Apple apologizes for iPhone slowdown controversy, will reduce out-of-warranty battery repl...

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  • Reply 121 of 233

    raclark77 said:
    AppleZulu said:
    ZooMigo said:
    So I guess Dodge should give me a one time replacement of brakes, wipers, clutch plates, batteries, and everything else that's a wearable item on my car? Its a fucking wearable item! Why does Apple need to give anyone a onetime exception to replace a battery on an older phone with a lets say it together...wearable item? 
    Dodge won't put your car into limp mode when it detects any wear item is reaching end of life. If Dodge did what Apple did, and decided to limit your car to 35 MPH if it detects worn brakes, refuses to start if its dark and it detects a bad light, or won't let you put it in 4WD if you haven't changed your diff oil as recommended then you might have an argument.
    Given the choice, I’d rather have a car that could detect a possible engine stall and slow me down to 35mph and keep going, rather than a car that would let the engine seize up while I’m going 80, likely causing a fatal end of my trip. But you know, that’s just a personal preference.
    It's also great when you can change your own cars battery too. Unlike with these phones with a sealed battery forcing paid maintanice. This is the same as if the car had to go the dealer for a battery change. That would upset people too.
    Bullshit. You can easily swap out a phone battery. Not much more work than a car battery. 
    bb-15watto_cobra
  • Reply 122 of 233
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,574member
    raclark77 said:
    If they had told people what they were doing before just slowing peoples phones down without their consent it would be different.

    This action is tantamount to malware being pushed out as a software update. More reason to NOT trust company updates.

    And now to restore the device to previous conditions the user must pay for a new battery?! How is this not equal to randsomware?! Having to spend money that had not been planned on being spent until this is basically extortion.

    At $29 a pop just how many millions will this make them?! This is outrageous, and just laughable that some of the people commenting here are just fine with this as it is.

    This just happened to slow down old devices at the exact same time as new Apple phones being sold too! This is too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence.

    I feel Apple has overstepped with this whole situation. The price reduction on a maintenance that wasn't needed until their actions is not a fix of any kind.

    As it stands now, I have no plans to buy anything Apple again. Microsoft, and Apple both are making some boneheaded decisions lately. I almost think they might just be the same company secretly.

    They were caught red handed. Me paying them for their actions is not going to make me feel any better about this in any way.

    If this was all fine, then why was it secretly/silently done?
    Batteries die. It's a fact of life. The battery in your smoke detector needs to be replaced often. Your car battery last like 5 years and may not work in extreme cold. Why aren't you complaining about buying those batteries?
    StrangeDaysbaconstangwatto_cobra
  • Reply 123 of 233
    jungmark said:
    raclark77 said:
    If they had told people what they were doing before just slowing peoples phones down without their consent it would be different.

    This action is tantamount to malware being pushed out as a software update. More reason to NOT trust company updates.

    And now to restore the device to previous conditions the user must pay for a new battery?! How is this not equal to randsomware?! Having to spend money that had not been planned on being spent until this is basically extortion.

    At $29 a pop just how many millions will this make them?! This is outrageous, and just laughable that some of the people commenting here are just fine with this as it is.

    This just happened to slow down old devices at the exact same time as new Apple phones being sold too! This is too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence.

    I feel Apple has overstepped with this whole situation. The price reduction on a maintenance that wasn't needed until their actions is not a fix of any kind.

    As it stands now, I have no plans to buy anything Apple again. Microsoft, and Apple both are making some boneheaded decisions lately. I almost think they might just be the same company secretly.

    They were caught red handed. Me paying them for their actions is not going to make me feel any better about this in any way.

    If this was all fine, then why was it secretly/silently done?
    Batteries die. It's a fact of life. The battery in your smoke detector needs to be replaced often. Your car battery last like 5 years and may not work in extreme cold. Why aren't you complaining about buying those batteries?
    It’s completely stupid. AAA does solid business replacing expired car batteries that fail to supply peak power draw to cars (cranking in cold weather), nobody cries there. But iphone? Massive whining. 

    The entitlement is strong. 
    GG1JFC_PAwatto_cobra
  • Reply 124 of 233
    If you want to know more about your iPhone battery; here is App for that Battery Health 3 by Fiplab
  • Reply 125 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    raclark77 said:
    If they had told people what they were doing before just slowing peoples phones down without their consent it would be different.

