But I do take issue with some American morals applied to higher education in America. Have you heard of "legacies?" Do you know the percentage they make up in Harvard, Yale and the top universities in your country? Can you say with a straight face that this is a merit-based system? What about the affirmative action program? Just tick the box that says you're a minority. But be careful not to say you're Asian. If you tick Asian, you'll need a perfect score on the SAT.
One of Harvard's legacies made his father proud by becoming a U.S. president. He must have done a real good job.
Sure, some Asians who are not qualified, AND some Americans who are definitely not qualified (e.g. George Dubya Bush) to lecture anyone about anything, slip through the cracks and get into top American universities because their daddies are rich and powerful. But those aren't the people who tend to ever excel academically. Yes, it is FAR AND AWAY a merit-based system, especially in comparison to the Korean system, which I outlined in my post above. I have no argument with your take on Bush, the man and his cronies IMHO are frauds and the worst criminals in American history bar none.
So, now that we've settled that, you're now saying that there are no "Asians" in American universities? WOW! I WAS NOT AWARE OF THAT. (You keep talking about "Asians" when we're supposed to be talking about Koreans, why is that??). There are plenty of Asians in American universities, some of them win Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals. What seems to upset you is that those Asians are of Japanese, Indian, Chinese, and Russian descent, among others. But none to date have been Korean. Would that be correct?
Soooo, according to your logic Korea has never won a FIFA World Cup, topped the Olympics medal tables, etc. etc. because "western" organizations like FIFA and the International Olympic Committee have a bias against "Asian" athletes??? I seeee....
Now the debate is spilling over into athletic achievement?
So, now that we've settled that, you're now saying that there are no "Asians" in American universities? WOW! I WAS NOT AWARE OF THAT. (You keep talking about "Asians" when we're supposed to be talking about Koreans, why is that??). There are plenty of Asians in American universities, some of them win Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals. What seems to upset you is that those Asians are of Japanese, Indian, Chinese, and Russian descent, among others. But none to date have been Korean. Would that be correct?
I am not upset at all. Where are you pulling your wild assumptions out from? From thin air? Did I say there were no Asians in American univ.? No, I did not. Why are you misconstruing what I didn't even say?
I think you missed the point of that article. What it's saying is that people who work hard tend to perform better. By this we can assume they mean technical players (although admittedly the writer didn't delve into any distinction between the technical and the creative). It didn't seem to mention rote memory.
Even so, it's no revelation that people who practice more become better players, or better anything. But let me ask you this. If you were into music, what would you rather be, a player piano (technical ability) or a Beethoven (a creative and technical genius)? And your answer sir, is the distinction between the end products of Confucian rote memory based education, and the western creative, individual mindset.
I am not upset at all. Where are you pulling your wild assumptions out from? From thin air? Did I say there were no Asians in American univ.? No, I did not. Why are you misconstruing what I didn't even say?
Perhaps because what you did say was so bizarre.
Anyway, it's been fun. But I really do have to go and get some actual work done around here.
Now the debate is spilling over into athletic achievement?
You seem to be having trouble with recognizing patterns of basic logical extension. You should try it some time, it can open up whole new worlds. Anyway, gotta go.
I think you missed the point of that article. What it's saying is that people who work hard tend to perform better. By this we can assume they mean technical players (although admittedly the writer didn't delve into any distinction between the technical and the creative). It didn't seem to mention rote memory.
Even so, it's no revelation that people who practice more become better players, or better anything. But let me ask you this. If you were into music, what would you rather be, a player piano (technical ability) or a Beethoven (a creative and technical genius)? And your answer sir, is the distinction between the end products of Confucian rote memory based education, and the western creative, individual mindset.
You missed the point.
Excerpted from the article.
"...we have discovered that “working memory capacity,” a core component of intellectual ability, predicts success in a wide variety of complex activities."
What I was inferring to was that "rote memory learning" per se could hone working memory capacity.
Aside from your missing the point of the article, I knew you would have a difficult time connecting the dots from "rote memory learning" to that excerpted passage. Sorry for not making it clearer to you. My mistake.
You seem to be having trouble with recognizing patterns of basic logical extension. You should try it some time, it can open up whole new worlds. Anyway, gotta go.
When you stray a bit you call it a "basic logical extension." You're pretty good.
And your answer sir, is the distinction between the end products of Confucian rote memory based education, and the western creative, individual mindset.
