His post makes little sense since it was nearly feature-free. I was impressed with the stability of the SL well into the Betas, which is something I didn't expect.
Yes I forgot, you are always right and everyone else is wrong. SL was buggy on release, that is a fact, so was Leopard, I can't say about Tiger because I didn't upgrade until around 10.4.3. If you were impressed by the stability, then all that says is you don't have a high standard level.
Anecdotal: But I was using my macbook yesterday in McDonald's (free wifi-and no I don't eat the food-just coffee!) And a retired gentlemen made a comment to me, that all the 'computers' in here are 4 macs! I held up my iPhone 3Gs and said, '5!' He opened his belt clip and pulled out an iPhone 3G and said, '6!'
Pretty cool!
I had that situation in my local coffee shop. When I opened my Mac book Pro someone shouted out "that's number 12 now". I looked up and all the patrons had Macs of various flavors. We all laughed and it became a great conversation piece.
From my own experience and other people I know, I don't recommend anyone upgrading to Snow Leopard. Nothing but a big fat headache.
Not sure how true this is, or what the issues are, but I for one, can't afford to upgrade if there are ANY issues! The mac's here are used to run a business, and without them working, we'd have a harder time doing our business.
We use a few application,s that likely won't work, or work well with Snow Leopard (FreeHand for one),, and having used these applications for years, we can't take any chances.
Yes, we could put Snow Leopard on one machine just to see, but I haven't heard anything earthe shattering that says we should upgrade?
We're at the point of, if it ain't broke, then don't try to fix it.
OS X is slowly gaining market share. I said for al these years I would like to see about 12% US share and a 7% world share for Apple. I am one of the few people that enjoys the same friendly would of Mac users.
In this little rant of yours what you are failing to understand is for every 5 Mac users there are 90 Windows users. So you cant compare OSX upgrade data to Windows data. Also the fact that Netbooks use Windows XP and are big sellers slants the numbers.
Windows 7 sold more copies in pre orders then SL has sold to date.
Windows 7 has been out for two months and it already has a larger install base then SL and Leopard and Tiger combined.
Lets also point out that with a much smaller install base over 20% of Mac users are still running an OS two generations or older.
All this back-and-forth makes no sense anyway. XP is what it is because so many businesses use it. They just don't upgrade fast, plain and simple. Apple is profit driven, not market share driven.
Also, all of the people I know who own an Intel Mac run Windows on them. So who cares which has the bigger market share? The two OSes are no longer mutually exclusive, and each has their good points as well as bad.
Oh and two generations would bring you to Tiger. That is what...2005 release with last update 2007? As well as the fastest OS on a G4 PPC machine? Two generations of Windows would be XP, and over 50% use it still. You're saying there are so many netbooks sold it accounts for 30% of XP's marketshare?
If you're going to argue in percentages, don't bring "install base" into it according to size. Use percentages throughout your argument.
OS X is slowly gaining market share. I said for al these years I would like to see about 12% US share and a 7% world share for Apple. I am one of the few people that enjoys the same friendly would of Mac users.
OS X as it stands (the full version of the OS) will gain share probably in proportion to the expansion or growth (assuming it'll grow) of the Premium market. The Premium end of the market being what it is, there will be natural limits on its growth, but that doesn't matter because the quality of products in this segment (coupled with the kinds of margins you find in this segment) render the Premium end fairly safe. You don't have to move a lot of product to make money in this end, and there'll always be folks with a lot of disposable $$ swishing around, or folks that are willing to pay more for *certain* goods due to the value proposition they perceive in those goods. Apple's performance in this recession has proved this abundantly.
So really we're looking at limited growth for OS X on Macs qua Macs, but still appreciable growth given the segment. That's not a problem, just natural behaviour for this kind of beast. In the Premium end it isn't about overall share, but about share of the Premium end, and Apple rules this end. A safe and happy situation.
Where you'll see growth of OS X - as we're seeing it now - is in the mobile space. As OS X converges with the iPhone OS and Apple shifts to a different computing paradigm, that is, Macs will become more iPad-like and in turn iPads will become more powerful and flexible, we'll see a much more broad adoption of OS X, part of the reason being that it'll be a sub-$1000 entry fee to get into Apple computing products. Chances are that even in its more mobile, touch-based iterations OS X will still run on devices in the Premium segment or devices that are otherwise priced higher than competing devices (competing slates, etc.), but growth will still be faster and greater in proportion.
