Yes, they do. But then, games for the Wii or DS are MUCH more expensive than the ones for Apple.
You can't compared the cost of the iPod games to the Wii games, they are two different devices. Compare the Wii games to PS3 or xbox games (then the wii games look overpriced).
And how many games on the iPhone compare to Resistance, Rachet and Clank etc on the PSP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
I'd say that an iPhone is good for two years as far as that goes. Companies will ensure that their games at least play as well as possible for two generations, which is as long as most people will keep their phones, or Touches.
I wouldn't be so sure about companies supporting older hardware, and if they do it will be at a loss for the newer hardware
Nintendo's slowdown doesn't surprise me that much because it's amazingly high sales volume from 2006 - 2008 were not going to be sustainable forever. I think Apple definitely had its influence on Nintendo's moves, and I see the DSi as an answer to a lot of what the iPod touch, iPhone and App Store brought to the table. Even the iPod's high sales levels have been unsustainable, with the difference being that Apple is competing with itself rather than with someone else.
Nintendo's already sold 52.62 Million Wii consoles in less than three years. The DS/DS Lite/DSi have sold 107.75 Million worldwide in a little over four years. Nintendo achieved these historic numbers (for the gaming industry) without dropping prices except for one occasion in 2005 for the DS. They actually upped the price of the DSi, yet have continued to sell lots of hardware. Even Apple budged on pricing before Nintendo did.
Unlike the iPod touch and iPhone, Nintendo can only sell DS handhelds on their gaming merits (with a few exceptions, but the DS is still a games machine). It's good for Nintendo that they've got the most iconic game properties in the industry, and that's something Apple will never be able to copy. But I've said this before and I'll say it again: Nintendo is not now just discovering the effect of non-gaming devices on its business. As far back as 2005, they expressed anxiety over Japanese keitai taking away Game Boy and DS sales, so they released the Game Boy micro to counter that movement. The iPhone and iPod touch, however, are the first devices that are of noticeable competition because it's easier to identify these two products than the myriad of advanced Japanese cellphones.
So what? Neither Nintendo's or Sony's devices will be able to play anything for Apple's machines either.
More their loss than ours.
I'm pretty sure a kid who gets an iPod touch for Christmas will be jealous of his classmate who gets to play the latest Pokemon.
The App Store may have a larger volume of games, but nothing on it comes close to Pokemon or Mario in terms of cultural icons. The DS Mario and Pokemon games have also sold over 20 Million units are still going.
It's good for Nintendo that they've got the most iconic game properties in the industry, and that's something Apple will never be able to copy.
$30B in cash enables an amazing amount of copying. Not that I really expect Apple to do so but it certainly would be within Apple's means to buy a few game studios. Sega was only a couple billion a couple years ago when MS was looking at buying them. Heck, Apple could afford EA at $6.5B (NOT a good fit IMHO).
Sonic isn't Mario but closes the gap quite a bit if Sega became a 1st party game developer for the iPhone platform. And Mario didn't save Nintendo against Sony and MS in the last generation console market.
MS just bought Big Park and folded it into MGS because 1st party titles are important to all platforms. There's no reason to think that Apple can't do the same if they think they want to pursue gaming more seriously.
Sonic isn't Mario but closes the gap quite a bit if Sega became a 1st party game developer for the iPhone platform. And Mario didn't save Nintendo against Sony and MS in the last generation console market.
Yes, it ended well for Sega last time they were a 1st party developer
$30B in cash enables an amazing amount of copying. Not that I really expect Apple to do so but it certainly would be within Apple's means to buy a few game studios. Sega was only a couple billion a couple years ago when MS was looking at buying them. Heck, Apple could afford EA at $6.5B (NOT a good fit IMHO).
Sonic isn't Mario but closes the gap quite a bit if Sega became a 1st party game developer for the iPhone platform. And Mario didn't save Nintendo against Sony and MS in the last generation console market.
MS just bought Big Park and folded it into MGS because 1st party titles are important to all platforms. There's no reason to think that Apple can't do the same if they think they want to pursue gaming more seriously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea
Which ones does Apple want? They can afford pretty much any of them...
Heh, this proves how much Apple fans actually know about the game industry...
Microsoft fans already went over this years ago before the first Xbox came around. If Apple wants to get into the gaming industry seriously, then they can buy a few studios, but that does not guarantee them killer app content. There have been times when hostile takeovers have resulted in a departure of the influential people that built the reputation of certain studios. Third party developers are still king. Nor does Apple have any realistic chance in getting into the Japanese gaming market scene by buying up that country's best studios either.