I saw a funny commercial on Youtube where a barista claimed he was creative. So you're saying Americans have a creative mindset. They are so creative that they don't make their own products. They just design and brand them and then market them like crazy. They leave all that non-creative work to Asia. That's what Dell did. Apple does it too.
Building something with your hands or with high tech factory machines is not creative because that's what Asians do and Asians, by your logic, have been grilled in the Confucian rote memory based education. They simply do not have the wonderful creative individual mindset of Americans.
Do you do this all the time? Make sweeping generalizations of the West and East?
Categorically dismiss a billion of them as Confucian rote memory-instilled types who have no creativity whatsoever.
This discourse is getting sadder and sadder.
I bet if you were to visit Thailand, you'd show contempt to the rampant prostitution there while categorically ignoring the "creative" Westerners with "individual mindsets" taking advantage of the locals with their mighty currency.
I saw a funny commercial on Youtube where a barista claimed he was creative. So you're saying Americans have a creative mindset. They are so creative that they don't make their own products. They just design and brand them and then market them like crazy. They leave all that non-creative work to Asia. That's what Dell did. Apple does it too.
Do you do this all the time? Make sweeping generalizations of the West and East?
Categorically dismiss a billion of them as Confucian rote memory-instilled types who have no creativity whatsoever.
This discourse is getting sadder and sadder.
I bet if you were to visit Thailand, you'd show contempt to the rampant prostitution there while categorically ignoring the "creative" Westerners with "individual mindsets" taking advantage of the locals with their mighty currency.
Talk about sweeping generalizations. Isn't it possible that that barista is a cutting-edge artist or a kick-**s writer or musician or songwriter or an astro-physics student trying to make rent? I know plenty of waiters and waitresses and baristas and other working people who are. Most of my most brilliant professors had jobs like that at some point. Haven't you?
And no I'm not saying that all Koreans or people who've grown up with a Confucian education are incapable of being creative. Every country has creative people and generalizations mean 'in general'; they aren't absolutisms. But I do believe that Confucian education systems such as those in Korea stymie creativity when compared with western education models. The entities which rank education and world-leading science, mathematics, and literature seem to confirm this.
I'm not sure how prostitution came into the debate but from what I saw in Korea there's certainly no shortage of Korean men 'ordering coffee', 'visiting barbershops', 'visiting train station areas' or availing of those thousands of call girl cards they scatter at the entrance of all those love hotels, or of Korean men going to Thailand on 'golfing trips' either. Matter of fact most Korean men I knew who went through the military (i.e. the vast majority of Korean men) seemed to take a visit to the local bawdy-house as some 'right of passage'. I'm not saying it's necessarily immoral but I'm curious as to why you equate lust with the creative mind or otherwise; I'm just calling your spade a spade. In other words, what's your point?
Regarding the assembly of western products such as iPads, I have no disdain for any poor soul who's strapped to an assembly line 16 hours a day, in a country like China where unions are basically illegal. But that's not creativity per se, it's simply back-breaking toil for some local goon looking to get rich (and for plenty of western goons looking to get rich, too).
Now ask yourself this. Who invented and designed that iPad, made the software, invented the telecommunications infrastructure that makes it work, the ships' engines that transport the products, the machine tools themselves which the Chinese factories use; even the very automated production processes they use. And who taught them how to use them? Who made the world-changing scientific breakthroughs that made any of these things possible, including virtually every single product ever sold by Samsung or LG or Kia or Hyundai; Korea? I think you know better than to take that debate further but if you like I'm happy to oblige.
Now ask yourself this. Who invented and designed that iPad, made the software, invented the telecommunications infrastructure that makes it work, the ships' engines that transport the products, the machine tools themselves which the Chinese factories use; even the very automated production processes they use. And who taught them how to use them? Who made the world-changing scientific breakthroughs that made any of these things possible, including virtually every single product ever sold by Samsung or LG or Kia or Hyundai; Korea? I think you know better than to take that debate further but if you like I'm happy to oblige.
Hope you're not claiming that Apple invented the tablet. Yes, they made the iPad. But to call it an invention is a stretch when it incorporates technology that was invented by others. People don't say Mercedes invented the car. Oh, sorry. Mercedes did invent the first car engine running on gas. And the Germans invented aspirin. But the Americans took ownership of aspirin for a few decades before giving it back. And the NASA moon project was made possible with good ol' American ingenuity. Except that without the Nazi German V rocket scientists who built the Saturn rocket, it wouldn't have been possible. Would you like to claim more ownership of European technology and scientific breakthroughs as American? Strange that you bunch up European technology and American technology together as "western technology." Korea, Japan, Vietnam and other Asian countries don't claim gun powder as their Asian technology. One world-changing scientific breakthrough that comes to mind is the polio vaccine. So you're going to claim this as an American invention, too? So who invented space rockets and automobile engines? Who taught Americans how to use them?
