To me it makes sense not to apologize, every headline would be "Steve Jobs Says I'm Sorry."
Instead, they're stuck with quotes like, "we want to make all of our users happy."
Why exactly SHOULD they apologize anyway. What the really said is that the data proves there is no wide spread issue, yet we're still giving everyone a free case. To me, that seems pretty generous, and not an 'apology required' gesture.
Not sure I get your question. Yes - REALLY. I really meant it.
They presented actual data and the actual data refutes the notion that this is a wide-spread issue. And against that, they still decided to give away free cases, and to allow refunds with no restocking.
They did the right thing, and then some, in my opinion.
The 'right thing' would have been NOT to release/re-enginner a device for which, "We knew that you could see bars drop on the phone when you hold it in a certain way..." - Steve Jobs
I'm holding off buying mine to see if there is a design tweak after Sept. 30th. Although there are some really nice cases out there, personally, I love the look of all my iPhones and the iPhone 4, bare. I accept the hardly noticeable scratches and would hate myself if it actually cracked the glass, but I just can't make myself put a case on it.
I see a lot of people in the queue who "never" had any signal issues! Hypocrites.
You do? You are looking at Apple's online list of people requesting a free bumper - even though the web site isn't even up yet?
Wow. I'm not surprised that people lie here, but it's astounding to see you say something that's so obviously and completely a lie.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpluck
So Apple did what it needed to do. This is over IMHO.
It's not over by a long shot. It SHOULD be, but there will still be a lot of whining and complaints and demands that Apple rewrite the laws of physics - and lawsuits. Sadly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macshark
Those plastic cases cost about 25c to manufacture, though after you factor in the packaging and distribution related expenses, the cost may be in the $1 range.
I've been in manufacturing my whole life. $0.25 isn't even close. Nor is the $10 figure someone else threw out. Based on my manufacturing experience, I'm guessing something like $2, maybe $2.50. Not that it matters. From the perspective of the facts, Apple didn't need to do it - the data supports the fact that ALL phones drop calls. The number of iPhone returns is tiny, so most customers are not seeing a problem. Apple did it for PR. Of course from the perspective of people who are never happy no matter what Apple does, it's not enough. They need a new iPhone that never drops calls no matter what you do - regardless of how much they have to rewrite the laws of physics. The cost of the bumpers couldn't be less relevant (other than the trivial impact on P&L).
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking
I think it is a good move.
I would like to hear from everyone who said that there was no way in hell Apple would ever give away free bumpers though.
I don't remember too many people saying that. Many (myself included) said that Apple SHOULDN'T give away free bumpers, but that's not the same thing. They clearly went for the PR.
However, as long as you're trying to make people stand by their earlier words, where are the people who said that the iPhone was being returned in massive numbers? Where are the people who said it was a massive problem and affected massive numbers of iPhone owners? Where are the people who said that the iPhone was the only phone that dropped calls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
And you don?t think this is true despite the multitude of videos.
What proof do you have that there is a [design] flaw, which I assume you to mean it would require a total recall of each and every iPhone 4 sold?
The free case, the stats suggesting the issue isn?t that widespread, and reiteration of the 30 days return policy is meant to make the whiny ass mob mentality chill the frak out. That?s it.
It?s all PR, but rest assured that the CEO of Apple is much more aware of this problem at Apple than we are.
Yes, it's all PR. IMHO, the important part of the press conference was the facts - few iPhones being returned. Less than 0.5% of customers calling to complain. Only a slight increase in dropped calls from the 3G (although I suspect that a lot of those were people intentionally going out of their way to demonstrate the problem). Dropped calls experienced on other smart phones. All of that set the stage for Steve to have said "there's nothing wrong with this phone", but he didn't. He made concessions to appease the whiners. And it appears to be working.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gotApple
Like I'd like to put my super expensive iPhone 4G inside some plastic crap. Steve, please fix the phone instead, ok?
So, in spite of the data above, you're going to insist that there's something wrong with the phone. As I said - some people will never be happy no matter what Apple does. Just return your phone and buy a Droid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
Well, I think he just showed that other than everyone knowing the best point to touch to drop signal, this really isn't any different than other phones out there, so, nothing to fix. So, get yourself a super expensive case if it's a problem, or return it. You can even buy one just to return if you want to make a statement that way.