And what pocket Mac would that be? There are no pocket macs that I know of (well unless you are trying to be funny and referring to the iPhone, and iPod touch, which of course you can't be because they are not a Mac)
I couldn't live without mine. In addition to doing all my email and web browsing, it's a four-track recording studio, a stock checker, a gaming platform, my facebook interface, my news reader, my remote control, my Danish language teacher, my calendar, my movie ticket purchaser, my TV Guide, my portable planetarium, my music player, and more?all in the palm of my hand. Beats the hell out of all my pre-2003 Macs.
O! be some other name: What?s in a name? That which we call a Mac by any other name would compute as sweet.
And what pocket Mac would that be? There are no pocket macs that I know of (well unless you are trying to be funny and referring to the iPhone, and iPod touch, which of course you can't be because they are not a Mac)
They're close. Close enough for the industry to designate them as miniature computing devices. That's what the iPhone brings to the table, at least. Combine the top apps in each category on the App Store, including the better VNC apps, plus access to your iDisk, ability to edit MS documents, etc., and you've got a pocket computer.
It's not funny. It's the reality of Apple's innovative approach to mobile computing hitting the industry right in the face. By the looks of it, the industry is *still* reeling from the shot Apple laid down in 2007, followed by the App Store, and it's about to witness the pile-driver called the iPad. We can't even really conceive of the impact the iPad will have - it'll be THAT big.
You don't have to believe me or anyone else on these forums. I encourage the forlorn Win/PC advocates to stick around though and see exactly how it's going to go down. They're about to see just how far ahead of the pack Apple is in terms of ideas. While you're bleating about raw specs and particular features, Apple is changing the entire way we view and work with content. The fundamentals. That is, while ABC netbook maker is working to shoehorn whatever awful version of Winblows onto a shrunken notebook or slate, Apple is changing the very fundamentals of how we use tech and its role in our lives - both functionally and aesthetically. This goes way deeper than adding a camera or a connectivity port. It's about Apple's entire software/hardware ecosystem, primed and ready to go with ridiculous ease of use, a great UI design and a remarkable flexible OS as part of the package. It's pretty clear that Apple has this part of the industry figured out and locked up for the next few years at least.
We're looking at another iPod phenomenon here. Easily. But this time it'll mean much more for everyone and the effects will be much farther-reaching, for PC and Mac users alike.
I have a 2006 Intel iMac with 2gig ram. I installed snow leopard as a clean install and I haven't had any problems. I've got Leopard running on my PowerPC mac mini and it works great. My overall experience since dumping windows has been great. Any problems that I have encountered were quickly resolved usually by using google to search out the answer.
I think that Macs in general can be kept in use longer than any windows machine. So, for me the cost of ownership is much lower. Macs do not seem to eat hard drives like my windows systems did.
They're close. Close enough for the industry to designate them as miniature computing devices. That's what the iPhone brings to the table, at least. Combine the top apps in each category on the App Store, including the better VNC apps, plus access to your iDisk, ability to edit MS documents, etc., and you've got a pocket computer.
Nothing you wrote changes the fact that the iPhone, or the iPhone touch is not a Mac, they are mobile computer devices running the iPhone OS.
All you need to do is check out their resale value. It speaks volumes. Even old Macs can fetch a pretty penny.
Old Macs as in PPC maybe, but the price of Macs has dropped quite a bit in the last few years. The top Mac Mini now about 60% the price of the original top Mac Mini.
I had that situation in my local coffee shop. When I opened my Mac book Pro someone shouted out "that's number 12 now". I looked up and all the patrons had Macs of various flavors. We all laughed and it became a great conversation piece.
It's amazing the number of older people with smartphones because of the iPhone.
The coffee shop I used to go to was almost always Macs. We're talking a pretty big place with a couple dozen or so on average. If you didn't know better you'd think Apple was the only PC maker and Facebook was the only thing you could do with a PC.