I give credit to America for inventing the Internet although CERN keeps saying they invented it. And America invented the atomic bomb with many non-American immigrant scientists who were quickly issued American citizenship. I'm just ticking off some of the world-changing breakthroughs you alluded to.
You sound very proud of your shared (or stolen Nazi) western technological heritage.
Hope you're not claiming that Apple invented the tablet. Yes, they made the iPad. But to call it an invention is a stretch when it incorporates technology that was invented by others. People don't say Mercedes invented the car. Oh, sorry. Mercedes did invent the car. And the Germans invented aspirin. But the Americans took ownership of aspirin for a few decades before giving it back. And your NASA moon project was made possible by good ol' American ingenuity. Except that without the German V rocket scientists, it wouldn't have been possible. Would you like to claim more ownership of European technology and scientific breakthroughs as American? Strange that you bunch up European technology and American together as "western technology." Korea, Japan, Vietnam and other Asian countries don't claim gun powder as their Asian technology.
What you've just said in essence is that Koreans had nothing to do with any of this. You're absolutely correct. (But as you know Korea didn't invent gunpowder, it was the Chinese, who were only able to use it for firecrackers).
Strange that you bunch up European technology and American technology together as "western technology.
Uh no, that's the generally accepted definition of 'the west' or 'Western'.
Here you go, from the Oxford dictionary:
western |ˈwɛstərn|
adjective
1 [ attrib. ] situated in the west, or directed toward or facing the west: there will be showers in some western areas.
• (of a wind) blowing from the west.
2 (usu. Western )living in or originating from the west, in particular Europe or the US: Western society.
Don't they teach you even this basic stuff in Korean schools? In the west (that'd be Europe, most of North America, Australia, New Zealand and so on) we learn it in elementary school if not earlier. \
What you've just said in essence is that Koreans had nothing to do with any of this. You're absolutely correct. (But as you know Korea didn't invent gunpowder, it was the Chinese, who were only able to use it for firecrackers).
And America had nothing to do with rockets, jet engines or automobiles. So who taught Asians how to build all those gee-whiz things? Oh, yeah. That's labeled western technology so Americans can conveniently claim that they were the inventors/originators of it like you are claiming yourself. You learned well from Steve Jobs' "great artists steal mentality." He says it on Youtube.
And America had nothing to do with rockets, jet engines or automobiles. So who taught Asians how to build all those gee-whiz things? Oh, yeah. That's labeled western technology so Americans can conveniently claim that they were the inventors/originators of it like you are claiming yourself.
You've never heard even of Goddard? Wow! (And you call yourself a Kyopo, shame on you).
Listen to this one folks: according to eric 475, now the Oxford Dictionary are part of a plot to define the very word "western" to NOT mean Europe and the US, so that "Americans cain conveniently claim they were the inventors/originators" of western technology? Brilliant! (Thanks, that one is up there with "our roads are too narrow for foreign cars" and kimchee stops AIDS). The folks in my office LOVE this one, too.
Can I please have some of that serious Korean cheeba-cheeba you're growing there these days?
You've never heard even of Goddard? Wow! (And you call yourself a Kyopo, shame on you).
Listen to this one folks: according to eric 475, now the Oxford Dictionary are part of a plot to define the very word "western" to NOT mean Europe and the US, so that "Americans cain conveniently claim they were the inventors/originators" of western technology? Brilliant! (Thanks, that one is up there with "our roads are too narrow for foreign cars" and kimchee stops AIDS). The folks in my office LOVE this one, too.
Can I please have some of that serious Korean cheeba-cheeba you're growing there these days?
Keep 'em coming!
von Braun is the Father of rocket science and built the Saturn V rocket. When the truth hits you, you run away, don't you? Braun was an ex-Nazi so I guess it's hard for you to accept any of this.
Comments
I do not take issue with the rankings.
