Editorial: Apple just told you that they aren't going to make an 'iPhone SE 2' any time so...

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  • Reply 21 of 64
    A smaller iPhone doesn't mean a 4.7" screen. An iPhone 8 screen sans bezels has the footprint of an SE, that's all anyone's asking for.

    The current Apple design cycle is three years, and rumors are already circulating that the 2020 iPhone will be a new design along the lines of iPhone, iPhone Pro, and iPhone Air. fingers crossed X,,
    leftoverbaconGeorgeBMacSamhaincornchipbaconstangargonaut
  • Reply 22 of 64
    Next iPhone SE is going to be an iPhone 8 with an A12 processor next year and the XR won't be produced. iPhone 11 will be the mid tier next year.
  • Reply 23 of 64
    If this logic were correct, we would not have an iPad Mini.  

    Yes, part of the appeal of both the iPad Mini and the SE was their price.   But using price as the main criteria for the argument ignores the appeal of the smaller form factor.   Further, using the price of the nearly obsolete and soon to be abandoned iPhone 8 is not a valid argument.   The iPhone 8 is cheap because it is an old, dated form factor using old, dated components.

    And, saying that nobody wants a 4" screen is obviously myoptic:   People don't want a small screen, they want a small phone.   Apple has already abandoned the old (iPhone 8) form factor with wide bezels and a big button at the bottom in favor of no bezel screens.   That could enable them to make an SE sized phone with a FAR bigger screen.

    But, lastly, there is simple logic:   The ONLY consumer priced small/medium phones Apple makes is the 8.    And, the 8 will be gone next year.  That will leave a big hole in Apple's lineup that will likely be filled with a successor to the SE.

    I say to those who want a smaller, consumer priced phone but don't want to invest in a nearly obsolete phone:   Wait them out!  
    edited September 11 leftoverbaconmuthuk_vanalingamSamhainretrogustoargonaut
  • Reply 24 of 64

    I hesitantly switched from the SE to the XR, and while I do love my XR, it's too big to use with one hand, and that's a serious setback in usability. I used to be able to use my SE one-handled all the time while walking the dog. Yes, a real dog (you dirty minds!) Now it's just a frustrating experience. The Apple Watch doesn't really help for messaging because I still need two hands to operate it. Go figure!

    I hope that Apple wises up and re-introduces a smaller (or much lighter) phone again.

    leftoverbaconSamhainretrogustobaconstangargonaut
  • Reply 25 of 64
    mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 2,028member
    lkrupp said:
    I want a modern iPhone that is not huge, heavy and $1000+

    I have a three year old iPhone 7 Plus and I want to downgrade in size. iPhone XR / 11 is roughly the same size but thicker and heavier. That leaves only the very pricy XS / 11 Pro series.

    All I can do is trade in and get an iPhone 8 or pony up too much cash and get an iPhone Pro I don’t need. Obviously there is a missing option here.
    Apple is not stupid. They conduct surveys all the time. They know what sells and what doesn’t. They know what their market is. Remember that tech blog comment sections amplify the minority opinion. Apple has apparently decided that the smaller screen size market is not worth the effort. They are probably right regardless of the constant drone for one on tech blogs, Reddit, Twitter, and the rest. 

    There's no need to conduct a survey to determine what portion of their user base is still using a smaller iPhone. I'm thinking, iOS 13 may be the last update for A9-based devices. If that's the case, then the the issue becomes that pie chart they love to put on the screen... iOS adoption rates. If there's a big enough chunk of users with an older, smaller phone, it may eventually start to affect those adoption rates. Apple doesn't want that. That was addressed with the SE. I, and I'm sure many, many, others, still use a smaller phone (SE here). If that "left behind" slice of the pie gets larger, Apple will again address it. 
    leftoverbaconSamhainbaconstangargonaut
  • Reply 26 of 64
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,470member
    Bugger, I predicted two years ago we'd get it this year... Meanwhile it looks like smallholephobia gate is gathering steam. FFS.


    https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-49660765
    The medical term is Trypophobia and the BBC is publishing this clickbait because it’s about Apple.
    JWSCargonaut
  • Reply 27 of 64
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,470member
    mjtomlin said:
    *** Disclaimer: Wishful Thinking ***

    Regardless, I still have hope. Apple's M.O. is to squeeze every dollar out of a production/assembly line for as long as possible, and use up as many parts/components they have stock piled.

