What a bunch of w*nkers some of you are. Do people really need "proof" that Apple maps are bad? Statistically? Come on.... I hope AA stays on this and doesn't let Apple off the hook. They treated their customers with contempt and even admitted their Maps are so unusable people should use other products.
What a bunch of w*nkers some of you are. Do people really need "proof" that Apple maps are bad? Statistically? Come on.... I hope AA stays on this and doesn't let Apple off the hook. They treated their customers with contempt and even admitted their Maps are so unusable people should use other products.
There are times when statistical 'proof' is necessary and times when it's not really necessary for the point being made.
I don't need statistical proof that it's raining when I can establish that by looking out the window. Likewise, to deny that there's a problem with Apple Maps in the face of widespread complaint and a public apology from Apple is not really feasible.
You seem to be hiding behind this requirement for statistics a bit. Do you have statistical proof that Apple Maps is as good as Google Maps or better?
It has less to do with statistics than with representative samples and controls. You may be willing to accept a bit of whining on the Internet as evidence. I am not.
There are plenty of examples where Google Maps is wrong, too. So why is everyone so quick to say that a few errors in Apple Maps makes it inferior? The only way to tell if one is inferior is to do a side-by-side comparison. CR did that, but with only a very limited sample.
It's the same thing as all the other whining about Apple. When people started complaining about the antennae in the iPhone 4, all we heard was whining about how the behavior sucked. It was only a couple of months later that we learned that all phones do exactly the same thing. There's a ton of whining about Apple's subcontractors in China. Yet no one wants to mention that all of their competitors use the same (or similar) contractors - and only Apple is working to better the working conditions. We hear about the glass on Apple's phones breaking - yet no one considers the fact that ANY phone with glass can break.
There's a difference between loud-mouthed whining and actually proving a claim. So far, all we have is the former. If anyone actually proves that Apple's Maps are significantly inferior, I'd be happy to acknowledge that fact. I am not, however, going to accept whining as fact.
Oh, and BTW, Euphonius - you have clearly demonstrated your inability to think critically. First, I never claimed that Apple Maps was better. I never even claimed it was as good. But, then, I'm not the one making claims. I'm simply asking those who are making claims to back them up with facts. The ones making the claims have the burden of proof. If you want my opinion, I would venture that they're both probably right over 99.9% of the time. I would also suppose that while both of them have very rare mistakes, Apple Maps may have a few more than Google's, but the numbers are too low to get excited about in either case. If someone actually does an analysis and finds that Apple is 99.9997% accurate and Google is 99.9998% accurate, is anyone going to care about the difference?
2. Apple maps isn't as bad as some people would have you believe.
3. Apple will release at least 2 and possibly 3 updates to maps before the end of the year fixing at least half of everything that people are bitching about and at least 3 more updates before next summer.
4. Apple has sold a shit load (and then some) of iPhone 5s and the amount sold will only increase.
5. By this time next year people won't know about this issue and the 5S (or whatever the hell it will be called) will be selling by the truckloads.
Apple caved in to bullshit that would have been water under the bridge in about a months' time. And in the meantime they'd have been busy making the app better.
If you already have other navigation apps, like TomTom and Garmin, and some great free ones like MotionX Drive and Waze, then chances are, you would have hardly been affected by Apple yanking Google Maps in the first place.
It's surprising because it's Apple, and that's fair enough, but even the smallest misstep by Apple *must* be spun to hell and back by a lazy, unimaginative industry that is full of Apple competitors that don't have nearly the same mindshare, cachet and desirability as Apple. For the last few years it's been all about Apple, and given that that isn't going to change anytime soon, the disaffected, envious, and the plain flat-footed have to magnify everything. The competition sees the writing on the wall, meaning that the next few years belong to Apple.
I'm kind of enjoying it, actually. Because as usual, when the quarterly reports and consumer satisfaction numbers come around as they always do, all that spin will have accomplished nothing.
Lazy?? Like the latest iPhone 5 having all, well, most of the features of other competitors phones? I am seeing some laziness lately in the mobile industry, and it ain't the competitors for sure.
It has less to do with statistics than with representative samples and controls. You may be willing to accept a bit of whining on the Internet as evidence. I am not.
There are plenty of examples where Google Maps is wrong, too. So why is everyone so quick to say that a few errors in Apple Maps makes it inferior? The only way to tell if one is inferior is to do a side-by-side comparison. CR did that, but with only a very limited sample.
It's the same thing as all the other whining about Apple. When people started complaining about the antennae in the iPhone 4, all we heard was whining about how the behavior sucked. It was only a couple of months later that we learned that all phones do exactly the same thing. There's a ton of whining about Apple's subcontractors in China. Yet no one wants to mention that all of their competitors use the same (or similar) contractors - and only Apple is working to better the working conditions. We hear about the glass on Apple's phones breaking - yet no one considers the fact that ANY phone with glass can break.