Yes, it ended well for Sega last time they were a 1st party developer
So you're saying that with Apple making the hardware that Sega is an instant fail as a 1st party dev? That the Sonic franchise would have zero impact as an exclusive?
So you're saying that with Apple making the hardware that Sega is an instant fail as a 1st party dev? That the Sonic franchise would have zero impact as an exclusive?
Mkay.
No, I am saying that Sonic used to be an exclusive, and that ended well for Sega didn't it
You can't compared the cost of the iPod games to the Wii games, they are two different devices. Compare the Wii games to PS3 or xbox games (then the wii games look overpriced).
And how many games on the iPhone compare to Resistance, Rachet and Clank etc on the PSP?
As you know, we're not talking about iPod games. a term you're deliberately using to attempt to change the issue.
John Carmack has already released games for Apple that he said can't be done on the DS, and possibly, not on the PSP either. We're also seeing other major games come out. Doom Resurrection, there's Resident Evil 4 and Degeneration.
Actually, i'm not as much of a gamer as I used to be, so I can't name much of this offhand, but there are plenty in all categories. I'm sure you also know that.
The problem is that no matter what games I may name, you'll try to find something bad about them, but in actuality, most games for the DS are junk too.
Quote:
I wouldn't be so sure about companies supporting older hardware, and if they do it will be at a loss for the newer hardware
Not true. Software can look at which hardware is present and play up to or down to it. It wouldn't be the first time. Most games allow manual control like that or automatic. Then you can override the settings as well. It's not a big deal.
No, I think you misunderstand. What exclusive studios do Apple have for games?
Most of the games on the platform are iPhone/iTouch only. Are the studios locked into Apple's platform/ no, but many have said that they won't write games for the DS.
Is ID locked into the platform? Not by contract. Will they produce a game for the DS that they're doing for this platform? Not from what he's said.
Heh, this proves how much Apple fans actually know about the game industry...
Microsoft fans already went over this years ago before the first Xbox came around. If Apple wants to get into the gaming industry seriously, then they can buy a few studios, but that does not guarantee them killer app content. There have been times when hostile takeovers have resulted in a departure of the influential people that built the reputation of certain studios. Third party developers are still king. Nor does Apple have any realistic chance in getting into the Japanese gaming market scene by buying up that country's best studios either.
Yes, I can just see Sonic jumping ship to another company. I wonder what kind of non-compete he signed and what his lockout period is.
You said iconic game franchises. Sonic is #9 and pretty much the only casual one that isn't already owned by Nintendo (Pokemon #2, DK #7, Zelda #8). Apple COULD try to get Final Fantasy at #3 but it isn't really in the same market space. In that space you got Mario and company and then Sonic at #2.
And it worked for MS. Notice who is the #2 console today? It's not Sony. And Halo was killer app content that MS purchased by buying Bungie. They bought Ensemble but disbanded it (WTF?). They bought Rare and it paid off for them...or are you going to tell me Perfect Dark Zero suxxored? Meh...folks leave companies all the time. After you get bought by MS the term is "cashing out" to do it over again. Some folks do, some don't and MGS certainly had it's ups and downs in terms of playing nice with devs.
If Apple get serious about games, it will buy 1st and 2nd party game devs. Why? Because it's the cost of doing business to get exclusives. If it really wants Sonic, it can likely buy Sega Sammy.
Consoles still live and die from exclusives. And if 3rd party devs are "king" then why did you mention Nintendo's iconic franchises. Those are all 1st party titles oh wise one.
Plus, Apple doesn't want to break into the Japanese market all that much. It's lived with lackluster japanese sales for a long time with the Mac and is US centric.
Most of the games on the platform are iPhone/iTouch only. Are the studios locked into Apple's platform/ no, but many have said that they won't write games for the DS.
Is ID locked into the platform? Not by contract. Will they produce a game for the DS that they're doing for this platform? Not from what he's said.
Square-Enix has sold over 3 Million copies of Dragon Quest IX in Japan for DS in three weeks.
Nintendo doesn't need these studios you speak of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinea
Yes, I can just see Sonic jumping ship to another company. I wonder what kind of non-compete he signed and what his lockout period is.
You said iconic game franchises. Sonic is #9 and pretty much the only casual one that isn't already owned by Nintendo (Pokemon #2, DK #7, Zelda #8). Apple COULD try to get Final Fantasy at #3 but it isn't really in the same market space. In that space you got Mario and company and then Sonic at #2.
