US could hit Russia with export rule that killed Huawei, banning US tech

Posted:
in General Discussion edited February 2022
In response to the crisis in Ukraine, the U.S. could deploy an economic sanction that could cut off support to American technology in Russia -- including iOS and Android devices.

The Kremlin. Credit: Ivan Lapyrin/Unsplash
The Kremlin. Credit: Ivan Lapyrin/Unsplash


The U.S. government has been contemplating a range of economic sanctions on Russia as the country masses troops around Ukraine's borders. On Monday, the crisis escalated as Russian President Vladimir Putin recognized the independence of two breakaway regions in Ukraine and ordered troops into the areas as "peacekeeping" forces.

One of those economic sanctions could be a Russia-focused Foreign Direct Product Rule (FDPR), according to U.S. think tank The Atlantic Council. Depending on its scope, the rule could cripple Russia's ability to source or use technology originating in the U.S.

If the rule sounds familiar, it's because the U.S. Commerce Department levied it against China-based smartphone manufacturer Huawei in 2019. As a result of the rule, Huawei was cut off from using U.S. chips or the Android operating system.

Since the ban was put into effect, Huawei's market share has plunged.

The effects of such a ban on an entire country will depend on its scope and breadth. However, The Washington Post points out that there isn't a chip or semiconductor on the planet made without U.S. tools or designed without U.S. software. So, there's no limit on how broad the U.S. ban could be.

According to The Economist correspondent Hal Hodson, it's possible to "say a few things about what applying the FDPR to Russia as a whole is likely to do."

Immediately after the ban, iPhone and Android devices could become less functional as App Store support and underlying protocols get cut off. Apple and Google would be forced to stop sending updates to their devices in Russia.

Even apps developed in Russia will be cut off from sending updates to U.S. app marketplaces. Phone networks and data centers could also be banned from using American software or hardware.

In other words, it would cripple Russia's ability to use any technology connected to the U.S. in any conceivable way.

Most of the discussion I see is around economic sanctions, how Russia is prepared, how they won't do much. but undermining a whole country's supply chains like this has never been done before. it has effectively destroyed Huawei. I think it caused serious pain to Russians

-- hal (@halhod)


The goal of an FDPR rule will likely be U.S. national security interests. The Atlantic Council says that the focus would be "hindering Russia's ability to procure crucial chips, integrated circuits, and microprocessors, as well as other advanced technologies." Those technologies are critical to Russia sectors like defense, civil aviation, and artificial intelligence.

"So far, the threat of the FDPR or other regulatory action has not induced the Kremlin to stand down, but Russia may soon join Huawei in realizing the potency of these measures," Annie Froehlich of The Atlantic Council wrote.

The U.S. is also preparing for such a ban. Earlier in February, the Commerce Department reorganized and reclassified rules that describe what foreign-produced items are and are not subject to export controls.

Leaders in the U.S. and its allies have already likened Russia's "peacekeeping" operations in eastern Ukraine to an invasion. The U.S. previously promised "swift and severe" consequences if an invasion occurs.

U.S. President Joe Biden is set to provide an update on the Russia-Ukraine crisis at 2 p.m. Eastern Time on Tuesday. The U.S. is also expected to announce a new set of sanctions, which could include the FDPR.

Read on AppleInsider
«13456710

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 193
    jas99jas99 Posts: 163member
    Full-scale sanctions should scare Putin. 
    edited February 2022 appleuseryeah
  • Reply 2 of 193
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,453member
    jas99 said:
    Full-scale sanctions should scare Putin. 
    The U.S. has backing on tech export controls from Japan, Singapore, and Taiwan. 

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/02/22/biden-russia-ukraine-sanctions-asia-allies-export-controls-invasion-plans/
    viclauyycwatto_cobrajony0
  • Reply 3 of 193
    Weak. 

    Gotta love the pundits Talking up this cop out like it’s something amazing. 

    America is supposed to be the international policeman. Walking softly but carrying a big stick to use when necessary. 

    Instead of defending freedom, we stand by and watch it crushed while shaking dollar signs the the bad guys with missiles. 

    Putin has China as an ally and Russia counterfeits American goods anyway. This isn’t going to do squat unfortunately. 

    Sanctions suck. Go and do some good in the world. Add the sanctions to that. 