There's a difference between loud-mouthed whining and actually proving a claim. So far, all we have is the former. If anyone actually proves that Apple's Maps are significantly inferior, I'd be happy to acknowledge that fact. I am not, however, going to accept whining as fact.
Oh, and BTW, Euphonius - you have clearly demonstrated your inability to think critically. First, I never claimed that Apple Maps was better. I never even claimed it was as good. But, then, I'm not the one making claims. I'm simply asking those who are making claims to back them up with facts. The ones making the claims have the burden of proof. If you want my opinion, I would venture that they're both probably right over 99.9% of the time. I would also suppose that while both of them have very rare mistakes, Apple Maps may have a few more than Google's, but the numbers are too low to get excited about in either case. If someone actually does an analysis and finds that Apple is 99.9997% accurate and Google is 99.9998% accurate, is anyone going to care about the difference?
I think you should know why the world is quick to complain about Apple. It is because Apple continues to project a persona that they look down on all their competitors. They are the elite. That works as long as you never make mistakes. It gives you hell to pay if you do make mistakes. Apple thrusts themselves into this situation, and now they are reaping the results of not delivering perfection. Tim Cook's apology is very odd to me. We are seeing a new side of Apple. It will be interesting if this new side is still as appealing to consumers.
I think you should know why the world is quick to complain about Apple. It is because Apple continues to project a persona that they look down on all their competitors. They are the elite. That works as long as you never make mistakes. It gives you hell to pay if you do make mistakes. Apple thrusts themselves into this situation, and now they are reaping the results of not delivering perfection. Tim Cook's apology is very odd to me. We are seeing a new side of Apple. It will be interesting if this new side is still as appealing to consumers.
Apple rarely advertises anything that 'looks down on their competitors'. (The 'I'm a Mac' ads were the main exception). Most Apple ads simply show what you can do with the product without even mentioning the competition.
The fundamental problem is that there is a mass of anti-Apple people out there. If you were using Macs in the 90s, you'd remember how many people told you that Macs were toys or junk or how no intelligent person could ever use them. Now, the topics have changed, but the general story is the same - a large number of Apple-haters manage to spread their story all over the place. I believe some of it is funded by their competitors (like Google's stupid #lost ad), but much of it is simply people who hate Apple and don't mind spreading lies.
I'm sorry, but I'm not going to give you my entire critical thinking course in one post.
People who have any concept of 'evidence' and 'proof' know what I'm talking about. You, unfortunately, don't - and are unwilling to learn. Go take a course in critical thinking.
That's fine, I'll bookmark this thread then and take your reply as an admission of failure. The reason why I did not provide you with evidence is because you refused to make your definition of evidence clear in order to keep your freedom to move the goal posts every time you're about to lose the argument. That might work against morons, but it fails terribly with me.
I've been dealing with fail Internet trolls like you since 1995, that tactic is old and flawed.
Just goes to show that they make nonsense claims to take advantage of the "group think" mentality of Apple users, knowing that whatever adjectives that they spew, their "fans" (congregation?) will most likely propagate it.
It has less to do with statistics than with representative samples and controls. You may be willing to accept a bit of whining on the Internet as evidence. I am not.
What is a "representative sample"? And why doesn't it qualify as statistics? Do you even know what statistics is?
There are plenty of examples where Google Maps is wrong, too. So why is everyone so quick to say that a few errors in Apple Maps makes it inferior? The only way to tell if one is inferior is to do a side-by-side comparison. CR did that, but with only a very limited sample.
But there are no examples of Google Maps being fundamentally flawed, like my previous example with the search, or the map being out of sync with the searchable data.
It's the same thing as all the other whining about Apple. When people started complaining about the antennae in the iPhone 4, all we heard was whining about how the behavior sucked. It was only a couple of months later that we learned that all phones do exactly the same thing. There's a ton of whining about Apple's subcontractors in China. Yet no one wants to mention that all of their competitors use the same (or similar) contractors - and only Apple is working to better the working conditions. We hear about the glass on Apple's phones breaking - yet no one considers the fact that ANY phone with glass can break.
This is a lie. Yes, all phones lose signal if you cover them completely, but they don't lose 75% of signal strength when you're holding them in a perfectly normal position. While I understand that your apologetic fundamentalism requires you to lie to yourself about these things, you should be ashamed of spreading misinformation to others. Apple themselves settled a class action lawsuit, essentially pleading guilty of the problem, and then redesigned the iPhone 4S to avoid it.
