[...] (larger than the iPhone, smaller than the iPad Mini)
WHY do people keep comparing iPhones and iPads?! The iPad is not a phone! The existence of the iPad has zero zilch nada SQUAT relevance to those who want a PHONE with a larger screen!
Speaking of product differences, I was actually considering an Air for my portable needs instead of an iPad because I prefer a conventional keyboard to typing on a touchscreen and the old clamshell design fits my particular use very well, but at the last minute I realized -- it's not a cellular device! It's WiFi or nothing, which isn't going to do me much good on the train.
I'd really like to see the ultra-portable laptop get a cellular data option like the similarly-used iPad.
For Tim to even broach the subject of a larger iPhone seems like plans are already in motion to introduce one if not this year then certainly in 2014. It was a sort of jab at Android phones saying that they don't mind making compromises. No one here knows exactly what compromises he is referring to since phones like the HTC One have a gorgeous display but I would guess battery life is probably the critical limiting factor. I simply do not see a lot of difference anymore between the displays of most flagship phones besides the actual screen size itself. Perhaps if you run certain tests or stare very closely you might notice some differences but to my eyes at least the HTC Droid DNA looked like a much nicer display than my iPhone 5 side by side. I am still hoping against hope they pull a surprise and release this no compromise larger iPhone later this year. If not I will regrettably have to go to the dark side for a while until thy do. Ironically the iPad has made this a much easier decision to make since I don't feel I will be missing out since I use my iPad at home.
I am still surprised, how people are trying to interpret every single word from TC to make up their own versions and be smarter. I am not fan of TC at all, but you will have to accept what he says. he is no SJ and he is trying to make us realize that.
Apple has to think about everything and everybody that uses their equipment. Their users are also developers. I can tell you from first hand, how shitty is development for various Android devices with different screen sizes and resolutions.
Sure, Apple could release an iPhone 6 with larger display, that would utilize screen with bigger size and inches to match exactly 2x the content of current iPhone 5, but let me somebody explain, what kind of CPU and GPU are we talking then about? What kind of battery? How thin should the casing be, solid enough not to break front glass by twisting? What kind of weight are we talking about?
So, when all this things can be put on satisfactory level, then we shall see iPhone with 5" or so screen. Until then, I will still loot at my development Samsung phone, which is slow with slow OS, which breaks front glass by twisting, which has shitty battery life, to mention just few obvious lacks. I wouldn't even think to compare windows-like Android OS to iOS. It's blasphemy..
I just find it hard to believe that Apple (and their LCD manufacturing partners) had no trouble developing beautiful 3.5" 3:2 screens...
and 4" 16:9 screens...
But they're stumped at making 4.5" 16:9 screens...
Would it just be adding to the wish fragmentation to suggest that I think 3:2 is actually a better aspect ratio for a phone than 16:9?
When using a phone for anything other than watching movies, in other words roughly 90% of the time or more, extra width matters as much as height. Use the example of writing a text message or email: with a 16:9 screen you have two choices: continue using a skinny tiny keyboard, or turn it sideways and wind up with all keyboard and very little content window. With a "closer to square" aspect ratio you have more "balance" between various screen components. That's why I was surprised when Apple went 9:16 with the iP5 -- while slightly larger than the old screen, it isn't a lot more useful.
As for watching movies, you still get the same size picture, just with a black bar at the top and bottom that have no effect on the experience.
They figured out all the other screens... but a new larger screen has them stumped.
They figured out already, that is how they know, they can't deliver it now. Course of technology development is not a roller coaster, but it's not linear as well. dpi has obviously advanced ahead of other factors in last year, so they need to catch up.
Would it just be adding to the wish fragmentation to suggest that I think 3:2 is actually a better aspect ratio for a phone than 16:9?