Exactly, but that won't satisfy some people. Sadly.
If the answer to appease customers is to give away a Bumper, then they might make it part of the product. I didn?t think they could give away a Bumper without making case makers upset, but that is apparently not a concern, or at least a major concern.
The next iPhones may simply come with a colour-approrpite Bumper in the box, already on the iPhone 4. This way it?s included and the customer can remove it at their discretion. Or, since it?s a ring, you don?t put it on the iPhone 4 (so you can still advertise the naked phone, but include it in the accessory area of the box with the headphones, power adapter and USB cable with the Bumper ring.
This leaves the opportunity to still sell other Bumper colours to customers.
Maybe. I think by Aug/Sept, they will be ramping up their lines to add a new coating to the antenna. Like Steve said, they can't get around physics. And physics says that touching the antenna or touching both will cause more of a problem than wrapping your hand around the phone.
If they really thought that simply holding the phone in that way caused the same problem it caused on other phones, then they know that a bumper doesn't change anything. The Blackberry and the other phones he showed already have a build in bumper...the shell of the phone itself. They know that the issue is touching it. They will adjust it accordingly, but it will take weeks to ramp up. So, free bumpers till sept.
actually it's exactly the other way around: "? Q: Does the refund apply only to Apple branded bumpers? A: Yes, no refund for third-party cases" from macdailynews.
TO JupiterOne
we should be appleinsider buddies! we think exactly the same!
They may indeed be providing a bumper refund, but they will NOT be providing a free bumper with each new purchase (until Sep 30th - or longer perhaps - he left this open-ended). The freebe will be a 3rd party case, because he said they do not have enough bumpers to go around (from the live blog of the event, which may or may not be accurate, of course)
"Look at our phones. They're beautiful. Jony Ive spent 13 years designing it. But for the phone to work, you have to throw this gay-ass cover on it and conceal the fruits of Jony's labor. Why look at a wonderful achievement in industrial design when you can ogle at Hello Kitty's ass?!"
Lots of Apple names were mentioned as being in attendance, some in the front row. Ives was not mentioned.
The 'right thing' would have been NOT to release/re-enginner a device for which, "We knew that you could see bars drop on the phone when you hold it in a certain way..." - Steve Jobs
It's That Simple - IMO
We'll have to agree to disagree.
Personally, i'm more amped than ever to get the phone - hoping it comes sooner rather than later.
1. I bought a Belkin Grip Vue case from best buy because i didnt want to deal with no back or front protection, and now i see i couldve had a free case? ugh, hope they strike a deal with Belkin
2. They're gonna give customers free bumper cases until september 30. HOW ABOUT THE CUSTOMERS AFTER THAT???? Will everybody just start going crazy about antenna problems then?? hmmm sounds to me like apple is planning to do something else about this by then
At the press conference, he said they would decide in September after acquiring more data.
So all of you who stated here that you never had issues with attenuation( Solipsism, etc. ), won't be
getting the free case, right? Right.. that's what I thought.
You're absolutely right. I've never had this problem, and I've never had a case for any phone I've owned over the past 15 years.
So no, I won't be getting one of these free cases.
Just being free doesn't make me want something. It still has to satisfy a need I have. Or do you collect all of those flyers people try to hand you in the street?
They may indeed be providing a bumper refund, but they will NOT be providing a free bumper with each new purchase (until Sep 30th - or longer perhaps - he left this open-ended). The freebe will be a 3rd party case, because he said they do not have enough bumpers to go around (from the live blog of the event, which may or may not be accurate, of course)
At the press conference, it was said that refunds would be provided to people who purchased APPLE bumpers, not third party cases (any there are very few on the market now anyway).
The freebie will be your selection of Apple and third-party cases/bumpers on the web site late next week You decide which one you want and they will send it to you free.
Those plastic cases cost about 25c to manufacture, though after you factor in the packaging and distribution related expenses, the cost may be in the $1 range.
I suggest you don't make a career in engineering manufacturing.
Comments
To me it makes sense not to apologize, every headline would be "Steve Jobs Says I'm Sorry."
Instead, they're stuck with quotes like, "we want to make all of our users happy."
Why exactly SHOULD they apologize anyway. What the really said is that the data proves there is no wide spread issue, yet we're still giving everyone a free case. To me, that seems pretty generous, and not an 'apology required' gesture.
