While you are probably correct that Wikipedia appears to greatly overstate the value of Aramco, it's irrelevant, anyway. Aramco is not a public company, so it doesn't have a market capitalization, so my statement that Apple has the largest market cap of any company in the world is correct.
Then your post makes absolutely no sense.
It is widely recognized that Apple has to license the FRAND patents. The only thing that's not settled is what the license fee should be.
But that's not the issue of this trial. The issue is what to do about Samsung stealing Apple's IP without permission and if you meant that Apple should pay to license technologies, that doesn't address the biggest issues.
No argument here. Just found the 2.2-2.7 potential market cap number fun to debate.
Finally I can send out my invitations for the Apple winning party, anyone wanna come? There will be Appletinis and Apple flavored vodka.
Actually, Apple could win and Samsung could also win its complaints. In the end, both companies could win than then be awarded practically nothing. Just because you "win" doesn't mean you will receive the damages that you expect.
I don't envy this jury. I have my own thoughts and opinions from having followed Apples innovation for the iPhone closely for years. To have all this crammed in 2 weeks must be mind boggling. I expect the jury to be hung.
The jury is not on trial. Hanging them seems a bit extreme, don't you think?
Well, they say if you repeat a lie enough, that makes it true.
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball referee running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball referee running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
Why should a moderator not be able to express opinions? Their job is to moderate based on the rules, not on opinions, so there is no inherent conflict of interest.
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball coach running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
No, moderators can still be part of the discussion. And he does a great job, he never says "Shut up, I am a moderator", or uses the power to ban people who doesn't like. He only bans spammers. So you shut up. And "left" MacRumors? He didn't leave...
But that's not the issue of this trial. The issue is what to do about Samsung stealing Apple's IP without permission and if you meant that Apple should pay to license technologies, that doesn't address the biggest issues.
Understood, this case was a disaster. Samsung kept trying to derail the case by saying Apple was infringing on many other company's patents too. If Apple was more cooperative in licensing others' patents instead of just flipping them off and saying sue me if you don't like it, then they would perhaps have a better standing in court the next time they start a lawsuit against the likes of Samsung. As it is now the defense is always going to be Apple steals everyone else IP too. Sure Apple is a big target but with this upcoming Motorola case they should just settle and be done with it. That way they have complied with Motorola so when it comes time to sue Google there is no counter argument available to them.
Why should a moderator not be able to express opinions? Their job is to moderate based on the rules, not on opinions, so there is no inherent conflict of interest.
The difference is that with his extreme polarizing and demeaning style he does cross the line often with impunity. If he wants to participate on the same level as the other members then the other members should be able to add him to their ignore list as I find him quite obnoxious at times.
So you prefer DOS prompts and crappy cell devices?
Bleh.. this is beyond silly. Apple didn't think of the GUI. Xerox made one before them. Others considered the idea before that. Get over it. Someone else would have come along and you have no way of knowing whether it would have been better or worse. Beyond that I've mentioned before that mobile phones would have changed anyway. You might not have quite as many apps yet, but things like larger screens and touch devices were merely accelerated by Apple. I've mentioned the plummeting price of lcd displays around the time of the iphone. Once the cost barrier was down, more companies would have moved in. The LG prada is mentioned frequently. It wouldn't have been the only one. They didn't even have the first high resolution display. A couple before them marketed as "print quality". Apple chose "retina" because it sounds cooler. It's fine to enjoy the stuff you own. Just get over the idea that they are the only ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
"Only way", huh.
Your line of thinking was outmoded 28 years ago.
It's still useful for scripting, although I typically use an IDE or a text editor that colors the font based on syntax.
Quote:
Originally Posted by softeky
The jury is not on trial. Hanging them seems a bit extreme, don't you think?
Not sure if you're kidding or unfamiliar with the term. If you're unfamiliar, a hung jury means they are unable to return a verdict due to unresolvable differences in opinion during deliberation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball referee running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
His posting style hasn't changed. It has always been like that. Other moderators also post regularly. Note Marvin and JeffDM.
But that's not the issue of this trial. The issue is what to do about Samsung stealing Apple's IP without permission and if you meant that Apple should pay to license technologies, that doesn't address the biggest issues.