    You let a bully beat up other kids and he just gets worse. Not looking good. 

    God help Ukraine. 
    edited February 2022 tmaymacplusplusbyronlviclauyycsconosciutogatorguy
  • Reply 4 of 193
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 5 of 193
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,453member
    Weak. 

    Gotta love the pundits Talking up this cop out like it’s something amazing. 

    America is supposed to be the international policeman. Walking softly but carrying a big stick to use when necessary. 

    Instead of defending freedom, we stand by and watch it crushed while shaking dollar signs the the bad guys with missiles. 

    Putin has China as an ally and Russia counterfeits American goods anyway. This isn’t going to do squat unfortunately. 

    Sanctions suck. Go and do some good in the world. Add the sanctions to that. 

    You let a bully beat up other kids and he just gets worse. Not looking good. 

    God help Ukraine. 
    The reason that the U.S., et al, doesn't engage in direct warfare with Russia, is that Russia has a similar number of nuclear weapons to the U.S., and Putin is daft enough to use them if he is cornered. Not unsurprisingly, Russia doesn't engage with the U.S., EU, or NATO, directly either. 

    While I would like to see the U.S. engage Russian forces in Ukraine, the best that will happen is that we will arm the Ukrainians, and place broad sanctions on Russia, its Oligarchs, and indirectly, Putin. 
    edited February 2022 watto_cobrajony0
  • Reply 6 of 193
    Great idea, destroy the planet, that will show him.
    macplusplusctt_zhbyronldewmewatto_cobra
  • Reply 7 of 193
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    emoeller said:
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.

    Putin is far from maniacal.   He is calculating.  Coldly, calculating for what is best for his country.

    In 2014 Hillary promised Ukraine a NATO membership if they left the Russian fold.
    NATO and its missiles, fighter planes, bombers, tanks, etc... on Russia's border are a direct threat to Russia -- just as they were to us in 1960 when Russia started moving them into Cuba.
    How did Putin respond to Hillary's foolishness?  By making sure she was not elected president.  And, we didn't hear anymore about NATO in Ukraine till Biden took office.

    How did Russia respond to all of that?
    Russia wanted ALL Ukrainians to have a vote - so they supported the Minsk agreement.  But western Ukraine blocked it (after agreeing to it) -- so only western Ukrainians got to vote -- and they are voting to let in NATO missiles next door to Russia.   Russia is understandably worried about that -- just as we were when missiles were shipped to Cuba in 1960 when we said:  Either remove them or there WILL BE WAR!

    The west knows better than to face Russia militarily.  So it is taking the Trump route with "sanctions".
    But, like with Trump's.  It is us who will pay the price. Oil prices are already headed up to $100.

    Meanwhile, we've been throwing economic warfare around since 2016 and those we are targeting are beginning to take action to defend themselves.  That will weaken us even further.  Actually, a LOT further when the dollar and U.S. financial systems are no longer the world standard.

    The losers in this cock fight will be, once again, us, the people.
    All we have to do is commit to never letting NATO into Ukraine and this nonsense would be at an end.  We would lose nothing and the world would gain peace.
    But no.  Instead we're starting an economic war.
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.

    ctt_zhwaveparticlebyronlappleuseryeahFileMakerFellerphonephreak
  • Reply 8 of 193
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,453member
    emoeller said:
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.

    Putin is far from maniacal.   He is calculating.  Coldly, calculating for what is best for his country.

    In 2014 Hillary promised Ukraine a NATO membership if they left the Russian fold.
    NATO and its missiles, fighter planes, bombers, tanks, etc... on Russia's border are a direct threat to Russia -- just as they were to us in 1960 when Russia started moving them into Cuba.
    How did Putin respond to Hillary's foolishness?  By making sure she was not elected president.  And, we didn't hear anymore about NATO in Ukraine till Biden took office.

    How did Russia respond to all of that?
    Russia wanted ALL Ukrainians to have a vote - so they supported the Minsk agreement.  But western Ukraine blocked it (after agreeing to it) -- so only western Ukrainians got to vote -- and they are voting to let in NATO missiles next door to Russia.   Russia is understandably worried about that -- just as we were when missiles were shipped to Cuba in 1960 when we said:  Either remove them or there WILL BE WAR!