But I do take issue with some American morals applied to higher education in America. Have you heard of "legacies?" Do you know the percentage they make up in Harvard, Yale and the top universities in your country? Can you say with a straight face that this is a merit-based system? What about the affirmative action program? Just tick the box that says you're a minority. But be careful not to say you're Asian. If you tick Asian, you'll need a perfect score on the SAT.
One of Harvard's legacies made his father proud by becoming a U.S. president. He must have done a real good job.
Sure, some Asians who are not qualified, AND some Americans who are definitely not qualified (e.g. George Dubya Bush) to lecture anyone about anything, slip through the cracks and get into top American universities because their daddies are rich and powerful. But those aren't the people who tend to ever excel academically. Yes, it is FAR AND AWAY a merit-based system, especially in comparison to the Korean system, which I outlined in my post above. I have no argument with your take on Bush, the man and his cronies IMHO are frauds and the worst criminals in American history bar none.
So, now that we've settled that, you're now saying that there are no "Asians" in American universities? WOW! I WAS NOT AWARE OF THAT. (You keep talking about "Asians" when we're supposed to be talking about Koreans, why is that??). There are plenty of Asians in American universities, some of them win Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals. What seems to upset you is that those Asians are of Japanese, Indian, Chinese, and Russian descent, among others. But none to date have been Korean. Would that be correct?
Soooo, according to your logic Korea has never won a FIFA World Cup, topped the Olympics medal tables, etc. etc. because "western" organizations like FIFA and the International Olympic Committee have a bias against "Asian" athletes??? I seeee....
Now the debate is spilling over into athletic achievement?
So, now that we've settled that, you're now saying that there are no "Asians" in American universities? WOW! I WAS NOT AWARE OF THAT. (You keep talking about "Asians" when we're supposed to be talking about Koreans, why is that??). There are plenty of Asians in American universities, some of them win Nobel Prizes and Fields Medals. What seems to upset you is that those Asians are of Japanese, Indian, Chinese, and Russian descent, among others. But none to date have been Korean. Would that be correct?
I am not upset at all. Where are you pulling your wild assumptions out from? From thin air? Did I say there were no Asians in American univ.? No, I did not. Why are you misconstruing what I didn't even say?
Maybe rote memory learning has some kind of purpose. Hmm...
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/20/op...t-matters.html
I think you missed the point of that article. What it's saying is that people who work hard tend to perform better. By this we can assume they mean technical players (although admittedly the writer didn't delve into any distinction between the technical and the creative). It didn't seem to mention rote memory.
Even so, it's no revelation that people who practice more become better players, or better anything. But let me ask you this. If you were into music, what would you rather be, a player piano (technical ability) or a Beethoven (a creative and technical genius)? And your answer sir, is the distinction between the end products of Confucian rote memory based education, and the western creative, individual mindset.
I am not upset at all. Where are you pulling your wild assumptions out from? From thin air? Did I say there were no Asians in American univ.? No, I did not. Why are you misconstruing what I didn't even say?
Perhaps because what you did say was so bizarre.
Anyway, it's been fun. But I really do have to go and get some actual work done around here.
Now the debate is spilling over into athletic achievement?
You seem to be having trouble with recognizing patterns of basic logical extension. You should try it some time, it can open up whole new worlds. Anyway, gotta go.
I think you missed the point of that article. What it's saying is that people who work hard tend to perform better. By this we can assume they mean technical players (although admittedly the writer didn't delve into any distinction between the technical and the creative). It didn't seem to mention rote memory.
Even so, it's no revelation that people who practice more become better players, or better anything. But let me ask you this. If you were into music, what would you rather be, a player piano (technical ability) or a Beethoven (a creative and technical genius)? And your answer sir, is the distinction between the end products of Confucian rote memory based education, and the western creative, individual mindset.
You missed the point.
Excerpted from the article.
"...we have discovered that “working memory capacity,” a core component of intellectual ability, predicts success in a wide variety of complex activities."
What I was inferring to was that "rote memory learning" per se could hone working memory capacity.
Aside from your missing the point of the article, I knew you would have a difficult time connecting the dots from "rote memory learning" to that excerpted passage. Sorry for not making it clearer to you. My mistake.
I played the contrabass so I'd choose Mozart.
You seem to be having trouble with recognizing patterns of basic logical extension. You should try it some time, it can open up whole new worlds. Anyway, gotta go.
When you stray a bit you call it a "basic logical extension." You're pretty good.
Perhaps because what you did say was so bizarre.
Go back and read the USA Today article link.
What I said about what boxes you shouldn't tick on your college applications is based on that "bizarre" article.
