Anyways I'm a bit confused by all the complaints...the 5 wishy washy ish was merely hope but all logic pointed to an incremental update a la 3G/3GS.
The iPhone 4 is still a capable phone and the 4S will continue to be...like many have said it is mainly for the 3GS holders and newcomers...NOT for the people with a 4. the 6 will come out and I'd bet top dollar the design will be different.
As for Android gaining off of this it's because Android is surely becoming more stable, the ecosystem is growing, people are wanting and pining for Android phones now. It hasn't permeated the mind as much as iOS (what has?) but it's known now. And with so many great companies coming out with so many great phones and with the platform itself stabilizing and (hopefully) beautifying it can still go up. And because the Apple news is here and won't be back for at least another 8 months Android will continue to make strides in tech and will pioneer new technologies first.
Honestly, the whole keynote was ridiculously boring...which upset me...like someone said Cook is no Steve Jobs and an issue is it looked like he was trying to be. The other speakers were boring as well.
Siri on the other hand...that was just plain awesome, and while I have Vlingo, Siri is like the super evolved cousin from a rich family comparatively.
I doubt I'd use it if I had it, but I like to have things.
Hello boys and girls, been lurking around here for so long, but I had to register and vent today cos I've had enough of the iOS vs. Android argument :-)
If Apple licenced iOS to other manufacturers we would not be having this discussion. If Android were only available on the Nexus we wouldn't be having this argument. Bottom line is this... Apple has one range of phones, now with 3 models covering a range of costs and features. Android is run on scores of phones from different manufacturers, the whole iOS / Android market share thing is pointless. If iOS were run on more manufacturers it would have a far greater market share.
Apple are right in doing things the way they do. I'm not upset about there being no iPhone 5 announcement yesterday, I'm happy with my 4 and really just want iOS5. When the 5 does come out next year, I'm sure it'll be something better.
My mistake. I had the chance to hold my friend's Samsung Galaxy II in my hand and it felt lighter and thinner... The facts seem to suggest differently.
But from the touch and feel, the Samsung feels much better. It's a personal opinion. I am an Apple fan and I had the original iPhone and want to see the original creator succeed but I think it's a mistake for Apple be complacent and offer the same form factor after the long wait time...
If you look at my reaction in the Steve's Return topic, you can see that I and a lot more people feel a bit .... "let down" is the only way I can think of to describe the way I feel.
Not just on the hardware side, but, as much as I like Timmy, he's not Steve.
And what I mean be that is, he presentation seems like it's forced "AppleVibe" -- he even has on the black mock turtleneck, for crimeny's sake.
Oh, well.
Given this debut, the good takeaway is his performance can only go up.
He had on a black buttondown shirt -_-
but I agree he tried to be Jobs...he should've made this fully his own.
One of the better presenters is Vic Gundrata (sp?) for Google I/O he has a swag about him that isn't Jobsian. Cook needs his own swag
I suggest you compare this keynote to the last few. Then you will see only small variations in script.
They always do some back-patting, and have spent more time on this as Android has grown. The defensiveness is there, and has been there for a year or two now. They almost always tout some home-grown app or insignificant (to us) feature. In fact, Scot Forstall has always liked showing off features or apps with family pictures. Perhaps he is a photography buff?
Listen to the words used. Cook had the same speech writer that Jobs used. There is no question about it. The simplicity of the sentences, spiced with high wattage superlatives, is very much Jobsian. The difference is that it wasn't Jobs. Cook does not have the same gravitas, for he has not been an industry pioneer for 3 decades. So the same words would sound different.
Personally, I give Apple kudos for believing in their design so much that they trust it to lead the industry for another year. Who cares if the competition feels compelled to change its looks every few months. A leader does not have to follow.
The other reason for the simplistic language and the pointing out of basic family oriented apps etc is that Apple does not want to portray itself as a tech company. Apple has commoditized tech and speaks to the mainstream world which consists of average Janes and Joes, not geeks. Look at their iPad tv ads - completely devoid of tech jargon, specifications etc. I think the 'events' are geared towards the press who invariably will quote the speakers in the mainstream media. So the self congratulatory aspects have a function. To me, the most powerful part of this whole presentation was the Siri part, along with the Video - the guy running etc. 'Normal' people will relate to that more than tech stats.