    The west knows better than to face Russia militarily.  So it is taking the Trump route with "sanctions".
    But, like with Trump's.  It is us who will pay the price. Oil prices are already headed up to $100.

    Meanwhile, we've been throwing economic warfare around since 2016 and those we are targeting are beginning to take action to defend themselves.  That will weaken us even further.  Actually, a LOT further when the dollar and U.S. financial systems are no longer the world standard.

    The losers in this cock fight will be, once again, us, the people.
    All we have to do is commit to never letting NATO into Ukraine and this nonsense would be at an end.  We would lose nothing and the world would gain peace.
    But no.  Instead we're starting an economic war.
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.

    The post above is chock full of misinformation.

    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.

    Here a twitter link to current news on the Ukraine Crisis;

    https://twitter.com/i/lists/1494877848087187461
    edited February 2022 lolliver9secondkox2drdavidJapheysandorqwerty52watto_cobra
  • Reply 9 of 193
    Deprive Russians from iPhones is inhuman !
    waveparticlewatto_cobra
  • Reply 10 of 193
    tmay said:
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.
    The post above is chock full of misinformation.
    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.
    It's actually entertaining whenever GBM speaks. I always wonder how he's going to defend brutal dictatorships, and he always manages. I would like to have seen him defend the dictatorships back around 1940.

    I wish websites like this would have a way we could block certain users from being seen by us. I know a few people would block me, but I think GBM would take top spot.
    tmay9secondkox2radarthekatdewmedrdavidappleuseryeahJapheyqwerty52watto_cobrajony0
  • Reply 11 of 193
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    tmay said:
    emoeller said:
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.

    Putin is far from maniacal.   He is calculating.  Coldly, calculating for what is best for his country.

    In 2014 Hillary promised Ukraine a NATO membership if they left the Russian fold.
    NATO and its missiles, fighter planes, bombers, tanks, etc... on Russia's border are a direct threat to Russia -- just as they were to us in 1960 when Russia started moving them into Cuba.
    How did Putin respond to Hillary's foolishness?  By making sure she was not elected president.  And, we didn't hear anymore about NATO in Ukraine till Biden took office.

    How did Russia respond to all of that?
    Russia wanted ALL Ukrainians to have a vote - so they supported the Minsk agreement.  But western Ukraine blocked it (after agreeing to it) -- so only western Ukrainians got to vote -- and they are voting to let in NATO missiles next door to Russia.   Russia is understandably worried about that -- just as we were when missiles were shipped to Cuba in 1960 when we said:  Either remove them or there WILL BE WAR!

    The west knows better than to face Russia militarily.  So it is taking the Trump route with "sanctions".
    But, like with Trump's.  It is us who will pay the price. Oil prices are already headed up to $100.

    Meanwhile, we've been throwing economic warfare around since 2016 and those we are targeting are beginning to take action to defend themselves.  That will weaken us even further.  Actually, a LOT further when the dollar and U.S. financial systems are no longer the world standard.

    The losers in this cock fight will be, once again, us, the people.
    All we have to do is commit to never letting NATO into Ukraine and this nonsense would be at an end.  We would lose nothing and the world would gain peace.
    But no.  Instead we're starting an economic war.
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.

    The post above is chock full of misinformation.

    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.

    Here a twitter link to current news on the Ukraine Crisis;

    https://twitter.com/i/lists/1494877848087187461

    Sorry, if it doesn't fit your agenda:  Spread Democracy -- even at the expense of a war.
    Sorry, too if the truth doesn't fit with your propaganda.
    9secondkox2
  • Reply 12 of 193
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    tmay said:
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.
    The post above is chock full of misinformation.
    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.
    It's actually entertaining whenever GBM speaks. I always wonder how he's going to defend brutal dictatorships, and he always manages. I would like to have seen him defend the dictatorships back around 1940.

    I wish websites like this would have a way we could block certain users from being seen by us. I know a few people would block me, but I think GBM would take top spot.

    I don;t defend "brutal dictatorships".
    But I do object to instigating totally unnecessary wars.

    All we have to do is guarantee that NATO will not threaten Russia by moving into (another of) its neighbor(s).
    But, we instead favor war.   Economic war (at least for us).  But still, war.

