Mac sales continue decline in Q3, Apple drops to 5th place worldwide

2456

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 105
    in a few years the Canadian dollar lost 30% of it's value to the American dollar. On top of that, the price of Apple Laptop increase. I guess many, like me, are stretching a little bit the time they keep their computer,
    hippieapplechicwatto_cobra
  • Reply 22 of 105
    dewmedewme Posts: 1,331member
    I wouldn't draw any special significance from these numbers. My nearly 5-year-old iMac is as speedy, functional, and pleasurable to use as it was the day I bought it. The OSX/macOS releases that Apple has shipped over the past few years have neither placed undue burden on nor diminished the performance or fitness-for-task of my 5-year-old iMac in any way. I'm sure that there are some newer macOS applications out there that would potentially run faster on newer Macs, or subtle new features I'm missing out on, but nothing I throw at any of my current Macs causes them to break a sweat in any way.  The same situation applies to all Macs in my home. They all continue to do absolutely everything I ask of them and the newer macOS releases have not degraded their performance in any way that affects me. Heck, even my old 2011 MacBook Air (i7) is still a great little computer with High Sierra. Some of the things Apple has done with iCloud have actually unburdened storage limitations on older Macs and they are better than ever.

    Pretty much all Mac hardware products released in the past 5 years are excellent platforms for running Apple's latest desktop operating system, High Sierra. Until Apple does something with macOS that results in a discernible negative impact or loss of functionality why would I ever consider purchasing a new Mac? Touch Bar is cool but not a must-have. Desktop computers are a very mature product category and if you buy quality products like Apple's they are going to last a long time. Is this good for Apple's bottom line? Absolutely! It inspires confidence and leads to customer and brand loyalty that follows Apple into its forays into new product categories. 

    Apple under Tim Cook has always played the big-picture long game and not concerned itself with product maturity and cannibalization factors that lesser companies get all bent out of shape worrying about. They are also not artificially sacrificing the value of current product lines by forcing obsolescence through feature creep and bloat. And time and time again, just when the self important analysts are congratulating themselves on predicting the demise of an Apple product line Apple surprises and reinvigorates the product line with something new and unexpected, e.g., iPad Pro, to keep the product line fresh in a significant way. the Mac product line will take some big new leaps at some point, but only when it makes sense to move in a new direction. In the meantime, the current offerings are making a lot of mainstream customers very happy with their Apple product investments. 

    christopher126stevenozStrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 23 of 105
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,426member
    dysamoria said:
    This is not a surprise, since their software is atrophying. I mean, with the way they gutted iWork, what's the use in having a mac if you're just going to put a crippled MS Office installation on it? Apple have de-professionalized every product they have. They're addicted to Wall Street BS and repeat iPhone sales. They have no vision, no leadership that isn't just more tonerhead mindlessness, no sense of useability (slowly killing every bit of usability that drove them up to 2013)... all the compelling excellence that Apple used to be known for has been ditched, replaced with ugly flat, minimalism, bugs that never get fixed, and missing functionality. iPhone was both a critical success for Apple and the lure to follow mindless cart-before-horse business practices that are killing the mac, Mac OS, and every piece of software Apple still has left.
    Not to mention what new Macs in June?????   I've yet to see a new Mac Mini or a better designed replacement for that platform, no new Mac Pro's, the iMac have been a joke for he last couple of years so All they have left is the laptops that haven't innovated one bit in years.   I still wonder why Apple has yet to release a laptop with a built in cellular modem.   I''m also extremely frustrated by Apple support of SSD expansion in any of its Macs including the laptops.   Also no ARM based Mac yet even thought it is pretty obvious such a machine would be a big win for Apple.   

    What Apple has done with the Mac is very similar to how it has destroyed other products due to laziness and a demand for sales beyond what the market will allow.   one example here is the terrible upgrades iPad mini got and as a result accelerated declining sales instead of beefing them up which is what an upgrade should do.   The Mac <Mini is another example, no credible upgrades and no innovation has lead to accelerated declining sales.    It is no surprise that most of Apples sales are going to the laptop line up as that is the only place you can buy a modern machine.

