt sufficiently motivated enough to join about a dozen sites for the purpose of participating in forum discussions, but this is the only one I have returned to more than 20 times. I credit that to the general knowledge, intelligence and tenor of the posters (as well as the compelling subject matter). I contrast this with many other forums where complete disdain for anyone who holds a different opinion drips from the posts like venom. Or where people are constantly trying to bait someone else into a pointless argument that distracts from the issue at hand.
If I believed that our trolls really were interested in the material and wanted to communicate then that would be fine. But I don't get that from them. All they want is to stir people up and, well, I just don't have the desire to bring that into my life. If they run free and multiply, then eventually, I'll limit myself to the articles. If I limit myself to the articles, then I just as well might drift to some other Apple news site...
Comments
AT&T: "Damn, we're going to charge an assload more for iPhone services than Apple is letting on! If only we weren't obliged to play ball because of being obliged to sell their damn phone, we'd be shouting that from the rooftops! We must continue to bit our tongues!"
Even if that was true, which I don't think it is, none of that explains why they would delay. ATT already allows cell phone users to tether their phone and there's no reason why iPhone users would use more data than other phone users when tethered. iPhone users will pay the same amount as other users to tether and will not use more data, so why would ATT care? It's all very profitable for ATT.
As has been said, they will charge for it.
Unless, for some reason, they won't.
We don't know. If they will charge, the reason why they aren't offering it could be some changes to their network as has also been mentioned, but it has also been written about this that they have to alter something in each account first, and that that will take time.
I would imagine that they would like to charge for this, and by waiting, they are just losing money. So I can't believe that they don't want to do it.
Of course, if they won't charge for it, possibly because of some deal with Apple, the situation could be different.
It isn't credible for AT&T to not want to offer tethering for the iPhone.
As has been said, they will charge for it.
Unless, for some reason, they won't.
We don't know. If they will charge, the reason why they aren't offering it could be some changes to their network as has also been mentioned, but it has also been written about this that they have to alter something in each account first, and that that will take time.
I would imagine that they would like to charge for this, and by waiting, they are just losing money. So I can't believe that they don't want to do it.
Of course, if they won't charge for it, possibly because of some deal with Apple, the situation could be different.
Not only are they losing money by not charging for the option, they have been losing money by having it function for free. I am now running iPhone OS X v3.0 GM and unfettered tethering is still active. If this is not plugged by next week then AT&T?s network may get a lot more business than it normally would and there will be plenty of upset customers when they finally pull the plug sometime in the future.
As I?ve stated before, AT&T is more reactive than proactive, but they?ve had so long to work on MMS and tethering issues and there other phones offer it so I have no idea what their issue is.
I don?t recall Apple jabbing AT&T at all. They mentioned that carriers will offer MMS next week and that AT&T will offer it later in the summer, people laughed as it?s funny but it wasn?t a jab. Then later they mentioned tethering and had a about 22 carriers on the board, people laughed when they noticed AT&T was not among them. Scott Forestall made no further mention of the situation.
h.
Well on the podcast MAC OS KEN. Ken and a Guest speaker who is a developer for app's and other software, talked about how great all the new iphone stuff is . Any way you have to play the podcast. I will try to get you a link. You will never undertand me i feel .
I
Your second paragraph I don?t follow. In what regard will they bring Verizon on board? subsidized notebooks with built-in 3G cards? While that sounds ideal I have a hard time thinking that Verizon will have bent so much to Apple?s demands, that Apple would make a CDMA-based-only notebook without it being GSM-based, and would want to make their lineup wonky by offering their iPhone on AT&T but have their customers also sign up for Verizon for their subsidized notebook. Overall, it?s not a big deal, but it?s certainly un-Apple-like.
.
Sorry, if i was not so clear. I was kinda DAY-dreaming like that apple is so fed up with ATT&T that verizon could back door there way in.
Those of us who have been with ATT for years, long before the iPhone, know that their older MMS system did not always work, and that they charge a hefty monthly fee for it (Yes, MMS is NOT free and it's not included on your text or data plans -- it will be an extra charge per month).
Second -- Tethering is also not free. Their current tethering data plans are in the 60 dollar range give or take a few bucks depending on your voice plan and phone. Current rumors state that the iPhone tethering plan will be 70.00. I've seen that on three or four different websites now.
