Where was the real money back in 2007? Who's to say that Apple wouldn't have made their own maps if Google had remained loyal to them. You're making a lot of assumptions that Google didn't have the luxury to make.
Google most definitely had the luxury because they held the upper hand with mapping SW. Unfortunately they abused their position which forced Apple to buy, build and release their own solution much faster than they otherwise would have.
Maybe Apple would have made and released their own solution, but maybe not. The only thing we know for sure is they didn't allow Apple to have access to modern mapping tech without giving over an excessive amount of user data.
Self preservation was why Google made Android. They didn't target anyone. They were simply insuring that they weren't anyone's target.
It's easy to say that Google could've had a fruitful partnership with Apple some 7 years later, what if Apple wasn't successful in the mobile realm? What if Apple decided it wanted the revenue Google was making off its users? There were just too many 'ifs' for Google to ignore.
Et tu, Brute?
Maybe this very short video clip of Gundotra declaring war on Apple publicly to hoots and catcalls will jog your memory:
Apple is still the underdog until the enemies of truth and user experience are shamed and humbled into impotence.
More like Apple wanted something without selling its soul to the devil, i.e., Google's ad-whoring-with-its-users machine. Who says they might not have offered to pay money for the function instead?
Obviously Google thought a differentiating feature wasn't worth selling. Everybody protects their own interests even from friends.
I liked the Captain ... but Mr Greenjeans was my favorite ...
WOT:
I was acting as executor on my parent's estate -- for 50+ years, they had lived in Pasadena about 3 blocks away from where the Rose Parade ends and the Floats were parked for several days.
On New Year's day, my parents always had a full house, entertaining ... People would come to the house in the morning and watch the start of the parade [about 5 miles away] on TV -- later, when the Parade progressed, they'd walk down and watch it again, live.
I worked on the rose Parade floats and even drove a float one year. After the Parade, I would go to the parents house with a truckload of leftover flowers -- lots of exotics, ginger, vanda orchids ... Every vessel that could hold water: sink, bathtub, laundry tub, bowls, vases, kiddy inflatable pool -- was filled with flowers ... Many special blooms, like long-stem roses, had been placed in individual vials/test tubes containing water ... Needless to say. the ladies all loved it and each left with her own float decorating flower arrangement kit ... Good Times!
As a tribute to my parents, and to help family select personal mementos and estate items, I threw a Final 2003 Rose Parade Party. Family from all over attended -- with kids from 4 - 70 years old.
Later, everyone walked the 2 blocks to see the parade pass by ...
To the children's delight, Mr. Rodgers was the Grand Marshal of the Parade -- and received cheers & applause from all ...
Sadly, Mr. Rodgers died a month later ...
Interesting. Deep background on hidden Pasadena. What neighborhood might that have been? I did manage to walk around the floats once after the parade, but I don't remember where in town that was.
That sounds like it supports my point especially in the first 10 seconds. He's exaggerating of course, which even SJ did that in his speeches.
No, your twist doesn't work.
"For Apple to win, Microsoft doesn't have to lose." Extending, as if Jobs were Gundotra:
"All we have to do at Apple is copy what Microsoft has done, but make it "open," in other words, let anybody develop within or on top of it, include it for free in any device they want, but in case you're wondering why we'd give our copy work away for free, we are doing it so the world isn't in thrall to one overlord. Oh, and we're going to sell ads to pay the bills so we can have an advantage over Microsoft, who want to be paid for selling their work."
Self-defense on the part of Google? Maybe, but also intending harm to Apple through copying, and making the world worse by giving away a tin-plated OS.
Haha ... OMG that is funny. I had to wait a while to hear one too! There is the perfect place for GG to write his speeches and let us Apple folks chat about what we love without annoyances. He could be a folk here there.
Help! He's gone, and handed the shift over to Dasaman69.
"For Apple to win, Microsoft doesn't have to lose." Extending, as if Jobs were Gundotra:
"All we have to do at Apple is copy what Microsoft has done, but make it "open," in other words, let anybody develop within or on top of it, include it for free in any device they want, but in case you're wondering why we'd give our copy work away for free, we are doing it so the world isn't in thrall to one overlord. Oh, and we're going to sell ads to pay the bills so we can have an advantage over Microsoft, who want to be paid for selling their work."
Self-defense on the part of Google? Maybe, but also intending harm to Apple through copying, and making the world worse by giving away a tin-plated OS.