Oh man, I forgot how painful it is to read these forums. A bunch of 12 year old fanboys rabidly defending apple products with no sense or logic.
I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.
If you look at my reaction in the Steve's Return topic, you can see that I and a lot more people feel a bit ....
"let down" is the only way I can think of to describe the way I feel after this Apple Event.
Not just on the hardware side, but, as much as I like Timmy, he's not Steve.
And what I mean be that is, he presentation seems like it's forced "AppleVibe".
He's even got on the black mock turtleneck, for criminy's sake.
Oh, well.
Given this debut, the good takeaway from this is thst his presentation performance can only go up.
Way up.
And I say that because I love.
I've watched some of Tim's presentation. I believe that he displayed warmth, sincerity and genuine affection for Apple. He's known to be intelligent, highly capable and very hard working. Tim Cook is a fantastic replacement for Steve Jobs as CEO of Apple.
My mistake. I had the chance to hold my friend's Samsung Galaxy II in my hand and it felt lighter and thinner... The facts seem to suggest differently.
But from the touch and feel, the Samsung feels much better. It's a personal opinion. I am an Apple fan and I had the original iPhone and want to see the original creator succeed but I think it's a mistake for Apple be complacent and offer the same form factor after the long wait time...
I hear what you're saying but at the same time there is a limit to how thin and light you can make a phone and it actually be of any benefit. The iPhone is also heavier because it's FAR better made. I for one would rather a bit of extra weight in my hand for that solid quality. Weight can be reassuring too. Like you say though, personal opinion.
I think the iPhone 4 is a beautiful design, I don't see it being around for two years as being a bad thing.
Oh man, I forgot how painful it is to read these forums. A bunch of 12 year old fanboys rabidly defending apple products with no sense or logic.
I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.
Careful when you point fingers my friend. Whenever you do, you always have three pointed right back at you.
If there's one thing I've learned from the so-called "analysts" is that they are full of shit. These are the same fools who were saying Enron was a "buy" stock, back in 01.
but I agree he tried to be Jobs...he should've made this fully his own.
One of the better presenters is Vic Gundrata (sp?) for Google I/O he has a swag about him that isn't Jobsian. Cook needs his own swag
Steve Jobs cannot be mimicked.
I think he looked nervous as well as most people would be in his position. He was professional but the enthusiasm is too rehearsed. I think Apple should employ a 'spokes person' who would be very comfortable on stage and who could project 'real' enthusiasm. He could then introduce all the Apple dignitaries as need be. The 'show' has gotten so big that pro presenters are needed. Its the same for Google or MS, their presentations are really lame. Apple should lead the way here. Were they to the rest of the tech industry would follow in no time, guaranteed. I mean, these are nothing but marketing events after all.
Oh man, I forgot how painful it is to read these forums. A bunch of 12 year old fanboys rabidly defending apple products with no sense or logic.
I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.
Well it is awesome to have the tone lifted by a real grown man with valuable opinions. Really. And you've gotta be, what, 15?
I think Apple is going to do very well with the iPhone 4S. Apple has had historic success with the iPhone thus far because it is a high quality piece with a great user interface that integrates into Apple's reliable family of products and services. This is why people purchased various iterations of the iPhone through the years now when there was almost always an Android (or other) phone with better specs. So now, with the 4S, Apple has a phone that is tougher to challenge or exceed even on the spec sheet yet it remains an Apple product with the quality and integration into their "eco-system". It's the best of both worlds.
On a somewhat unrelated point, those who say Steve Jobs left because he anticipated an impending failure of the iPhone line and perhaps Apple itself to some degree because of this are morons. I mean for God's sake how stupid can people be? Steve Jobs was with the company since its formation in the mid-1970's and through its initial success and then resurgence in recent years. Yet he left because the new iPhone is a 4S instead of a 5 with a different case? That's why some of you think he left!?!?! Have you not paid any attention to his health issues?
The comments of some of these idiots would be funny were it not for the fact that they breed and vote.
[QUOTE=...One of the better presenters is Vic Gundrata (sp?) for Google I/O he has a swag about him that isn't Jobsian. C...[/QUOTE]
You must be on crack to compare Vic (it's Gundota btw) to Steve Jobs. It's an absolute insult to the man.
