Can someone please take a stab at which 9 accounts he is talking about. I tried to think of some but I'm not very familiar with Android, and came up quite a few short of 9.
Perhaps he means that not all the content is on Google Play so you need to sign up for some other obscure third party app stores as well.
I didn't say Apple didn't design the Ax processors. But Eric claims that Apple designs their own custom processor yet almighty samsung can't. Samsung also makes its own custom Exynos processor just like apple makes Ax. Both Apple and samsung uses ARM reference to build their processors. And samsung design's and manufactures the Exynos where Apple designs the AX, but needs samsung's help to manufacture it.
I guess it's Samsung's (and HTC's) way of distancing themselves from Google, log in on some Samsung phones and you get 48GB extra free for two years, HTC it's 23GB extra.
Samsung phone's also come with Navigon in some countries, although why they need an alternative to the oh so perfect Google Maps is beyond me.
Then there's Picassa and Google's constant demands to join Google +
If you don't want the free storage, you don't have to sign up. Note that in iOS you get NOTHING for free (I am paying $100 a year for iCloud storage, which is more expensive than dropbox and google drive (both of which I have), and worse than either one. For office docs SkyDrive is way better (and you get plenty of storage for free with Office 365).
I never claimed Apple didn't design the Ax processor. Just like apple, Samsung also designs its own Exynos processor and they both use ARM architecture. The difference is Apple is dependent on Samsung to manufacture their chip while Samsung doesn't need Apple for anything.
If you don't want the free storage, you don't have to sign up. Note that in iOS you get NOTHING for free (I am paying $100 a year for iCloud storage, which is more expensive than dropbox and google drive (both of which I have), and worse than either one. For office docs SkyDrive is way better (and you get plenty of storage for free with Office 365).
Personally I like Back to My Mac. That way I have complete control over my files. I back them up as I see fit, log in from anywhere and work on the original file without any proprietary collaboration or sharing scenarios, etc. Perhaps it is not as full featured, but it supports any file type and helps with versioning. Storage is so ridiculously inexpensive now days, I don't see the advantage of using a third party cloud that may have downtime or privacy issues. That said, I have my own private file sharing application which I wrote and run from our data center.
Personally I like Back to My Mac. That way I have complete control over my files. I back them up as I see fit, log in from anywhere and work on the original file without any proprietary collaboration or sharing scenarios, etc. Perhaps it is not as full featured, but it supports any file type and helps with versioning. Storage is so ridiculously inexpensive now days, I don't see the advantage of using a third party cloud that may have downtime or privacy issues. That said I have my own private file sharing application which I wrote and run from our data center.
Through the magic of rsync iCloud is definitely useful for some things (which is why I do use it), but Dropbox is great for having access to all your files everywhere. Google drive is slightly more clunky, but WAY cheaper (I have a terabyte for about the same as what I get 100GB on iCloud).
I never claimed Apple didn't design the Ax processor. Just like apple, Samsung also designs its own Exynos processor and they both use ARM architecture. The difference is Apple is dependent on Samsung to manufacture their chip while Samsung doesn't need Apple for anything.
1) Bullshit! You brought Samsung into the conversation to discredit Apple's achievement.
2) Bullshit! Samsung's ads, their marketing, their HW and SW designs are so similar to what Apple has done that you can't say it's just a coincidence. They took from Apple and took heavily. Whether it's illegal or not is irrelevant but they took from Apple. On top of that, where would Samsung be today without Apple changing up the smartphone market? Still copying the Blackberry, Nokia and Moto, I presume.
3) Apple is using Samsung right now and Samsung has the best ARM foundries for the quality and yield they need. These are production facilities only. They do not design anything for Apple. They aren't Apple's only chip manufacturer. Apple relies more on Foxconn as a sole production plant than anything to do with Samsung but I don't see you claiming Foxconn should get credit for Apple's success. Bullshit!
Through the magic of rsync iCloud is definitely useful for some things (which is why I do use it), but Dropbox is great for having access to all your files everywhere. Google drive is slightly more clunky, but WAY cheaper (I have a terabyte for about the same as what I get 100GB on iCloud).
Sure but with Back to My Mac I can use applications without having another copy on my MBP. I can open and save any of the proprietary files like Maya, and CS documents without having to buy another license.