    This action is tantamount to malware being pushed out as a software update. More reason to NOT trust company updates.

    And now to restore the device to previous conditions the user must pay for a new battery?! How is this not equal to randsomware?! Having to spend money that had not been planned on being spent until this is basically extortion.

    At $29 a pop just how many millions will this make them?! This is outrageous, and just laughable that some of the people commenting here are just fine with this as it is.

    This just happened to slow down old devices at the exact same time as new Apple phones being sold too! This is too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence.

    I feel Apple has overstepped with this whole situation. The price reduction on a maintenance that wasn't needed until their actions is not a fix of any kind.

    As it stands now, I have no plans to buy anything Apple again. Microsoft, and Apple both are making some boneheaded decisions lately. I almost think they might just be the same company secretly.

    They were caught red handed. Me paying them for their actions is not going to make me feel any better about this in any way.

    If this was all fine, then why was it secretly/silently done?
    Everything you said is false, good grief pure junk.
     A crappo battery from some crap shop cost me $30 to install on the then 4 year old 3GS years ago, and you think Apple will make money from this...

    The 3GS was easier to open and service than the latest phones (cheapo shops probably are not touching the X).

    Those articles do dredge up trolls by the bushells.

    BTW, if a mallware saves your battery, maybe they should sell that solution cause that sure seems usefull.
    edited December 2017 bb-15baconstangJFC_PAwatto_cobra
  • Reply 126 of 233
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 1,860member
    Successive iOS versions are more and more bloated and reduce device performance (the GUI is the computer; the computer is the GUI). That's not a conspiracy theory. It's bad software optimization and it's fact. This battery situation was a stupid act by Apple, now sort of addressed, but is not the main problem.
    AI_liasmuthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 127 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    hentaiboy said:
    Will be interesting to see how this affect Apple’s future sales once everyone realises they can make their phones ‘new’ again for only $29.

    BTW that $29 will be $69 in Australia and $89 in New Zealand...
    It won't make it new for most people who already knew to replace the battery before, this is a lot like the Antenna Gate bumpers, except more people will obviously take Apple on their offer of a cheaper battery replacement.

    If anything, this will affect the bottom line of other Android phones more cause well, they're not offering battery replacements for $30.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 128 of 233
    raclark77 said:
    If they had told people what they were doing before just slowing peoples phones down without their consent it would be different.

    This action is tantamount to malware being pushed out as a software update. More reason to NOT trust company updates.

    And now to restore the device to previous conditions the user must pay for a new battery?! How is this not equal to randsomware?! Having to spend money that had not been planned on being spent until this is basically extortion.

    At $29 a pop just how many millions will this make them?! This is outrageous, and just laughable that some of the people commenting here are just fine with this as it is.

    This just happened to slow down old devices at the exact same time as new Apple phones being sold too! This is too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence.

    I feel Apple has overstepped with this whole situation. The price reduction on a maintenance that wasn't needed until their actions is not a fix of any kind.

    As it stands now, I have no plans to buy anything Apple again. Microsoft, and Apple both are making some boneheaded decisions lately. I almost think they might just be the same company secretly.

    They were caught red handed. Me paying them for their actions is not going to make me feel any better about this in any way.

    If this was all fine, then why was it secretly/silently done?
    What planet are you from, where batteries don’t wear out and/or for profit corporations replace them for you for free for life?

    What brand car do you drive, where you get free battery replacements?
    The planet is Earth, where phones that worked well on iOS 10 started unexpectedly shutting down under iOS 11. 
    williamlondon
  • Reply 129 of 233
    It makes sense why Apple is doing this. Reducing performance is an elegant solution.

    However they should have been transparent about it and provide clarity prior to this ‘exposure’.

    Also I think battery replacements in a device that we can’t open up ourselves should be $29 permanently. Asking $79 for a replacement is unfair if I can’t buy a battery myself and put it in, like one of these classic Nokia’s. So I hope Apple will be pressured on that front.