    Something is rotten inside of Apple and frankly it has driven customers away for no good reason.   You really have to ask, how many companies out there survive routinely pissing off customers.    
    mobirdentropysdonjuansunwukongdysamoriajbaustian
  • Reply 24 of 105
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,426member

    Soli said:
    Remember when Acer was rising up through the unit sales ranks with shitty* netbooks?

    * I know, that's redundant.

    dysamoria said:
    This is not a surprise, since their software is atrophying. I mean, with the way they gutted iWork, what's the use in having a mac if you're just going to put a crippled MS Office installation on it? Apple have de-professionalized every product they have. They're addicted to Wall Street BS and repeat iPhone sales. They have no vision, no leadership that isn't just more tonerhead mindlessness, no sense of useability (slowly killing every bit of usability that drove them up to 2013)... all the compelling excellence that Apple used to be known for has been ditched, replaced with ugly flat, minimalism, bugs that never get fixed, and missing functionality. iPhone was both a critical success for Apple and the lure to follow mindless cart-before-horse business practices that are killing the mac, Mac OS, and every piece of software Apple still has left.
    The Mac HW and macOS have never been better.
    While Mac OS is pretty good, you are way out of bounds when it comes to Mac Hardware.   Some of the models are now decades old, some getting no real updates in years and you try to pass off the hardware as never being better????   Seriously?    

    A more accurate statement would be to say that Mac Hardware is pathetic and demonstrates a complete lack of interest on Apples part.
    donjuandysamoria
  • Reply 25 of 105
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,426member

    eightzero said:
    Pretty sure the profitability of their shipments is most important to Apple.

    "Sure, we lose money on every PC. But we make it up in the volume."
    You will never make a profit on hardware that never gets updated and never shows any innovation.   In the PC world sales will crash under such narrow minded marketing.   The Mini is a perfect example, Apple really needs to update the machine every year or remove it from the product line.   It isn't possible in this market to have machines as old as this model selling for premium pricing.    The Mac Pro is a similar issue, they kill sales due to glaring lack of updates.    Now I understand that the pro machine suffers from a different supply chain where annual updates might not make sense but everything is inlace to upgrade this machine so you have to wonder if sales are important to Apple at all.   
    sunwukongdysamoriajbaustian
  • Reply 26 of 105
    davemulrichdavemulrich Posts: 1unconfirmed, member
    To be honest, I think it's the Pro crowd. They waited for so long for hardware updates that they left the platform. I'm in one of the industries with Creative Pro needs, and everyone I know has either built a hackintosh or moved over to PC so they could render files in 1/10 of the time. Some actually left before the desktop hardware grew so embarrassing, because all of the Apple Pro software became very un-"Pro." Now that Apple is paying attention to the Mac hardware and beefing up their software again, it seems way too late, and it's rolling out way too slow. The new Mac Pro rethink is years away and there's no guarantee it will be expandable. Plus, Apple doesn't even make monitors anymore. The people who would have hungrily rushed out for the new Macs this quarter have already moved on — even though they could have finally had some of their needs (somewhat) met. Nonetheless, I'm totally down with the new iMac, and will be getting one very soon... but I'm not a Creative Pro.
    donjuansunwukongdysamoria
  • Reply 27 of 105
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,426member

    darkvader said:
    Soli said:
    Remember when Acer was rising up through the unit sales ranks with shitty* netbooks?

    * I know, that's redundant.

    dysamoria said:
    This is not a surprise, since their software is atrophying. I mean, with the way they gutted iWork, what's the use in having a mac if you're just going to put a crippled MS Office installation on it? Apple have de-professionalized every product they have. They're addicted to Wall Street BS and repeat iPhone sales. They have no vision, no leadership that isn't just more tonerhead mindlessness, no sense of useability (slowly killing every bit of usability that drove them up to 2013)... all the compelling excellence that Apple used to be known for has been ditched, replaced with ugly flat, minimalism, bugs that never get fixed, and missing functionality. iPhone was both a critical success for Apple and the lure to follow mindless cart-before-horse business practices that are killing the mac, Mac OS, and every piece of software Apple still has left.
    The Mac HW and macOS have never been better.
    You're a loony.