Understood, this case was a disaster. Samsung kept trying to derail the case by saying Apple was infringing on many other company's patents too. If Apple was more cooperative in licensing others' patents instead of just flipping them off and saying sue me if you don't like it, then they would perhaps have a better standing in court the next time they start a lawsuit against the likes of Samsung. As it is now the defense is always going to be Apple steals everyone else IP too. Sure Apple is a big target but with this upcoming Motorola case they should just settle and be done with it. That way they have complied with Motorola so when it comes time to sue Google there is no counter argument available to them.
It might well help Apple in court to be immune from counter-claims, but probably not at the cost of settling unreasonable claims; setting that kind of precedent would likely backfire in the long term. I've also wondered whether some of the license offers that are made to them are deliberately unreasonable, just to ensure that they don't settle in order to enable these kinds of counter-claims when Apple sues.
Why should a moderator not be able to express opinions? Their job is to moderate based on the rules, not on opinions, so there is no inherent conflict of interest.
The difference is that with his extreme polarizing and demeaning style he does cross the line often with impunity. If he wants to participate on the same level as the other members then the other members should be able to add him to their ignore list as I find him quite obnoxious at times.
Fair enough on the ignore thing. Personally, I find him to be quite knowledgeable, and never worse than amusing. There are several far more obnoxious posters here - even ones that I generally agree with. Certainly wouldn't be on my ignore list.
If he wants to participate on the same level as the other members then the other members should be able to add him to their ignore list as I find him quite obnoxious at times.
Well, you seem to have taken care of that and are advertising as such to everyone else, so why bother complaining about it?
Originally Posted by hmm
It's still useful for scripting, although I typically use an IDE or a text editor that colors the font based on syntax.
Oh, sure! Most classes are still almost exclusively command-line, too, as silly and pointless as that can be at times. It's just that the perpetuation of this form of input turns into "this is the only way to fly" for some people when that couldn't be further from the truth.
[QUOTE]Jury likely to decide Apple and Samsung case as parties fail to narrow dispute[/QUOTE] Even if it had been narrowed, it would have been decided by a jury. Judge Koh was wanting Apple & Samsung to narrow it down to make it simpler for the jury to decide. The only way the jury would NOT have made a decision is if both sides had agreed to get rid of everything (either drop the claims, cross-licensing, whatever).
I certainly hope Apple loses as well. This will show relatively smaller, yet significantly wealthy tech corporations that they cannot go around bullying larger SUPER-MEGA-GINORMO-CONGLOMORATE-CORPORATIONS-THAT-COPY-THE-HELL-OUT-OF-EVERYTHING. Oh and just so you don't mistake me for a troll, I have been an Apple user since the Reagan administration (true story), I have 300 different Apple products, and have owned stock since OSX 10.2.3 build number 6G37. /s
Everyone makes a big deal about how Apple hates competition...they don't hate competition...they hate the competition building "look & feel" clones based on their IP. Maybe its far-reaching of Apple to make the argument that people are confused between the two product lines, but it should be reasonable to say that Samsung's success at the top of the Android food-chain is due to Apple already doing the R&D for them. Whether Apple was inspired by Sony is irrelevant...Apple never copied Sony or even released a product that might have been a copy of a Sony product. Samsung was not inspired by Apple...they were inspired by Apple's success and then copied the hell out of their products.
However, methinks the next month will really provide some serious competition should Apple actually be making a larger iPhone and a smaller iPad/larger iPod touch. Though, Apple critics will likely make a stink that Apple supposedly invented these "new" form factors (new for its product lines anyway). The point is, if these products come out, people will buy them...not because they are in response to Android, but because people have wanted these products in these form factors from Apple and Apple listened. Apple usually does listen, it just generally takes a few years to make sure everything works well and fits the eco-system. Sometimes there's even a little clever misdirection from the late CEO to keep people guessing. Maybe these two products are just rumors and will remain rumors...we won't know till mid-September.
i have a lot of apple stuff at home but there were lots of candy bar style phones out before the iphone. samsung entered like 10 of them into evidence, just the apple blogs ignored it. going back further RIM had the grid style layout with different screens and folders. Palm had the rectangle with rounded corners and grid layout as well. apple gave us the best OS on a mobile device at the time
other than some icons being too similar and maybe the rubber band effect there was lots of prior art for everything apple and samsung had done. just like MS in the 90's, apple had the right product at the right time when the cost structure became right to build a nice smartphone
Personally I would prefer that Apple settle and license virtually every patent claim thus taking the high road. .
So they should settle and pay what could be FRAND violating rates for Samsungs SEPs and settle and let Samsung have access to Apples nonSEP that Apple is not legally required to give them at all much less under any pricing restrictions
Apple is 'one and only' trouble maker in industry.
