Why does he need a link? Macs were updated once every six months for roughly a decade. How'd you forget that? Even I remember it, and that's ludicrous.
That's also because the growth of new tech and decline in pricing was moving fast. Now it's not. It's reaching a plateau. So it's logical that things will slow down until someone comes up with something hot dog amazing to put in new machines.
That's also because the growth of new tech and decline in pricing was moving fast. Now it's not. It's reaching a plateau. So it's logical that things will slow down until someone comes up with something hot dog amazing to put in new machines.
Right; exactly. Chips don't come out nearly as fast anymore.
Originally Posted by Barrett Falter
This is because they haven't offered anything new or noteworthy in the last half year. …iOS is stale looking, and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple. …their terrible software engineers and small batteries…
We're waiting for the refresh. We plan to buy four 9.7 iPad 5 and two or three next gen iPhones. Tracking quarterly sales of Apple products is a fool's game.
I'm sorry but my iPhone 5 battery life is garbage for the last 2 months
And you didn't see what it takes to get it fixed? Batteries do go bad, and I think it might be covered under warranty.
iOS is stale looking
There are treatments for ADHD.
and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple.
The indications are just rumors, a lot of them pulled out of people's asses and passed off as a rumor. There's no sure way to know what's actually in iOS 7 until it's announced.
Not for you, but you aren't the universal mind. Lots of folks disagree with you and did and will upgrade. Particularly when we have no idea what the iPad 5 and Mini 2 will look like.
I agree with you regarding the iPad 5 but I highly doubt the iPad mini 2 will get a redesign. Best case scenario, the iPad mini 2 gets the 2048x1536 retina screen. Worst case scenario, it gets a performance bump but I'm willing to bet money the hardware design will look the same.
And you didn't see what it takes to get it fixed? Batteries do go bad, and I think it might be covered under warranty.
There are treatments for ADHD.
The indications are just rumors, a lot of them pulled out of people's asses and passed off as a rumor. There's no sure way to know what's actually in iOS 7 until it's announced.
Can you check this miscreant's address? He sure sounds like he's following the hired-troll playbook.
The difference is that cheap people are getting around to buying tablets. And people who aren't cheap already bought theirs.
Any time you saturate a market, sales will begin to decline until you hit a replacement cycle. But I don't think we're there yet, and I don't expect big declines in Apple's sales, especially if they release new models, which will garner new interest.
Back in the "computer days", the analysts always used to argue that Apple should either license the OS or find a way to produce cheap computers like Dell and the other clone makers. Look where Dell and those clone makers are today. Apple said they didn't want to play in the low-end of the market and they were proven correct. While Apple has become much more of a mass-market company since then, they don't want to play at the low end of the Pad (or Phone) market either. You can drive out a lot of units that way, but they're all at no margin and if the models are crappy, which they'd probably need to be, it destroys your branding and product line reputation. And the analysts also complain when Apple's mighty margins dip a bit, but they seem to want it both ways.
I think a lighter iPad is going to sell a lot of units and I think there's going to be a lot of continued demand for the mini. There are still tons of people who haven't completed the "I guess I don't need a computer anymore because for the type of things I do, I can do it on a Pad" purchasing rationale. Furthermore, if price were the primary consideration, Amazon's Kindle and Barnes and Noble's Nook would have already killed Apple and B&N is rumored to be backing out of the Nook business.
I think with the maturation of the Pad business, additional sales are going to come from people buying additional iPads for more members of the family....kids, etc.
If Apple really wants to knock one out of the park, they would release a new iOS that's more than a slight evolutionary improvement. An iOS with a vastly improved look and feel, especially if it appeared to the average person to be incredibly superior to Android, would drive a lot of Apple hardware sales, IMO. One of the things that both Android and Microsoft have accomplished is that they have taken away Apple's monopoly on decent UI design from a look and feel standpoint, even in such simple terms as the use of fonts and color, taking away much of the obvious factors of Apple's uniqueness.
Frankly, I don't trust any analyst's opinions of Apple, even in the cases where I might agree. If they're projecting bad news, I don't know if they're actually trying to short the stock or not. Even if they are optimistic, they might just be trying to inflate the stock price.
And you didn't see what it takes to get it fixed? Batteries do go bad, and I think it might be covered under warranty.
There are treatments for ADHD.
The indications are just rumors, a lot of them pulled out of people's asses and passed off as a rumor. There's no sure way to know what's actually in iOS 7 until it's announced.