The delay on tethering is most likely due to ATT not having updated their databases so that they can properly charge for tethering without letting accounts connect for free and bypass their billing system. Again, it's in-house data-base work. It involves making sure they have tested everything for data codes and IP address feedback. some of us from ATT will recall the threatening letter they sent out to early users of their HTC windows mobile phones that were able to tether for awhile for free, until ATT caught on and sent out cease and decist letters, down to indicating the number of minutes of tethering data on their databases via laptop IP codes. They closed that loop pretty fast but lost millions in the meantime. This one will be better planned out for sure before they launch something they aren't ready for.
In essence, ATT is not at all data-savvy --- Apple can create these amazing machines, but neither Apple, Rim, nor HTC phones are well understood by the phone company itself. That wouldn't make a difference if it were Verizon, Sprint, or any other provider (and heaven forbid, T-Mobile). But that results in all sorts of in-house problems for ATT. Those of us who had the original iPhone will remember talking to ATT Customer Service reps who didn't either understand the questions they were being asked, nor what the answers they were reading out of their prompt books even meant! Eventually, they switched all iPhone questions directly over to Apple support. This was also not helpful because Apple support doesn't understand the phone-company specific questions -- remember being switched back and forth from Customer service rep to Customer service rep, until you ultimately hung up in futility?
That hasn't improved. But people have gotten more knowlegeble about using the iPhones now - and the forums are the first place people head for questions and feedback. Look at the Apple iPhone discussion forum -- there are tens of thousands of iPhone threads...
By the way, speaking of Moderators (As mentioned earlier above) - ATT's discussion forums moderators once used to DELETE any thread that referred any users to Apple's iPhone Discussion forum. What we have here is a failure to communicate.
Sorry, if i was not so clear. I was kinda DAY-dreaming like that apple is so fed up with ATT&T that verizon could back door there way in.
Funny thing about *contracts*.....
This makes a good point and it's why, if I'm going to get really crabby and reactionary, it's likely going to be in response to a new poster who leads off with "Wow, what a bunch of fanboys you guys are really lame", etc.
It has nothing to do with defending the honor of Apple or some nonsense, it's simple manners. If you were hanging out with a loose circle of friends at the neighborhood pub, and someone you'd never seen before came in and sat down at your table and the first thing they said was "Wow, you guys are totally posers I couldn't help but overhear your conversation and let me tell you, you sound like a bunch of idiots", that person would not be warmly welcomed.
Apparently on the internet the proper response is "you make an interesting point, indeed some of our crowd are useless twits, but stick around, I think you'll find that at least some of us are worthy of your attention". Not really feeling that, unless we just agree that being a Mac user is sort of shameful and we have to adopt an attitude of obsequious deference to our betters, or some fucked up notion such as that.
The trouble is, when enough people start coming and going, and enough of those are expending a lot of energy loudly decrying the general shabbiness and stupidity of our metaphorical pub, it's unlikely your going to have much of a sense of community or comity.
Myself, I can't see the point of hanging out in a Mac enthusiast forum so that you can tell everybody how stupid their enthusiasm is, over and over again. It strikes me as a mental illness, and I think such people should be banned just because the sourness and bitterness that apparently is a symptom of such illness is toxic to any sense of community.
That's a fair sight from demanding everyone toe the Apple line, or only speak well of the platform, or whatever other straw man might leap to mind. But constant, sneering references to "fan boys" and meeting every appreciation of any particular thing Apple might do with the same, tedious sarcasm about "worshipping at Jobs feet" and "flipping out if anyone questions your precious Apple" are, to my mind, a kind of sludge that ever drags down the forum into ugliness. It's a freaking Mac enthusiast site. Why do I have to worry about coming off as "enthusiastic"?
Lots of people here, myself included, are perfectly capable of calling Apple out for boneheaded moves or wondering what the hell they were thinking when they did whatever without relying on the lazy, braindead "fanboy" chant to knock down anyone who disagrees.
Since at this point the very use of the term "fanboy" is such a clear indicator of having nothing to contribute beyond tribal hostility I would ban a member for using it, every time. That alone would probably clear about about 75% of the pointless snark that's infesting the forum.