World will be a better place if without Apple
A statement like that shows how little you get this scene. For every lawsuit with Apple as a party there are at least ten IP suits without. We don't hear about them because, the site in question is about Apple and doesnt post things with no connection or simply the companies dont get the page hits that invoking Apple does so the general sites are less inclined to waste time on them.
You do know that the Judge can overthrow the Jury's decision if she/he doesnt agree with its outcome, no?
There would have to be a major reason to do so or she just guaranteed an appeal by the losing party, if not also the winning one ( if say she downgraded the damages majorly).
Comments
No argument here. Just found the 2.2-2.7 potential market cap number fun to debate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by logandigges
Finally I can send out my invitations for the Apple winning party, anyone wanna come? There will be Appletinis and Apple flavored vodka.
Actually, Apple could win and Samsung could also win its complaints. In the end, both companies could win than then be awarded practically nothing. Just because you "win" doesn't mean you will receive the damages that you expect.
The jury is not on trial. Hanging them seems a bit extreme, don't you think?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Well, they say if you repeat a lie enough, that makes it true.
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
"Samsung is innovative."
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball referee running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
Why should a moderator not be able to express opinions? Their job is to moderate based on the rules, not on opinions, so there is no inherent conflict of interest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball coach running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
No, moderators can still be part of the discussion. And he does a great job, he never says "Shut up, I am a moderator", or uses the power to ban people who doesn't like. He only bans spammers. So you shut up. And "left" MacRumors? He didn't leave...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
But that's not the issue of this trial. The issue is what to do about Samsung stealing Apple's IP without permission and if you meant that Apple should pay to license technologies, that doesn't address the biggest issues.
Understood, this case was a disaster. Samsung kept trying to derail the case by saying Apple was infringing on many other company's patents too. If Apple was more cooperative in licensing others' patents instead of just flipping them off and saying sue me if you don't like it, then they would perhaps have a better standing in court the next time they start a lawsuit against the likes of Samsung. As it is now the defense is always going to be Apple steals everyone else IP too. Sure Apple is a big target but with this upcoming Motorola case they should just settle and be done with it. That way they have complied with Motorola so when it comes time to sue Google there is no counter argument available to them.
Originally Posted by BertieBig
If he were being paid by Samsung to make specious arguments without declaring it, would that be a breach of the rules?
Paid, yes. Back in 2008, we had some paid Adobe shills (posting from Adobe IPs, the morons) touting how great Flash was. In the dumpster they went.
Originally Posted by logandigges
And "left" MacRumors? He didn't leave...
Should have, though.
But then I wouldn't have met you fine people as early as I did. So it all works out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetry
Why should a moderator not be able to express opinions? Their job is to moderate based on the rules, not on opinions, so there is no inherent conflict of interest.
The difference is that with his extreme polarizing and demeaning style he does cross the line often with impunity. If he wants to participate on the same level as the other members then the other members should be able to add him to their ignore list as I find him quite obnoxious at times.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA
So you prefer DOS prompts and crappy cell devices?
Bleh.. this is beyond silly. Apple didn't think of the GUI. Xerox made one before them. Others considered the idea before that. Get over it. Someone else would have come along and you have no way of knowing whether it would have been better or worse. Beyond that I've mentioned before that mobile phones would have changed anyway. You might not have quite as many apps yet, but things like larger screens and touch devices were merely accelerated by Apple. I've mentioned the plummeting price of lcd displays around the time of the iphone. Once the cost barrier was down, more companies would have moved in. The LG prada is mentioned frequently. It wouldn't have been the only one. They didn't even have the first high resolution display. A couple before them marketed as "print quality". Apple chose "retina" because it sounds cooler. It's fine to enjoy the stuff you own. Just get over the idea that they are the only ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
"Only way", huh.
Your line of thinking was outmoded 28 years ago.
It's still useful for scripting, although I typically use an IDE or a text editor that colors the font based on syntax.
Quote:
Originally Posted by softeky
The jury is not on trial. Hanging them seems a bit extreme, don't you think?
Not sure if you're kidding or unfamiliar with the term. If you're unfamiliar, a hung jury means they are unable to return a verdict due to unresolvable differences in opinion during deliberation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamewing
Shouldn't the moderators job be to make sure everything runs well in the forums and not to constantly post their opinions in the forums?