I can't imagine what in my comment you don't understand so I'll restate it using simpler words to help you out.
Android can be forked. That means anyone — even you — can take Android and then make it your own OS. The Kindle Fire uses a forked version of Android. It's based on Android just like Android is Linux-based and iOS is Darwin-based off of BSD, hence my comment that you might as well call it an Amazon Linux tablet (and while you're at it call the iPhone an BSD smartphone) as both sound as equally foolish.
Sure but with Back to My Mac I can use applications without having another copy on my MBP. I can open and save any of the proprietary files like Maya, and CS documents without having to buy another license.
Eric are you serious? <span style="color:rgb(24,24,24);font-family:arial, helvetica, sans-serif;line-height:18.196022033691406px;font-size:13px;">Apple's custom designed ARM processors.How about Samsung custom designed Exynos processor? Last I checked, samsung still makes majority of apple chips. I guess Apple needs samsung more than Samsung needs Apple. </span>
Quite serious, and not only are you a poor troll, but an ill-informed one as well.
Apple designs the A6 and A6X (largely hand laid out, BTW). Apple has a license to produce ARM compatible chips. This is why the A6 isn't an A9 or A15 - it's a custom chip with elements of each. Qualcomm also does this.
Samsung doesn't. Their ARM chips are ARM reference designs. Samsung makes A9's, A15's and that's it. They don't make hybrid chips the way Apple and Qualcomm do. This puts Apple and Qualcomm ahead of Samsung who just copy existing designs. Apple is innovating by creating new versions of ARM processors that didn't exist before.
I can't imagine what in my comment you don't understand so I'll restate it using simpler words to help you out.
Android can be forked. That means anyone — even you — can take Android and then make it your own OS. The Kindle Fire uses a forked version of Android. It's based on Android just like Android is Linux-based and iOS is Darwin-based off of BSD, hence my comment that you might as well call it an Amazon Linux tablet (and while you're at it call the iPhone an BSD smartphone) as both sound as equally foolish.
Amazingly, I understood what you were saying, but could not believe that someone of your calibre could say something so patently idiotic. Amazon's android is (in essence) a skin on top of standard Android, and about two lines of configuration can, in fact, make it a fully functional android device. Amazon has some of their own functionality on the kindle, but the Amazon app store is a subset of the standard android store (can be made the whole store by changing the above-mentioned two lines). The UI not having with consuming amazon content is identical to any other android phone/tablet, and has very little to do with a garden-variety Red Hat server or a Ubuntu desktop (though it is true that you can ssh into a Kindle if you are really so inclined, and you can't into an iPhone.
Further, for a Kindle to be useful as a Kindle you HAVE to have an amazon account. That however, is all you need if all you want is a kindle, though if you want a general purpose tablet, a Google account comes in handy.
Soli, believe what you want. Whatever makes you sleep better. I brought it up just to point out that just like Apple, Samsung also designs its own custom processors. And as for copying if I recall correctly Jobs himself said "good artists copy, great artists steal. We have always been shameless about stealing great ideas".
Quite serious, and not only are you a poor troll, but an ill-informed one as well.
Apple designs the A6 and A6X (largely hand laid out, BTW). Apple has a license to produce ARM compatible chips. This is why the A6 isn't an A9 or A15 - it's a custom chip with elements of each. Qualcomm also does this.
Samsung doesn't. Their ARM chips are ARM reference designs. Samsung makes A9's, A15's and that's it. They don't make hybrid chips the way Apple and Qualcomm do. This puts Apple and Qualcomm ahead of Samsung who just copy existing designs. Apple is innovating by creating new versions of ARM processors that didn't exist before.
Good point but we can say Samsung designs their own ASIC, just not their own ARM chips, as far as I've seen.
Sure but with Back to My Mac I can use applications without having another copy on my MBP. I can open and save any of the proprietary files like Maya, and CS documents without having to buy another license.
Granted, that is very fine functionality.
Furthermore I have very strict rules about which IPs can access our datacenter network and using Back to my Mac I have a two tiered security layer protection, the first being my firewall rules which allow my office workstation and secondly Apple's iCloud shared device security on top of that. Without Back to My Mac I would not be able to access my datacenter files when on the road as the firewall rules would prevent it. With Back to My Mac it just works.