And it worked for MS. Notice who is the #2 console today? It's not Sony. And Halo was killer app content that MS purchased by buying Bungie. They bought Ensemble but disbanded it (WTF?). They bought Rare and it paid off for them...or are you going to tell me Perfect Dark Zero suxxored? Meh...folks leave companies all the time. After you get bought by MS the term is "cashing out" to do it over again. Some folks do, some don't and MGS certainly had it's ups and downs in terms of playing nice with devs.
If Apple get serious about games, it will buy 1st and 2nd party game devs. Why? Because it's the cost of doing business to get exclusives. If it really wants Sonic, it can likely buy Sega Sammy.
Consoles still live and die from exclusives. And if 3rd party devs are "king" then why did you mention Nintendo's iconic franchises. Those are all 1st party titles oh wise one.
Plus, Apple doesn't want to break into the Japanese market all that much. It's lived with lackluster japanese sales for a long time with the Mac and is US centric.
You didn't get the point of my earlier post. I'm not saying Apple can't do it. They have to have a solid plan and a good foundation. You seemed to be saying earlier that buying up studios will make all of Apple's hurdles go away, and that's not true.
On the Japanese market: the Japanese games market is highly influential and there has been no number one game system in the world without breaking into this market. The Wii and DS have been very successful on the basis of Japanese game properties and ideas on a worldwide scale. Japan is the one industry in the world you cannot ignore for games (you can't ignore any of them, really).
I'm pretty sure a kid who gets an iPod touch for Christmas will be jealous of his classmate who gets to play the latest Pokemon.
The App Store may have a larger volume of games, but nothing on it comes close to Pokemon or Mario in terms of cultural icons. The DS Mario and Pokemon games have also sold over 20 Million units are still going.
There's Pokemon stuff in the games and music sections of the App Store. I haven't looked to see exactly what it is.
But I'm sure that his friend with the DS will be jealous that he can't watch the latest Pokemon movie on it as can his friend with the Touch.
Comments
All those people who have said the iPhone isn't for gaming/is bad for gaming/will never challenge Sony or Nintendo
Who was saying that? You seem to have a lot of time on your hands -- maybe you could provide some links?
You've been told this a long time ago.
Who are referring to, the hypothetical people you're starting an argument with?
But some of you still refuse to believe the sheer power and influence of this company...
Nothing much that you can do on the DS or PSP that can't be done on Apple's devices, often much more cheaply.
Well apart from running games that are owned by Sony or Nintendo
Yes, they do. But then, games for the Wii or DS are MUCH more expensive than the ones for Apple.
You can't compared the cost of the iPod games to the Wii games, they are two different devices. Compare the Wii games to PS3 or xbox games (then the wii games look overpriced).
And how many games on the iPhone compare to Resistance, Rachet and Clank etc on the PSP?
I'd say that an iPhone is good for two years as far as that goes. Companies will ensure that their games at least play as well as possible for two generations, which is as long as most people will keep their phones, or Touches.
I wouldn't be so sure about companies supporting older hardware, and if they do it will be at a loss for the newer hardware
Nintendo's already sold 52.62 Million Wii consoles in less than three years. The DS/DS Lite/DSi have sold 107.75 Million worldwide in a little over four years. Nintendo achieved these historic numbers (for the gaming industry) without dropping prices except for one occasion in 2005 for the DS. They actually upped the price of the DSi, yet have continued to sell lots of hardware. Even Apple budged on pricing before Nintendo did.
Unlike the iPod touch and iPhone, Nintendo can only sell DS handhelds on their gaming merits (with a few exceptions, but the DS is still a games machine). It's good for Nintendo that they've got the most iconic game properties in the industry, and that's something Apple will never be able to copy. But I've said this before and I'll say it again: Nintendo is not now just discovering the effect of non-gaming devices on its business. As far back as 2005, they expressed anxiety over Japanese keitai taking away Game Boy and DS sales, so they released the Game Boy micro to counter that movement. The iPhone and iPod touch, however, are the first devices that are of noticeable competition because it's easier to identify these two products than the myriad of advanced Japanese cellphones.
Well apart from running games that are owned by Sony or Nintendo
So what? Neither Nintendo's or Sony's devices will be able to play anything for Apple's machines either.
More their loss than ours.
So what? Neither Nintendo's or Sony's devices will be able to play anything for Apple's machines either.
More their loss than ours.
No, I think you misunderstand. What exclusive studios do Apple have for games?
So what? Neither Nintendo's or Sony's devices will be able to play anything for Apple's machines either.
More their loss than ours.
I'm pretty sure a kid who gets an iPod touch for Christmas will be jealous of his classmate who gets to play the latest Pokemon.