I was waiting at a coffee shop to meet up with a friend one afternoon about 3 years ago. I was the ONLY one in the place with a not-Mac. No, there was no gesturing and pointing, but still...! I was also the oldest guy in the place by far.
Now, I run an all-Mac fleet except for the Dell desktop I have for doing work in Office 2003. And before anyone says anything, Office for the Mac is not, repeat NOT, compatible with Office for the PC if you have any macros at all. Run a spreadsheet with VBA macros in OftM and it barfs all over the rug.
All you need to do is check out their resale value. It speaks volumes. Even old Macs can fetch a pretty penny.
I have one of the first Mac Minis, with the G4 processor. It was bought so I could see what all the excitement was about, and I decided to make the transition (except for one last PC I use for stuff I can't do on my Macs).
It is coming up fast on 5 years old, almost-daily usage, and all I did was put a bigger hard disc in it. It now is "retired", serving as a music player; one big iPod if you will. Just about every CD I own is in it, and soon will have my little bit of vinyl and a handful of cassettes I still have. I'll run it until it fails. Somehow, I think that will be a while.
Windows used to be far more dominant. It's in fact experienced its greatest decline in share (along with share value) under Ballmer.
I'm not sure what Balmer has to do with the decline, at least in a direct sense. He's an ill-tempered, strange man, but that is beside the point I think. The reason the share is declining is because Microsoft is just plain not offering anything really new or better.
I have a Win7 machine where I work. I find the interface more annoying than ever, with all manner of new "features" I just plain do not like. It also tends to lock up FAR more often than the XP machine I had at my previous workplace. -shrug- It's not my money...
Nothing you wrote changes the fact that the iPhone, or the iPhone touch is not a Mac, they are mobile computer devices running the iPhone OS.
is that you have no idea what a Mac is. This thing I carry around in my pocket has the soul of a Mac, it runs Mac OSX, and the first words out of my mouth after booting the thing up for the first time were: Holy @&"$ this is a pocket Mac.
I'm wondering: do you own an iPhone or iPod Touch?
Comments
His post makes little sense since it was nearly feature-free. I was impressed with the stability of the SL well into the Betas, which is something I didn't expect.
Yes I forgot, you are always right and everyone else is wrong. SL was buggy on release, that is a fact, so was Leopard, I can't say about Tiger because I didn't upgrade until around 10.4.3. If you were impressed by the stability, then all that says is you don't have a high standard level.
Thanks.
What about worldwide?
Same here, let's wait for tomorrow's results on NetMarketShare (most interestingly this table), which are global.
Wow, Windows sure it dominant. It's good to see the Mac still growing though.
Windows used to be far more dominant. It's in fact experienced its greatest decline in share (along with share value) under Ballmer.
Anecdotal: But I was using my macbook yesterday in McDonald's (free wifi-and no I don't eat the food-just coffee!) And a retired gentlemen made a comment to me, that all the 'computers' in here are 4 macs! I held up my iPhone 3Gs and said, '5!' He opened his belt clip and pulled out an iPhone 3G and said, '6!'
Pretty cool!
I had that situation in my local coffee shop. When I opened my Mac book Pro someone shouted out "that's number 12 now". I looked up and all the patrons had Macs of various flavors. We all laughed and it became a great conversation piece.
From my own experience and other people I know, I don't recommend anyone upgrading to Snow Leopard. Nothing but a big fat headache.
Not sure how true this is, or what the issues are, but I for one, can't afford to upgrade if there are ANY issues! The mac's here are used to run a business, and without them working, we'd have a harder time doing our business.
We use a few application,s that likely won't work, or work well with Snow Leopard (FreeHand for one),, and having used these applications for years, we can't take any chances.
Yes, we could put Snow Leopard on one machine just to see, but I haven't heard anything earthe shattering that says we should upgrade?
We're at the point of, if it ain't broke, then don't try to fix it.
Skip
In this little rant of yours what you are failing to understand is for every 5 Mac users there are 90 Windows users. So you cant compare OSX upgrade data to Windows data. Also the fact that Netbooks use Windows XP and are big sellers slants the numbers.
Windows 7 sold more copies in pre orders then SL has sold to date.
Windows 7 has been out for two months and it already has a larger install base then SL and Leopard and Tiger combined.