    Who is going to pay for this war of ours?   As usual, it will be us.

    But, I am sorry if the truth does not support your war mongering imperialism.  Perhaps it is YOU that should be blocked?
    byronl9secondkox2
  • Reply 13 of 193
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    hydrogen said:
    Deprive Russians from iPhones is inhuman !

    So the U.S. is considering weaponizing its biggest and best corporation.  What could possibly go wrong?
    byronl9secondkox2
  • Reply 14 of 193
    JWSCJWSC Posts: 1,203member
    tmay said:
    emoeller said:
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.

    Putin is far from maniacal.   He is calculating.  Coldly, calculating for what is best for his country.

    In 2014 Hillary promised Ukraine a NATO membership if they left the Russian fold.
    NATO and its missiles, fighter planes, bombers, tanks, etc... on Russia's border are a direct threat to Russia -- just as they were to us in 1960 when Russia started moving them into Cuba.
    How did Putin respond to Hillary's foolishness?  By making sure she was not elected president.  And, we didn't hear anymore about NATO in Ukraine till Biden took office.

    How did Russia respond to all of that?
    Russia wanted ALL Ukrainians to have a vote - so they supported the Minsk agreement.  But western Ukraine blocked it (after agreeing to it) -- so only western Ukrainians got to vote -- and they are voting to let in NATO missiles next door to Russia.   Russia is understandably worried about that -- just as we were when missiles were shipped to Cuba in 1960 when we said:  Either remove them or there WILL BE WAR!

    The west knows better than to face Russia militarily.  So it is taking the Trump route with "sanctions".
    But, like with Trump's.  It is us who will pay the price. Oil prices are already headed up to $100.

    Meanwhile, we've been throwing economic warfare around since 2016 and those we are targeting are beginning to take action to defend themselves.  That will weaken us even further.  Actually, a LOT further when the dollar and U.S. financial systems are no longer the world standard.

    The losers in this cock fight will be, once again, us, the people.
    All we have to do is commit to never letting NATO into Ukraine and this nonsense would be at an end.  We would lose nothing and the world would gain peace.
    But no.  Instead we're starting an economic war.
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.

    The post above is chock full of misinformation.

    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.

    Here a twitter link to current news on the Ukraine Crisis;

    https://twitter.com/i/lists/1494877848087187461
    I don’t know about the misinformation part. While I don’t agree with everything George said above, I agree with most of it, especially the conclusion. The losers will be us.

    Economic sanctions will be ineffective and only hurt technology businesses such as Apple. Banning the direct sales of iPhones and Macs will only encourage third party intermediaries. It’s pointless.
    GeorgeBMacOferbyronl9secondkox2
  • Reply 15 of 193
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,453member
    JWSC said:
    tmay said:
    emoeller said:
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.

    Putin is far from maniacal.   He is calculating.  Coldly, calculating for what is best for his country.

    In 2014 Hillary promised Ukraine a NATO membership if they left the Russian fold.
    NATO and its missiles, fighter planes, bombers, tanks, etc... on Russia's border are a direct threat to Russia -- just as they were to us in 1960 when Russia started moving them into Cuba.
    How did Putin respond to Hillary's foolishness?  By making sure she was not elected president.  And, we didn't hear anymore about NATO in Ukraine till Biden took office.

    How did Russia respond to all of that?
    Russia wanted ALL Ukrainians to have a vote - so they supported the Minsk agreement.  But western Ukraine blocked it (after agreeing to it) -- so only western Ukrainians got to vote -- and they are voting to let in NATO missiles next door to Russia.   Russia is understandably worried about that -- just as we were when missiles were shipped to Cuba in 1960 when we said:  Either remove them or there WILL BE WAR!

    The west knows better than to face Russia militarily.  So it is taking the Trump route with "sanctions".
    But, like with Trump's.  It is us who will pay the price. Oil prices are already headed up to $100.

    Meanwhile, we've been throwing economic warfare around since 2016 and those we are targeting are beginning to take action to defend themselves.  That will weaken us even further.  Actually, a LOT further when the dollar and U.S. financial systems are no longer the world standard.

    The losers in this cock fight will be, once again, us, the people.
    All we have to do is commit to never letting NATO into Ukraine and this nonsense would be at an end.  We would lose nothing and the world would gain peace.
    But no.  Instead we're starting an economic war.
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.