Dude you have 8000 posts. You must love apple a little.
If you slam apple for no reason everytime you post and i defend apple each time // am i a fan boy ??
Apple is a company. People getting all upset either way is stupid . I just hate people who come here to fight or start fights. Trolls I guess is the term. And feeding the trolls sucks too. I do take pride in apple and all they have done. I took my life saving's and bought apple when they were at 8. I lost tons of cash every where else.
9
Yes, I was talking to an Apple Tech on the store chat because I wanted to switch from a reservation to just getting it shipped to me and she said the following.
•\tYou are chatting with Yolanda, an Apple Expert
•\tHi, my name is Yolanda. Welcome to Apple!
•\tYou: Hello, Earlier in the week I preordered an iPhone and decided to reserve it at the store, unfortunately I won’t be able to pick it up at the store. Can I now just re-preorder it and have it shipped to me? Or will there be a problem?
•\tYolanda: Good evening.
•\tYolanda: How may I help you today?
•\tYolanda: You can call Customer Service to cancel the order.
•\tYolanda: If you don't show up on the 19th, that is okay acutally.
•\tYolanda: The numbers of orders has exceeded the first shipments to the stores.
•\tYolanda: Meaning we are expected to not have enough on the 19th to give out anyway.
•\tYolanda: its okay if you go in a day or two later for pickup.
•\tYou: Okay, thank you very much
Yes, but we all know that Yolanda skipped off with security programmer, made you shave off your beard, and left you in the desert naked. All because you tricked into getting an iPhone early. Apple service I think not!
To those who get this, thank you.
(and I have been waiting for an excuse!)
Interesting that it's now the 14th, and the online Apple Store still says that orders will be delivered on the 19th.
i've read the article and posts a couple of times and I see no mention of Apple deliveries anywhere. It seems to affect AT&T only.
(of course that is what I'm hoping for since we've got two on order for home delivery on Friday from Apple directly)
Order Status on the Apple Store shows prepared for shipment. So I'm hopeful.
Order Status on the Apple Store shows prepared for shipment. So I'm hopeful.
I also ordered two--a 32 for me and a 16 for the wife. Mine says "prepared for shipment" while hers still says "not yet shipped." I sure hope her delivery date doesn't slip--especially if mine ships ontime...
I also ordered two--a 32 for me and a 16 for the wife. Mine says "prepared for shipment" while hers still says "not yet shipped." I sure hope her delivery date doesn't slip--especially if mine ships ontime...
Yeah! Not only will she be ticked that you bought the 32 for yourself while getting her the cheaper 16, but that yours came first.
This makes a good point and it's why, if I'm going to get really crabby and reactionary, it's likely going to be in response to a new poster who leads off with "Wow, what a bunch of fanboys you guys are really lame", etc.
It has nothing to do with defending the honor of Apple or some nonsense, it's simple manners. If you were hanging out with a loose circle of friends at the neighborhood pub, and someone you'd never seen before came in and sat down at your table and the first thing they said was "Wow, you guys are totally posers I couldn't help but overhear your conversation and let me tell you, you sound like a bunch of idiots", that person would not be warmly welcomed.
Apparently on the internet the proper response is "you make an interesting point, indeed some of our crowd are useless twits, but stick around, I think you'll find that at least some of us are worthy of your attention". Not really feeling that, unless we just agree that being a Mac user is sort of shameful and we have to adopt an attitude of obsequious deference to our betters, or some fucked up notion such as that.
The trouble is, when enough people start coming and going, and enough of those are expending a lot of energy loudly decrying the general shabbiness and stupidity of our metaphorical pub, it's unlikely your going to have much of a sense of community or comity.
Myself, I can't see the point of hanging out in a Mac enthusiast forum so that you can tell everybody how stupid their enthusiasm is, over and over again. It strikes me as a mental illness, and I think such people should be banned just because the sourness and bitterness that apparently is a symptom of such illness is toxic to any sense of community.
That's a fair sight from demanding everyone toe the Apple line, or only speak well of the platform, or whatever other straw man might leap to mind. But constant, sneering references to "fan boys" and meeting every appreciation of any particular thing Apple might do with the same, tedious sarcasm about "worshipping at Jobs feet" and "flipping out if anyone questions your precious Apple" are, to my mind, a kind of sludge that ever drags down the forum into ugliness. It's a freaking Mac enthusiast site. Why do I have to worry about coming off as "enthusiastic"?