Lets also point out that with a much smaller install base over 20% of Mac users are still running an OS two generations or older.
All this back-and-forth makes no sense anyway. XP is what it is because so many businesses use it. They just don't upgrade fast, plain and simple. Apple is profit driven, not market share driven.
Also, all of the people I know who own an Intel Mac run Windows on them. So who cares which has the bigger market share? The two OSes are no longer mutually exclusive, and each has their good points as well as bad.
Oh and two generations would bring you to Tiger. That is what...2005 release with last update 2007? As well as the fastest OS on a G4 PPC machine? Two generations of Windows would be XP, and over 50% use it still. You're saying there are so many netbooks sold it accounts for 30% of XP's marketshare?
If you're going to argue in percentages, don't bring "install base" into it according to size. Use percentages throughout your argument.
OS X is slowly gaining market share. I said for al these years I would like to see about 12% US share and a 7% world share for Apple. I am one of the few people that enjoys the same friendly would of Mac users.
OS X as it stands (the full version of the OS) will gain share probably in proportion to the expansion or growth (assuming it'll grow) of the Premium market. The Premium end of the market being what it is, there will be natural limits on its growth, but that doesn't matter because the quality of products in this segment (coupled with the kinds of margins you find in this segment) render the Premium end fairly safe. You don't have to move a lot of product to make money in this end, and there'll always be folks with a lot of disposable $$ swishing around, or folks that are willing to pay more for *certain* goods due to the value proposition they perceive in those goods. Apple's performance in this recession has proved this abundantly.
So really we're looking at limited growth for OS X on Macs qua Macs, but still appreciable growth given the segment. That's not a problem, just natural behaviour for this kind of beast. In the Premium end it isn't about overall share, but about share of the Premium end, and Apple rules this end. A safe and happy situation.
Where you'll see growth of OS X - as we're seeing it now - is in the mobile space. As OS X converges with the iPhone OS and Apple shifts to a different computing paradigm, that is, Macs will become more iPad-like and in turn iPads will become more powerful and flexible, we'll see a much more broad adoption of OS X, part of the reason being that it'll be a sub-$1000 entry fee to get into Apple computing products. Chances are that even in its more mobile, touch-based iterations OS X will still run on devices in the Premium segment or devices that are otherwise priced higher than competing devices (competing slates, etc.), but growth will still be faster and greater in proportion.
And what pocket Mac would that be? There are no pocket macs that I know of (well unless you are trying to be funny and referring to the iPhone, and iPod touch, which of course you can't be because they are not a Mac)
I couldn't live without mine. In addition to doing all my email and web browsing, it's a four-track recording studio, a stock checker, a gaming platform, my facebook interface, my news reader, my remote control, my Danish language teacher, my calendar, my movie ticket purchaser, my TV Guide, my portable planetarium, my music player, and more?all in the palm of my hand. Beats the hell out of all my pre-2003 Macs.
O! be some other name: What?s in a name? That which we call a Mac by any other name would compute as sweet.
And what pocket Mac would that be? There are no pocket macs that I know of (well unless you are trying to be funny and referring to the iPhone, and iPod touch, which of course you can't be because they are not a Mac)
They're close. Close enough for the industry to designate them as miniature computing devices. That's what the iPhone brings to the table, at least. Combine the top apps in each category on the App Store, including the better VNC apps, plus access to your iDisk, ability to edit MS documents, etc., and you've got a pocket computer.
It's not funny. It's the reality of Apple's innovative approach to mobile computing hitting the industry right in the face. By the looks of it, the industry is *still* reeling from the shot Apple laid down in 2007, followed by the App Store, and it's about to witness the pile-driver called the iPad. We can't even really conceive of the impact the iPad will have - it'll be THAT big.
You don't have to believe me or anyone else on these forums. I encourage the forlorn Win/PC advocates to stick around though and see exactly how it's going to go down. They're about to see just how far ahead of the pack Apple is in terms of ideas. While you're bleating about raw specs and particular features, Apple is changing the entire way we view and work with content. The fundamentals. That is, while ABC netbook maker is working to shoehorn whatever awful version of Winblows onto a shrunken notebook or slate, Apple is changing the very fundamentals of how we use tech and its role in our lives - both functionally and aesthetically. This goes way deeper than adding a camera or a connectivity port. It's about Apple's entire software/hardware ecosystem, primed and ready to go with ridiculous ease of use, a great UI design and a remarkable flexible OS as part of the package. It's pretty clear that Apple has this part of the industry figured out and locked up for the next few years at least.
