Sure, it's possible. I don't have any issues with that. In fact, they're welcome to their share. I could care less. After all, someone needs to serve the low end of the segment. It's just that everyone trots out these numbers with not one -- I repeat, not one -- providing audited net sales numbers for their handset sales.
The only company that provides this info every quarter is Apple.
I like to inhabit the world of audited facts for which you -- or someone in your company -- can be held accountable. It just riles me that people throw around estimates, forecasts, hunches, guesses and so forth as though they are facts.
What "....legal documents from companies..."? Are you referring to third party companies, or Samsung?
I'll happily believe Samsung's legal documents. If you don't have any to link to, don't even bother.
C'mon, SolipsismX, you are really way better than that, and you know that.
I'm referring to legal documents as in SEC filings and quarterly reports. In that same vein we don't know how many iPhone 4Ses Apple sold last quarter, yet from every analyst we get reports that the iPhone 4S is number one this or that carrier without older iPhones still being popular yet being farther down the list. From that we assume that Apple's iPhone 4S outsells the other iPhone models. Do you need a specific statement from Apple saying the exact numbers of each model sold to know that is the case? I certainly don't. Using that same logic and same information I deduce that Samsung is dominating the Android market and see no reason to assume that they can't sell a half-dozen million units of a new phone that looks to be the best Android phone on the market.
Sure, it's possible. I don't have any issues with that. In fact, they're welcome to their share. I could care less. After all, someone needs to serve the low end of the segment. It's just that everyone trots out these numbers with not one -- I repeat, not one -- providing audited net sales numbers for their handset sales.
The only company that provides this info every quarter is Apple.
I like to inhabit the world of audited facts for which you -- or someone in your company -- can be held accountable. It just riles me that people throw around estimates, forecasts, hunches, guesses and so forth as though they are facts.
Oh yes... you and your hurt feelings meme. I'm guessing you are around 15. Tops.
[ Remember TS when I pointed out a post where the person mentioned "hurt feelings" and I told you who it really was regardless of the alias... well, here's your proof ]
The individuals who directly equate their success to the success of the device in their pocket. Those with no sself esteem and require flashy, tech devices to prove their worth or they will feel tiny and unimportant.
Blah blah blah. You, GG, and others keep making these claims about Samsung that Samsung itself, for some strange(!) reason, doesn't back up.
Give up guys. Go somewhere else -- the other tech forums, for instance -- where you can bullis**t your way through basic stuff like this.
I'm smart enough to know that a company doesn't produce a bunch of products if they don't plan on selling them...
That applies to every company.
I don't need a list with the names and addresses of every person on the planet who bought a Samsung phone over the last 90 days.
But you can go on and believe that Samsung is outright lying with everything they say... or that they produce a bunch of phones with no intention to sell and instead shove them in a warehouse somewhere...
We're talking about billions of dollars in inventory here... don't be a fool :-)
I'm referring to legal documents as in SEC filings and quarterly reports. In that same vein we don't know how many iPhone 4Ses Apple sold last quarter, yet from every analyst we get reports that the iPhone 4S is number one this or that carrier without older iPhones still being popular yet being farther down the list. From that we assume that Apple's iPhone 4S outsells the other iPhone models. Do you need a specific statement from Apple saying the exact numbers of each model sold to know that is the case? I certainly don't. Using that same logic and same information I deduce that Samsung is dominating the Android market and see no reason to assume that they can't sell a half-dozen million units of a new phone that looks to be the best Android phone on the market.
What SEC documents from Samsung are you referring to, and what do they report? I'll bet, none (at least none that you've looked at). Stop digging.
As to things at the level of "iPhone 4S or 3GS or whatever sales," I could give a hoot. I don't get into arguments or make assertions based on complete hypotheticals. I can, however, tell you quite confidently how many handsets Apple sells every quarter, and at what average price. That is huge. That is way more than anyone -- Samsung, HTC, Nokia, RIM, etc -- provides.
If you are happy engaging in a conversation with those who are equally blasé about such basic facts, good for you. Go ahead. I tend not to waste my time on conversations that are devoid of any facts whatsoever.
Please don't misunderstand: I have no issues if Samsung's sales were less than, equal to, or greater than that of Apple. I just don't make assertions as though I know whether any one of those plausible outcomes is a fact, when I have no facts. The reason is, that would be no different from my pulling, say, an EPS number for Samsung out of my hat.
I'm smart enough to know that a company doesn't produce a bunch of products if they don't plan on selling them...
That applies to every company.
"Plan on selling them" is not the same as "selling them" (which is not the same as "shipping them').
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
I don't need a list with the names and addresses of every person on the planet who bought a Samsung phone over the last 90 days.