There's a difference between loud-mouthed whining and actually proving a claim. So far, all we have is the former. If anyone actually proves that Apple's Maps are significantly inferior, I'd be happy to acknowledge that fact. I am not, however, going to accept whining as fact.
I have already proven that earlier in the thread, and you refused to answer to my posts. Why?
Just goes to show that they make nonsense claims to take advantage of the "group think" mentality of Apple users, knowing that whatever adjectives that they spew, their "fans" (congregation?) will most likely propagate it.
Basically, act first then question later.
I think you just defined advertising in general. It's the rule, rather than the exception, to overstate a product's worth.
That's fine, I'll bookmark this thread then and take your reply as an admission of failure. The reason why I did not provide you with evidence is because you refused to make your definition of evidence clear in order to keep your freedom to move the goal posts every time you're about to lose the argument. That might work against morons, but it fails terribly with me.
I've been dealing with fail Internet trolls like you since 1995, that tactic is old and flawed.
Once again, take a course in critical thinking. I'm not going to condense my entire 15 week course into one post.
Since you don't have any clue what 'evidence' is, there's no point in explaining it to you.
Since you are apparently willing to believe everything you see on the Internet without evidence, this is for you:
Comments
It has less to do with statistics than with representative samples and controls. You may be willing to accept a bit of whining on the Internet as evidence. I am not.
There are plenty of examples where Google Maps is wrong, too. So why is everyone so quick to say that a few errors in Apple Maps makes it inferior? The only way to tell if one is inferior is to do a side-by-side comparison. CR did that, but with only a very limited sample.
It's the same thing as all the other whining about Apple. When people started complaining about the antennae in the iPhone 4, all we heard was whining about how the behavior sucked. It was only a couple of months later that we learned that all phones do exactly the same thing. There's a ton of whining about Apple's subcontractors in China. Yet no one wants to mention that all of their competitors use the same (or similar) contractors - and only Apple is working to better the working conditions. We hear about the glass on Apple's phones breaking - yet no one considers the fact that ANY phone with glass can break.
There's a difference between loud-mouthed whining and actually proving a claim. So far, all we have is the former. If anyone actually proves that Apple's Maps are significantly inferior, I'd be happy to acknowledge that fact. I am not, however, going to accept whining as fact.
Oh, and BTW, Euphonius - you have clearly demonstrated your inability to think critically. First, I never claimed that Apple Maps was better. I never even claimed it was as good. But, then, I'm not the one making claims. I'm simply asking those who are making claims to back them up with facts. The ones making the claims have the burden of proof. If you want my opinion, I would venture that they're both probably right over 99.9% of the time. I would also suppose that while both of them have very rare mistakes, Apple Maps may have a few more than Google's, but the numbers are too low to get excited about in either case. If someone actually does an analysis and finds that Apple is 99.9997% accurate and Google is 99.9998% accurate, is anyone going to care about the difference?
1. Apple Maps is bad.
2. Apple maps isn't as bad as some people would have you believe.
3. Apple will release at least 2 and possibly 3 updates to maps before the end of the year fixing at least half of everything that people are bitching about and at least 3 more updates before next summer.
4. Apple has sold a shit load (and then some) of iPhone 5s and the amount sold will only increase.
5. By this time next year people won't know about this issue and the 5S (or whatever the hell it will be called) will be selling by the truckloads.
6. Haters
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610
Apple caved in to bullshit that would have been water under the bridge in about a months' time. And in the meantime they'd have been busy making the app better.
If you already have other navigation apps, like TomTom and Garmin, and some great free ones like MotionX Drive and Waze, then chances are, you would have hardly been affected by Apple yanking Google Maps in the first place.
It's surprising because it's Apple, and that's fair enough, but even the smallest misstep by Apple *must* be spun to hell and back by a lazy, unimaginative industry that is full of Apple competitors that don't have nearly the same mindshare, cachet and desirability as Apple. For the last few years it's been all about Apple, and given that that isn't going to change anytime soon, the disaffected, envious, and the plain flat-footed have to magnify everything. The competition sees the writing on the wall, meaning that the next few years belong to Apple.
I'm kind of enjoying it, actually. Because as usual, when the quarterly reports and consumer satisfaction numbers come around as they always do, all that spin will have accomplished nothing.
Lazy?? Like the latest iPhone 5 having all, well, most of the features of other competitors phones? I am seeing some laziness lately in the mobile industry, and it ain't the competitors for sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
It has less to do with statistics than with representative samples and controls. You may be willing to accept a bit of whining on the Internet as evidence. I am not.