I doubt that they intended harm just like Apple never intended harm to the companies that are now gone because of them. There's no winning in business, but there's certainly losing, and one will eventually lose if they count on another company to make them money. Now how Google went about it is a different discussion.
I liked the Captain ... but Mr Greenjeans was my favorite ...
WOT:
I was acting as executor on my parent's estate -- for 50+ years, they had lived in Pasadena about 3 blocks away from where the Rose Parade ends and the Floats were parked for several days.
On New Year's day, my parents always had a full house, entertaining ... People would come to the house in the morning and watch the start of the parade [about 5 miles away] on TV -- later, when the Parade progressed, they'd walk down and watch it again, live.
I worked on the rose Parade floats and even drove a float one year. After the Parade, I would go to the parents house with a truckload of leftover flowers -- lots of exotics, ginger, vanda orchids ... Every vessel that could hold water: sink, bathtub, laundry tub, bowls, vases, kiddy inflatable pool -- was filled with flowers ... Many special blooms, like long-stem roses, had been placed in individual vials/test tubes containing water ... Needless to say. the ladies all loved it and each left with her own float decorating flower arrangement kit ... Good Times!
As a tribute to my parents, and to help family select personal mementos and estate items, I threw a Final 2003 Rose Parade Party. Family from all over attended -- with kids from 4 - 70 years old.
Later, everyone walked the 2 blocks to see the parade pass by ...
To the children's delight, Mr. Rodgers was the Grand Marshal of the Parade -- and received cheers & applause from all ...
Sadly, Mr. Rodgers died a month later ...
Interesting. Deep background on hidden Pasadena. What neighborhood might that have been? I did manage to walk around the floats once after the parade, but I don't remember where in town that was.
Victory Park -- Intersection of N. Altadena Dr. and Paloma
Help! He's gone, and handed the shift over to Dasaman69.
Don't confuse me with GG. I'm absolutely not a defender of all things Google. I'm simply stating that I understand why Google built their own OS, and we're at least smart enough to see the paradigm shift created by Apple, and adjusted their plans accordingly. They took their fate into their own hands instead of relying on someone else. If it fails then they can only blame themselves.
GoogleGuy is a troll -- and when you quote him in a post, he succeeds -- in spite of those of us have him blocked!
1) It's hard to see how someone is a troll when they no t only write well but also back up their positions. Are we calling those with alternative views trolls now? I would prefer to use that term to define those that purposely try to jack a thread with juvenile and superficial commentary.
2) Purposely making a pejorative out of a username, not matter how slight, is a personal attack. If you disagree with his positions on a subject then attack it. I certainly do, and I know can easily hold your own in a debate so I see no reason for any of use not to use GatorGuy or the abbreviated GG.
Of course, you're right on 2).
On 1), GG writes well and sometimes posts links -- as often as not they do not support his position or unrelated to the topic being discussed. There are lots of ways to jack a thread -- starting in a continuous sub-discussion about unrelated materiel is one form of muddying the waters ... IMO, GG does this as a matter of SOP!
GG usually takes a pro-Google, anti-Apple stance in his posts ... that's why I blocked him -- I am an admitted Apple fan and come to Apple Insider to discuss topic of interest to other Apple fans. As a common courtesy, I do not go Google [fan] sites and try to disrupt their discussions. I expect the same in return from the likes of GG.
I admit, that I sometimes go SOT or WOT -- or add humor to a contentious thread ... But I do try to stay mostly on topic!
On 1), GG writes well and sometimes posts links -- as often as not they do not support his position or unrelated to the topic being discussed. There are lots of ways to jack a thread -- starting in a continuous sub-discussion about unrelated materiel is one form of muddying the waters ... IMO, GG does this as a matter of SOP!
GG usually takes a pro-Google, anti-Apple stance in his posts ... that's why I blocked him -- I am an admitted Apple fan and come to Apple Insider to discuss topic of interest to other Apple fans. As a common courtesy, I do not go Google [fan] sites and try to disrupt their discussions. I expect the same in return from the likes of GG.
I admit, that I sometimes go SOT or WOT -- or add humor to a contentious thread ... But I do try to stay mostly on topic!
For me it comes down to selfishness. If a poster hasn't taught given me anything through my dis/agreements with them then they are pretty much worthless to me in this medium. If [@]Gatorguy[/@] was the only kind of "troll" we had around here I believe this forum would be much better for it.