    Case in point... While all other iPad's moved to a bigger display, the "cheap" model was kept around to use up their 9.7" displays. It's this same reasoning this new iPad is the last iPad with an A10 - in fact, along with the iPod Touch, they're only Apple devices with an A10. (By this time next year, both will be upgraded to include a Neural Engine.)

    Having all price points covered now, doesn't prove a thing. Keeping the iPhone 8 and XR around isn't costing Apple anything - this is their normal way to milk as much cost as they can out of a product. It's my belief (see disclaimer), that during the traditional slow-down after the Holiday,. Apple will release the "SE 2". It will be an XR with a 4.7" display and priced at $499. The iPhone 8 will move down in price to $399.

    This time next year, the iPhone 8 will be gone and the SE 2 will down to $399...
    399 XR mini
    499 XR
    599 iPhone 11
    699 iPhone 12
    999 iPhone 12 Pro
    1099 iPhone 12 Pro Max
    With your negative opinion of Apple’s business practices I wonder why you are still a customer. If I thought a company was “milking” or “squeezing” me for my last dollar I sure wouldn’t continue to do business with them. Why do you?
    brucemc
  • Reply 28 of 64
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,470member
    Rajka said:
    I'm not sure Apple is not stupid, that it knows what sells and what doesn't. Sure, its products are selling and it is flush with cash. But the corporate landscape is littered with corporations who once reigned king but are relegated to much smaller market segments today, if even still in business. Apple will prove to be no exception. How say? Because its lost focus, deviated from what Steve Jobs built to lay the foundation for the excessive wealth Apple enjoys today. Jobs was so successful because he gave Apple customers outstanding value and innovative products. His product line was simple and clearly differentiated. Most products could be readily repaired, expanded, and upgraded. But his real killer feature was delivering excellence, the best user experience possible (at specific price points) for a modest premium. That's what Apple lacks today, and why I predict its ship will sail too. Greed always loses in the end.
    Unadulterated horse shit IMHO.
    edited September 11 ken burns effectcornchipbrucemc
  • Reply 29 of 64
    Samhain said:
    Wel yes an SE2 is about size but it's also about price, while $449 may see like a great price point the iPhone SE base model was $399 while that doesn't seem a lot of difference with the economies of scale Apple have now there is no reason if they wanted to they couldn't offer an iPhone SE2 starting at $349.

    The reality is Apple needs to look at the fact that it is losing market share, not because it's iPhones are no good but other than buying Old technology (iPhone 8) Apple has no current technology level product at a reason price point.

    In the developed world we may not feel this is important but the less well off people in the world are voting with their feet, if Apple fails to offer this massive segment of the market a viably priced product it is the Apple ecosystem that will lose out to Android hordes!
    What makes you think Apple is losing market share? They're not. Importantly, you leave out that there is a vast secondary market for iPhones and you can buy a refurbished iPhone 7 at less than $200 at many places such as Amazon, and other iPhones in Asia and elsewhere are available at $100 or less. Finally, you're confused in believing Apple is trying to compete with the Android horde. Apple isn't trying to compete to sell phones at the cheapest price. They never have, nor will they ever do so. They want to sell a quality product with a reasonable profit; that's why they consistently make close to 90% of the entire industry's profits in smart phones. It's why they don't care to compete with cheap, throwaway tablets, cheap wireless headphones, etc., etc. Market share means nothing to them. Just sit back and relax as Apple sells over 200 MILLION iPhones this year and approaches 1.5 BILLION users. #Winning
    cornchipbaconstang
  • Reply 30 of 64
    What happened to the tracker tile everyone predicted? Mis read of the intention of the discovered code, or just a later release?
    razorpitlostkiwi
  • Reply 31 of 64
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 5,007administrator
    What happened to the tracker tile everyone predicted? Mis read of the intention of the discovered code, or just a later release?
    Probably a later release. There is sufficient smoke, and the U1 doesn't do a lot today.

    https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/09/10/heres-what-apples-new-u1-chip-in-the-iphone-11-iphone-11-pro-does
  • Reply 32 of 64
    One observation about all this.