Furthermore, Vic Gundota will go down in history as being a righteous hypocrite for calling out Jobs and Apple as "Big Brother" while the company he works for copied/purchased its way into the market.
Why does'nt Google open source stuff that matters to them???
I suggest you compare this keynote to the last few. Then you will see only small variations in script.
They always do some back-patting, and have spent more time on this as Android has grown. The defensiveness is there, and has been there for a year or two now. They almost always tout some home-grown app or insignificant (to us) feature. In fact, Scot Forstall has always liked showing off features or apps with family pictures. Perhaps he is a photography buff?
Listen to the words used. Cook had the same speech writer that Jobs used. There is no question about it. The simplicity of the sentences, spiced with high wattage superlatives, is very much Jobsian. The difference is that it wasn't Jobs. Cook does not have the same gravitas, for he has not been an industry pioneer for 3 decades. So the same words would sound different.
Personally, I give Apple kudos for believing in their design so much that they trust it to lead the industry for another year. Who cares if the competition feels compelled to change its looks every few months. A leader does not have to follow.
I don't really disagree, but just feel that that format strained patience even under Steve.
I think he looked nervous as well as most people would be in his position. He was professional but the enthusiasm is too rehearsed. I think Apple should employ a 'spokes person' who would be very comfortable on stage and who could project 'real' enthusiasm. He could then introduce all the Apple dignitaries as need be. The 'show' has gotten so big that pro presenters are needed. Its the same for Google or MS, their presentations are really lame. Apple should lead the way here. Were they to the rest of the tech industry would follow in no time, guaranteed. I mean, these are nothing but marketing events after all.
It was the man's first major gig - can we cut him some slack?
I have to say I as so sick of hearing all the crap flying around about this being the iPhone 4S and not the iPhone 5. If it was an iPhone 5 it would just be the same hardware with the iPhone 5 name, maybe with a slightly different form. Does that change how functional it is or what improvements there are. No. It's just moron hype and that is what has created the expectation problem. Morons.
I especially hate the 4G idiots. We all know 4G LTE is not fully rolled out and that phones with 4G LTE have short battery life. Apple was always going to wait for better chips and better coverage to roll this out. Yes we would all love the speed, but if the whole thing doesn't work is it worth anything.
There is my rant and I see the iPhone 4S as being a great upgrade for myself coming from an iPhone 3GS. If you have an iPhone 4, maybe not, but then again why waste money on an early upgrade in the first place.
After reading this I think I'll stick with my HTC EVO 4G ...
I hear what you're saying but at the same time there is a limit to how thin and light you can make a phone and it actually be of any benefit. The iPhone is also heavier because it's FAR better made. I for one would rather a bit of extra weight in my hand for that solid quality. Weight can be reassuring too. Like you say though, personal opinion.
I think the iPhone 4 is a beautiful design, I don't see it being around for two years as being a bad thing.
Agreed. It would have been nice to see it come in other colours as well (metallic gray?). Again, a personal opinion but the curved design of the iPhone 3G feels much better if compared to the boxy iPhone 4. The glass and metal is really adding weigh. Let's also keep in mind that if we look at buying habits, the durability factor probably should not outweigh the lightness factor IMHO.
People trade in their phones usually after their contract expires and often, they purchase a case for extra protection anyways.
I think he looked nervous as well as most people would be in his position. He was professional but the enthusiasm is too rehearsed. I think Apple should employ a 'spokes person' who would be very comfortable on stage and who could project 'real' enthusiasm. He could then introduce all the Apple dignitaries as need be. The 'show' has gotten so big that pro presenters are needed. Its the same for Google or MS, their presentations are really lame. Apple should lead the way here. Were they to the rest of the tech industry would follow in no time, guaranteed. I mean, these are nothing but marketing events after all.
Jeff Bezos had no problem pulling off a Stevie in front of a much larger audience last week. I think it was the hall itself- felt like was down in some bunker. Town Hall?
Why do people have an aversion to the glass back? As an owner of a 3GS and a 4, I can safely say the 4 is MUCH more durable, and I've dropped it several dozen times, even on asphalt. My 3GS' case would often crack while in a case, and the whole thing would creak when I squeezed it.