That is not what I asked for. Simply, it is for audited sales numbers. US companies are required to reports basic stuff like that if they believe is is material.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
But you can go on and believe that Samsung is outright lying with everything they say...
Please. I did not say that. In fact, how could they possibly be 'lying' when they've not said anything about what their sales are? All you have are estimates from third parties.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
... or that they produce a bunch of phones with no intention to sell and instead shove them in a warehouse somewhere...
I don't have any clue about that. Maybe they give two away for every one that someone buys, maybe they have fire sales..... I have no clue, and the more important point is, you don't either.
This data is hardly relevant given how the GS3 rolled out globally, and when Samsung's Q2 ended. They had something like 9 million pre-ordered when it was announced so I find these numbers to be off by a wide margin. The (often wrong) analysts of course don't factor in iPhone sales covers the iPhone 3GS, 4 & 4S vs Samsungs GS3 which is a single model. How about comparing the 4S vs GS3.
I actually tested out my co-workers GS3 on Verizon and I can say if Apple fails to show something impressive in October (or whenever they launch the next phone) the GS3 will continue to dominate in sales. Its a very impressive phone, and if you wan't give a competitor the nod for bringing it to the game then you are hardly an open minded user of mobile technology.
My iPhone 4S was sold off (early) so I wouldn't be stuck with a Verizon model that would lose value faster than the Titantic at launch time so I am anxiously waiting for something real to arrive.
C'mon man admit it - it's obviously a popular phone which is selling well whether anyone on here likes it or not.
I doubt many of these people would have bought an iPhone anyway as most Android users I know are Windows users who hate Apple products with a passion.
Not 6 million, I am guessing. Perhaps 3 million? 2.5 million? 4.25 million? Do we know? Do you?
Btw, I've said repeatedly, I truly have no like nor dislike for whether Samsung products are 'selling well' or not. Good for Samsung if they are. I hope they are. (You can choose to believe that or not.)
Yes, I do like Apple products with a passion. But I have absolutely no view on Samsung products since I have never used them. So I have no dislike for Samsung, since I have no clue about whether they are good or not. If anything, I wish them well! It's simply that I don't believe the numbers that are regularly trotted out by people like you, since they are based on surmise and estimates rather than actual facts.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac.World
Of course the Android OS has more phones in circulation....
You have no clue as to whether or not that is true.
If you do, I'd like to see a link for it.
I imagine that it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK
Phone retailers don't keep piles and piles of stock - they buy them and sell them - then buy some more and sell them.
Or, they return them.
Hint: Net versus gross sales.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
I imagine that it is.
Sure, it's possible. I don't have any issues with that. In fact, they're welcome to their share. I could care less. After all, someone needs to serve the low end of the segment. It's just that everyone trots out these numbers with not one -- I repeat, not one -- providing audited net sales numbers for their handset sales.
The only company that provides this info every quarter is Apple.
I like to inhabit the world of audited facts for which you -- or someone in your company -- can be held accountable. It just riles me that people throw around estimates, forecasts, hunches, guesses and so forth as though they are facts.
I'm referring to legal documents as in SEC filings and quarterly reports. In that same vein we don't know how many iPhone 4Ses Apple sold last quarter, yet from every analyst we get reports that the iPhone 4S is number one this or that carrier without older iPhones still being popular yet being farther down the list. From that we assume that Apple's iPhone 4S outsells the other iPhone models. Do you need a specific statement from Apple saying the exact numbers of each model sold to know that is the case? I certainly don't. Using that same logic and same information I deduce that Samsung is dominating the Android market and see no reason to assume that they can't sell a half-dozen million units of a new phone that looks to be the best Android phone on the market.
Hey, cut out the common sense.
Just because you do not understand a thread does not mean others do not. I could simply explain it too you but your babbling is entertaining, go on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool
Just because you do not understand a thread does not mean others do not. I could simply explain it too you but your babbling is entertaining, go on.
Thank you for proving my point.
I have an iTissue if you need it.
Who cares?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool
I have an iTissue if you need it.
Oh yes... you and your hurt feelings meme. I'm guessing you are around 15. Tops.
[ Remember TS when I pointed out a post where the person mentioned "hurt feelings" and I told you who it really was regardless of the alias... well, here's your proof ]
The individuals who directly equate their success to the success of the device in their pocket. Those with no sself esteem and require flashy, tech devices to prove their worth or they will feel tiny and unimportant.
And I am guessing you are 65-70 and have outlived your usefulness and need forums to feel important. Keep clogging up Medicare.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram
Or, they return them.
Hint: Net versus gross sales.
Return 6 million phones ?
C'mon man admit it - it's obviously a popular phone which is selling well whether anyone on here likes it or not.
I doubt many of these people would have bought an iPhone anyway as most Android users I know are Windows users who hate Apple products with a passion.