    In the iPad line-up, Apple sells the recently upgraded iPad Mini for *MORE* than the new iPad 2019.  So, there's no reason that Apple couldn't charge a premium for a smaller iPhone SE 2 with newer tech than the iPhone 8.  

    Indeed, I'll predict that’s exactly what they're going to do!
    leftoverbaconmuthuk_vanalingamSamhainretrogustobaconstangpscooter63GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 33 of 64
    mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 2,028member
    lkrupp said:
    mjtomlin said:
    *** Disclaimer: Wishful Thinking ***

    Regardless, I still have hope. Apple's M.O. is to squeeze every dollar out of a production/assembly line for as long as possible, and use up as many parts/components they have stock piled.

    Case in point... While all other iPad's moved to a bigger display, the "cheap" model was kept around to use up their 9.7" displays. It's this same reasoning this new iPad is the last iPad with an A10 - in fact, along with the iPod Touch, they're only Apple devices with an A10. (By this time next year, both will be upgraded to include a Neural Engine.)

    Having all price points covered now, doesn't prove a thing. Keeping the iPhone 8 and XR around isn't costing Apple anything - this is their normal way to milk as much cost as they can out of a product. It's my belief (see disclaimer), that during the traditional slow-down after the Holiday,. Apple will release the "SE 2". It will be an XR with a 4.7" display and priced at $499. The iPhone 8 will move down in price to $399.

    This time next year, the iPhone 8 will be gone and the SE 2 will down to $399...
    399 XR mini
    499 XR
    599 iPhone 11
    699 iPhone 12
    999 iPhone 12 Pro
    1099 iPhone 12 Pro Max
    With your negative opinion of Apple’s business practices I wonder why you are still a customer. If I thought a company was “milking” or “squeezing” me for my last dollar I sure wouldn’t continue to do business with them. Why do you?

    I think you misunderstood. Never said they were milking their customers... I said...

    Apple's M.O. is to squeeze every dollar out of a production/assembly line for as long as possible, and use up as many parts/components they have stock piled.

    and...

    this is their normal way to milk as much cost as they can out of a product.


    Personally, I think it's a brilliant business practice that cuts costs, maximizes profits and still allows them to offer products at a lower price.

    edited September 11 avon b7muthuk_vanalingamSamhainken burns effectbaconstangargonautJWSC
  • Reply 34 of 64
    Current iPhone SE owner here. I went from a 5s to a 6, and absolutely HATED the camera bump, and the bump in size. Skipped the 6S, and went to the SE as soon as it was available. I'm now on my 3rd SE. I used to buy a new phone every year, until Apple decided bigger is better. I want a phone that can disappear into my pocket, has a good camera, and can EASILY be used with one hand. I'll gladly return to my annual purchases if Apple can make a small phone. For things that require a bigger screen, I bring along my brand new iPad mini; with pencil support, it has replaced a paper notebook that was always with me.

    As for saying the 8 isn't that much bigger than the SE; it's bigger than a 6. It's big enough to be annoying to use.

    Apple, please go back to your trend of making the best and smallest. I'll gladly pay for a small phone loaded w/ the latest tech.

    And the naysayers who say "just get an apple watch". It's not the same. Not the same interface, not the same functionality, and it takes 2 hands to do anything aside from tell time or view whatever complication that's on the current display.

    If there is no small phone to replace the SE, and support / software updates for it ends, I may have to consider leaving the Apple ecosystem for something like the Palm Palm; a truly small phone.
    SamhainretrogustobaconstangGeorgeBMacargonaut
  • Reply 35 of 64
    So for 2019, starting prices:

    $449 - iPhone 8
    $549 - iPhone 8 Plus
    $599 - iPhone XR      
    $699 - iPhone 11
    $999 - iPhone 11 Pro
    $1099 - iPhone 11 Pro Max

    Based on rumors, maybe the "SE2" would come out next year with iPhone 8 form factor?  If so, maybe for 2020:

    $449ish - iPhone SE2 (or maybe even call it iPhone 9)
    $599 - iPhone 11
    $699 - iPhone 12
    $999 - iPhone 12 Pro
    $1099 - iPhone 12 Pro Max

    One last hurrah for those who want a relatively smaller phone size and/or classic Touch ID only.
    edited September 11
  • Reply 36 of 64
    razorpitrazorpit Posts: 1,075member
    moxom said:
    Viewing this on my iPhone 5. 