There are plenty of examples where Google Maps is wrong, too. So why is everyone so quick to say that a few errors in Apple Maps makes it inferior? The only way to tell if one is inferior is to do a side-by-side comparison. CR did that, but with only a very limited sample.
It's the same thing as all the other whining about Apple. When people started complaining about the antennae in the iPhone 4, all we heard was whining about how the behavior sucked. It was only a couple of months later that we learned that all phones do exactly the same thing. There's a ton of whining about Apple's subcontractors in China. Yet no one wants to mention that all of their competitors use the same (or similar) contractors - and only Apple is working to better the working conditions. We hear about the glass on Apple's phones breaking - yet no one considers the fact that ANY phone with glass can break.
There's a difference between loud-mouthed whining and actually proving a claim. So far, all we have is the former. If anyone actually proves that Apple's Maps are significantly inferior, I'd be happy to acknowledge that fact. I am not, however, going to accept whining as fact.
Oh, and BTW, Euphonius - you have clearly demonstrated your inability to think critically. First, I never claimed that Apple Maps was better. I never even claimed it was as good. But, then, I'm not the one making claims. I'm simply asking those who are making claims to back them up with facts. The ones making the claims have the burden of proof. If you want my opinion, I would venture that they're both probably right over 99.9% of the time. I would also suppose that while both of them have very rare mistakes, Apple Maps may have a few more than Google's, but the numbers are too low to get excited about in either case. If someone actually does an analysis and finds that Apple is 99.9997% accurate and Google is 99.9998% accurate, is anyone going to care about the difference?
I think you should know why the world is quick to complain about Apple. It is because Apple continues to project a persona that they look down on all their competitors. They are the elite. That works as long as you never make mistakes. It gives you hell to pay if you do make mistakes. Apple thrusts themselves into this situation, and now they are reaping the results of not delivering perfection. Tim Cook's apology is very odd to me. We are seeing a new side of Apple. It will be interesting if this new side is still as appealing to consumers.
Apple rarely advertises anything that 'looks down on their competitors'. (The 'I'm a Mac' ads were the main exception). Most Apple ads simply show what you can do with the product without even mentioning the competition.
The fundamental problem is that there is a mass of anti-Apple people out there. If you were using Macs in the 90s, you'd remember how many people told you that Macs were toys or junk or how no intelligent person could ever use them. Now, the topics have changed, but the general story is the same - a large number of Apple-haters manage to spread their story all over the place. I believe some of it is funded by their competitors (like Google's stupid #lost ad), but much of it is simply people who hate Apple and don't mind spreading lies.
That's fine, I'll bookmark this thread then and take your reply as an admission of failure. The reason why I did not provide you with evidence is because you refused to make your definition of evidence clear in order to keep your freedom to move the goal posts every time you're about to lose the argument. That might work against morons, but it fails terribly with me.
I've been dealing with fail Internet trolls like you since 1995, that tactic is old and flawed.
Just goes to show that they make nonsense claims to take advantage of the "group think" mentality of Apple users, knowing that whatever adjectives that they spew, their "fans" (congregation?) will most likely propagate it.
Basically, act first then question later.
What is a "representative sample"? And why doesn't it qualify as statistics? Do you even know what statistics is?
But there are no examples of Google Maps being fundamentally flawed, like my previous example with the search, or the map being out of sync with the searchable data.
This is a lie. Yes, all phones lose signal if you cover them completely, but they don't lose 75% of signal strength when you're holding them in a perfectly normal position. While I understand that your apologetic fundamentalism requires you to lie to yourself about these things, you should be ashamed of spreading misinformation to others. Apple themselves settled a class action lawsuit, essentially pleading guilty of the problem, and then redesigned the iPhone 4S to avoid it.
I have already proven that earlier in the thread, and you refused to answer to my posts. Why?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi
Just goes to show that they make nonsense claims to take advantage of the "group think" mentality of Apple users, knowing that whatever adjectives that they spew, their "fans" (congregation?) will most likely propagate it.
Basically, act first then question later.
I think you just defined advertising in general. It's the rule, rather than the exception, to overstate a product's worth.
Once again, take a course in critical thinking. I'm not going to condense my entire 15 week course into one post.
Since you don't have any clue what 'evidence' is, there's no point in explaining it to you.
Since you are apparently willing to believe everything you see on the Internet without evidence, this is for you:
Enjoy your date with a French model.
I knew I was reminded of something by some of you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz
Justin Bieber fans..
I knew I was reminded of something by some of you.
More like fans of the Boss.
Cheers
And what exactly are you attempting to establish with this ad hominem fallacy, oh wannabe critical thinker?
Strange that a critical thinker such as you has to resort to straw man fallacies in order to try to win a debate...
Uh... You may wish to look in the mirror before accusing me of being gullible...