Former Apple consultant: Apple's iPhone naming conventions send 'weak message'

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  • Reply 181 of 203
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,363member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post



    Sure they did, just as people refer to various versions as iPhone 4G. It's either shorthand or just not knowing the proper nomenclature. You also hear people refer to the iPod Touch as an iTouch and refer to non-Apple products as iPods, iPhones and iPads.


    Never heard anyone refer to an iPhone 4G either, maybe I'm not hanging around enough illiterate people.  iTouch I've heard, but I'd say that's just a shortening of the product name, and certainly not a confusion of the versioning, so it's besides the point.  4G if it is used is quite possibly a reference to LTE by someone in the know, so possibly also besides the point.


     


    This is an almost completely manufactured issue, that if it does exist at all is a rare in the extreme, and in those rare instances at most creates a slight air of confusion about Apple's products that pales in comparison to the confusion around other manufacturers (i.e. AppleZilla's post above).


     


    Pedantic nerds, nerdy pedants, and out-of-work brand consultants are the only ones who care.


     


    Move. On.

  • Reply 182 of 203
    magic_almagic_al Posts: 325member
    The S is honest, and there's no choice but to be honest because the S model has the same form factor as the previous year. The S product doesn't LOOK new.

    Remember most people have two-year contracts. Knowing the next year's model is not "all that" compared to what you have is comforting. If you buy an S, you wait for the next S. The people who want the latest bling buy the integer release, while the people who like the product to "mature" or whatever get on the S cycle.
  • Reply 183 of 203
    Completely agree with this guy. Who wants to buy a 3 year old phone? iphone 4 anyone? Is the MBP called MBP 6S?

    Change model lineup to:

    IPHONE: cheapest body, smallest screen, slowest but still an iPhone ( this is the cheap iphone the global phone to sell in india, etc.)

    IPHONE S nicest body, great screen, fastest, best camera

    IPHONE XL: big honking screen for big handed people, similar feature set, specs of iPhone S
  • Reply 184 of 203
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    crowley wrote: »
    Never heard anyone refer to an iPhone 4G either, maybe I'm not hanging around enough illiterate people.  iTouch I've heard, but I'd say that's just a shortening of the product name, and certainly not a confusion of the versioning, so it's besides the point.  4G if it is used is quite possibly a reference to LTE by someone in the know, so possibly also besides the point.

    This is an almost completely manufactured issue, that if it does exist at all is a rare in the extreme, and in those rare instances at most creates a slight air of confusion about Apple's products that pales in comparison to the confusion around other manufacturers (i.e. AppleZilla's post above).

    Pedantic nerds, nerdy pedants, and out-of-work brand consultants are the only ones who care.

    Move. On.

    1) Clearly Apple cares since they have decided to use various additives to their branding with each revision. It's quite foolish to say that Apple's marketing are just "pedantic nerds, nerdy pedants, and out-of-work brand consultants." Seriously?!

    2) Just this morning at Starbucks I heard someone refer to their iPhone as their Apple. If you've never heard someone use a incorrect product or brand name it's likely you're not paying attention. Even Blackberry users often refer to the company as Blackberry — which it is now for obvious reasons — but many wouldn't know whom you refer if you had sad Research in Motion.
  • Reply 185 of 203
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    fuji apple wrote: »
    Completely agree with this guy. Who wants to buy a 3 year old phone? iphone 4 anyone? Is the MBP called MBP 6S?

    Change model lineup to:

    IPHONE: cheapest body, smallest screen, slowest but still an iPhone ( this is the cheap iphone the global phone to sell in india, etc.)

    IPHONE S nicest body, great screen, fastest, best camera

    IPHONE XL: big honking screen for big handed people, similar feature set, specs of iPhone S

    This doesn't work because a phone you buy one day could be named something else the next. Fluctuating branding of a specific product is rarely a good idea.
  • Reply 186 of 203
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,921member
    fuji apple wrote: »
    Completely agree with this guy. Who wants to buy a 3 year old phone? iphone 4 anyone? Is the MBP called MBP 6S?

    Change model lineup to:

    IPHONE: cheapest body, smallest screen, slowest but still an iPhone ( this is the cheap iphone the global phone to sell in india, etc.)