When using a phone for anything other than watching movies, in other words roughly 90% of the time or more, extra width matters as much as height. Use the example of writing a text message or email: with a 16:9 screen you have two choices: continue using a skinny tiny keyboard, or turn it sideways and wind up with all keyboard and very little content window. With a "closer to square" aspect ratio you have more "balance" between various screen components. That's why I was surprised when Apple went 9:16 with the iP5 -- while slightly larger than the old screen, it isn't a lot more useful.
As for watching movies, you still get the same size picture, just with a black bar at the top and bottom that have no effect on the experience.
I dunno... 16:9 seems to be a thing now
But I do prefer 4:3 on tablets.
As for turning a smartphone sideways to use the landscape keyboard... that's a smack in the face to the idea of "one-handed" use
Oh, sorry, didn't see that. Whenever pedro starts typing, I quickly move along to the next post while trying not to make eye contact.
you fool! lol
My point was: there's no high-quality 4.5+ screen on a phone that sells on the millions. So, Cook is right.
The One is a great phone, and is costing HTC dearly.
Looks like they would be better would low build quality, a oversaturated screen with wrong colors, pentile, with software made for a 3"phone and spend money on ads.
The LCD screens in the 'jumbo' HTC phones of today pumping out 1920x1080 at a true 440+ ppi (the One is an insane 468ppi) made in part by the same suppliers as the iPhone screens essentially negates his entire point. Unless he's talking form factor, battery life, or some other screen related piece that's not the screen itself, I'm at a loss. The actual LCD tech is there, today. Samsung's AMOLED panels are still pure saturated trash.
I just got an HTC One, and I don't see that they made any sacrifices for a decent screen size. Battery life is fine, the screen is goreous (as is the whole device).
Simple calculation shows, that 4.5 screen would need at least 581 dpi screen and even 5" would still need 522 dpi.
DPI is not such a big problem if you don't really care about picture quality, but this is not he main point. THe main point is how to handle 4x the graphic info without turning iPhone into iShit.
The LCD screens in the 'jumbo' HTC phones of today pumping out 1920x1080 at a true 440+ ppi (the One is an insane 468ppi) made in part by the same suppliers as the iPhone screens essentially negates his entire point. Unless he's talking form factor, battery life, or some other screen related piece that's not the screen itself, I'm at a loss. The actual LCD tech is there, today. Samsung's AMOLED panels are still pure saturated trash.
I just got an HTC One, and I don't see that they made any sacrifices for a decent screen size. Battery life is fine, the screen is goreous (as is the whole device).
I'd love to know what phones you are talking about. Please don't list any Samsung products. Sure the screens look pretty good, and they are bigger if that is your thing, but when you pick the phone up it feels cheap. The build quality of the iPhone is phenomenal. My family still has an original four year old 3GS in use. Most Samsung products are cheaply made. If I couldn't use an iPhone, I'd have to go with Window on a Nokia handset. At least Nokia knows how to make a phone.
Why do you think that the cheap feeling is due to the larger display? That's what this thread is about...
Yeah, right... "mess with" a note 10.1, then come back and speak to it...
Why has a stylus become a 'huge issue' for you with your school work? It isn't for me in any capacity. I have a stylus for iPad, but rarely use it. Not because it's 'so-so' but because I just… don't… need it where I thought I might.
I do use a bluetooth Apple keyboard alongside the iPad for extended typing sessions (Pages or Numbers mostly). It's great to be able to cursor around documents in iWork, and select text using key commands, etc…
Curious, which app do you think you need a stylus for on your iPad?
I am guessing he needs it because he takes handwritten notes, and does drawings. Both are not that pleasant to do with your finger. This is the one area where Windows devices have always been better (and still are).
No. Not really "sub par", but then neither are the prices. And HTC is rocketing toward bankruptcy. They just aren't selling enough of even their best phablet, the One.
I actually like the HTC One. Let me qualify that… I like how it LOOKS… not sure about the battery life, the weight, the 'heft'… definitely not a fan of Android or their "marketplace"...
Still, I hope HTC can hang on. They have potential.