Metal & Glass > Plastic
Because it gives them something to bitch about.
I dropped mine a few times with no harm, but did finally drop and crack the back.
Simple order of a $30 replacement from a company in AU that included tools, and had a really cool transparent back.
Comments
The iPhone 4 is still a capable phone and the 4S will continue to be...like many have said it is mainly for the 3GS holders and newcomers...NOT for the people with a 4. the 6 will come out and I'd bet top dollar the design will be different.
As for Android gaining off of this it's because Android is surely becoming more stable, the ecosystem is growing, people are wanting and pining for Android phones now. It hasn't permeated the mind as much as iOS (what has?) but it's known now. And with so many great companies coming out with so many great phones and with the platform itself stabilizing and (hopefully) beautifying it can still go up. And because the Apple news is here and won't be back for at least another 8 months Android will continue to make strides in tech and will pioneer new technologies first.
Honestly, the whole keynote was ridiculously boring...which upset me...like someone said Cook is no Steve Jobs and an issue is it looked like he was trying to be. The other speakers were boring as well.
Siri on the other hand...that was just plain awesome, and while I have Vlingo, Siri is like the super evolved cousin from a rich family comparatively.
I doubt I'd use it if I had it, but I like to have things.
Semi coherent comment over.
Hello boys and girls, been lurking around here for so long, but I had to register and vent today cos I've had enough of the iOS vs. Android argument :-)
If Apple licenced iOS to other manufacturers we would not be having this discussion. If Android were only available on the Nexus we wouldn't be having this argument. Bottom line is this... Apple has one range of phones, now with 3 models covering a range of costs and features. Android is run on scores of phones from different manufacturers, the whole iOS / Android market share thing is pointless. If iOS were run on more manufacturers it would have a far greater market share.
Apple are right in doing things the way they do. I'm not upset about there being no iPhone 5 announcement yesterday, I'm happy with my 4 and really just want iOS5. When the 5 does come out next year, I'm sure it'll be something better.
Welcome to AI. With you on your comments.
The Galaxy S2 .6oz lighter and actually THICKER than the iPhone.
http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/09/iph...rds-authority/
Are you really suggesting this matters?
My mistake. I had the chance to hold my friend's Samsung Galaxy II in my hand and it felt lighter and thinner... The facts seem to suggest differently.
But from the touch and feel, the Samsung feels much better. It's a personal opinion. I am an Apple fan and I had the original iPhone and want to see the original creator succeed but I think it's a mistake for Apple be complacent and offer the same form factor after the long wait time...
I dunno ....
If you look at my reaction in the Steve's Return topic, you can see that I and a lot more people feel a bit .... "let down" is the only way I can think of to describe the way I feel.
Not just on the hardware side, but, as much as I like Timmy, he's not Steve.
And what I mean be that is, he presentation seems like it's forced "AppleVibe" -- he even has on the black mock turtleneck, for crimeny's sake.
Oh, well.
Given this debut, the good takeaway is his performance can only go up.
He had on a black buttondown shirt -_-
but I agree he tried to be Jobs...he should've made this fully his own.
One of the better presenters is Vic Gundrata (sp?) for Google I/O he has a swag about him that isn't Jobsian. Cook needs his own swag
Steve Jobs cannot be mimicked.
I suggest you compare this keynote to the last few. Then you will see only small variations in script.
They always do some back-patting, and have spent more time on this as Android has grown. The defensiveness is there, and has been there for a year or two now. They almost always tout some home-grown app or insignificant (to us) feature. In fact, Scot Forstall has always liked showing off features or apps with family pictures. Perhaps he is a photography buff?
Listen to the words used. Cook had the same speech writer that Jobs used. There is no question about it. The simplicity of the sentences, spiced with high wattage superlatives, is very much Jobsian. The difference is that it wasn't Jobs. Cook does not have the same gravitas, for he has not been an industry pioneer for 3 decades. So the same words would sound different.
Personally, I give Apple kudos for believing in their design so much that they trust it to lead the industry for another year. Who cares if the competition feels compelled to change its looks every few months. A leader does not have to follow.