The App Store may have a larger volume of games, but nothing on it comes close to Pokemon or Mario in terms of cultural icons. The DS Mario and Pokemon games have also sold over 20 Million units are still going.
It's good for Nintendo that they've got the most iconic game properties in the industry, and that's something Apple will never be able to copy.
$30B in cash enables an amazing amount of copying. Not that I really expect Apple to do so but it certainly would be within Apple's means to buy a few game studios. Sega was only a couple billion a couple years ago when MS was looking at buying them. Heck, Apple could afford EA at $6.5B (NOT a good fit IMHO).
Sonic isn't Mario but closes the gap quite a bit if Sega became a 1st party game developer for the iPhone platform. And Mario didn't save Nintendo against Sony and MS in the last generation console market.
MS just bought Big Park and folded it into MGS because 1st party titles are important to all platforms. There's no reason to think that Apple can't do the same if they think they want to pursue gaming more seriously.
No, I think you misunderstand. What exclusive studios do Apple have for games?
Which ones does Apple want? They can afford pretty much any of them...
Sonic isn't Mario but closes the gap quite a bit if Sega became a 1st party game developer for the iPhone platform. And Mario didn't save Nintendo against Sony and MS in the last generation console market.
Yes, it ended well for Sega last time they were a 1st party developer
Which ones does Apple want? They can afford pretty much any of them...
Just because they can afford them doesn't mean they can buy them
$30B in cash enables an amazing amount of copying. Not that I really expect Apple to do so but it certainly would be within Apple's means to buy a few game studios. Sega was only a couple billion a couple years ago when MS was looking at buying them. Heck, Apple could afford EA at $6.5B (NOT a good fit IMHO).
Sonic isn't Mario but closes the gap quite a bit if Sega became a 1st party game developer for the iPhone platform. And Mario didn't save Nintendo against Sony and MS in the last generation console market.
MS just bought Big Park and folded it into MGS because 1st party titles are important to all platforms. There's no reason to think that Apple can't do the same if they think they want to pursue gaming more seriously.
Which ones does Apple want? They can afford pretty much any of them...
Heh, this proves how much Apple fans actually know about the game industry...
Microsoft fans already went over this years ago before the first Xbox came around. If Apple wants to get into the gaming industry seriously, then they can buy a few studios, but that does not guarantee them killer app content. There have been times when hostile takeovers have resulted in a departure of the influential people that built the reputation of certain studios. Third party developers are still king. Nor does Apple have any realistic chance in getting into the Japanese gaming market scene by buying up that country's best studios either.
Yes, it ended well for Sega last time they were a 1st party developer
So you're saying that with Apple making the hardware that Sega is an instant fail as a 1st party dev? That the Sonic franchise would have zero impact as an exclusive?
Mkay.
So you're saying that with Apple making the hardware that Sega is an instant fail as a 1st party dev? That the Sonic franchise would have zero impact as an exclusive?
Mkay.
No, I am saying that Sonic used to be an exclusive, and that ended well for Sega didn't it
Just like when Microsoft tried to buy Nintendo. Oh what fun Nintendo had with that.
Sonic, by the way, enjoys a lot of success on Nintendo systems these days.
You can't compared the cost of the iPod games to the Wii games, they are two different devices. Compare the Wii games to PS3 or xbox games (then the wii games look overpriced).
And how many games on the iPhone compare to Resistance, Rachet and Clank etc on the PSP?
As you know, we're not talking about iPod games. a term you're deliberately using to attempt to change the issue.
John Carmack has already released games for Apple that he said can't be done on the DS, and possibly, not on the PSP either. We're also seeing other major games come out. Doom Resurrection, there's Resident Evil 4 and Degeneration.
Actually, i'm not as much of a gamer as I used to be, so I can't name much of this offhand, but there are plenty in all categories. I'm sure you also know that.
The problem is that no matter what games I may name, you'll try to find something bad about them, but in actuality, most games for the DS are junk too.
I wouldn't be so sure about companies supporting older hardware, and if they do it will be at a loss for the newer hardware
Not true. Software can look at which hardware is present and play up to or down to it. It wouldn't be the first time. Most games allow manual control like that or automatic. Then you can override the settings as well. It's not a big deal.
No, I think you misunderstand. What exclusive studios do Apple have for games?
Most of the games on the platform are iPhone/iTouch only. Are the studios locked into Apple's platform/ no, but many have said that they won't write games for the DS.
Is ID locked into the platform? Not by contract. Will they produce a game for the DS that they're doing for this platform? Not from what he's said.