Soli, believe what you want. Whatever makes you sleep better. I brought it up just to point out that just like Apple, Samsung also designs its own custom processors. And as for copying if I recall correctly Jobs himself said "good artists copy, great artists steal. We have always been shameless about stealing great ideas".
As EricTheHalfBee points points out there is no evidence of Samsung designing their own processors, only their own ASIC. Making an SoC on an ARM chips is very different from taking an ARM reference design and building around it.
Amazingly, I understood what you were saying, but could not believe that someone of your calibre could say something so patently idiotic. Amazon's android is (in essence) a skin on top of standard Android, and about two lines of configuration can, in fact, make it a fully functional android device. Amazon has some of their own functionality on the kindle, but the Amazon app store is a subset of the standard android store (can be made the whole store by changing the above-mentioned two lines). The UI not having with consuming amazon content is identical to any other android phone/tablet, and has very little to do with a garden-variety Red Hat server or a Ubuntu desktop (though it is true that you can ssh into a Kindle if you are really so inclined, and you can't into an iPhone.
Further, for a Kindle to be useful as a Kindle you HAVE to have an amazon account. That however, is all you need if all you want is a kindle, though if you want a general purpose tablet, a Google account comes in handy.
A fork is a fork. For example, Apple's A4 used ARM Cortex-A8. The A4 was their design but the Cortex-A8 came directly from ARM. Their later chips were considerably more custom to the point they can't even use Cortex-A9 and Cortex-A15 brands because they don't use them even those a great deal of their ARM components will be similar, if not the same, and it's still ARMv7 across the board.
1) Bullshit! You brought Samsung into the conversation to discredit Apple's achievement.
2) Bullshit! Samsung's ads, their marketing, their HW and SW designs are so similar to what Apple has done that you can't say it's just a coincidence. They took from Apple and took heavily. Whether it's illegal or not is irrelevant but they took from Apple. On top of that, where would Samsung be today without Apple changing up the smartphone market? Still copying the Blackberry, Nokia and Moto, I presume.
3) Apple is using Samsung right now and Samsung has the best ARM foundries for the quality and yield they need. These are production facilities only. They do not design anything for Apple. They aren't Apple's only chip manufacturer. Apple relies more on Foxconn as a sole production plant than anything to do with Samsung but I don't see you claiming Foxconn should get credit for Apple's success. Bullshit!
There isn't any real penalty for stealing or copying from another company. Perfect examply is Google was fined 7 million for stealing information. If you and I did that we would be in jail for 30 years. A 7 million dollar fine for Google is a joke.
At some point I start to wonder when all this stops becoming news. Most consumers don't know about the Samsung vs Apple situation and most will never care. All your points are valid but if feels like the time has past for anyone to really do anything about it legal or illegal. Both companies are simply too big to do any real damage to each other. Each one will win some and lose some in court.
These days all current smartphones tend to look alike to most consumers. If they can get on twitter, facebook, text and play games not sure anyone cares.
With all that being said Apple appears to be defensive and Samsung appears to be winning the ad battle at least in recent polls. It will be interesting to see how this all looks five years from now.
And as for copying if I recall correctly Jobs himself said "good artists copy, great artists steal. We have always been shameless about stealing great ideas".
And didn't Google say, "Don't be Evil"?
How many times have they been caught breaking the law?
Comments
Can someone please take a stab at which 9 accounts he is talking about. I tried to think of some but I'm not very familiar with Android, and came up quite a few short of 9.
Perhaps he means that not all the content is on Google Play so you need to sign up for some other obscure third party app stores as well.
I don't know how else to explain it.
Troubling...
I didn't say Apple didn't design the Ax processors. But Eric claims that Apple designs their own custom processor yet almighty samsung can't. Samsung also makes its own custom Exynos processor just like apple makes Ax. Both Apple and samsung uses ARM reference to build their processors. And samsung design's and manufactures the Exynos where Apple designs the AX, but needs samsung's help to manufacture it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60
I guess it's Samsung's (and HTC's) way of distancing themselves from Google, log in on some Samsung phones and you get 48GB extra free for two years, HTC it's 23GB extra.