We're looking at another iPod phenomenon here. Easily. But this time it'll mean much more for everyone and the effects will be much farther-reaching, for PC and Mac users alike.
I think that Macs in general can be kept in use longer than any windows machine. So, for me the cost of ownership is much lower. Macs do not seem to eat hard drives like my windows systems did.
It's simple, you have to pay for quality.
I think that Macs in general can be kept in use longer than any windows machine.
All you need to do is check out their resale value. It speaks volumes. Even old Macs can fetch a pretty penny.
They're close. Close enough for the industry to designate them as miniature computing devices. That's what the iPhone brings to the table, at least. Combine the top apps in each category on the App Store, including the better VNC apps, plus access to your iDisk, ability to edit MS documents, etc., and you've got a pocket computer.
Nothing you wrote changes the fact that the iPhone, or the iPhone touch is not a Mac, they are mobile computer devices running the iPhone OS.
All you need to do is check out their resale value. It speaks volumes. Even old Macs can fetch a pretty penny.
Old Macs as in PPC maybe, but the price of Macs has dropped quite a bit in the last few years. The top Mac Mini now about 60% the price of the original top Mac Mini.
I had that situation in my local coffee shop. When I opened my Mac book Pro someone shouted out "that's number 12 now". I looked up and all the patrons had Macs of various flavors. We all laughed and it became a great conversation piece.
Cool!
Wow, Windows sure it dominant. It's good to see the Mac still growing though.
Right...But Quadra is right on this....in business, if you're not 'growing' your 'dying!'
It's amazing the number of older people with smartphones because of the iPhone.
The coffee shop I used to go to was almost always Macs. We're talking a pretty big place with a couple dozen or so on average. If you didn't know better you'd think Apple was the only PC maker and Facebook was the only thing you could do with a PC.
I was waiting at a coffee shop to meet up with a friend one afternoon about 3 years ago. I was the ONLY one in the place with a not-Mac. No, there was no gesturing and pointing, but still...! I was also the oldest guy in the place by far.
Now, I run an all-Mac fleet except for the Dell desktop I have for doing work in Office 2003. And before anyone says anything, Office for the Mac is not, repeat NOT, compatible with Office for the PC if you have any macros at all. Run a spreadsheet with VBA macros in OftM and it barfs all over the rug.
All you need to do is check out their resale value. It speaks volumes. Even old Macs can fetch a pretty penny.
I have one of the first Mac Minis, with the G4 processor. It was bought so I could see what all the excitement was about, and I decided to make the transition (except for one last PC I use for stuff I can't do on my Macs).
It is coming up fast on 5 years old, almost-daily usage, and all I did was put a bigger hard disc in it. It now is "retired", serving as a music player; one big iPod if you will. Just about every CD I own is in it, and soon will have my little bit of vinyl and a handful of cassettes I still have. I'll run it until it fails. Somehow, I think that will be a while.
Windows used to be far more dominant. It's in fact experienced its greatest decline in share (along with share value) under Ballmer.
I'm not sure what Balmer has to do with the decline, at least in a direct sense. He's an ill-tempered, strange man, but that is beside the point I think. The reason the share is declining is because Microsoft is just plain not offering anything really new or better.
I have a Win7 machine where I work. I find the interface more annoying than ever, with all manner of new "features" I just plain do not like. It also tends to lock up FAR more often than the XP machine I had at my previous workplace. -shrug- It's not my money...
Nothing you wrote changes the fact that the iPhone, or the iPhone touch is not a Mac, they are mobile computer devices running the iPhone OS.
is that you have no idea what a Mac is. This thing I carry around in my pocket has the soul of a Mac, it runs Mac OSX, and the first words out of my mouth after booting the thing up for the first time were: Holy @&"$ this is a pocket Mac.
I'm wondering: do you own an iPhone or iPod Touch?