bobolicious

lkrupp said:

wizard69 said:

It is still expensive for what you get. This especiallyl after upgrading to a reasonably sized SSD.  

bobolicious said:

...non-upgradable = unappealing from this camp...

Is the ANY Apple product either of you would buy now?

The iMac (non-pro) remains an apparent last bastion of (in Apple terms hardware flexibility - options would be appreciated...

I hope to upgrade another Time Capsule and add to the fleet that are all working from as far back as 2008 vintage to Apple's credit with appreciation! For those that prioritize security and speed (vs flexibility or costs) the T2 regimen offers much, however is such a one size fits all and is the digging required to integrate it all, including cost premium and repair limitations 'for the rest of us' ?

For consideration: https://www.macworld.com/article/3245764/the-t2-chip-makes-the-imac-pro-the-start-of-a-mac-revolution.html#tk.rss_news

...non-upgradable = unappealing from this camp...

Is Apple design increasingly unacceptable?

"there is a loud outcry for reliable, long-lasting, upgradeable machines. Just look at the market demand for the six-year-old 2012 MacBook Pro—the last fully upgradeable notebook Apple made. I use one myself, and I love it. Apple can do better." marco.org/2016/01/04/md101ll-a

"As we’ve progressed toward thinner, lighter, more integrated Macs, we’ve paid dearly in upgradeability, versatility, and value.”

"There is a real business impact caused by unrepairable product design.”

...and on it goes...

Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall With the Macbook Pro Keyboard - iFixit www.ifixit.com/News/macbook-pro-keyboard

"No one who has followed this Apple support document instructing them to shake their laptop at a 75 degree angle and spray their keyboard with air in a precise zig-zag pattern will quibble over a slightly thicker design.” support.apple.com/en-us/ht205662

...and in contrast:

"Everything about this device says, “HP cares.” This manufacturer wants you to upgrade and maintain this device as long as physically possible.” www.ifixit.com/News/hp-elitebook-a-friend-to-the-user

IIf there is some overarching benefit to customers in all of this it would be helpful to know. Reliability (given the keyboard-gate) and sustainability arguments would seem moot in context. Should speed depend on customer need? Would making speed/privacy (T2) and storage flexible (BTO?) for those that choose it be better?

Is there a benefit to Apple in having the most reliable data on its user base via fixed T2 drives ?  Even if such data is not sold directly to others, does this build into some bigger potential agenda of parallel or future use?  All Photos are now apparently tagged, with no 'off' switch, for example...?

...I've been using pro higher end macs since System 7 and I have upgraded pretty much every one of them over the years... These comments about 'onboard' being OK are ridiculous to me. I stopped buying macs when The Appliance King™ took over...  Business needs change, assuming we are talking 'pro' - paying for a touch bar (which I have tried) and locked on storage at 4x the price of retail and losing port convenience are all of no interest. The berated $700 OEM MBP keyboard repair isn't something I'd look forward to either.

If Apple released a desktop touchbar keyboard to span all macs would it sell ?  Would a touchbar & fixed T2 security drive sell if buyers had a MBP BTO choices vs a proportionate cost savings ?  Is it easier to click 'I do' in a free survey than pony up for who knows how much for 'upgrades' essentially forced on customers with debatable efficacy ? 

...how about make the touchbar optional, across the entire line of macs (for workflow consistency) at a cost based and usual markup, and see if customers actually want it...?  

Duet used to offer touchbar for iOS for older macs for $9.99, for example:  
apps.apple.com/us/app/duet-display/id935754064  
www.imore.com/how-use-duet-have-touch-bar-your-mac