Yes, you are.
Denial works, huh? When you don't like the facts, just deny, deny, deny that they even exist.
According to you, every road in Korea is as wide as an American road. Good grief. You actually believe your own misperceptions.
And your answer sir, is the distinction between the end products of Confucian rote memory based education, and the western creative, individual mindset.
I saw a funny commercial on Youtube where a barista claimed he was creative. So you're saying Americans have a creative mindset. They are so creative that they don't make their own products. They just design and brand them and then market them like crazy. They leave all that non-creative work to Asia. That's what Dell did. Apple does it too.
Building something with your hands or with high tech factory machines is not creative because that's what Asians do and Asians, by your logic, have been grilled in the Confucian rote memory based education. They simply do not have the wonderful creative individual mindset of Americans.
Do you do this all the time? Make sweeping generalizations of the West and East?
Categorically dismiss a billion of them as Confucian rote memory-instilled types who have no creativity whatsoever.
This discourse is getting sadder and sadder.
I bet if you were to visit Thailand, you'd show contempt to the rampant prostitution there while categorically ignoring the "creative" Westerners with "individual mindsets" taking advantage of the locals with their mighty currency.
I saw a funny commercial on Youtube where a barista claimed he was creative. So you're saying Americans have a creative mindset. They are so creative that they don't make their own products. They just design and brand them and then market them like crazy. They leave all that non-creative work to Asia. That's what Dell did. Apple does it too.
Do you do this all the time? Make sweeping generalizations of the West and East?
Categorically dismiss a billion of them as Confucian rote memory-instilled types who have no creativity whatsoever.
This discourse is getting sadder and sadder.
I bet if you were to visit Thailand, you'd show contempt to the rampant prostitution there while categorically ignoring the "creative" Westerners with "individual mindsets" taking advantage of the locals with their mighty currency.
Talk about sweeping generalizations. Isn't it possible that that barista is a cutting-edge artist or a kick-**s writer or musician or songwriter or an astro-physics student trying to make rent? I know plenty of waiters and waitresses and baristas and other working people who are. Most of my most brilliant professors had jobs like that at some point. Haven't you?
And no I'm not saying that all Koreans or people who've grown up with a Confucian education are incapable of being creative. Every country has creative people and generalizations mean 'in general'; they aren't absolutisms. But I do believe that Confucian education systems such as those in Korea stymie creativity when compared with western education models. The entities which rank education and world-leading science, mathematics, and literature seem to confirm this.
I'm not sure how prostitution came into the debate but from what I saw in Korea there's certainly no shortage of Korean men 'ordering coffee', 'visiting barbershops', 'visiting train station areas' or availing of those thousands of call girl cards they scatter at the entrance of all those love hotels, or of Korean men going to Thailand on 'golfing trips' either. Matter of fact most Korean men I knew who went through the military (i.e. the vast majority of Korean men) seemed to take a visit to the local bawdy-house as some 'right of passage'. I'm not saying it's necessarily immoral but I'm curious as to why you equate lust with the creative mind or otherwise; I'm just calling your spade a spade. In other words, what's your point?
Regarding the assembly of western products such as iPads, I have no disdain for any poor soul who's strapped to an assembly line 16 hours a day, in a country like China where unions are basically illegal. But that's not creativity per se, it's simply back-breaking toil for some local goon looking to get rich (and for plenty of western goons looking to get rich, too).
Now ask yourself this. Who invented and designed that iPad, made the software, invented the telecommunications infrastructure that makes it work, the ships' engines that transport the products, the machine tools themselves which the Chinese factories use; even the very automated production processes they use. And who taught them how to use them? Who made the world-changing scientific breakthroughs that made any of these things possible, including virtually every single product ever sold by Samsung or LG or Kia or Hyundai; Korea? I think you know better than to take that debate further but if you like I'm happy to oblige.
Now ask yourself this. Who invented and designed that iPad, made the software, invented the telecommunications infrastructure that makes it work, the ships' engines that transport the products, the machine tools themselves which the Chinese factories use; even the very automated production processes they use. And who taught them how to use them? Who made the world-changing scientific breakthroughs that made any of these things possible, including virtually every single product ever sold by Samsung or LG or Kia or Hyundai; Korea? I think you know better than to take that debate further but if you like I'm happy to oblige.