It's clear that everything "battery" is Apples fault -- funny when "I" run APPS like Instagram or ANY map APP - or location services -- They DRAIN the battery -- that's true of ANY device -- Apples or not -- ANY APP that pushes the processor will drain your unit. Get a clue.
Of course the sales of Android tablets is increasing - people are replacing their cheap tablets when the battery dies or they can no longer run apps on their outdated systems. On the other hand my iPad 2 is still performing like the day it was bought.
This is because they haven't offered anything new or noteworthy in the last half year. I'm sorry but my iPhone 5 battery life is garbage for the last 2 months, iOS is stale looking, and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple. The only upside Apple has is their use of metals. But that aside I would like a device I can use through the day and not have to be tethered to a power cord. Apple has had long enough to learn this lesson and despite this, their terrible software engineers and small batteries are making many of my family members anxious to dump iPhone and iOS.
So do it. Since you find absolutely nothing else of value from Apple except "use of metals."
People here is happy to admit the computer market is saturated, as a justification for Apple investing more on iToys than on the Mac. However, they'll never thought the toy market is soon to become saturated. Easy money comes easy, but ends easy as well. Get used to it, such toy saturation will be a reality soon. However, people will continue to need new computers. Once the toy market becomes saturated, the computer market will show its natural higher demand than the toy market.
I don't mind. These forums are magnets for posts like that. Cursing Apple (for "garbage" battery life, "stale" iOS, and "terrible" engineers) when there are alternatives is like blaming your spouse for your unhappiness when there are more compatible mates out there. If you're unhappy, get a different phone and be happy.
IPad shipments aren't perpetually up quarter over quarter? Apple is doomed.
(Note from three years ago: "what's an iPad?")
It's year over year...
and since the iPhone is defining success for apple, the new 'flagship' product iPad, not doing a YoY growth is sky is falling fearfulness of doomage.
Note from 3 years ago: "iPod Sales fall again"
The issue is that an iPhone is probably the most useful (size, function, power) device ever made, and also lives in the most hostile environment (in the pocket of people who move, work outdoors, go to the toilet, use over the kitchen sink, etc). It has both power growth curve on Moore's Law, and obsolescence issues, that drive repurchase. 1.5 years is probably the useful life span of an iPhone on average.
An iPad, is a 3 year cycle on average, since it is: not in the pocket, used two handedle, doesn't have a huge mobility requirement (iphones below), doesn't have a huge performance requirement (laptops above). So, they fill a longer term niche. And as opposed to replacing 'dumb/feature' phones that were quite limiting, Laptops are quite capable, and will take a longer time for people to 'retire/replace those'.
And as for market share, I don't think apple even worries about that.
Cursing Apple (for "garbage" battery life, "stale" iOS, and "terrible" engineers) when there are alternatives is like blaming your spouse for your unhappiness when there are more compatible mates out there.
"My wife left me for blaming my problems on others. Better go blame Apple for that!"
People here is happy to admit the computer market is saturated, as a justification for Apple investing more on iToys than on the Mac. However, they'll never thought the toy market is soon to become saturated. Easy money comes easy, but ends easy as well. Get used to it, such toy saturation will be a reality soon. However, people will continue to need new computers. Once the toy market becomes saturated, the computer market will show its natural higher demand than the toy market.
This is because they haven't offered anything new or noteworthy in the last half year. I'm sorry but my iPhone 5 battery life is garbage for the last 2 months, iOS is stale looking, and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple. The only upside Apple has is their use of metals. But that aside I would like a device I can use through the day and not have to be tethered to a power cord. Apple has had long enough to learn this lesson and despite this, their terrible software engineers and small batteries are making many of my family members anxious to dump iPhone and iOS.
You have to always be on your A game these days because of the options and the price premium Apple charged used to indicate a premium product. Today it just ensures their profit margins are safe. That's just not cutting it anymore for many.
Another Samsung/Google mole arrives at AI forums. Joy.
The same stale talking points (speaking of stale) that every other OBVIOUS newcomer brings to the debate...
"Nothing new from Apple in <xx> months…"
"iOS looking stale…"
"<insert any random, disparaging, typically nonsense remark about iPhone performance…"
"Terrible software engineering, small batteries…"
"My Friends/My Family/My Co-Workers/Everyone I know (choose one or more) are dumping/have dumped/want to dump their iPhone and/or iOS…"
"Apple is failing us, and therefore doomed (paraphrased in a hundred clever ways)…"
Keep trying with that "self fulfilling prophecy" thing, Sammy, it may eventually wear off… even broken clocks are right once or twice a day.