Samsung phone's also come with Navigon in some countries, although why they need an alternative to the oh so perfect Google Maps is beyond me.
Then there's Picassa and Google's constant demands to join Google +
If you don't want the free storage, you don't have to sign up. Note that in iOS you get NOTHING for free (I am paying $100 a year for iCloud storage, which is more expensive than dropbox and google drive (both of which I have), and worse than either one. For office docs SkyDrive is way better (and you get plenty of storage for free with Office 365).
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse
There's no such thing as an "Android Kindle".
Just like there is no such thing as an iOS iPhone. Give me a f***ing break.
I never claimed Apple didn't design the Ax processor. Just like apple, Samsung also designs its own Exynos processor and they both use ARM architecture. The difference is Apple is dependent on Samsung to manufacture their chip while Samsung doesn't need Apple for anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv
If you don't want the free storage, you don't have to sign up. Note that in iOS you get NOTHING for free (I am paying $100 a year for iCloud storage, which is more expensive than dropbox and google drive (both of which I have), and worse than either one. For office docs SkyDrive is way better (and you get plenty of storage for free with Office 365).
Personally I like Back to My Mac. That way I have complete control over my files. I back them up as I see fit, log in from anywhere and work on the original file without any proprietary collaboration or sharing scenarios, etc. Perhaps it is not as full featured, but it supports any file type and helps with versioning. Storage is so ridiculously inexpensive now days, I don't see the advantage of using a third party cloud that may have downtime or privacy issues. That said, I have my own private file sharing application which I wrote and run from our data center.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone
Personally I like Back to My Mac. That way I have complete control over my files. I back them up as I see fit, log in from anywhere and work on the original file without any proprietary collaboration or sharing scenarios, etc. Perhaps it is not as full featured, but it supports any file type and helps with versioning. Storage is so ridiculously inexpensive now days, I don't see the advantage of using a third party cloud that may have downtime or privacy issues. That said I have my own private file sharing application which I wrote and run from our data center.
Through the magic of rsync
1) Bullshit! You brought Samsung into the conversation to discredit Apple's achievement.
2) Bullshit! Samsung's ads, their marketing, their HW and SW designs are so similar to what Apple has done that you can't say it's just a coincidence. They took from Apple and took heavily. Whether it's illegal or not is irrelevant but they took from Apple. On top of that, where would Samsung be today without Apple changing up the smartphone market? Still copying the Blackberry, Nokia and Moto, I presume.
3) Apple is using Samsung right now and Samsung has the best ARM foundries for the quality and yield they need. These are production facilities only. They do not design anything for Apple. They aren't Apple's only chip manufacturer. Apple relies more on Foxconn as a sole production plant than anything to do with Samsung but I don't see you claiming Foxconn should get credit for Apple's success. Bullshit!
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv
Through the magic of rsync
Sure but with Back to My Mac I can use applications without having another copy on my MBP. I can open and save any of the proprietary files like Maya, and CS documents without having to buy another license.
I can't imagine what in my comment you don't understand so I'll restate it using simpler words to help you out.
Android can be forked. That means anyone — even you — can take Android and then make it your own OS. The Kindle Fire uses a forked version of Android. It's based on Android just like Android is Linux-based and iOS is Darwin-based off of BSD, hence my comment that you might as well call it an Amazon Linux tablet (and while you're at it call the iPhone an BSD smartphone) as both sound as equally foolish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone
Sure but with Back to My Mac I can use applications without having another copy on my MBP. I can open and save any of the proprietary files like Maya, and CS documents without having to buy another license.
Granted, that is very fine functionality.
Apple designs the A6 and A6X (largely hand laid out, BTW). Apple has a license to produce ARM compatible chips. This is why the A6 isn't an A9 or A15 - it's a custom chip with elements of each. Qualcomm also does this.
Samsung doesn't. Their ARM chips are ARM reference designs. Samsung makes A9's, A15's and that's it. They don't make hybrid chips the way Apple and Qualcomm do. This puts Apple and Qualcomm ahead of Samsung who just copy existing designs. Apple is innovating by creating new versions of ARM processors that didn't exist before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
I can't imagine what in my comment you don't understand so I'll restate it using simpler words to help you out.