Hope you're not claiming that Apple invented the tablet. Yes, they made the iPad. But to call it an invention is a stretch when it incorporates technology that was invented by others. People don't say Mercedes invented the car. Oh, sorry. Mercedes did invent the first car engine running on gas. And the Germans invented aspirin. But the Americans took ownership of aspirin for a few decades before giving it back. And the NASA moon project was made possible with good ol' American ingenuity. Except that without the Nazi German V rocket scientists who built the Saturn rocket, it wouldn't have been possible. Would you like to claim more ownership of European technology and scientific breakthroughs as American? Strange that you bunch up European technology and American technology together as "western technology." Korea, Japan, Vietnam and other Asian countries don't claim gun powder as their Asian technology. One world-changing scientific breakthrough that comes to mind is the polio vaccine. So you're going to claim this as an American invention, too? So who invented space rockets and automobile engines? Who taught Americans how to use them?
I give credit to America for inventing the Internet although CERN keeps saying they invented it. And America invented the atomic bomb with many non-American immigrant scientists who were quickly issued American citizenship. I'm just ticking off some of the world-changing breakthroughs you alluded to.
You sound very proud of your shared (or stolen Nazi) western technological heritage.
Hope you're not claiming that Apple invented the tablet. Yes, they made the iPad. But to call it an invention is a stretch when it incorporates technology that was invented by others. People don't say Mercedes invented the car. Oh, sorry. Mercedes did invent the car. And the Germans invented aspirin. But the Americans took ownership of aspirin for a few decades before giving it back. And your NASA moon project was made possible by good ol' American ingenuity. Except that without the German V rocket scientists, it wouldn't have been possible. Would you like to claim more ownership of European technology and scientific breakthroughs as American? Strange that you bunch up European technology and American together as "western technology." Korea, Japan, Vietnam and other Asian countries don't claim gun powder as their Asian technology.
What you've just said in essence is that Koreans had nothing to do with any of this. You're absolutely correct. (But as you know Korea didn't invent gunpowder, it was the Chinese, who were only able to use it for firecrackers).
I give credit to America for inventing the Internet
Gee thanks, that's mighty white of you.
Strange that you bunch up European technology and American technology together as "western technology.
Uh no, that's the generally accepted definition of 'the west' or 'Western'.
Here you go, from the Oxford dictionary:
western |ˈwɛstərn|
adjective
1 [ attrib. ] situated in the west, or directed toward or facing the west: there will be showers in some western areas.
• (of a wind) blowing from the west.
2 (usu. Western )living in or originating from the west, in particular Europe or the US: Western society.
Don't they teach you even this basic stuff in Korean schools? In the west (that'd be Europe, most of North America, Australia, New Zealand and so on) we learn it in elementary school if not earlier.
What you've just said in essence is that Koreans had nothing to do with any of this. You're absolutely correct. (But as you know Korea didn't invent gunpowder, it was the Chinese, who were only able to use it for firecrackers).
And America had nothing to do with rockets, jet engines or automobiles. So who taught Asians how to build all those gee-whiz things? Oh, yeah. That's labeled western technology so Americans can conveniently claim that they were the inventors/originators of it like you are claiming yourself. You learned well from Steve Jobs' "great artists steal mentality." He says it on Youtube.
Gee thanks, that's mighty white of you.
You're welcome.
And America had nothing to do with rockets, jet engines or automobiles. So who taught Asians how to build all those gee-whiz things? Oh, yeah. That's labeled western technology so Americans can conveniently claim that they were the inventors/originators of it like you are claiming yourself.
You've never heard even of Goddard? Wow! (And you call yourself a Kyopo, shame on you).
Listen to this one folks: according to eric 475, now the Oxford Dictionary are part of a plot to define the very word "western" to NOT mean Europe and the US, so that "Americans cain conveniently claim they were the inventors/originators" of western technology?
Can I please have some of that serious Korean cheeba-cheeba you're growing there these days?
Keep 'em coming!
You've never heard even of Goddard? Wow! (And you call yourself a Kyopo, shame on you).
Listen to this one folks: according to eric 475, now the Oxford Dictionary are part of a plot to define the very word "western" to NOT mean Europe and the US, so that "Americans cain conveniently claim they were the inventors/originators" of western technology?
Can I please have some of that serious Korean cheeba-cheeba you're growing there these days?
Keep 'em coming!
von Braun is the Father of rocket science and built the Saturn V rocket. When the truth hits you, you run away, don't you? Braun was an ex-Nazi so I guess it's hard for you to accept any of this.