The other reason for the simplistic language and the pointing out of basic family oriented apps etc is that Apple does not want to portray itself as a tech company. Apple has commoditized tech and speaks to the mainstream world which consists of average Janes and Joes, not geeks. Look at their iPad tv ads - completely devoid of tech jargon, specifications etc. I think the 'events' are geared towards the press who invariably will quote the speakers in the mainstream media. So the self congratulatory aspects have a function. To me, the most powerful part of this whole presentation was the Siri part, along with the Video - the guy running etc. 'Normal' people will relate to that more than tech stats.
I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.
I dunno ....
If you look at my reaction in the Steve's Return topic, you can see that I and a lot more people feel a bit ....
"let down" is the only way I can think of to describe the way I feel after this Apple Event.
Not just on the hardware side, but, as much as I like Timmy, he's not Steve.
And what I mean be that is, he presentation seems like it's forced "AppleVibe".
He's even got on the black mock turtleneck, for criminy's sake.
Oh, well.
Given this debut, the good takeaway from this is thst his presentation performance can only go up.
Way up.
And I say that because I love.
I've watched some of Tim's presentation. I believe that he displayed warmth, sincerity and genuine affection for Apple. He's known to be intelligent, highly capable and very hard working. Tim Cook is a fantastic replacement for Steve Jobs as CEO of Apple.
My mistake. I had the chance to hold my friend's Samsung Galaxy II in my hand and it felt lighter and thinner... The facts seem to suggest differently.
But from the touch and feel, the Samsung feels much better. It's a personal opinion. I am an Apple fan and I had the original iPhone and want to see the original creator succeed but I think it's a mistake for Apple be complacent and offer the same form factor after the long wait time...
I hear what you're saying but at the same time there is a limit to how thin and light you can make a phone and it actually be of any benefit. The iPhone is also heavier because it's FAR better made. I for one would rather a bit of extra weight in my hand for that solid quality. Weight can be reassuring too. Like you say though, personal opinion.
I think the iPhone 4 is a beautiful design, I don't see it being around for two years as being a bad thing.
Oh man, I forgot how painful it is to read these forums. A bunch of 12 year old fanboys rabidly defending apple products with no sense or logic.
I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.
Careful when you point fingers my friend. Whenever you do, you always have three pointed right back at you.
He had on a black buttondown shirt -_-
but I agree he tried to be Jobs...he should've made this fully his own.
One of the better presenters is Vic Gundrata (sp?) for Google I/O he has a swag about him that isn't Jobsian. Cook needs his own swag
Steve Jobs cannot be mimicked.
I think he looked nervous as well as most people would be in his position. He was professional but the enthusiasm is too rehearsed. I think Apple should employ a 'spokes person' who would be very comfortable on stage and who could project 'real' enthusiasm. He could then introduce all the Apple dignitaries as need be. The 'show' has gotten so big that pro presenters are needed. Its the same for Google or MS, their presentations are really lame. Apple should lead the way here. Were they to the rest of the tech industry would follow in no time, guaranteed. I mean, these are nothing but marketing events after all.
Oh man, I forgot how painful it is to read these forums. A bunch of 12 year old fanboys rabidly defending apple products with no sense or logic.
I've been browsing some 'real' forums for a while now, and coming back here makes me loose faith in humanity for how much blatant stupidity is flying around.
Well it is awesome to have the tone lifted by a real grown man with valuable opinions. Really. And you've gotta be, what, 15?
On a somewhat unrelated point, those who say Steve Jobs left because he anticipated an impending failure of the iPhone line and perhaps Apple itself to some degree because of this are morons. I mean for God's sake how stupid can people be? Steve Jobs was with the company since its formation in the mid-1970's and through its initial success and then resurgence in recent years. Yet he left because the new iPhone is a 4S instead of a 5 with a different case? That's why some of you think he left!?!?! Have you not paid any attention to his health issues?
The comments of some of these idiots would be funny were it not for the fact that they breed and vote.
You must be on crack to compare Vic (it's Gundota btw) to Steve Jobs. It's an absolute insult to the man.
Furthermore, Vic Gundota will go down in history as being a righteous hypocrite for calling out Jobs and Apple as "Big Brother" while the company he works for copied/purchased its way into the market.