Lots of people here, myself included, are perfectly capable of calling Apple out for boneheaded moves or wondering what the hell they were thinking when they did whatever without relying on the lazy, braindead "fanboy" chant to knock down anyone who disagrees.
Since at this point the very use of the term "fanboy" is such a clear indicator of having nothing to contribute beyond tribal hostility I would ban a member for using it, every time. That alone would probably clear about about 75% of the pointless snark that's infesting the forum.
You make some outstanding points here. But it is inherent to the nature of the beast, and it seems to me that one has no choice but to deal with it. The continued success of sites like AI requires revenue, revenue requires ads, ads require eyeballs, and eyeballs are drawn to controversy and bomb-throwers.
If folks were banned for the criteria recommended above, there'd be very few left here, and AI would not survive.
I think a deeper - and more interesting - challenge is to focus on how people can be brought around to a point of view that, over time and by dint of persuasive arguments, espouses some of the important attributes you mention, such as manners, community, and comity.
Yes, but we all know that Yolanda skipped off with security programmer, made you shave off your beard, and left you in the desert naked. All because you tricked into getting an iPhone early. Apple service I think not!
To those who get this, thank you.
(and I have been waiting for an excuse!)
Alas, if Steve understood this reference, we'd have another big damn movie.
Even if the last big damn movie didn't actually turn out to be too big. But I'd pay $50 to buy a direct to iTunes mini series.
I also ordered two--a 32 for me and a 16 for the wife. Mine says "prepared for shipment" while hers still says "not yet shipped." I sure hope her delivery date doesn't slip--especially if mine ships ontime...
In our household there would be some discussion about whether or not the one of us that got it first would even be able to crack open the box.
Yeah! Not only will she be ticked that you bought the 32 for yourself while getting her the cheaper 16, but that yours came first.
I know--I'm in dangerous territory now. I was counting on the iPhone in her hand to dazzle her so as to not notice the storage differential, but if mine arrives first, who knows what details she will see.
My best option (assuming an asymetrical delay) would be to sit on mine unopened in the package until hers arrived. Yeah, I see that happening...
In our household there would be some discussion about whether or not the one of us that got it first would even be able to crack open the box.
Well, they are coming to my place of work so as to avoid the dreaded delivery-slip-left-on-the-door angst. I suppose I could crack it to poke at it and such. Activating it, on the other hand, could rock the boat...
I'm just kidding, of course. I married right--12 year Mac user and all, no conversion necessary--but she knows her iPhone lust is not in the same ball park as mine. She would not hold me back (assuming she did not know about the extra 16 gigs of storage)...
You make some outstanding points here. But it is inherent to the nature of the beast, and it seems to me that one has no choice but to deal with it. The continued success of sites like AI requires revenue, revenue requires ads, ads require eyeballs, and eyeballs are drawn to controversy and bomb-throwers.
If folks were banned for the criteria recommended above, there'd be very few left here, and AI would not survive.
I think a deeper - and more interesting - challenge is to focus on how people can be brought around to a point of view that, over time and by dint of persuasive arguments, espouses some of the important attributes you mention, such as manners, community, and comity.
I think you make a point we often try to ignore--AI is not just a free service for the regular users, it is a business and if it came to a choice between numbers and community...well, you know.
But still. While a few pernicious trolls may have driven up the post count on some threads lately, I can't imagine they do much for the long term numbers. I have felt sufficiently motivated enough to join about a dozen sites for the purpose of participating in forum discussions, but this is the only one I have returned to more than 20 times. I credit that to the general knowledge, intelligence and tenor of the posters (as well as the compelling subject matter). I contrast this with many other forums where complete disdain for anyone who holds a different opinion drips from the posts like venom. Or where people are constantly trying to bait someone else into a pointless argument that distracts from the issue at hand.
If I believed that our trolls really were interested in the material and wanted to communicate then that would be fine. But I don't get that from them. All they want is to stir people up and, well, I just don't have the desire to bring that into my life. If they run free and multiply, then eventually, I'll limit myself to the articles. If I limit myself to the articles, then I just as well might drift to some other Apple news site...