People here is happy to admit the computer market is saturated, as a justification for Apple investing more on iToys than on the Mac. However, they'll never thought the toy market is soon to become saturated. Easy money comes easy, but ends easy as well. Get used to it, such toy saturation will be a reality soon. However, people will continue to need new computers. Once the toy market becomes saturated, the computer market will show its natural higher demand than the toy market.
I think you're trolling hard, but in the unlikely event you aren't:
I don't think you understand. Consumers don't need laptops as much when they have smart phones and tablets. This group is made up of people that mostly chat, message, take a few amateur photos, videos, play media, and use social media. The consumer market for computers is shrinking as it is. I know a few families that don't even have a computer in the home, they're on smart phones, so it's fair to say that Apple and Android are the culprits in shaking the PC hegemony.
Businesses will need laptops, and a few desktops, no question about that, but as devs figure out how to make more complicated software touch-optimized, then the old style personal computer will continue to decline, even accelerate.
Another issue is that computers have gotten powerful enough and compelling need for more power has diminished, so it's easier to keep using a 5+ year old computer running. My personal laptop is from 2007. While a newer computer would be nicer, it works, it's a known quantity and I'd rather use the money for something else.
It is not really a fair YOY quarter comparision as last years quarter had a new iPad released in it while this years quarter has no new iPads.
Yes, "analysts" are, in general, pretty lazy, especially when it comes to intelligent thought. I know, I know, it's a lot of work to actually use your mind and reason things out, that's why "analysts" favor convenient little metrics like comparing the same quarters year to year and "shipments", because those are "clean" little yardsticks that don't actually require any, you know, analysis, to trot out.
And, while quarterly year-over-year comparisons aren't necessarily the complete garbage "analysis" that sequential quarter-to-quarter comparisons are, they suffer from exactly the same problem of having, at best, questionable validity. While it's pretty obvious to most people (except those who want to make a point without regard to its validity) that, for example, comparing (calendar) Q4 to Q1 is nonsense because it completely ignores the annual hysteria known as "Christmas Shopping" in Q4, which is followed by "Paying the Bills" in Q1, what may not be so immediately obvious is that a year-over-year comparison of quarters may suffer from exactly the same problems. If the quarters aren't analogous, meaning if the conditions prevailing in each quarter you are comparing aren't the same, the comparison may not be valid. And, that's essentially what this boils down to, an argument by analogy, without establishing, or even considering the strength of the analogy.
So, without exploring the differences, even if they have the numbers correct, this type of comparison isn't meaningful. And, as you rightly point out, in this case they are comparing a quarter with a product release to a quarter without one. While this might be relevant if you were taking an extremely short term outlook, it doesn't say anything about the overall health and long term outlook of the company. In fact, pretty much any analysis that's strictly based on a comparison of arbitrary periods, regardless of how "standard" it may be, is essentially worthless, unless it actually includes a discussion of all the factors that may be relevant.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Why does he need a link? Macs were updated once every six months for roughly a decade. How'd you forget that? Even I remember it, and that's ludicrous.
That's also because the growth of new tech and decline in pricing was moving fast. Now it's not. It's reaching a plateau. So it's logical that things will slow down until someone comes up with something hot dog amazing to put in new machines.
Originally Posted by charlituna
That's also because the growth of new tech and decline in pricing was moving fast. Now it's not. It's reaching a plateau. So it's logical that things will slow down until someone comes up with something hot dog amazing to put in new machines.
Right; exactly. Chips don't come out nearly as fast anymore.
Originally Posted by Barrett Falter
This is because they haven't offered anything new or noteworthy in the last half year. …iOS is stale looking, and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple. …their terrible software engineers and small batteries…
Shut up and go away, you useless idiot.
And you didn't see what it takes to get it fixed? Batteries do go bad, and I think it might be covered under warranty.
There are treatments for ADHD.
The indications are just rumors, a lot of them pulled out of people's asses and passed off as a rumor. There's no sure way to know what's actually in iOS 7 until it's announced.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
Not for you, but you aren't the universal mind. Lots of folks disagree with you and did and will upgrade. Particularly when we have no idea what the iPad 5 and Mini 2 will look like.
I agree with you regarding the iPad 5 but I highly doubt the iPad mini 2 will get a redesign. Best case scenario, the iPad mini 2 gets the 2048x1536 retina screen. Worst case scenario, it gets a performance bump but I'm willing to bet money the hardware design will look the same.
Can you check this miscreant's address? He sure sounds like he's following the hired-troll playbook.
Quote:
Originally Posted by konqerror
The difference is that cheap people are getting around to buying tablets. And people who aren't cheap already bought theirs.
