Here's my take. There is obviously a problem affecting some (who knows how many) phones. It seems that it is a small percentage of the total sold. But for those who have the bad ones, it's a big issue. They are not nuts just because someone else's phone works fine. My sense is that a bad batch or two were shipped. I have never been impressed with the Chinese regarding QC. So now Apple has to confirm what the issue is with the bad ones and correct it which is what they are probably doing right now. If I had a bad one I would just return it. And wait for the issue to be fixed. The returned ones will be fixed and sold as refurbs. It just doesn't seem as though, judging by how many people are raving (positively) about the phone, that is a universal issue or one just limited to low signal areas, etc.
Unfortunately, they contradict themselves in their own article. In some places they uncategorically state that the problem affects all iPhones, then, they say their review unit wasn't affected. Then there's the ridiculous claim that CR showed that it affects all iPhones... by testing 3 phones.
This is hilarious! I'm a HUGE Apple fanboy most of the time, but when I had an iPhone 4, I would constantly lose all data all together. I would sit there and try to download something, only to finally realize that I had my pinky finger partially covering the black seam. That's just not right, so I returned it. Do what is right... return the iPhone 4 until Apple figures out how to fix it. Until then, I'll be using my iPhone 3G because it works perfectly fine on 2.2.1.
Even *I* can't defend Apple on this stupid mistake. They're hurting their image!
This is hilarious! I'm a HUGE Apple fanboy most of the time, but when I had an iPhone 4, I would constantly lose all data all together. I would sit there and try to download something, only to finally realize that I had my pinky finger partially covering the black seam. That's just not right, so I returned it. Do what is right... return the iPhone 4 until Apple figures out how to fix it. Until then, I'll be using my iPhone 3G because it works perfectly fine on 2.2.1.
I couldn't go back to my iPhone 3G. The screen looks out of focus compared to my iPhone 4.
This is hilarious! I'm a HUGE Apple fanboy most of the time, but when I had an iPhone 4, I would constantly lose all data all together. I would sit there and try to download something, only to finally realize that I had my pinky finger partially covering the black seam. That's just not right, so I returned it. Do what is right... return the iPhone 4 until Apple figures out how to fix it. Until then, I'll be using my iPhone 3G because it works perfectly fine on 2.2.1.
Even *I* can't defend Apple on this stupid mistake. They're hurting their image!
... far more important than 'their image' is the inconvenience this obvious design flaw is causing their customers.
CR's conclusions still don't make sense as RF does not behave like electrical current. A simple piece of tape shouldn't make a difference.
Besides, all that matters for me is real world performance vs. theoretical pontificating. The iPhine 4 beats the pants off of the 3Gs in actual usage - without a case. I haven't used on before and I have no intention of bulking up my phone now with useless plastic or rubber.
While I agree that real world performance is more important than number of bars, your first statement is wrong. In my case, a piece of electrical tape (which is thinner than duct tape) reduced the signal loss - at least as measured by the number of bars.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe
Just look at the results they obtained. The answer should be obvious.
Will they retest once the software is updated? This is a non issue.
More importantly, will they test other phones with the same test method? This "iPhone signal drops" mania is ridiculous if they don't test other phones.
The signal bar display is not a bug. They intentionally chose to have the bars not present a display that was analogous to signal strength.
Yes, I believe Apple has known all along about the signal bars. Remember this episode from 2008, when Apple increased the number of bars displayed in iOS 2.1?
Yes, I believe Apple has known all along about the signal bars. Remember this episode from 2008, when Apple increased the number of bars displayed in iOS 2.1?
Serious questions here guys: I live in a high signal area. If the new patch from Apple reports the bars correctly, will I then see a reduction in bars when touching the lower left corner? Also, shouldn't I at least be experiencing dropped calls? I'm thinking if this is in fact a design error, shouldn't all iPhones be affected, or is it because I'm in a high signal area that I haven't noticed the problem yet?
Dear Apple: I will be happy if you demonstrate fairness to customers by giving credit for bumpers purchased and if you demonstrate honesty by bringing back Field Test Mode in the next iOS update.
Serious questions here guys: I live in a high signal area. If the new patch from Apple reports the bars correctly, will I then see a reduction in bars when touching the lower left corner. Also, shouldn't I at least be experiencing dropped calls? I'm thinking if this is in fact a design error, shouldn't all iPhones be affected, or is it because I'm in a high signal area that I haven't noticed the problem yet?
Chances are... your being in a 'strong signal area' is working to your benefit in this situation.
Here's my take. There is obviously a problem affecting some (who knows how many) phones. It seems that it is a small percentage of the total sold. But for those who have the bad ones, it's a big issue. They are not nuts just because someone else's phone works fine. My sense is that a bad batch or two were shipped. I have never been impressed with the Chinese regarding QC. So now Apple has to confirm what the issue is with the bad ones and correct it which is what they are probably doing right now. If I had a bad one I would just return it. And wait for the issue to be fixed. The returned ones will be fixed and sold as refurbs. It just doesn't seem as though, judging by how many people are raving (positively) about the phone, that is a universal issue or one just limited to low signal areas, etc.