Heh, this proves how much Apple fans actually know about the game industry...
Microsoft fans already went over this years ago before the first Xbox came around. If Apple wants to get into the gaming industry seriously, then they can buy a few studios, but that does not guarantee them killer app content. There have been times when hostile takeovers have resulted in a departure of the influential people that built the reputation of certain studios. Third party developers are still king. Nor does Apple have any realistic chance in getting into the Japanese gaming market scene by buying up that country's best studios either.
Yes, I can just see Sonic jumping ship to another company. I wonder what kind of non-compete he signed and what his lockout period is.
You said iconic game franchises. Sonic is #9 and pretty much the only casual one that isn't already owned by Nintendo (Pokemon #2, DK #7, Zelda #8). Apple COULD try to get Final Fantasy at #3 but it isn't really in the same market space. In that space you got Mario and company and then Sonic at #2.
And it worked for MS. Notice who is the #2 console today? It's not Sony. And Halo was killer app content that MS purchased by buying Bungie. They bought Ensemble but disbanded it (WTF?). They bought Rare and it paid off for them...or are you going to tell me Perfect Dark Zero suxxored? Meh...folks leave companies all the time. After you get bought by MS the term is "cashing out" to do it over again. Some folks do, some don't and MGS certainly had it's ups and downs in terms of playing nice with devs.
If Apple get serious about games, it will buy 1st and 2nd party game devs. Why? Because it's the cost of doing business to get exclusives. If it really wants Sonic, it can likely buy Sega Sammy.
Consoles still live and die from exclusives. And if 3rd party devs are "king" then why did you mention Nintendo's iconic franchises. Those are all 1st party titles oh wise one.
Plus, Apple doesn't want to break into the Japanese market all that much. It's lived with lackluster japanese sales for a long time with the Mac and is US centric.
Most of the games on the platform are iPhone/iTouch only. Are the studios locked into Apple's platform/ no, but many have said that they won't write games for the DS.
Is ID locked into the platform? Not by contract. Will they produce a game for the DS that they're doing for this platform? Not from what he's said.
Square-Enix has sold over 3 Million copies of Dragon Quest IX in Japan for DS in three weeks.
Nintendo doesn't need these studios you speak of.
Yes, I can just see Sonic jumping ship to another company. I wonder what kind of non-compete he signed and what his lockout period is.
You said iconic game franchises. Sonic is #9 and pretty much the only casual one that isn't already owned by Nintendo (Pokemon #2, DK #7, Zelda #8). Apple COULD try to get Final Fantasy at #3 but it isn't really in the same market space. In that space you got Mario and company and then Sonic at #2.
And it worked for MS. Notice who is the #2 console today? It's not Sony. And Halo was killer app content that MS purchased by buying Bungie. They bought Ensemble but disbanded it (WTF?). They bought Rare and it paid off for them...or are you going to tell me Perfect Dark Zero suxxored? Meh...folks leave companies all the time. After you get bought by MS the term is "cashing out" to do it over again. Some folks do, some don't and MGS certainly had it's ups and downs in terms of playing nice with devs.
If Apple get serious about games, it will buy 1st and 2nd party game devs. Why? Because it's the cost of doing business to get exclusives. If it really wants Sonic, it can likely buy Sega Sammy.
Consoles still live and die from exclusives. And if 3rd party devs are "king" then why did you mention Nintendo's iconic franchises. Those are all 1st party titles oh wise one.
Plus, Apple doesn't want to break into the Japanese market all that much. It's lived with lackluster japanese sales for a long time with the Mac and is US centric.
You didn't get the point of my earlier post. I'm not saying Apple can't do it. They have to have a solid plan and a good foundation. You seemed to be saying earlier that buying up studios will make all of Apple's hurdles go away, and that's not true.
On the Japanese market: the Japanese games market is highly influential and there has been no number one game system in the world without breaking into this market. The Wii and DS have been very successful on the basis of Japanese game properties and ideas on a worldwide scale. Japan is the one industry in the world you cannot ignore for games (you can't ignore any of them, really).
I'm pretty sure a kid who gets an iPod touch for Christmas will be jealous of his classmate who gets to play the latest Pokemon.
The App Store may have a larger volume of games, but nothing on it comes close to Pokemon or Mario in terms of cultural icons. The DS Mario and Pokemon games have also sold over 20 Million units are still going.
There's Pokemon stuff in the games and music sections of the App Store. I haven't looked to see exactly what it is.
But I'm sure that his friend with the DS will be jealous that he can't watch the latest Pokemon movie on it as can his friend with the Touch.