Any time you saturate a market, sales will begin to decline until you hit a replacement cycle. But I don't think we're there yet, and I don't expect big declines in Apple's sales, especially if they release new models, which will garner new interest.
Back in the "computer days", the analysts always used to argue that Apple should either license the OS or find a way to produce cheap computers like Dell and the other clone makers. Look where Dell and those clone makers are today. Apple said they didn't want to play in the low-end of the market and they were proven correct. While Apple has become much more of a mass-market company since then, they don't want to play at the low end of the Pad (or Phone) market either. You can drive out a lot of units that way, but they're all at no margin and if the models are crappy, which they'd probably need to be, it destroys your branding and product line reputation. And the analysts also complain when Apple's mighty margins dip a bit, but they seem to want it both ways.
I think a lighter iPad is going to sell a lot of units and I think there's going to be a lot of continued demand for the mini. There are still tons of people who haven't completed the "I guess I don't need a computer anymore because for the type of things I do, I can do it on a Pad" purchasing rationale. Furthermore, if price were the primary consideration, Amazon's Kindle and Barnes and Noble's Nook would have already killed Apple and B&N is rumored to be backing out of the Nook business.
I think with the maturation of the Pad business, additional sales are going to come from people buying additional iPads for more members of the family....kids, etc.
If Apple really wants to knock one out of the park, they would release a new iOS that's more than a slight evolutionary improvement. An iOS with a vastly improved look and feel, especially if it appeared to the average person to be incredibly superior to Android, would drive a lot of Apple hardware sales, IMO. One of the things that both Android and Microsoft have accomplished is that they have taken away Apple's monopoly on decent UI design from a look and feel standpoint, even in such simple terms as the use of fonts and color, taking away much of the obvious factors of Apple's uniqueness.
Frankly, I don't trust any analyst's opinions of Apple, even in the cases where I might agree. If they're projecting bad news, I don't know if they're actually trying to short the stock or not. Even if they are optimistic, they might just be trying to inflate the stock price.
It's clear that everything "battery" is Apples fault -- funny when "I" run APPS like Instagram or ANY map APP - or location services -- They DRAIN the battery -- that's true of ANY device -- Apples or not -- ANY APP that pushes the processor will drain your unit. Get a clue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crosslad
Of course the sales of Android tablets is increasing - people are replacing their cheap tablets when the battery dies or they can no longer run apps on their outdated systems. On the other hand my iPad 2 is still performing like the day it was bought.
Mine too. The battery life is amazing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrett Falter
This is because they haven't offered anything new or noteworthy in the last half year. I'm sorry but my iPhone 5 battery life is garbage for the last 2 months, iOS is stale looking, and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple. The only upside Apple has is their use of metals. But that aside I would like a device I can use through the day and not have to be tethered to a power cord. Apple has had long enough to learn this lesson and despite this, their terrible software engineers and small batteries are making many of my family members anxious to dump iPhone and iOS.
So do it. Since you find absolutely nothing else of value from Apple except "use of metals."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Shut up and go away, you useless idiot.
I don't mind. These forums are magnets for posts like that. Cursing Apple (for "garbage" battery life, "stale" iOS, and "terrible" engineers) when there are alternatives is like blaming your spouse for your unhappiness when there are more compatible mates out there. If you're unhappy, get a different phone and be happy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber
IPad shipments aren't perpetually up quarter over quarter? Apple is doomed.
(Note from three years ago: "what's an iPad?")
It's year over year...
and since the iPhone is defining success for apple, the new 'flagship' product iPad, not doing a YoY growth is sky is falling fearfulness of doomage.
Note from 3 years ago: "iPod Sales fall again"
The issue is that an iPhone is probably the most useful (size, function, power) device ever made, and also lives in the most hostile environment (in the pocket of people who move, work outdoors, go to the toilet, use over the kitchen sink, etc). It has both power growth curve on Moore's Law, and obsolescence issues, that drive repurchase. 1.5 years is probably the useful life span of an iPhone on average.
An iPad, is a 3 year cycle on average, since it is: not in the pocket, used two handedle, doesn't have a huge mobility requirement (iphones below), doesn't have a huge performance requirement (laptops above). So, they fill a longer term niche. And as opposed to replacing 'dumb/feature' phones that were quite limiting, Laptops are quite capable, and will take a longer time for people to 'retire/replace those'.
And as for market share, I don't think apple even worries about that.
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
Cursing Apple (for "garbage" battery life, "stale" iOS, and "terrible" engineers) when there are alternatives is like blaming your spouse for your unhappiness when there are more compatible mates out there.