Why does'nt Google open source stuff that matters to them???
I suggest you compare this keynote to the last few. Then you will see only small variations in script.
They always do some back-patting, and have spent more time on this as Android has grown. The defensiveness is there, and has been there for a year or two now. They almost always tout some home-grown app or insignificant (to us) feature. In fact, Scot Forstall has always liked showing off features or apps with family pictures. Perhaps he is a photography buff?
Listen to the words used. Cook had the same speech writer that Jobs used. There is no question about it. The simplicity of the sentences, spiced with high wattage superlatives, is very much Jobsian. The difference is that it wasn't Jobs. Cook does not have the same gravitas, for he has not been an industry pioneer for 3 decades. So the same words would sound different.
Personally, I give Apple kudos for believing in their design so much that they trust it to lead the industry for another year. Who cares if the competition feels compelled to change its looks every few months. A leader does not have to follow.
I don't really disagree, but just feel that that format strained patience even under Steve.
I think he looked nervous as well as most people would be in his position. He was professional but the enthusiasm is too rehearsed. I think Apple should employ a 'spokes person' who would be very comfortable on stage and who could project 'real' enthusiasm. He could then introduce all the Apple dignitaries as need be. The 'show' has gotten so big that pro presenters are needed. Its the same for Google or MS, their presentations are really lame. Apple should lead the way here. Were they to the rest of the tech industry would follow in no time, guaranteed. I mean, these are nothing but marketing events after all.
It was the man's first major gig - can we cut him some slack?
I have to say I as so sick of hearing all the crap flying around about this being the iPhone 4S and not the iPhone 5. If it was an iPhone 5 it would just be the same hardware with the iPhone 5 name, maybe with a slightly different form. Does that change how functional it is or what improvements there are. No. It's just moron hype and that is what has created the expectation problem. Morons.
I especially hate the 4G idiots. We all know 4G LTE is not fully rolled out and that phones with 4G LTE have short battery life. Apple was always going to wait for better chips and better coverage to roll this out. Yes we would all love the speed, but if the whole thing doesn't work is it worth anything.
There is my rant and I see the iPhone 4S as being a great upgrade for myself coming from an iPhone 3GS. If you have an iPhone 4, maybe not, but then again why waste money on an early upgrade in the first place.
After reading this I think I'll stick with my HTC EVO 4G ...
I hear what you're saying but at the same time there is a limit to how thin and light you can make a phone and it actually be of any benefit. The iPhone is also heavier because it's FAR better made. I for one would rather a bit of extra weight in my hand for that solid quality. Weight can be reassuring too. Like you say though, personal opinion.
I think the iPhone 4 is a beautiful design, I don't see it being around for two years as being a bad thing.
Agreed. It would have been nice to see it come in other colours as well (metallic gray?). Again, a personal opinion but the curved design of the iPhone 3G feels much better if compared to the boxy iPhone 4. The glass and metal is really adding weigh. Let's also keep in mind that if we look at buying habits, the durability factor probably should not outweigh the lightness factor IMHO.
People trade in their phones usually after their contract expires and often, they purchase a case for extra protection anyways.
I think he looked nervous as well as most people would be in his position. He was professional but the enthusiasm is too rehearsed. I think Apple should employ a 'spokes person' who would be very comfortable on stage and who could project 'real' enthusiasm. He could then introduce all the Apple dignitaries as need be. The 'show' has gotten so big that pro presenters are needed. Its the same for Google or MS, their presentations are really lame. Apple should lead the way here. Were they to the rest of the tech industry would follow in no time, guaranteed. I mean, these are nothing but marketing events after all.
Jeff Bezos had no problem pulling off a Stevie in front of a much larger audience last week. I think it was the hall itself- felt like was down in some bunker. Town Hall?
Why do people have an aversion to the glass back? As an owner of a 3GS and a 4, I can safely say the 4 is MUCH more durable, and I've dropped it several dozen times, even on asphalt. My 3GS' case would often crack while in a case, and the whole thing would creak when I squeezed it.
Metal & Glass > Plastic
Because it gives them something to bitch about.
I dropped mine a few times with no harm, but did finally drop and crack the back.
Simple order of a $30 replacement from a company in AU that included tools, and had a really cool transparent back.