His actions are like a beach volley ball referee running on the sand to play the game when he should be making sure everybody else follows the rules. But, I guess when you have all the power you can do what you want without worrying about others' recourse. Probably the reason he left Mac Rumors(?) after three years.
His posting style hasn't changed. It has always been like that. Other moderators also post regularly. Note Marvin and JeffDM.
It might well help Apple in court to be immune from counter-claims, but probably not at the cost of settling unreasonable claims; setting that kind of precedent would likely backfire in the long term. I've also wondered whether some of the license offers that are made to them are deliberately unreasonable, just to ensure that they don't settle in order to enable these kinds of counter-claims when Apple sues.
Fair enough on the ignore thing. Personally, I find him to be quite knowledgeable, and never worse than amusing. There are several far more obnoxious posters here - even ones that I generally agree with. Certainly wouldn't be on my ignore list.
Originally Posted by mstone
If he wants to participate on the same level as the other members then the other members should be able to add him to their ignore list as I find him quite obnoxious at times.
Well, you seem to have taken care of that and are advertising as such to everyone else, so why bother complaining about it?
Originally Posted by hmm
It's still useful for scripting, although I typically use an IDE or a text editor that colors the font based on syntax.
Oh, sure! Most classes are still almost exclusively command-line, too, as silly and pointless as that can be at times. It's just that the perpetuation of this form of input turns into "this is the only way to fly" for some people when that couldn't be further from the truth.
Even if it had been narrowed, it would have been decided by a jury.
Judge Koh was wanting Apple & Samsung to narrow it down to make it simpler for the jury to decide.
The only way the jury would NOT have made a decision is if both sides had agreed to get rid of everything (either drop the claims, cross-licensing, whatever).
I certainly hope Apple loses as well. This will show relatively smaller, yet significantly wealthy tech corporations that they cannot go around bullying larger SUPER-MEGA-GINORMO-CONGLOMORATE-CORPORATIONS-THAT-COPY-THE-HELL-OUT-OF-EVERYTHING. Oh and just so you don't mistake me for a troll, I have been an Apple user since the Reagan administration (true story), I have 300 different Apple products, and have owned stock since OSX 10.2.3 build number 6G37. /s
Everyone makes a big deal about how Apple hates competition...they don't hate competition...they hate the competition building "look & feel" clones based on their IP. Maybe its far-reaching of Apple to make the argument that people are confused between the two product lines, but it should be reasonable to say that Samsung's success at the top of the Android food-chain is due to Apple already doing the R&D for them. Whether Apple was inspired by Sony is irrelevant...Apple never copied Sony or even released a product that might have been a copy of a Sony product. Samsung was not inspired by Apple...they were inspired by Apple's success and then copied the hell out of their products.
However, methinks the next month will really provide some serious competition should Apple actually be making a larger iPhone and a smaller iPad/larger iPod touch. Though, Apple critics will likely make a stink that Apple supposedly invented these "new" form factors (new for its product lines anyway). The point is, if these products come out, people will buy them...not because they are in response to Android, but because people have wanted these products in these form factors from Apple and Apple listened. Apple usually does listen, it just generally takes a few years to make sure everything works well and fits the eco-system. Sometimes there's even a little clever misdirection from the late CEO to keep people guessing. Maybe these two products are just rumors and will remain rumors...we won't know till mid-September.
i have a lot of apple stuff at home but there were lots of candy bar style phones out before the iphone. samsung entered like 10 of them into evidence, just the apple blogs ignored it. going back further RIM had the grid style layout with different screens and folders. Palm had the rectangle with rounded corners and grid layout as well. apple gave us the best OS on a mobile device at the time
other than some icons being too similar and maybe the rubber band effect there was lots of prior art for everything apple and samsung had done. just like MS in the 90's, apple had the right product at the right time when the cost structure became right to build a nice smartphone
So they should settle and pay what could be FRAND violating rates for Samsungs SEPs and settle and let Samsung have access to Apples nonSEP that Apple is not legally required to give them at all much less under any pricing restrictions
A statement like that shows how little you get this scene. For every lawsuit with Apple as a party there are at least ten IP suits without. We don't hear about them because, the site in question is about Apple and doesnt post things with no connection or simply the companies dont get the page hits that invoking Apple does so the general sites are less inclined to waste time on them.
There would have to be a major reason to do so or she just guaranteed an appeal by the losing party, if not also the winning one ( if say she downgraded the damages majorly).
Why bother even trying to think up something. Put him on ignore and move on.