From the least information to the most I'd say it falls into this pattern:
Learning from others to whom you agree, but who add info that you hadn't otherwise considered.
Learning from others to whom you disagree, by having a new PoV introduced that you previously hadn't considered.
Learning from others to whom you agree, but where one or both use the other each other as a backboard to build ideas off a general premise.
Learning from others to whom you disagree, by researching and formulating a response that refutes their claims.
* I switched taught to given as this more general term would include the gift of laughter through clever and/or funny comments, but outside of that I'm here to learn something new.
GG usually takes a pro-Google, anti-Apple stance in his posts ...
He's definitely pro-Google, but he's not anti-Apple as you, and many here think he is. He provides tons of good information even updating threads if some new pertinent information has come out.
Comments
Google most definitely had the luxury because they held the upper hand with mapping SW. Unfortunately they abused their position which forced Apple to buy, build and release their own solution much faster than they otherwise would have.
Maybe Apple would have made and released their own solution, but maybe not. The only thing we know for sure is they didn't allow Apple to have access to modern mapping tech without giving over an excessive amount of user data.
Et tu, Brute?
Maybe this very short video clip of Gundotra declaring war on Apple publicly to hoots and catcalls will jog your memory:
Apple is still the underdog until the enemies of truth and user experience are shamed and humbled into impotence.
Your supposition is correct.
Obviously Google thought a differentiating feature wasn't worth selling. Everybody protects their own interests even from friends.
That sounds like it supports my point especially in the first 10 seconds. He's exaggerating of course, which even SJ did that in his speeches.
Interesting. Deep background on hidden Pasadena. What neighborhood might that have been? I did manage to walk around the floats once after the parade, but I don't remember where in town that was.
No, your twist doesn't work.
"For Apple to win, Microsoft doesn't have to lose." Extending, as if Jobs were Gundotra:
"All we have to do at Apple is copy what Microsoft has done, but make it "open," in other words, let anybody develop within or on top of it, include it for free in any device they want, but in case you're wondering why we'd give our copy work away for free, we are doing it so the world isn't in thrall to one overlord. Oh, and we're going to sell ads to pay the bills so we can have an advantage over Microsoft, who want to be paid for selling their work."
Self-defense on the part of Google? Maybe, but also intending harm to Apple through copying, and making the world worse by giving away a tin-plated OS.
Help! He's gone, and handed the shift over to Dasaman69.
I doubt that they intended harm just like Apple never intended harm to the companies that are now gone because of them. There's no winning in business, but there's certainly losing, and one will eventually lose if they count on another company to make them money. Now how Google went about it is a different discussion.
Victory Park -- Intersection of N. Altadena Dr. and Paloma
Don't confuse me with GG. I'm absolutely not a defender of all things Google. I'm simply stating that I understand why Google built their own OS, and we're at least smart enough to see the paradigm shift created by Apple, and adjusted their plans accordingly. They took their fate into their own hands instead of relying on someone else. If it fails then they can only blame themselves.
My favourite was Babylon 5 - ok series 5 wasn't up to the same standards of what went before but I still revisit it regularly.
Of course, you're right on 2).
On 1), GG writes well and sometimes posts links -- as often as not they do not support his position or unrelated to the topic being discussed. There are lots of ways to jack a thread -- starting in a continuous sub-discussion about unrelated materiel is one form of muddying the waters ... IMO, GG does this as a matter of SOP!
GG usually takes a pro-Google, anti-Apple stance in his posts ... that's why I blocked him -- I am an admitted Apple fan and come to Apple Insider to discuss topic of interest to other Apple fans. As a common courtesy, I do not go Google [fan] sites and try to disrupt their discussions. I expect the same in return from the likes of GG.
I admit, that I sometimes go SOT or WOT -- or add humor to a contentious thread ... But I do try to stay mostly on topic!
For me it comes down to selfishness. If a poster hasn't
taughtgiven me anything through my dis/agreements with them then they are pretty much worthless to me in this medium. If [@]Gatorguy[/@] was the only kind of "troll" we had around here I believe this forum would be much better for it.From the least information to the most I'd say it falls into this pattern:
* I switched taught to given as this more general term would include the gift of laughter through clever and/or funny comments, but outside of that I'm here to learn something new.
He's definitely pro-Google, but he's not anti-Apple as you, and many here think he is. He provides tons of good information even updating threads if some new pertinent information has come out.