To say that Apple COULD make a phone like the One and it'd turn the market on its head might be true… one day… maybe… once Apple can satisfy ALL of Apple's very high watermark criteria first (and I'll tell you this, WE who buy into Apple in part because of that high standard hope they NEVER waver on this point)… Once Apple decides they've removed enough "trade-offs" to produce a larger screen device (larger than the iPhone, smaller than the iPad Mini) what they produce will indeed be a market killer.
For whatever reason, Apple feels it isn't "time" yet…
I for one, will not argue. Carry on...
The One is a phone not a phablet. It looks great, the battery life is better than the iPhone so far for me, the weight is very close (close enough so I don't see the difference), Google Now is awesome, having keyboard choices (e.g. SwiftKeys) is great. I have no idea what HTC's business situation is, but the phone is great.
No, but I think Tim and his crew may have different priorities than many smartphone buyers.
For example, one of the things they might have to sacrifice to get a larger screen is color accuracy. To Apple, that matters. To many buyers, it doesn't. People aren't using colorometers to calibrate their 4" movie viewing experience. Heck, they're not even comparing black levels when choosing a 50" TV. To that buyer, the ease-of-use provided by a larger screen may be a higher priority than color.
Same with pixel density. To my eyes, a super-sharp image that's too small to read is less valuable than a larger, easier to read display, even if it is sightly softer.
Then there's Messaging and email, both of which are easier on a larger keyboard. Is that more or less important than maximum brightness?
It's not my intention to initiate debate about any of the specific comparisons I've listed as examples, but to point out that the term "trade-offs" means making value judgements about the relative importance of several characteristics, and that some trade-offs matter more to me than they may to you and vice-versa. It's actually not at all unreasonable to expect that any given buyer may disagree with Apple's particular choices.
Why should the larger screen affect color accuracy?
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical
[...] (larger than the iPhone, smaller than the iPad Mini)
WHY do people keep comparing iPhones and iPads?! The iPad is not a phone! The existence of the iPad has zero zilch nada SQUAT relevance to those who want a PHONE with a larger screen!
Speaking of product differences, I was actually considering an Air for my portable needs instead of an iPad because I prefer a conventional keyboard to typing on a touchscreen and the old clamshell design fits my particular use very well, but at the last minute I realized -- it's not a cellular device! It's WiFi or nothing, which isn't going to do me much good on the train.
I'd really like to see the ultra-portable laptop get a cellular data option like the similarly-used iPad.
For Tim to even broach the subject of a larger iPhone seems like plans are already in motion to introduce one if not this year then certainly in 2014. It was a sort of jab at Android phones saying that they don't mind making compromises. No one here knows exactly what compromises he is referring to since phones like the HTC One have a gorgeous display but I would guess battery life is probably the critical limiting factor. I simply do not see a lot of difference anymore between the displays of most flagship phones besides the actual screen size itself. Perhaps if you run certain tests or stare very closely you might notice some differences but to my eyes at least the HTC Droid DNA looked like a much nicer display than my iPhone 5 side by side. I am still hoping against hope they pull a surprise and release this no compromise larger iPhone later this year. If not I will regrettably have to go to the dark side for a while until thy do. Ironically the iPad has made this a much easier decision to make since I don't feel I will be missing out since I use my iPad at home.
I am still surprised, how people are trying to interpret every single word from TC to make up their own versions and be smarter. I am not fan of TC at all, but you will have to accept what he says. he is no SJ and he is trying to make us realize that.
Apple has to think about everything and everybody that uses their equipment. Their users are also developers. I can tell you from first hand, how shitty is development for various Android devices with different screen sizes and resolutions.
Sure, Apple could release an iPhone 6 with larger display, that would utilize screen with bigger size and inches to match exactly 2x the content of current iPhone 5, but let me somebody explain, what kind of CPU and GPU are we talking then about? What kind of battery? How thin should the casing be, solid enough not to break front glass by twisting? What kind of weight are we talking about?