    They've both been better, the 2012 MacBook Pro was much better than the current touchbar "Pro", the 2012 Mac Pro was much better than the "current" 2013, the 2012 Mac mini was much better than the "current" 2014.  The 2011 MacBook Pro had a maximum of 16GB RAM, and a brand-new MacBook Pro has a maximum of... 16GB RAM.  You can put a 4TB SSD in the 2012, the 2017 maxes out at 2TB.  If you give up the internal optical drive in the 2012, you can put 8TB of SSD in, the 2017 maxes out at - yep, still 2TB.

    And lots of things in Mac OS X haven't been right since 10.6, and it got much uglier with 10.10.  It's not more stable, it's not faster, it's not more usable, the server version is a joke, and we still don't have scroll arrows.

    Nope, you're definitely a loony.
    I see the current Mac Line up as being absolutely pathetic.   While I very much like Mac OS I'm more concerned about Appel unwillingness to support apps such a Numbers properly.   Numbers still doesn't support things like ISNUMBER which seems to be something you would obviously support in a spread sheet dealing with numbers.   The fact is you can't even import the simplest spread sheets into Numbers which is a joke.   Why Apple goes for years without actually improving the apps beyond me.   I don't mean improvements to support the latest Mac OS features but improvements the tide compatibility.
    entropysdonjuansunwukongdysamoria
  • Reply 28 of 105
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 4,353member
    netrox said:
    Apple needs to make affordable Mac minis!!!!
    $499 is not affordable? Sorry but the Mac mini isn't going to increase Apple's sales. It never has and never will be a big player. Apple is not in a race to the bottom. I'm sure Apple makes more revenue than most above them. Apple is never really concerned about selling the most...they're more concerned about the user experience and selling the best. Apple cannot cater to every single income level. 
    edited October 2017 MacProStrangeDays
  • Reply 29 of 105
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 4,353member
    To be honest, I think it's the Pro crowd. They waited for so long for hardware updates that they left the platform. I'm in one of the industries with Creative Pro needs, and everyone I know has either built a hackintosh or moved over to PC so they could render files in 1/10 of the time. Some actually left before the desktop hardware grew so embarrassing, because all of the Apple Pro software became very un-"Pro." Now that Apple is paying attention to the Mac hardware and beefing up their software again, it seems way too late, and it's rolling out way too slow. The new Mac Pro rethink is years away and there's no guarantee it will be expandable. Plus, Apple doesn't even make monitors anymore. The people who would have hungrily rushed out for the new Macs this quarter have already moved on — even though they could have finally had some of their needs (somewhat) met. Nonetheless, I'm totally down with the new iMac, and will be getting one very soon... but I'm not a Creative Pro.
    The pro crowd is such a niche market for Apple...I hardly doubt its that. 
    StrangeDays
  • Reply 30 of 105
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,426member
    To be honest, I think it's the Pro crowd. They waited for so long for hardware updates that they left the platform. I'm in one of the industries with Creative Pro needs, and everyone I know has either built a hackintosh or moved over to PC so they could render files in 1/10 of the time. Some actually left before the desktop hardware grew so embarrassing, because all of the Apple Pro software became very un-"Pro." Now that Apple is paying attention to the Mac hardware and beefing up their software again, it seems way too late, and it's rolling out way too slow. The new Mac Pro rethink is years away and there's no guarantee it will be expandable. Plus, Apple doesn't even make monitors anymore. The people who would have hungrily rushed out for the new Macs this quarter have already moved on — even though they could have finally had some of their needs (somewhat) met. Nonetheless, I'm totally down with the new iMac, and will be getting one very soon... but I'm not a Creative Pro.
    It is far more than the Pro crowd sen though that is significant.   Think about the Mini a very non pro machine, but who in their right mind would pay list price for that machine right now?   It is extremely dated, and hasn't had any visionary updated in decades.    