Most Android users I know are tech types and love all tech and do not hate Apple, they hate ignorant, apologetic Apple shIlls.
I'm smart enough to know that a company doesn't produce a bunch of products if they don't plan on selling them...
That applies to every company.
I don't need a list with the names and addresses of every person on the planet who bought a Samsung phone over the last 90 days.
But you can go on and believe that Samsung is outright lying with everything they say... or that they produce a bunch of phones with no intention to sell and instead shove them in a warehouse somewhere...
We're talking about billions of dollars in inventory here... don't be a fool :-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
I'm referring to legal documents as in SEC filings and quarterly reports. In that same vein we don't know how many iPhone 4Ses Apple sold last quarter, yet from every analyst we get reports that the iPhone 4S is number one this or that carrier without older iPhones still being popular yet being farther down the list. From that we assume that Apple's iPhone 4S outsells the other iPhone models. Do you need a specific statement from Apple saying the exact numbers of each model sold to know that is the case? I certainly don't. Using that same logic and same information I deduce that Samsung is dominating the Android market and see no reason to assume that they can't sell a half-dozen million units of a new phone that looks to be the best Android phone on the market.
What SEC documents from Samsung are you referring to, and what do they report? I'll bet, none (at least none that you've looked at). Stop digging.
As to things at the level of "iPhone 4S or 3GS or whatever sales," I could give a hoot. I don't get into arguments or make assertions based on complete hypotheticals. I can, however, tell you quite confidently how many handsets Apple sells every quarter, and at what average price. That is huge. That is way more than anyone -- Samsung, HTC, Nokia, RIM, etc -- provides.
If you are happy engaging in a conversation with those who are equally blasé about such basic facts, good for you. Go ahead. I tend not to waste my time on conversations that are devoid of any facts whatsoever.
Please don't misunderstand: I have no issues if Samsung's sales were less than, equal to, or greater than that of Apple. I just don't make assertions as though I know whether any one of those plausible outcomes is a fact, when I have no facts. The reason is, that would be no different from my pulling, say, an EPS number for Samsung out of my hat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
I'm smart enough to know that a company doesn't produce a bunch of products if they don't plan on selling them...
That applies to every company.
"Plan on selling them" is not the same as "selling them" (which is not the same as "shipping them').
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
I don't need a list with the names and addresses of every person on the planet who bought a Samsung phone over the last 90 days.
That is not what I asked for. Simply, it is for audited sales numbers. US companies are required to reports basic stuff like that if they believe is is material.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
But you can go on and believe that Samsung is outright lying with everything they say...
Please. I did not say that. In fact, how could they possibly be 'lying' when they've not said anything about what their sales are? All you have are estimates from third parties.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
... or that they produce a bunch of phones with no intention to sell and instead shove them in a warehouse somewhere...
I don't have any clue about that. Maybe they give two away for every one that someone buys, maybe they have fire sales..... I have no clue, and the more important point is, you don't either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
.. don't be a fool :-)
Ah, the irony...
This data is hardly relevant given how the GS3 rolled out globally, and when Samsung's Q2 ended. They had something like 9 million pre-ordered when it was announced so I find these numbers to be off by a wide margin. The (often wrong) analysts of course don't factor in iPhone sales covers the iPhone 3GS, 4 & 4S vs Samsungs GS3 which is a single model. How about comparing the 4S vs GS3.
I actually tested out my co-workers GS3 on Verizon and I can say if Apple fails to show something impressive in October (or whenever they launch the next phone) the GS3 will continue to dominate in sales. Its a very impressive phone, and if you wan't give a competitor the nod for bringing it to the game then you are hardly an open minded user of mobile technology.
My iPhone 4S was sold off (early) so I wouldn't be stuck with a Verizon model that would lose value faster than the Titantic at launch time so I am anxiously waiting for something real to arrive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK
Return 6 million phones ?
C'mon man admit it - it's obviously a popular phone which is selling well whether anyone on here likes it or not.
I doubt many of these people would have bought an iPhone anyway as most Android users I know are Windows users who hate Apple products with a passion.
Not 6 million, I am guessing. Perhaps 3 million? 2.5 million? 4.25 million? Do we know? Do you?
Btw, I've said repeatedly, I truly have no like nor dislike for whether Samsung products are 'selling well' or not. Good for Samsung if they are. I hope they are. (You can choose to believe that or not.)
Yes, I do like Apple products with a passion. But I have absolutely no view on Samsung products since I have never used them. So I have no dislike for Samsung, since I have no clue about whether they are good or not. If anything, I wish them well! It's simply that I don't believe the numbers that are regularly trotted out by people like you, since they are based on surmise and estimates rather than actual facts.