    The post above is chock full of misinformation.

    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.

    Here a twitter link to current news on the Ukraine Crisis;

    https://twitter.com/i/lists/1494877848087187461
    I don’t know about the misinformation part. While I don’t agree with everything George said above, I agree with most of it, especially the conclusion. The losers will be us.

    Economic sanctions will be ineffective and only hurt technology businesses such as Apple. Banning the direct sales of iPhones and Macs will only encourage third party intermediaries. It’s pointless.
    So, you didn't investigate any of George's claims, and you are passively on the side of Russia, because there is some kind of indirect financial pain that technology businesses will feel.

    Good to know.

    Meanwhile, the EU is ramping up sanctions, and the EU will definitely feel the economic pain of that, for a short time anyway;

    https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/statement_22_1281

    The decision of the Russian Federation to recognise as independent entities and send Russian troops to certain areas of Ukraine's Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts is illegal and unacceptable. It violates international law, Ukraine's territorial integrity and sovereignty, Russia's own international commitments and it further escalates the crisis.

    Both Presidents welcome the steadfast unity of Member States and their determination to react with robustness and speed to the illegal actions of Russia in close coordination with international partners.

    An informal meeting of EU Foreign Affairs Ministers chaired by the High Representative will take place today at 4 pm. Following that, a first package of sanctions will be formally tabled later this afternoon.

    Appropriate bodies will then meet to finalise the package without delay.

    The package contains proposals:

    • to target those who were involved in the illegal decision,
    • to target banks that are financing Russian military and other operations in those territories,
    • to target the ability of the Russian state and government to access the EU's capital and financial markets and services, to limit the financing of escalatory and aggressive policies,
    • and to target trade from the two breakaway regions to and from the EU, to ensure that those responsible clearly feel the economic consequences of their illegal and aggressive actions.

    The EU has prepared and stands ready to adopt additional measures at a later stage if needed in the light of further developments.

    Both Presidents supported by the High Representative continue to follow closely developments on the ground and consult with fellow EU leaders and international counterparts.

    The Union remains in full solidarity with Ukraine and united in support for its sovereignty and territorial integrity.

    We stand by and will continue to support Ukraine and its people.

    Were you aware that mothers in Ukraine are pinning the blood types of their children onto their children's clothing, just in case something happens, like you know, a brutal invasion by Russia into their lives?
    edited February 2022 lolliver9secondkox2radarthekatdrdavidJapheyqwerty52watto_cobrajony0
  • Reply 16 of 193
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    tmay said:
    JWSC said:
    tmay said:
    emoeller said:
    Putin is maniacal and not easily dissuaded.   If both iOS and Android were cut off that would be devastating as the home grown mobile OS that Russia is using is terrible.   Along with other sanctions it would cripple the Russian economy.

    Putin is far from maniacal.   He is calculating.  Coldly, calculating for what is best for his country.

    In 2014 Hillary promised Ukraine a NATO membership if they left the Russian fold.
    NATO and its missiles, fighter planes, bombers, tanks, etc... on Russia's border are a direct threat to Russia -- just as they were to us in 1960 when Russia started moving them into Cuba.
    How did Putin respond to Hillary's foolishness?  By making sure she was not elected president.  And, we didn't hear anymore about NATO in Ukraine till Biden took office.

    How did Russia respond to all of that?
    Russia wanted ALL Ukrainians to have a vote - so they supported the Minsk agreement.  But western Ukraine blocked it (after agreeing to it) -- so only western Ukrainians got to vote -- and they are voting to let in NATO missiles next door to Russia.   Russia is understandably worried about that -- just as we were when missiles were shipped to Cuba in 1960 when we said:  Either remove them or there WILL BE WAR!

    The west knows better than to face Russia militarily.  So it is taking the Trump route with "sanctions".
    But, like with Trump's.  It is us who will pay the price. Oil prices are already headed up to $100.

    Meanwhile, we've been throwing economic warfare around since 2016 and those we are targeting are beginning to take action to defend themselves.  That will weaken us even further.  Actually, a LOT further when the dollar and U.S. financial systems are no longer the world standard.