    The Mac Pro on the other hand should have been refactored into a low cost mid range machine.   Put a multi core processor in their from Intels desktop platform and add one GPU card {with a modern GPU} and sell the thing for $1500 and you would have a winner.   The evil thing here is that if you wanted a desktop machine form Apple you are screwed as the Mini doesn't cut it and the Mac Pro is way too expensive for many peoples needs.   Why Apple leaves the Midrange systems market unsatisfied is beyond me.
    cgWerkssunwukongdysamoria
  • Reply 31 of 105
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,426member
    macxpress said:
    netrox said:
    Apple needs to make affordable Mac minis!!!!
    $499 is not affordable? Sorry but the Mac mini isn't going to increase Apple's sales. It never has and never will be a big player. Apple is not in a race to the bottom. I'm sure Apple makes more revenue than most above them. Apple is never really concerned about selling the most...they're more concerned about the user experience and selling the best. Apple cannot cater to every single income level. 
    You are a bit out of touch.    The corporate world has gone to Mini sized PC's, mostly from Lonovo, for desktop installations.   The Mini had great potential that Apple unfortunately never really tried to eek out of the machine.
    donjuansunwukongdysamoria
  • Reply 32 of 105
    The idea of a "Personal Computer" being a laptop or desktop computer is disingenuous. iPhones and iPads are highly capable personal computers and indeed replace this function for a great many individuals (just hop on an airplane for a live demonstration.) Also disingenuous is reporting sales by unit shipment, we're talking about a market with a significantly wide range of price points.

    However the numbers do reveal something and it's not that personal computing is in decline, far from it, in fact the extreme opposite is true - personal computers are booming. Instead what the numbers reveal is that society is moving away from Laptop and Desktop computers as the dominant and essential means to accessing personal computing. (If anything a "declining PC market" is good news for Apple.)

    I have upgraded my phone and tablet 4 times since my last laptop/desktop computer purchase. In dollars that comparable to about 6 to 8 HP computers.
    brucemcStrangeDaysjony0
  • Reply 33 of 105
    nhtnht Posts: 4,125member
    wizard69 said:
    dysamoria said:
    This is not a surprise, since their software is atrophying. I mean, with the way they gutted iWork, what's the use in having a mac if you're just going to put a crippled MS Office installation on it? Apple have de-professionalized every product they have. They're addicted to Wall Street BS and repeat iPhone sales. They have no vision, no leadership that isn't just more tonerhead mindlessness, no sense of useability (slowly killing every bit of usability that drove them up to 2013)... all the compelling excellence that Apple used to be known for has been ditched, replaced with ugly flat, minimalism, bugs that never get fixed, and missing functionality. iPhone was both a critical success for Apple and the lure to follow mindless cart-before-horse business practices that are killing the mac, Mac OS, and every piece of software Apple still has left.
    Not to mention what new Macs in June?????   I've yet to see a new Mac Mini or a better designed replacement for that platform, no new Mac Pro's, the iMac have been a joke for he last couple of years so All they have left is the laptops that haven't innovated one bit in years.   I still wonder why Apple has yet to release a laptop with a built in cellular modem.   I''m also extremely frustrated by Apple support of SSD expansion in any of its Macs including the laptops.   Also no ARM based Mac yet even thought it is pretty obvious such a machine would be a big win for Apple.   

    What Apple has done with the Mac is very similar to how it has destroyed other products due to laziness and a demand for sales beyond what the market will allow.   one example here is the terrible upgrades iPad mini got and as a result accelerated declining sales instead of beefing them up which is what an upgrade should do.   The Mac <Mini is another example, no credible upgrades and no innovation has lead to accelerated declining sales.    It is no surprise that most of Apples sales are going to the laptop line up as that is the only place you can buy a modern machine.

    Something is rotten inside of Apple and frankly it has driven customers away for no good reason.   You really have to ask, how many companies out there survive routinely pissing off customers.    
    Lol...an Apple is Doomed post in 2017.

    The iMac is a fantastic machine as a desktop and the MBP a fantastic machines for mobile pro use.  Apple stumbled a bit with the Mac Pro but will fix it next year or so.