    I think a lot of this would disappear if Apple manages to expand their subscription. Having to pay monthly for a phone which covers all repairs and warranties is a good thing. You get their latest phone and all old phones are recycled in a controlled manner (I won’t end up with my old phones in a box in the garage).
    JFC_PA
  • Reply 130 of 233
    AppleZulu said:
    ZooMigo said:
    So I guess Dodge should give me a one time replacement of brakes, wipers, clutch plates, batteries, and everything else that's a wearable item on my car? Its a fucking wearable item! Why does Apple need to give anyone a onetime exception to replace a battery on an older phone with a lets say it together...wearable item? 
    Dodge won't put your car into limp mode when it detects any wear item is reaching end of life. If Dodge did what Apple did, and decided to limit your car to 35 MPH if it detects worn brakes, refuses to start if its dark and it detects a bad light, or won't let you put it in 4WD if you haven't changed your diff oil as recommended then you might have an argument.
    Given the choice, I’d rather have a car that could detect a possible engine stall and slow me down to 35mph and keep going, rather than a car that would let the engine seize up while I’m going 80, likely causing a fatal end of my trip. But you know, that’s just a personal preference.
    Yeah - I totally agree - but there's almost always a little light on the dashboard which tells you there's a problem. No such dashboard light with this battery issue. You're just left with a crappy experience with no understanding why except for release notes which state "a performance management feature", whatever that means.

    Also I notice that Apple didn't actually apologize for the issue. They apologized for some people feeling a certain way. Subtle, but significant difference:

    "We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down. We apologize."
    anantksundaram
  • Reply 131 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    dysamoria said:
    Successive iOS versions are more and more bloated and reduce device performance (the GUI is the computer; the computer is the GUI). That's not a conspiracy theory. It's bad software optimization and it's fact. This battery situation was a stupid act by Apple, now sort of addressed, but is not the main problem.
    The main issue here is not IOS being bloated, it's not IOS that's inducing those peak usages. I'd bet, a good bit of it comes from things like the browser, games, AR, etc.
    Putting a laptop power battery inside a phone when you don't have a laptop size battery has to have some consequences.
    Battery tech simply has not followed through with the every mounting power of the A chip.

    Mobile workloads tends to be extremely bursty, but now those bursty tasks are being done with extremely powerful processors, which introduces extreme short demand of current which are very demanding on batteries.

    No wonder Apple is looking into designing and integrating their own power management chip, it seems to be absolutely necessary that they do so considering the SOC's demands on the battery subsystem.

    Apple creating smaller SOCs and offloading specialized tasks to coprocessors can also be explained by this issue of trying to reduce the stress on the battery, waking up the main processor as little as possible for tasks that can be spread out (not timing critical).

    I think if anyone is desperately looking for a successor to Lithium Ion batteries, it is Apple. At least it should be batteries that better resist to peak usage: wonder if solid state ones would be better for that.
    edited December 2017 watto_cobra
  • Reply 132 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    AI_lias said:
    raclark77 said:
    If they had told people what they were doing before just slowing peoples phones down without their consent it would be different.

    This action is tantamount to malware being pushed out as a software update. More reason to NOT trust company updates.

    And now to restore the device to previous conditions the user must pay for a new battery?! How is this not equal to randsomware?! Having to spend money that had not been planned on being spent until this is basically extortion.

    At $29 a pop just how many millions will this make them?! This is outrageous, and just laughable that some of the people commenting here are just fine with this as it is.

    This just happened to slow down old devices at the exact same time as new Apple phones being sold too! This is too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence.

    I feel Apple has overstepped with this whole situation. The price reduction on a maintenance that wasn't needed until their actions is not a fix of any kind.

    As it stands now, I have no plans to buy anything Apple again. Microsoft, and Apple both are making some boneheaded decisions lately. I almost think they might just be the same company secretly.

    They were caught red handed. Me paying them for their actions is not going to make me feel any better about this in any way.

    If this was all fine, then why was it secretly/silently done?
    What planet are you from, where batteries don’t wear out and/or for profit corporations replace them for you for free for life?