So, when all this things can be put on satisfactory level, then we shall see iPhone with 5" or so screen. Until then, I will still loot at my development Samsung phone, which is slow with slow OS, which breaks front glass by twisting, which has shitty battery life, to mention just few obvious lacks. I wouldn't even think to compare windows-like Android OS to iOS. It's blasphemy..
[I]and[/I] 4" 16:9 screens...
But they're stumped at making 4.5" 16:9 screens...
Where is stated they don't know how to make display larger than 4" and less than 7.85"?
It's not "stated" anywhere.
But if they can do it... they're taking their sweet time bringing it to market.
We're now patiently waiting for the 7th iPhone to be released later this year... and I'm guessing it will be another 4-incher...
Sad panda...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
It's not "stated" anywhere.
But if they can do it... they're taking their sweet time bringing it to market.
We're now patiently waiting for the 7th iPhone to be released later this year... and I'm guessing it will be another 4-incher...
Sad panda...
Read my post above: make screen and utilize it satisfactory are 2 very different things...
Correct... and that's what I meant.
Apparently Apple can't do it successfully.
They figured out all the other screens... but a new larger screen has them stumped.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
I just find it hard to believe that Apple (and their LCD manufacturing partners) had no trouble developing beautiful 3.5" 3:2 screens...
and 4" 16:9 screens...
But they're stumped at making 4.5" 16:9 screens...
Would it just be adding to the wish fragmentation to suggest that I think 3:2 is actually a better aspect ratio for a phone than 16:9?
When using a phone for anything other than watching movies, in other words roughly 90% of the time or more, extra width matters as much as height. Use the example of writing a text message or email: with a 16:9 screen you have two choices: continue using a skinny tiny keyboard, or turn it sideways and wind up with all keyboard and very little content window. With a "closer to square" aspect ratio you have more "balance" between various screen components. That's why I was surprised when Apple went 9:16 with the iP5 -- while slightly larger than the old screen, it isn't a lot more useful.
As for watching movies, you still get the same size picture, just with a black bar at the top and bottom that have no effect on the experience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
Correct... and that's what I meant.
Apparently Apple can't do it successfully.
They figured out all the other screens... but a new larger screen has them stumped.
They figured out already, that is how they know, they can't deliver it now. Course of technology development is not a roller coaster, but it's not linear as well. dpi has obviously advanced ahead of other factors in last year, so they need to catch up.
I dunno... 16:9 seems to be a thing now
But I do prefer 4:3 on tablets.
As for turning a smartphone sideways to use the landscape keyboard... that's a smack in the face to the idea of "one-handed" use
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
Oh, sorry, didn't see that. Whenever pedro starts typing, I quickly move along to the next post while trying not to make eye contact.
you fool! lol
My point was: there's no high-quality 4.5+ screen on a phone that sells on the millions. So, Cook is right.
The One is a great phone, and is costing HTC dearly.
Looks like they would be better would low build quality, a oversaturated screen with wrong colors, pentile, with software made for a 3"phone and spend money on ads.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thataveragejoe
The LCD screens in the 'jumbo' HTC phones of today pumping out 1920x1080 at a true 440+ ppi (the One is an insane 468ppi) made in part by the same suppliers as the iPhone screens essentially negates his entire point. Unless he's talking form factor, battery life, or some other screen related piece that's not the screen itself, I'm at a loss. The actual LCD tech is there, today. Samsung's AMOLED panels are still pure saturated trash.
I just got an HTC One, and I don't see that they made any sacrifices for a decent screen size. Battery life is fine, the screen is goreous (as is the whole device).
Simple calculation shows, that 4.5 screen would need at least 581 dpi screen and even 5" would still need 522 dpi.
DPI is not such a big problem if you don't really care about picture quality, but this is not he main point. THe main point is how to handle 4x the graphic info without turning iPhone into iShit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thataveragejoe
The LCD screens in the 'jumbo' HTC phones of today pumping out 1920x1080 at a true 440+ ppi (the One is an insane 468ppi) made in part by the same suppliers as the iPhone screens essentially negates his entire point. Unless he's talking form factor, battery life, or some other screen related piece that's not the screen itself, I'm at a loss. The actual LCD tech is there, today. Samsung's AMOLED panels are still pure saturated trash.