Am in Los Angeles. Me and a roomate bought our iphone 4's on day one. Each of us HAVE NO RECEPTION ISSUES at all. In fact this new iphone performs FASTER, downloads FASTER from our WIFI, the face time is awesome.. The only "issue" i can report is that the prox sensor is a little too sensitive sometimes. But overall this phone is a major upgrade from past models and just flies with speed and moving through websites and applications is now super fast and flawless. Clearly to me the "issues" people are experiencing must be related to a combination of factors that don't exist in my case and the case of countless others. Dropped calls are a fricking fact of life, not apple. And yea that goes for EVERY network out there including Verizon.
Hey I am def not a fan of ATT. But am not concerned about Apple "ponying" up or not. I'm a 25++ year customer and can say that right now I have 6 Apple products in my house including iphones and their customer service has stood behind my purchases within REASON.
And...I might add...Even today, calling Apple is so much easier than calling almost ANY consumer electronics company on earth!
I mean, what's the problem? If my phone, no matter who I bought it from...did not make calls or consistantely exhibited problems making it unable to function, i'd just return it either for my money back or exchange it. It boggles my mind why paid shrills from Apple's competitors stir up these forums and convince people that have no issues to honestly develop one while they sit on these forums ranting about an issue when a solution exists, it's called exchange or return.
My phones reception is GREATLY improved over previous models. Its internet speed also performs as promised.
If you get dropped calls that doesn't mean you have any more of a problem than with any other cell phone.
My iPhone 4 will drop calls on que every time, no problem. It has been demonstrated with an Apple Genius and with AppleCare. I have tested several other phones at the same locations and at the same times and they do not suffer the same results as the iPhone 4. In the tests were iPhone 4, iPhone 3GS, iPhone 3G, Motorolla RAZR. We also tested a Nokia, an LG, and a Samsung, but I didn't record the model numbers of those three.
Bottom line is that my iPhone 4 performed well sitting on a table, but when picked up with two fingers anywhere on the sides, the call would drop in approximately 20 seconds. With all of the other phones we tested, not one call was dropped no matter how they were held. Also, data downloads can be halted with my iPhone 4. Could not get data to stop with the others.
Yes, I believe Apple has known all along about the signal bars. Remember this episode from 2008, when Apple increased the number of bars displayed in iOS 2.1?
While the informal test results in that article don't seem to agree with more recent, formal testing, I think it's pretty clear, based on the more recent tests, that they set the signal display to show expected call quality rather than signal strength. So 5 bars meant you would get good call quality, with a decrease in bars indicating how much you should expect the call quality to decline.
But, because 5 bars represented such a wide range of signal strength, the difference between holding and not holding the iP4 sometimes appears dramatic, even though it isn't. The bar display will "fix" that by eliminating the apparent dramatic drop in signal strength.
But, the announced fix doesn't seem to address at all the issue that some phones will lose connection when the seam is bridged but others won't. And they have publicly addressed the proximity sensor issue either.
It's likely the latter of these is easily fixable with a software update, which has not yet been announced. It's possible the seam bridging issue on the phones that experience it may also be fixable in software, but they have not yet announced anything related to that either.
Doesn't seem like a flip flop. Their initial testing couldn't reproduce the problem. They gathered additional information, corrected their methodology and now can reproduce it.
The problem was that their initial "testing" wasn't really testing by their normally thorough standards. I was actually shocked that they even published that initial finding knowing that they didn't really test it. And I suspected that they'd have to change their stance once real testing was done.
My confidence in CR wasn't diminished by their flip-flop, it was diminished by them apparently getting caught up in the iPhone frenzy and feeling they needed to weigh in with an opinion without conducting proper tests first.
Here's my take. There is obviously a problem affecting some (who knows how many) phones. It seems that it is a small percentage of the total sold. But for those who have the bad ones, it's a big issue. They are not nuts just because someone else's phone works fine. My sense is that a bad batch or two were shipped. I have never been impressed with the Chinese regarding QC. So now Apple has to confirm what the issue is with the bad ones and correct it which is what they are probably doing right now. If I had a bad one I would just return it. And wait for the issue to be fixed. The returned ones will be fixed and sold as refurbs. It just doesn't seem as though, judging by how many people are raving (positively) about the phone, that is a universal issue or one just limited to low signal areas, etc.
Beacrefull...someone is going to accuse you of making sense!
Off topic a bit, but just an observation. If anyone is in my boat and their iPhone 3G contract just expired, and you're thinking of buying an iPhone 4, take heed!