Not sure I get your question. Yes - REALLY. I really meant it.
They presented actual data and the actual data refutes the notion that this is a wide-spread issue. And against that, they still decided to give away free cases, and to allow refunds with no restocking.
They did the right thing, and then some, in my opinion.
The 'right thing' would have been NOT to release/re-enginner a device for which, "We knew that you could see bars drop on the phone when you hold it in a certain way..." - Steve Jobs
It's That Simple - IMO
I see a lot of people in the queue who "never" had any signal issues! Hypocrites.
You do? You are looking at Apple's online list of people requesting a free bumper - even though the web site isn't even up yet?
Wow. I'm not surprised that people lie here, but it's astounding to see you say something that's so obviously and completely a lie.
So Apple did what it needed to do. This is over IMHO.
It's not over by a long shot. It SHOULD be, but there will still be a lot of whining and complaints and demands that Apple rewrite the laws of physics - and lawsuits. Sadly.
Those plastic cases cost about 25c to manufacture, though after you factor in the packaging and distribution related expenses, the cost may be in the $1 range.
I've been in manufacturing my whole life. $0.25 isn't even close. Nor is the $10 figure someone else threw out. Based on my manufacturing experience, I'm guessing something like $2, maybe $2.50. Not that it matters. From the perspective of the facts, Apple didn't need to do it - the data supports the fact that ALL phones drop calls. The number of iPhone returns is tiny, so most customers are not seeing a problem. Apple did it for PR. Of course from the perspective of people who are never happy no matter what Apple does, it's not enough. They need a new iPhone that never drops calls no matter what you do - regardless of how much they have to rewrite the laws of physics. The cost of the bumpers couldn't be less relevant (other than the trivial impact on P&L).
I think it is a good move.
I would like to hear from everyone who said that there was no way in hell Apple would ever give away free bumpers though.
I don't remember too many people saying that. Many (myself included) said that Apple SHOULDN'T give away free bumpers, but that's not the same thing. They clearly went for the PR.
However, as long as you're trying to make people stand by their earlier words, where are the people who said that the iPhone was being returned in massive numbers? Where are the people who said it was a massive problem and affected massive numbers of iPhone owners? Where are the people who said that the iPhone was the only phone that dropped calls?
And you don?t think this is true despite the multitude of videos.
What proof do you have that there is a [design] flaw, which I assume you to mean it would require a total recall of each and every iPhone 4 sold?
The free case, the stats suggesting the issue isn?t that widespread, and reiteration of the 30 days return policy is meant to make the whiny ass mob mentality chill the frak out. That?s it.
It?s all PR, but rest assured that the CEO of Apple is much more aware of this problem at Apple than we are.
Yes, it's all PR. IMHO, the important part of the press conference was the facts - few iPhones being returned. Less than 0.5% of customers calling to complain. Only a slight increase in dropped calls from the 3G (although I suspect that a lot of those were people intentionally going out of their way to demonstrate the problem). Dropped calls experienced on other smart phones. All of that set the stage for Steve to have said "there's nothing wrong with this phone", but he didn't. He made concessions to appease the whiners. And it appears to be working.
Like I'd like to put my super expensive iPhone 4G inside some plastic crap. Steve, please fix the phone instead, ok?
So, in spite of the data above, you're going to insist that there's something wrong with the phone. As I said - some people will never be happy no matter what Apple does. Just return your phone and buy a Droid.
Well, I think he just showed that other than everyone knowing the best point to touch to drop signal, this really isn't any different than other phones out there, so, nothing to fix. So, get yourself a super expensive case if it's a problem, or return it. You can even buy one just to return if you want to make a statement that way.
Exactly, but that won't satisfy some people. Sadly.
If the answer to appease customers is to give away a Bumper, then they might make it part of the product. I didn?t think they could give away a Bumper without making case makers upset, but that is apparently not a concern, or at least a major concern.
The next iPhones may simply come with a colour-approrpite Bumper in the box, already on the iPhone 4. This way it?s included and the customer can remove it at their discretion. Or, since it?s a ring, you don?t put it on the iPhone 4 (so you can still advertise the naked phone, but include it in the accessory area of the box with the headphones, power adapter and USB cable with the Bumper ring.
This leaves the opportunity to still sell other Bumper colours to customers.