I just got an HTC One, and I don't see that they made any sacrifices for a decent screen size. Battery life is fine, the screen is goreous (as is the whole device).
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell
I'd love to know what phones you are talking about. Please don't list any Samsung products. Sure the screens look pretty good, and they are bigger if that is your thing, but when you pick the phone up it feels cheap. The build quality of the iPhone is phenomenal. My family still has an original four year old 3GS in use. Most Samsung products are cheaply made. If I couldn't use an iPhone, I'd have to go with Window on a Nokia handset. At least Nokia knows how to make a phone.
Why do you think that the cheap feeling is due to the larger display? That's what this thread is about...
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical
Yeah, right... "mess with" a note 10.1, then come back and speak to it...
Why has a stylus become a 'huge issue' for you with your school work? It isn't for me in any capacity. I have a stylus for iPad, but rarely use it. Not because it's 'so-so' but because I just… don't… need it where I thought I might.
I do use a bluetooth Apple keyboard alongside the iPad for extended typing sessions (Pages or Numbers mostly). It's great to be able to cursor around documents in iWork, and select text using key commands, etc…
Curious, which app do you think you need a stylus for on your iPad?
I am guessing he needs it because he takes handwritten notes, and does drawings. Both are not that pleasant to do with your finger. This is the one area where Windows devices have always been better (and still are).
Quote:
Originally Posted by tribalogical
No. Not really "sub par", but then neither are the prices. And HTC is rocketing toward bankruptcy. They just aren't selling enough of even their best phablet, the One.
I actually like the HTC One. Let me qualify that… I like how it LOOKS… not sure about the battery life, the weight, the 'heft'… definitely not a fan of Android or their "marketplace"...
Still, I hope HTC can hang on. They have potential.
To say that Apple COULD make a phone like the One and it'd turn the market on its head might be true… one day… maybe… once Apple can satisfy ALL of Apple's very high watermark criteria first (and I'll tell you this, WE who buy into Apple in part because of that high standard hope they NEVER waver on this point)… Once Apple decides they've removed enough "trade-offs" to produce a larger screen device (larger than the iPhone, smaller than the iPad Mini) what they produce will indeed be a market killer.
For whatever reason, Apple feels it isn't "time" yet…
I for one, will not argue. Carry on...
The One is a phone not a phablet. It looks great, the battery life is better than the iPhone so far for me, the weight is very close (close enough so I don't see the difference), Google Now is awesome, having keyboard choices (e.g. SwiftKeys) is great. I have no idea what HTC's business situation is, but the phone is great.
Quote:
Originally Posted by v5v
No, but I think Tim and his crew may have different priorities than many smartphone buyers.
For example, one of the things they might have to sacrifice to get a larger screen is color accuracy. To Apple, that matters. To many buyers, it doesn't. People aren't using colorometers to calibrate their 4" movie viewing experience. Heck, they're not even comparing black levels when choosing a 50" TV. To that buyer, the ease-of-use provided by a larger screen may be a higher priority than color.
Same with pixel density. To my eyes, a super-sharp image that's too small to read is less valuable than a larger, easier to read display, even if it is sightly softer.
Then there's Messaging and email, both of which are easier on a larger keyboard. Is that more or less important than maximum brightness?
It's not my intention to initiate debate about any of the specific comparisons I've listed as examples, but to point out that the term "trade-offs" means making value judgements about the relative importance of several characteristics, and that some trade-offs matter more to me than they may to you and vice-versa. It's actually not at all unreasonable to expect that any given buyer may disagree with Apple's particular choices.
Why should the larger screen affect color accuracy?
Quote:
Originally Posted by antkm1
I guess you missed the other articles where Cook said they are planning a $100b buy back of their stock over the next 30 mos.?
At the end of which they will be sitting on a BIGGER pile of cash. Arithmetic is your friend.