    But folks like you have been predicting the doom of Apple by pissing off important loyal customers like yourself because of no xMac for the last 20 years. 
    brucemcStrangeDaysjony0
  • Reply 34 of 105
    wizard69 said:
    macxpress said:
    netrox said:
    Apple needs to make affordable Mac minis!!!!
    $499 is not affordable? Sorry but the Mac mini isn't going to increase Apple's sales. It never has and never will be a big player. Apple is not in a race to the bottom. I'm sure Apple makes more revenue than most above them. Apple is never really concerned about selling the most...they're more concerned about the user experience and selling the best. Apple cannot cater to every single income level. 
    You are a bit out of touch.    The corporate world has gone to Mini sized PC's, mostly from Lonovo, for desktop installations.   The Mini had great potential that Apple unfortunately never really tried to eek out of the machine.
    Apple already dominates the corporate world with the iPad. Mini sized thin client PC on the desk of every Word user is not among Apple’s interests.
    brucemcStrangeDaysjony0
  • Reply 35 of 105
    wizard69 said:
    To be honest, I think it's the Pro crowd. They waited for so long for hardware updates that they left the platform. I'm in one of the industries with Creative Pro needs, and everyone I know has either built a hackintosh or moved over to PC so they could render files in 1/10 of the time. Some actually left before the desktop hardware grew so embarrassing, because all of the Apple Pro software became very un-"Pro." Now that Apple is paying attention to the Mac hardware and beefing up their software again, it seems way too late, and it's rolling out way too slow. The new Mac Pro rethink is years away and there's no guarantee it will be expandable. Plus, Apple doesn't even make monitors anymore. The people who would have hungrily rushed out for the new Macs this quarter have already moved on — even though they could have finally had some of their needs (somewhat) met. Nonetheless, I'm totally down with the new iMac, and will be getting one very soon... but I'm not a Creative Pro.
    It is far more than the Pro crowd sen though that is significant.   Think about the Mini a very non pro machine, but who in their right mind would pay list price for that machine right now?   It is extremely dated, and hasn't had any visionary updated in decades.    

    The Mac Pro on the other hand should have been refactored into a low cost mid range machine.   Put a multi core processor in their from Intels desktop platform and add one GPU card {with a modern GPU} and sell the thing for $1500 and you would have a winner.   The evil thing here is that if you wanted a desktop machine form Apple you are screwed as the Mini doesn't cut it and the Mac Pro is way too expensive for many peoples needs.   Why Apple leaves the Midrange systems market unsatisfied is beyond me.
    The Mini doesn’t cut the Mac Pro is way too expensive and the iMac never existed so we are screwed... Instead Apple should sell a Pro machine (with a modern GPU) for $1500. Good luck with that.
    edited October 2017 brucemcStrangeDayssunwukong
  • Reply 36 of 105
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 4,353member
    wizard69 said:
    macxpress said:
    netrox said:
    Apple needs to make affordable Mac minis!!!!
    $499 is not affordable? Sorry but the Mac mini isn't going to increase Apple's sales. It never has and never will be a big player. Apple is not in a race to the bottom. I'm sure Apple makes more revenue than most above them. Apple is never really concerned about selling the most...they're more concerned about the user experience and selling the best. Apple cannot cater to every single income level. 
    You are a bit out of touch.    The corporate world has gone to Mini sized PC's, mostly from Lonovo, for desktop installations.   The Mini had great potential that Apple unfortunately never really tried to eek out of the machine.
    What corporate world is that? I see more of the corporate world going iOS. I think you are actually a bit out of touch....
    brucemcStrangeDays
  • Reply 37 of 105
    nhtnht Posts: 4,125member
    macxpress said:
    wizard69 said:
    macxpress said:
    netrox said:
    Apple needs to make affordable Mac minis!!!!
    $499 is not affordable? Sorry but the Mac mini isn't going to increase Apple's sales. It never has and never will be a big player. Apple is not in a race to the bottom. I'm sure Apple makes more revenue than most above them. Apple is never really concerned about selling the most...they're more concerned about the user experience and selling the best. Apple cannot cater to every single income level. 
    You are a bit out of touch.    The corporate world has gone to Mini sized PC's, mostly from Lonovo, for desktop installations.   The Mini had great potential that Apple unfortunately never really tried to eek out of the machine.
    What corporate world is that? I see more of the corporate world going iOS. I think you are actually a bit out of touch....
    He's still living in 1997
    brucemcStrangeDays
  • Reply 38 of 105
    schlackschlack Posts: 672member
    pricing and ports probably has something to do with this, but it could also be that apple fans are spending their apple money on iPad Pros and iPhone 8/X and holding onto their laptops a bit longer.
    dysamoria
  • Reply 39 of 105
    MacProMacPro Posts: 17,290member
    darkvader said:
    Soli said:
    Remember when Acer was rising up through the unit sales ranks with shitty* netbooks?