If you order a iPhone 4 with the iPhone App, it bangs you the 18.00 upgrade fee, but if you do it on a real Mac, the fee is waved. Go figure.
Consumer reports can remove the phone from their ass and they will get better reception. If those of you can't figure out how to hold a phone properly without covering a 2 mm strip, then don't buy one. If you are too cheap to buy one of the many different cases available, then don't buy one. If you don't like the phone, return it. Most of the people here making comments don't even own the iPhone 4. I get better reception with the iPhone 4 than I ever did with the original iPhone. If I smother the antenna on the original iPhone, the bars go down on that one too. It doesn't matter if the display shows 2 bars or 4 bars, you can still make a phone call.
Comments
Engadget confirms as well, with some of their phones dropping calls and experiencing reduced Internet speeds:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/12/c...ems-and-so-do/
Unfortunately, they contradict themselves in their own article. In some places they uncategorically state that the problem affects all iPhones, then, they say their review unit wasn't affected. Then there's the ridiculous claim that CR showed that it affects all iPhones... by testing 3 phones.
Even *I* can't defend Apple on this stupid mistake. They're hurting their image!
The Boy Who Cried Wolf.
Not Applicable...
This is hilarious! I'm a HUGE Apple fanboy most of the time, but when I had an iPhone 4, I would constantly lose all data all together. I would sit there and try to download something, only to finally realize that I had my pinky finger partially covering the black seam. That's just not right, so I returned it. Do what is right... return the iPhone 4 until Apple figures out how to fix it. Until then, I'll be using my iPhone 3G because it works perfectly fine on 2.2.1.
I couldn't go back to my iPhone 3G. The screen looks out of focus compared to my iPhone 4.
This is hilarious! I'm a HUGE Apple fanboy most of the time, but when I had an iPhone 4, I would constantly lose all data all together. I would sit there and try to download something, only to finally realize that I had my pinky finger partially covering the black seam. That's just not right, so I returned it. Do what is right... return the iPhone 4 until Apple figures out how to fix it. Until then, I'll be using my iPhone 3G because it works perfectly fine on 2.2.1.
Even *I* can't defend Apple on this stupid mistake. They're hurting their image!
... far more important than 'their image' is the inconvenience this obvious design flaw is causing their customers.
CR's conclusions still don't make sense as RF does not behave like electrical current. A simple piece of tape shouldn't make a difference.
Besides, all that matters for me is real world performance vs. theoretical pontificating. The iPhine 4 beats the pants off of the 3Gs in actual usage - without a case. I haven't used on before and I have no intention of bulking up my phone now with useless plastic or rubber.
While I agree that real world performance is more important than number of bars, your first statement is wrong. In my case, a piece of electrical tape (which is thinner than duct tape) reduced the signal loss - at least as measured by the number of bars.
Just look at the results they obtained. The answer should be obvious.
Will they retest once the software is updated? This is a non issue.
More importantly, will they test other phones with the same test method? This "iPhone signal drops" mania is ridiculous if they don't test other phones.
The signal bar display is not a bug. They intentionally chose to have the bars not present a display that was analogous to signal strength.
Yes, I believe Apple has known all along about the signal bars. Remember this episode from 2008, when Apple increased the number of bars displayed in iOS 2.1?
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-19512_7-10115756-233.html
This Consumer Report video of the iPhone4 is absolute pure win!
Outstanding Pure Win!
Do you hear that Mr. Jobs? Consumer Reports cannot recommend the iPhone4.
But I guess this is a "Non Issue"
However there is still light at the end of the Tunnel former Apple boys n girls.
Its called.....
*btw..... where are those sexy White iPhone4's?
Or did they walk off the job and transform into White HTC's. Rumor has it that HTC in White has surfaced the retail floor today!
If you can cope with Android bad seeds Why wouldn't iPhone users cope?
Unintelligent rant.
Yes, I believe Apple has known all along about the signal bars. Remember this episode from 2008, when Apple increased the number of bars displayed in iOS 2.1?
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-19512_7-10115756-233.html
Serious questions here guys: I live in a high signal area. If the new patch from Apple reports the bars correctly, will I then see a reduction in bars when touching the lower left corner. Also, shouldn't I at least be experiencing dropped calls? I'm thinking if this is in fact a design error, shouldn't all iPhones be affected, or is it because I'm in a high signal area that I haven't noticed the problem yet?
Chances are... your being in a 'strong signal area' is working to your benefit in this situation.
Here's my take. There is obviously a problem affecting some (who knows how many) phones. It seems that it is a small percentage of the total sold. But for those who have the bad ones, it's a big issue. They are not nuts just because someone else's phone works fine. My sense is that a bad batch or two were shipped. I have never been impressed with the Chinese regarding QC. So now Apple has to confirm what the issue is with the bad ones and correct it which is what they are probably doing right now. If I had a bad one I would just return it. And wait for the issue to be fixed. The returned ones will be fixed and sold as refurbs. It just doesn't seem as though, judging by how many people are raving (positively) about the phone, that is a universal issue or one just limited to low signal areas, etc.