Android can be forked. That means anyone — even you — can take Android and then make it your own OS. The Kindle Fire uses a forked version of Android. It's based on Android just like Android is Linux-based and iOS is Darwin-based off of BSD, hence my comment that you might as well call it an Amazon Linux tablet (and while you're at it call the iPhone an BSD smartphone) as both sound as equally foolish.
Amazingly, I understood what you were saying, but could not believe that someone of your calibre could say something so patently idiotic. Amazon's android is (in essence) a skin on top of standard Android, and about two lines of configuration can, in fact, make it a fully functional android device. Amazon has some of their own functionality on the kindle, but the Amazon app store is a subset of the standard android store (can be made the whole store by changing the above-mentioned two lines). The UI not having with consuming amazon content is identical to any other android phone/tablet, and has very little to do with a garden-variety Red Hat server or a Ubuntu desktop (though it is true that you can ssh into a Kindle if you are really so inclined, and you can't into an iPhone.
Further, for a Kindle to be useful as a Kindle you HAVE to have an amazon account. That however, is all you need if all you want is a kindle, though if you want a general purpose tablet, a Google account comes in handy.
Soli, believe what you want. Whatever makes you sleep better. I brought it up just to point out that just like Apple, Samsung also designs its own custom processors. And as for copying if I recall correctly Jobs himself said "good artists copy, great artists steal. We have always been shameless about stealing great ideas".
Good point but we can say Samsung designs their own ASIC, just not their own ARM chips, as far as I've seen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by igriv
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone
Sure but with Back to My Mac I can use applications without having another copy on my MBP. I can open and save any of the proprietary files like Maya, and CS documents without having to buy another license.
Granted, that is very fine functionality.
Furthermore I have very strict rules about which IPs can access our datacenter network and using Back to my Mac I have a two tiered security layer protection, the first being my firewall rules which allow my office workstation and secondly Apple's iCloud shared device security on top of that. Without Back to My Mac I would not be able to access my datacenter files when on the road as the firewall rules would prevent it. With Back to My Mac it just works.
As EricTheHalfBee points points out there is no evidence of Samsung designing their own processors, only their own ASIC. Making an SoC on an ARM chips is very different from taking an ARM reference design and building around it.
A fork is a fork. For example, Apple's A4 used ARM Cortex-A8. The A4 was their design but the Cortex-A8 came directly from ARM. Their later chips were considerably more custom to the point they can't even use Cortex-A9 and Cortex-A15 brands because they don't use them even those a great deal of their ARM components will be similar, if not the same, and it's still ARMv7 across the board.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
1) Bullshit! You brought Samsung into the conversation to discredit Apple's achievement.
2) Bullshit! Samsung's ads, their marketing, their HW and SW designs are so similar to what Apple has done that you can't say it's just a coincidence. They took from Apple and took heavily. Whether it's illegal or not is irrelevant but they took from Apple. On top of that, where would Samsung be today without Apple changing up the smartphone market? Still copying the Blackberry, Nokia and Moto, I presume.
3) Apple is using Samsung right now and Samsung has the best ARM foundries for the quality and yield they need. These are production facilities only. They do not design anything for Apple. They aren't Apple's only chip manufacturer. Apple relies more on Foxconn as a sole production plant than anything to do with Samsung but I don't see you claiming Foxconn should get credit for Apple's success. Bullshit!
There isn't any real penalty for stealing or copying from another company. Perfect examply is Google was fined 7 million for stealing information. If you and I did that we would be in jail for 30 years. A 7 million dollar fine for Google is a joke.
At some point I start to wonder when all this stops becoming news. Most consumers don't know about the Samsung vs Apple situation and most will never care. All your points are valid but if feels like the time has past for anyone to really do anything about it legal or illegal. Both companies are simply too big to do any real damage to each other. Each one will win some and lose some in court.
These days all current smartphones tend to look alike to most consumers. If they can get on twitter, facebook, text and play games not sure anyone cares.
With all that being said Apple appears to be defensive and Samsung appears to be winning the ad battle at least in recent polls. It will be interesting to see how this all looks five years from now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mars123
And as for copying if I recall correctly Jobs himself said "good artists copy, great artists steal. We have always been shameless about stealing great ideas".
And didn't Google say, "Don't be Evil"?
How many times have they been caught breaking the law?