    * I know, that's redundant.

    dysamoria said:
    This is not a surprise, since their software is atrophying. I mean, with the way they gutted iWork, what's the use in having a mac if you're just going to put a crippled MS Office installation on it? Apple have de-professionalized every product they have. They're addicted to Wall Street BS and repeat iPhone sales. They have no vision, no leadership that isn't just more tonerhead mindlessness, no sense of useability (slowly killing every bit of usability that drove them up to 2013)... all the compelling excellence that Apple used to be known for has been ditched, replaced with ugly flat, minimalism, bugs that never get fixed, and missing functionality. iPhone was both a critical success for Apple and the lure to follow mindless cart-before-horse business practices that are killing the mac, Mac OS, and every piece of software Apple still has left.
    The Mac HW and macOS have never been better.
    You're a loony.

    They've both been better, the 2012 MacBook Pro was much better than the current touchbar "Pro", the 2012 Mac Pro was much better than the "current" 2013, the 2012 Mac mini was much better than the "current" 2014.  The 2011 MacBook Pro had a maximum of 16GB RAM, and a brand-new MacBook Pro has a maximum of... 16GB RAM.  You can put a 4TB SSD in the 2012, the 2017 maxes out at 2TB.  If you give up the internal optical drive in the 2012, you can put 8TB of SSD in, the 2017 maxes out at - yep, still 2TB.

    And lots of things in Mac OS X haven't been right since 10.6, and it got much uglier with 10.10.  It's not more stable, it's not faster, it's not more usable, the server version is a joke, and we still don't have scroll arrows.

    Nope, you're definitely a loony.
    What a load of codswallop.
    edited October 2017 brucemcStrangeDays
  • Reply 40 of 105
    nhtnht Posts: 4,125member
    MacPro said:
    darkvader said:
    Soli said:
    Remember when Acer was rising up through the unit sales ranks with shitty* netbooks?

    * I know, that's redundant.

    dysamoria said:
    This is not a surprise, since their software is atrophying. I mean, with the way they gutted iWork, what's the use in having a mac if you're just going to put a crippled MS Office installation on it? Apple have de-professionalized every product they have. They're addicted to Wall Street BS and repeat iPhone sales. They have no vision, no leadership that isn't just more tonerhead mindlessness, no sense of useability (slowly killing every bit of usability that drove them up to 2013)... all the compelling excellence that Apple used to be known for has been ditched, replaced with ugly flat, minimalism, bugs that never get fixed, and missing functionality. iPhone was both a critical success for Apple and the lure to follow mindless cart-before-horse business practices that are killing the mac, Mac OS, and every piece of software Apple still has left.
    The Mac HW and macOS have never been better.
    You're a loony.

    They've both been better, the 2012 MacBook Pro was much better than the current touchbar "Pro", the 2012 Mac Pro was much better than the "current" 2013, the 2012 Mac mini was much better than the "current" 2014.  The 2011 MacBook Pro had a maximum of 16GB RAM, and a brand-new MacBook Pro has a maximum of... 16GB RAM.  You can put a 4TB SSD in the 2012, the 2017 maxes out at 2TB.  If you give up the internal optical drive in the 2012, you can put 8TB of SSD in, the 2017 maxes out at - yep, still 2TB.

    And lots of things in Mac OS X haven't been right since 10.6, and it got much uglier with 10.10.  It's not more stable, it's not faster, it's not more usable, the server version is a joke, and we still don't have scroll arrows.

    Nope, you're definitely a loony.
    What a load of codswallop.
    Isn't the English language grand?
    dysamoria
Sign In or Register to comment.