    IPHONE S nicest body, great screen, fastest, best camera

    IPHONE XL: big honking screen for big handed people, similar feature set, specs of iPhone S

    Who? Apparently a lot more than those who want the SG3.
  • Reply 187 of 203
    This guy makes a good point, but there is also a danger of diluting enthusiasm with too many numbered releases. A new iPhone number currently generates excitement because people know it means a phone that is entirely new. Start calling the "S" models new numbers, and people will start yawning when they hear about an iPhone 27.

  • Reply 188 of 203
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,363member
    solipsismx wrote: »
    1) Clearly Apple cares since they have decided to use various additives to their branding with each revision. It's quite foolish to say that Apple's marketing are just "pedantic nerds, nerdy pedants, and out-of-work brand consultants." Seriously?!
    I really don't think Apple give a hoot about people getting confused about the generation of their old phones. They care about them getting confused about their new phones, which is why they've settled for a simple N, NS, N+1, N+1S system. It makes sense now, it just doesn't make sense if you check the history. Apple doesn't care about the history, only the aforementioned do.
    solipsismx wrote: »
    2) Just this morning at Starbucks I heard someone refer to their iPhone as their Apple. If you've never heard someone use a incorrect product or brand name it's likely you're not paying attention. Even Blackberry users often refer to the company as Blackberry — which it is now for obvious reasons — but many wouldn't know whom you refer if you had sad Research in Motion.
    As long as you're buying an Apple I doubt Mac care what you think the company is called. And what exactly would they do about it anyway, mount a "We are Apple" ad campaign? Pointless.
  • Reply 189 of 203
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    crowley wrote: »
    I really don't think Apple give a hoot about people getting confused about the generation of their old phones. They care about them getting confused about their new phones, which is why they've settled for a simple N, NS, N+1, N+1S system. It makes sense now, it just doesn't make sense if you check the history. Apple doesn't care about the history, only the aforementioned do.
    As long as you're buying an Apple I doubt Mac care what you think the company is called. And what exactly would they do about it anyway, mount a "We are Apple" ad campaign? Pointless.

    This is all silly. A great deal of money goes into marketing. This means brands and trademarks not being copied by others and even keeping highly popular brands from being genericized. Saying they only care about the purchase is a fallacious argument. If you can't see that brand recognition matters then explain why there are so many lawsuits across all industries trying to protect their branding?
  • Reply 190 of 203
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,363member
    solipsismx wrote: »
    This is all silly. A great deal of money goes into marketing. This means brands and trademarks not being copied by others and even keeping highly popular brands from being genericized. Saying they only care about the purchase is a fallacious argument. If you can't see that brand recognition matters then explain why there are so many lawsuits across all industries trying to protect their branding?
    So iPhone should sue Apple for confusing their brand? And Apple should sue Mac?
    As long as the recognition is favourable and coming to one of Apples products they really don't care about incidental confusions. You knew exactly what the guy using an "Apple" phone meant didn't you? The store goon will as well so the sale will go through. They're selling devices just fine, even if the odd idiot doesn't remember what it's called.

    Of course brand recognition is important, but to stop potential iPhone customers from buying Galaxy S3s, not to ensure those customers are intimately aware of precise naming conventions.
  • Reply 191 of 203
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    crowley wrote: »
    So iPhone should sue Apple for confusing their brand? And Apple should sue Mac?
    As long as the recognition is favourable and coming to one of Apples products they really don't care about incidental confusions. You knew exactly what the guy using an "Apple" phone meant didn't you? The store goon will as well so the sale will go through. They're selling devices just fine, even if the odd idiot doesn't remember what it's called.

    Of course brand recognition is important, but to stop potential iPhone customers from buying Galaxy S3s, not to ensure those customers are intimately aware of precise naming conventions.

    None of your comments make any sense. If you are still talking about the original point you may want to try again.
  • Reply 192 of 203
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member


    Originally Posted by Crowley View Post

    As long as you're buying an Apple I doubt Mac care what you think the company is called.


     


    Is this on purpose? I honestly can't tell, given the rest of your comment.





    Originally Posted by Crowley View Post

    So iPhone should sue Apple for confusing their brand? And Apple should sue Mac?


     


    I'm starting to think it wasn't on purpose.






     And what exactly would they do about it anyway, mount a "We are Apple" ad campaign? Pointless.



    image

  • Reply 193 of 203
    macbook promacbook pro Posts: 1,605member
    I believe Solipsism stated earlier that he hears people referring to the iPhone with all manner of names.

    I hear the same thing constantly.