Maybe. I think by Aug/Sept, they will be ramping up their lines to add a new coating to the antenna. Like Steve said, they can't get around physics. And physics says that touching the antenna or touching both will cause more of a problem than wrapping your hand around the phone.
If they really thought that simply holding the phone in that way caused the same problem it caused on other phones, then they know that a bumper doesn't change anything. The Blackberry and the other phones he showed already have a build in bumper...the shell of the phone itself. They know that the issue is touching it. They will adjust it accordingly, but it will take weeks to ramp up. So, free bumpers till sept.
TO BAGMAN
actually it's exactly the other way around: "? Q: Does the refund apply only to Apple branded bumpers? A: Yes, no refund for third-party cases" from macdailynews.
TO JupiterOne
we should be appleinsider buddies! we think exactly the same!
They may indeed be providing a bumper refund, but they will NOT be providing a free bumper with each new purchase (until Sep 30th - or longer perhaps - he left this open-ended). The freebe will be a 3rd party case, because he said they do not have enough bumpers to go around (from the live blog of the event, which may or may not be accurate, of course)
Does anyone offer a clear bumper case?
Google is useful for these things.
"Look at our phones. They're beautiful. Jony Ive spent 13 years designing it. But for the phone to work, you have to throw this gay-ass cover on it and conceal the fruits of Jony's labor. Why look at a wonderful achievement in industrial design when you can ogle at Hello Kitty's ass?!"
Lots of Apple names were mentioned as being in attendance, some in the front row. Ives was not mentioned.
The 'right thing' would have been NOT to release/re-enginner a device for which, "We knew that you could see bars drop on the phone when you hold it in a certain way..." - Steve Jobs
It's That Simple - IMO
We'll have to agree to disagree.
Personally, i'm more amped than ever to get the phone - hoping it comes sooner rather than later.
1. I bought a Belkin Grip Vue case from best buy because i didnt want to deal with no back or front protection, and now i see i couldve had a free case? ugh, hope they strike a deal with Belkin
2. They're gonna give customers free bumper cases until september 30. HOW ABOUT THE CUSTOMERS AFTER THAT???? Will everybody just start going crazy about antenna problems then?? hmmm sounds to me like apple is planning to do something else about this by then
At the press conference, he said they would decide in September after acquiring more data.
Like I'd like to put my super expensive iPhone 4G inside some plastic crap. Steve, please fix the phone instead, ok?
Just return it and go away.
I see a lot of people in the queue who "never" had any signal issues! Hypocrites.
Where is this queue... I'd like to see it too! Do you have a link, or are you just making an assumption?
.
So all of you who stated here that you never had issues with attenuation( Solipsism, etc. ), won't be
getting the free case, right? Right.. that's what I thought.
You're absolutely right. I've never had this problem, and I've never had a case for any phone I've owned over the past 15 years.
So no, I won't be getting one of these free cases.
Just being free doesn't make me want something. It still has to satisfy a need I have. Or do you collect all of those flyers people try to hand you in the street?
They may indeed be providing a bumper refund, but they will NOT be providing a free bumper with each new purchase (until Sep 30th - or longer perhaps - he left this open-ended). The freebe will be a 3rd party case, because he said they do not have enough bumpers to go around (from the live blog of the event, which may or may not be accurate, of course)
At the press conference, it was said that refunds would be provided to people who purchased APPLE bumpers, not third party cases (any there are very few on the market now anyway).
The freebie will be your selection of Apple and third-party cases/bumpers on the web site late next week You decide which one you want and they will send it to you free.
Just return it and go away.
Just close this browser window and go away.
But seriously.
Saying: "If you don't like the phone it, return it".
Is the same as saying: "If you don't like the discussion, don't read it".
Has anyone else noticed this:
Most of the time when I go to the next page ">" in an AI forum, a separate window opens, full screen with a URL:
http://results.googlesyndication.com/
http://results.googlesyndication.com/
Very annoying! What's that all about?
,
Those plastic cases cost about 25c to manufacture, though after you factor in the packaging and distribution related expenses, the cost may be in the $1 range.
I suggest you don't make a career in engineering manufacturing.
Where is this queue... I'd like to see it too! Do you have a link, or are you just making an assumption?
.
It was said at the press conference that a web site will be up next week and you can make your selection there.