Am in Los Angeles. Me and a roomate bought our iphone 4's on day one. Each of us HAVE NO RECEPTION ISSUES at all. In fact this new iphone performs FASTER, downloads FASTER from our WIFI, the face time is awesome.. The only "issue" i can report is that the prox sensor is a little too sensitive sometimes. But overall this phone is a major upgrade from past models and just flies with speed and moving through websites and applications is now super fast and flawless. Clearly to me the "issues" people are experiencing must be related to a combination of factors that don't exist in my case and the case of countless others. Dropped calls are a fricking fact of life, not apple. And yea that goes for EVERY network out there including Verizon.
Hey I am def not a fan of ATT. But am not concerned about Apple "ponying" up or not. I'm a 25++ year customer and can say that right now I have 6 Apple products in my house including iphones and their customer service has stood behind my purchases within REASON.
And...I might add...Even today, calling Apple is so much easier than calling almost ANY consumer electronics company on earth!
I mean, what's the problem? If my phone, no matter who I bought it from...did not make calls or consistantely exhibited problems making it unable to function, i'd just return it either for my money back or exchange it. It boggles my mind why paid shrills from Apple's competitors stir up these forums and convince people that have no issues to honestly develop one while they sit on these forums ranting about an issue when a solution exists, it's called exchange or return.
My phones reception is GREATLY improved over previous models. Its internet speed also performs as promised.
If you get dropped calls that doesn't mean you have any more of a problem than with any other cell phone.
My iPhone 4 will drop calls on que every time, no problem. It has been demonstrated with an Apple Genius and with AppleCare. I have tested several other phones at the same locations and at the same times and they do not suffer the same results as the iPhone 4. In the tests were iPhone 4, iPhone 3GS, iPhone 3G, Motorolla RAZR. We also tested a Nokia, an LG, and a Samsung, but I didn't record the model numbers of those three.
Bottom line is that my iPhone 4 performed well sitting on a table, but when picked up with two fingers anywhere on the sides, the call would drop in approximately 20 seconds. With all of the other phones we tested, not one call was dropped no matter how they were held. Also, data downloads can be halted with my iPhone 4. Could not get data to stop with the others.
Yes, I believe Apple has known all along about the signal bars. Remember this episode from 2008, when Apple increased the number of bars displayed in iOS 2.1?
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-19512_7-10115756-233.html
While the informal test results in that article don't seem to agree with more recent, formal testing, I think it's pretty clear, based on the more recent tests, that they set the signal display to show expected call quality rather than signal strength. So 5 bars meant you would get good call quality, with a decrease in bars indicating how much you should expect the call quality to decline.
But, because 5 bars represented such a wide range of signal strength, the difference between holding and not holding the iP4 sometimes appears dramatic, even though it isn't. The bar display will "fix" that by eliminating the apparent dramatic drop in signal strength.
But, the announced fix doesn't seem to address at all the issue that some phones will lose connection when the seam is bridged but others won't. And they have publicly addressed the proximity sensor issue either.
It's likely the latter of these is easily fixable with a software update, which has not yet been announced. It's possible the seam bridging issue on the phones that experience it may also be fixable in software, but they have not yet announced anything related to that either.
Doesn't seem like a flip flop. Their initial testing couldn't reproduce the problem. They gathered additional information, corrected their methodology and now can reproduce it.
The problem was that their initial "testing" wasn't really testing by their normally thorough standards. I was actually shocked that they even published that initial finding knowing that they didn't really test it. And I suspected that they'd have to change their stance once real testing was done.
My confidence in CR wasn't diminished by their flip-flop, it was diminished by them apparently getting caught up in the iPhone frenzy and feeling they needed to weigh in with an opinion without conducting proper tests first.
Here's my take. There is obviously a problem affecting some (who knows how many) phones. It seems that it is a small percentage of the total sold. But for those who have the bad ones, it's a big issue. They are not nuts just because someone else's phone works fine. My sense is that a bad batch or two were shipped. I have never been impressed with the Chinese regarding QC. So now Apple has to confirm what the issue is with the bad ones and correct it which is what they are probably doing right now. If I had a bad one I would just return it. And wait for the issue to be fixed. The returned ones will be fixed and sold as refurbs. It just doesn't seem as though, judging by how many people are raving (positively) about the phone, that is a universal issue or one just limited to low signal areas, etc.
Beacrefull...someone is going to accuse you of making sense!
If you order a iPhone 4 with the iPhone App, it bangs you the 18.00 upgrade fee, but if you do it on a real Mac, the fee is waved. Go figure.