    I was hoping for a new small iPhone like a lot if people but I have now accepted that it's not going to happen. 

    Unfortunately, I have to change my phone now as many apps I use (including banking apps) no longer run which is a real shame as my phone is working great. 

    I may now consider getting a second hand iPhone SE or just go for an iPhone 8 which is at an attractive price now. 

    First World problems indeed...


    The 5 came out seven years ago. I'd say you had a good run with it.
    moxom
  • Reply 37 of 64
    macguimacgui Posts: 1,527member
    As for saying the 8 isn't that much bigger than the SE; it's bigger than a 6. It's big enough to be annoying to use.
    This ^ . All these suggestions of the 8 being 'close enough' miss that fact that for most of us wanting an updated SE, 'close enough' just isn't.

    I didn't think we'd get an updated SE, and I was right. Nothing even close. To be fair, there were no 'real' indications there would be one.

    The smallest phone in the new lineup is bigger than an 8, and even an 8 is bigger than I'd want. Put a case on it and it's even bigger.

    There's only so much that can be done to update and upgrade the SE form factor. And I'm all for living with that limitation. The iPhone 5~SE form factor isn't about wanting a 4" screen or about a cheap phone. It's about the size of the phone, the thing that's held in your hand and stored in a pocket. Fit as big a screen as possible, or don't (but please do, Apple). A upgraded CPU and maybe GPU would be all it takes to get my money. Anything else would be gravy.
    leftoverbaconmjtomlinbaconstangcornchip
  • Reply 38 of 64
    mjtomlinmjtomlin Posts: 2,028member
    Based on rumors, maybe the "SE2" would come out next year with iPhone 8 form factor?  If so, maybe for 2020:

    Noooooo!!! Haha.

    Most people with an SE would argue it's all about the size of the device, not the cost. An iPhone 8 is too big!!! Haha.

    I had a 6, didn't like it, was too big (and it got the "back pocket bends"), bought the SE as soon as it came out. And it's not about the display size, it's the overall size; a 4.7" display in an "X" design would probably be just a tad bit bigger than an SE.

    If they decide to never release another smallish phone, I'm sure I'll just eventually get an Apple Watch w/AirPods and keep my SE.
    edited September 11 Samhainargonaut
  • Reply 39 of 64
    I'll echo the stance of some on this board.  I'm a huge advocate of the iPhone SE form factor.... not so much for the size in of itself, but for the usability with one hand.  It fits very comfortably in my palm, with a near-perfect center of gravity that keeps it from teetering on the edge of catastrophe.  For reference, I have an iPhone 8 that I use for work, and the confidence I have when holding it in one-handed is minimal.  "Reachability" is a poor compromise, and the acrobatics that my (large-sized) hands have to go through to manipulate it one-handed is uncomfortable at best, and potentially disastrous at worst.  Apple and Jobs picked the original 3.5" form factor for a reason.  I have an iPad for a reason, and a tablet as a phone is not what many of us need (unless foldable screens make it into legitimate prime time).

    It's sad that I now find myself having to defend my iPhone SE from others when they see me using it.  It's a pity that the masses, in a never-ending propensity to value "bigger as better", have forgotten what it was like to hold balanced perfection in one hand.... The longer Apple neglects the one-handed phone market, the greater the chance that the public forgets or finally gives up on it.




    SamhainbaconstangDarkxPunkargonautcornchip
  • Reply 40 of 64
    I find people are conflating smaller phone with lesser price. The rumored iPhone 12, A14, 5.4 inch model will be smaller in physical size than the iPhone 8, and not much larger than an SE. The price will be $999. A low cost model with an A13 mimicking the iPhone 8 in size, but in an all aluminum casing, like the SE, for $349 is a real possibility for next spring. Those wanting a smaller phone will get it, but will pay the premium price. The smaller premium phone makes perfect sense. Currently, the three premium phones are projected to be, in terms of sales numbers, iPhone 11, iPhone 11 Pro Max, followed by the iPhone 11 Pro. By making the iPhone 12 Pro smaller, Apple can get a significant bump in demand for that phone. This is very clever.
    atomic101ken burns effect
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