    What brand car do you drive, where you get free battery replacements?
    The planet is Earth, where phones that worked well on iOS 10 started unexpectedly shutting down under iOS 11. 
    Considering that would be the opposite of what they're doing (the phones were shutting down prior), I don't know WTF you're saying.
    is that the same planet were you just pulled a straw man anecdote out of your ass?
    baconstangJFC_PAwilliamlondonflashfan207StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 133 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    djsherly said:
    AppleZulu said:
    ZooMigo said:
    So I guess Dodge should give me a one time replacement of brakes, wipers, clutch plates, batteries, and everything else that's a wearable item on my car? Its a fucking wearable item! Why does Apple need to give anyone a onetime exception to replace a battery on an older phone with a lets say it together...wearable item? 
    Dodge won't put your car into limp mode when it detects any wear item is reaching end of life. If Dodge did what Apple did, and decided to limit your car to 35 MPH if it detects worn brakes, refuses to start if its dark and it detects a bad light, or won't let you put it in 4WD if you haven't changed your diff oil as recommended then you might have an argument.
    Given the choice, I’d rather have a car that could detect a possible engine stall and slow me down to 35mph and keep going, rather than a car that would let the engine seize up while I’m going 80, likely causing a fatal end of my trip. But you know, that’s just a personal preference.
    Yeah - I totally agree - but there's almost always a little light on the dashboard which tells you there's a problem. No such dashboard light with this battery issue. You're just left with a crappy experience with no understanding why except for release notes which state "a performance management feature", whatever that means.

    Also I notice that Apple didn't actually apologize for the issue. They apologized for some people feeling a certain way. Subtle, but significant difference:

    "We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down. We apologize."
    Considering there are pending legal cases, they don't have much choice in that subtility, even if I think it reflects reality. They indeed don't have much to apologize for, but for PR reason will do so anyway. That's textbook crisis management. Ackowledge the issue, try to solve it and steer away from admitting any responsability at the outset at least (unless it will ultimately come out anyway that you did something wrong and it is better that you say it than some journalist).

     Regaining control of the message is the key here, instead of Apple screwing you up, the narrative switches to Apple sells inexpensive battery replacement as an act of good faith.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 134 of 233
        
    edited December 2017 williamlondon
  • Reply 135 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    AI_lias said:
    foggyhill said:
    AI_lias said:
    foggyhill said:
    AI_lias said:
    Everyone on here that said Apple did nothing wrong, should keep paying $80 for their battery replacements.
    Paying $80 bucks after you recharged your battery 800 times is NORMAL unless you think Apple should pay for god damn tires if they sold a car hey logic boy.

    So, go away troll, buy a Note 8 or S8 which dies quick and dirty and doesn't come back.
     


    Exactly my point, people like you should keep paying $80.
    So, basically you are a little child who doesn't know the cost and value anything. Lithium battery has 800-1000 full cycles before crapping out (at the best of times). That's it.
    If you can't afford to spend money on anything, stay away from stores.
    No. I happen to believe, like many others here, that Apple was in the wrong: they bogged down older devices with bloated iOS updates, they did not properly test those updates to detect unexpected shutdowns, and throttled the device speed unbeknownst to their users, unintentionally causing people to factor their device slowness in the decision to buy a new iPhone or not. And don’t lecture me on the value of money. If you’ll take advantage of $29 battery change, donate $50 to your favorite charity. 
    Funny, how everything you said is lie. Goodbye and frack off dumbass.
    edited December 2017 bb-15baconstangwilliamlondonStrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 136 of 233
    There’s a great deal of denial in this thread. 

    I said it when this issue first hit the screen (to much pushback), and I’ll say it again: (1) This is serious sh**. (2) Apple has to FUNDAMENTALLY change the way it communicates with its customers. This is a game-changer. 

    This whole episode is going to get a lot worse before it gets better. Apple’s cash pile doesn’t help. 
    djsherlymuthuk_vanalingamtheothergeoffmaxit
  • Reply 137 of 233
    foggyhillfoggyhill Posts: 4,767member
    There’s a great deal of denial in this thread. 

    I said it when this issue first hit the screen (to much pushback), and I’ll say it again: (1) This is serious sh**. (2) Apple has to FUNDAMENTALLY change the way it communicates with its customers. This is a game-changer. 

    This whole episode is going to get a lot worse before it gets better. Apple’s cash pile doesn’t help. 
    Denial of what exactly? That's as vague as can be.

    No, this is not serious shit at all. Not at all. They have literally no real liability here.
    In fact, if they could instantly go to court and plead out, they'd likely be vindicated on all points.

    But, the law being slow as sludge and that leaves time for FUD to spread.