"My wife left me for blaming my problems on others. Better go blame Apple for that!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecs
People here is happy to admit the computer market is saturated, as a justification for Apple investing more on iToys than on the Mac. However, they'll never thought the toy market is soon to become saturated. Easy money comes easy, but ends easy as well. Get used to it, such toy saturation will be a reality soon. However, people will continue to need new computers. Once the toy market becomes saturated, the computer market will show its natural higher demand than the toy market.
[Citation needed]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrett Falter
This is because they haven't offered anything new or noteworthy in the last half year. I'm sorry but my iPhone 5 battery life is garbage for the last 2 months, iOS is stale looking, and the indications of what iOS 7 hold for end users makes it sound like Android is going to leverage this change to one up apple. The only upside Apple has is their use of metals. But that aside I would like a device I can use through the day and not have to be tethered to a power cord. Apple has had long enough to learn this lesson and despite this, their terrible software engineers and small batteries are making many of my family members anxious to dump iPhone and iOS.
You have to always be on your A game these days because of the options and the price premium Apple charged used to indicate a premium product. Today it just ensures their profit margins are safe. That's just not cutting it anymore for many.
Another Samsung/Google mole arrives at AI forums. Joy.
The same stale talking points (speaking of stale) that every other OBVIOUS newcomer brings to the debate...
"Nothing new from Apple in <xx> months…"
"iOS looking stale…"
"<insert any random, disparaging, typically nonsense remark about iPhone performance…"
"Terrible software engineering, small batteries…"
"My Friends/My Family/My Co-Workers/Everyone I know (choose one or more) are dumping/have dumped/want to dump their iPhone and/or iOS…"
"Apple is failing us, and therefore doomed (paraphrased in a hundred clever ways)…"
Keep trying with that "self fulfilling prophecy" thing, Sammy, it may eventually wear off… even broken clocks are right once or twice a day.
I think you're trolling hard, but in the unlikely event you aren't:
I don't think you understand. Consumers don't need laptops as much when they have smart phones and tablets. This group is made up of people that mostly chat, message, take a few amateur photos, videos, play media, and use social media. The consumer market for computers is shrinking as it is. I know a few families that don't even have a computer in the home, they're on smart phones, so it's fair to say that Apple and Android are the culprits in shaking the PC hegemony.
Businesses will need laptops, and a few desktops, no question about that, but as devs figure out how to make more complicated software touch-optimized, then the old style personal computer will continue to decline, even accelerate.
Another issue is that computers have gotten powerful enough and compelling need for more power has diminished, so it's easier to keep using a 5+ year old computer running. My personal laptop is from 2007. While a newer computer would be nicer, it works, it's a known quantity and I'd rather use the money for something else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacOSXAddict
It is not really a fair YOY quarter comparision as last years quarter had a new iPad released in it while this years quarter has no new iPads.
Yes, "analysts" are, in general, pretty lazy, especially when it comes to intelligent thought. I know, I know, it's a lot of work to actually use your mind and reason things out, that's why "analysts" favor convenient little metrics like comparing the same quarters year to year and "shipments", because those are "clean" little yardsticks that don't actually require any, you know, analysis, to trot out.
And, while quarterly year-over-year comparisons aren't necessarily the complete garbage "analysis" that sequential quarter-to-quarter comparisons are, they suffer from exactly the same problem of having, at best, questionable validity. While it's pretty obvious to most people (except those who want to make a point without regard to its validity) that, for example, comparing (calendar) Q4 to Q1 is nonsense because it completely ignores the annual hysteria known as "Christmas Shopping" in Q4, which is followed by "Paying the Bills" in Q1, what may not be so immediately obvious is that a year-over-year comparison of quarters may suffer from exactly the same problems. If the quarters aren't analogous, meaning if the conditions prevailing in each quarter you are comparing aren't the same, the comparison may not be valid. And, that's essentially what this boils down to, an argument by analogy, without establishing, or even considering the strength of the analogy.
So, without exploring the differences, even if they have the numbers correct, this type of comparison isn't meaningful. And, as you rightly point out, in this case they are comparing a quarter with a product release to a quarter without one. While this might be relevant if you were taking an extremely short term outlook, it doesn't say anything about the overall health and long term outlook of the company. In fact, pretty much any analysis that's strictly based on a comparison of arbitrary periods, regardless of how "standard" it may be, is essentially worthless, unless it actually includes a discussion of all the factors that may be relevant.
deleted
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lerxt
Asia is now Samsung territory, Apple product use has significantly declined. That has got to have a lot to do with it.
In your wet dreams.