    Referencing something called iPhone 2
    Referring to Android phones as iPhones
    Referring to iPhone 4 as iPhone 4G
    etc.
  • Reply 194 of 203
    resnycresnyc Posts: 90member
    Consistency is probably the most important thing in something like the brand/model number. The phones' paradigm of alternating a new number with that number "S" works fine now because everyone's accustomed to it, and "S" has meant, consistently: no new form factor but improved functionality (primarily). The "S" label even seems like a model/brand Apple is committed to, the way they're designing the packaging. People do say, "I'll wait for the 'S'," (usually if they had bought the previous "S"). But in the case of iPad, where Apple just discarded any discernable labeling logic, none of this appears to matter, maybe because there's almost no competition. People are more or less comfortable saying "the latest iPad" or "the previous model", and people clearly don't care, they just snatch them right up.
  • Reply 195 of 203
    arlorarlor Posts: 529member
    Nikon is another pretty successful company that has used the "s" tag to indicate an upgrade that they don't quite want to call a new generation.
  • Reply 196 of 203
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,363member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


     


    Is this on purpose? I honestly can't tell, given the rest of your comment.


     


    I'm starting to think it wasn't on purpose.


    image



     


    Of course it was all intentional.  I was making a point - everyone who buys an iPhone or Mac knows the brand, whether they call them Apple or Mac, and whether they call the product an iPhone or an Apple.  Brand awareness is about making people aware of your company and/or products, not about the subtleties of product naming and fascistic technical correctness about terms. Again, Apple don't care if people spell it "MAC", or go to "The Mac Store", or talk on their "Apple phone" or play with their "iTouch".  As long as they're in the ballpark and they've identified the product with one of Apple's trademarks, Apple are perfectly comfortable with it.  This applies 10x to people calling the iPhone 3G the iPhone 3.  Apple have genuine things to put their attention to, so they leave getting worked up over these trivialities to people with more time on their hands.


     


     


    Not sure why you went to the trouble of posting the advert which I referenced, but thanks.  They ran that horrendous campaign in 1984 for sales reps to put across a message to retailers.  At that time comparatively few people knew about the company or its products, but with the mindshare they currently enjoy they'll probably never feel they have to do anything like that again (unless they hit the road hard or if they launch in North Korea).  They certainly don't feel that now.  You get it?

  • Reply 197 of 203
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,363member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post





    None of your comments make any sense. If you are still talking about the original point you may want to try again.


    They make perfect sense.  Try reading them again, or feel free to ask me for clarification on any particular passage that you're having difficulty with.


     


    Actually, don't.  This conversation is half past boring.  Carry on caring about immaterial nonsense if you like.

  • Reply 198 of 203
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member


    Originally Posted by Crowley View Post

    Again, Apple don't care if people spell it "MAC", or go to "The Mac Store", or talk on their "Apple phone" or play with their "iTouch".


     


    They specifically do care about those things. They have documents on their website that outline all the guidelines for such things.






    As long as they're in the ballpark and they've identified the product with one of Apple's trademarks



     


    Well, none of those are Apple's trademarks, so…






    This applies 10x to people calling the iPhone 3G the iPhone 3.  Apple have genuine things to put their attention to, so they leave getting worked up over these trivialities to people with more time on their hands.



     


    The "triviality" known as "Having to lie to a customer about support for their device because you don't have a clue which one they actually have since they're too stupid to call it the right name", you mean?

  • Reply 199 of 203
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,921member
    They specifically do care about those things. They have documents on their website that outline all the guidelines for such things.
    Apple cares that ITS employees use the proper names. But if a customer says he has an iPhone, they are not going to berate the man and refuse to help him until he says the actual name. Notice the iDevices just have the base iDevice name and not 3/4/4S after them.
  • Reply 200 of 203

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Crowley View Post


     


    Brand awareness is about making people aware of your company and/or products, not about the subtleties of product naming and fascistic technical correctness about terms. Again, Apple don't care if people spell it "MAC", or go to "The Mac Store", or talk on their "Apple phone" or play with their "iTouch".  As long as they're in the ballpark and they've identified the product with one of Apple's trademarks, Apple are perfectly comfortable with it.  This applies 10x to people calling the iPhone 3G the iPhone 3.  Apple have genuine things to put their attention to, so they leave getting worked up over these trivialities to people with more time on their hands.


     



     


    Not so. Every detail, including the naming system, is very important. Brand architecture and naming are key elements of brand strategy. If you are not convinced read any one of a thousand books on the subject.

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