    So , the main issue while all this goes on is PR.
    First, show that you understand their pain (doesn't matter if it is warranted or not, the pain is acknowledged )
    Second, show good faith. Everyone will get a chance to see for themselves that indeed getting a new battery restores full function.
    Third, talk about how this will be fixed for all future Apple users

    They did a classic PR and likely this will be enough to temper most of the crap spreading.
    Hard to be mad when most people who were not even hit by this (most Apple clients) will in fact receive a serious extension to their phone's longevity for next to nothing.

    I think the main thing this will change is Apple will now assume, most of their users are indeed complete Noobs when it comes to smart phones and communicate to them accordingly.

    People will likely have all moved on by February, lets see who is wrong about that.

    That you mention the big pile of cash indicates you plainly know what the real reason for this clamor is.
    baconstangStrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 138 of 233
    How does the saying go?  With great power comes great responsibility?  Apple's size and power forces them to do things that most other companies wouldn't, won't or can't do, even when it's not really an Apple issue or fault.  The Apple brand is such a huge click bait and lawsuit bait opportunity that someone out there is always ready to go after them for just about anything, knowing they'll get the clicks even if they "win" nothing from Apple.

    And that's why I'm sticking with Apple products.. because they are the most scrutinised. Everyone else are doing QCs for me. :smiley: 
    edited December 2017 flashfan207christopher126watto_cobra
  • Reply 139 of 233
    vonbrick said:
    Apple feels the need to roll over on this one because there’s a segment of consumers that are five, and don’t get the point of the way the iPhone functions under the circumstances as explained by Apple. It’s a total non-issue, but sometimes you have to simply bow to the absurd. 
    Why is it so impossible for so many to admit that Apple was wrong here?

    There is nothing absurd in trying to figure out why your phone...which worked perfectly yesterday...now slows to a crawl after installing an official update.  This is an issue.  And Apple admitted it today.

    They screwed this up not by hobbling functioning phones with an update but by not communicating with their customers what that update may look like after installed.  They admitted it.  And now, they’re gonna try to fix it...as they should.

    Stop blaming the customer and let Apple fix this.

    1. They weren't actually "wrong." Some folks not liking their design decisions doesn't make them "wrong." Maybe misunderstood, but it's at best a matter of semantic word play than anyone being in the wrong. Apple gave in to "the customer is always right...  even when they don't understand perfectly reasonable motives explained in plain english". And since Apple is all about making consumers happy – often no matter what, they decided to roll over on this one. Probably for the best.

    2. "now slows to a crawl after installing an official update." Conclusions drawn from assumptions. Will need to know age of phone, model, how it is being used, its condition, and exactly how many people are experiencing this. Personal anecdotes are of no interest. There's nothing here whatsoever from which to draw any conclusions.

    3. They admitted to not making something clear that they thought was already understood. Apple taking responsibility doesn't admit of any actual wrongdoing. It's a business decision. Don't read too much into it. Apple's about making customers happy, even the unreasonable ones. 

    4. Customers very often a) don't read, b) don't understand even the most basic, straightforward logic, so yeah, I WILL blame the customer in many cases. But as with children who have patient parents, eventually mum and dad will make it all better. 

    5. I'm totally not preventing Apple from fixing this.

    There is no actual conspiracy here. No "planned obsolescence" or any other cloak-and-dagger nonsense. Planned obsolescence does not sell new iPhones. New iPhones sell new iPhones. 

    They implemented a feature they thought made sense, and which they sincerely believed consumers would benefit from. They then went on to explain it, and given its logic, believed consumers would understand and appreciate same. It turned out differently, but not because of any nefarious activity. 
    So, in your mind, until Apple apologized Thursday for not telling anyone about this new feature, any customer who may have had negative experiences with the update was “holding it wrong”...?  It’s all on the customer here, eh?

    Tell me:  If this “feature” had been rolled out quietly to Samsung devices with zero fanfare or with just a blip in a release document, would you have applauded the Samsung marketing department for giving the customer exactly what they didn’t know they wanted when they didn’t know they wanted it?  Or would you have pointed and laughed at a complete lack of communication and, worse, a perceived lack of respect for customers?
    edited December 2017 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 140 of 233
    Apple should reopen the ability to downgrade back to iOS 10.
    AI_lias
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