    The losers in this cock fight will be, once again, us, the people.
    All we have to do is commit to never letting NATO into Ukraine and this nonsense would be at an end.  We would lose nothing and the world would gain peace.
    But no.  Instead we're starting an economic war.
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.

    The post above is chock full of misinformation.

    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.

    Here a twitter link to current news on the Ukraine Crisis;

    https://twitter.com/i/lists/1494877848087187461
    I don’t know about the misinformation part. While I don’t agree with everything George said above, I agree with most of it, especially the conclusion. The losers will be us.

    Economic sanctions will be ineffective and only hurt technology businesses such as Apple. Banning the direct sales of iPhones and Macs will only encourage third party intermediaries. It’s pointless.
    So, you didn't investigate any of George's claims, and you are passively on the side of Russia, because there is some kind of indirect financial pain that technology businesses will feel.
    ...
    Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld used the same approach to intimidate people into supporting the war that they were selling:  "If you don't support this war you are a traitor".  People even stopped eating FrenchFries because they, in our eyes, were traitors because they wouldn't support our foolish, crazy cock fight -- err, I mean "war".

    by the way, they are not "Claims".  They are facts.  real ones.  Sorry though if they don't support the war you are trying to sell.

    There are such things as facts and right vs wrong -- and smart vs stupid.
    Maybe those are the things YOU should be investigating.
  • Reply 17 of 193
    jas99 said:
    Full-scale sanctions should scare Putin. 
    No, they won't. Russia's mentality is different from the Western one. This is what Western leaders do not understand about Russia to their cost. It is like: "The more you hit us, the stronger and more united we become". Russia cannot be fought with sanctions because they only make people unite with Putin. People see him as the only protector and US as their main enemy. The only way to fight Russia is as it was done in 1985: give them something sweet and slow destroy from inside. There were professionals at that time, who knew this about Russia. There are none now. That's why it is not working now.
    byronl9secondkox2GeorgeBMacJapheyFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 18 of 193
    mike1mike1 Posts: 3,409member

    tmay said:
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.
    The post above is chock full of misinformation.
    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.
    It's actually entertaining whenever GBM speaks. I always wonder how he's going to defend brutal dictatorships, and he always manages. I would like to have seen him defend the dictatorships back around 1940.

    I wish websites like this would have a way we could block certain users from being seen by us. I know a few people would block me, but I think GBM would take top spot.

    I don;t defend "brutal dictatorships".
    But I do object to instigating totally unnecessary wars.

    All we have to do is guarantee that NATO will not threaten Russia by moving into (another of) its neighbor(s).
    But, we instead favor war.   Economic war (at least for us).  But still, war.

    Who is going to pay for this war of ours?   As usual, it will be us.

    But, I am sorry if the truth does not support your war mongering imperialism.  Perhaps it is YOU that should be blocked?

    I thought Neville Chamberlain died in 1940.
    So, we guarantee that Ukraine won't join NATO. Russia then invades or usurps Ukraine's democracy, like they did Belarus.
    Then Russia's interests border Poland, Slovakia, Romania and further isolate the Baltic states.
    Then they say NATO membership for Poland, Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania must be revoked. Or else.
    At best, we are at the same borders before the demise of the Warsaw Pact, at worst, he makes a play for all of Europe.

    Does any of this sound at all familiar???
    tmaylolliverradarthekatdrdavidJapheysandorqwerty52jony0
  • Reply 19 of 193
    One more thing to add. If we assume US imposes sanctions on Germany, for example, what would Germany do? Weep and plead for forgiveness. What would Russia do? Show middle finger to US and go to work harder. As usual. Russia has several thousands (!!!) of years of economic troubles and wars. It never lived well and very few had any wealth at all. So even if sanctions make life a little harder, russians are used to it. "If it does not kill, it only makes us stronger" - this is a typical opinion. And another: "Who comes to us with a sword, will die from that sword". That one is about 2000 years old and still very popular.

    So, guys, really, if you want all this madness to end, ask US/EU leaders to get some really good advisers, who understand how russians think. It is impossible to win without understanding your enemy. And it does not seem like anybody understands russians or Putin.
    byronl9secondkox2GeorgeBMacJWSCJapheyFileMakerFellercat52
  • Reply 20 of 193
    tmay said:
    ... Stupid.   Very, very stupid.
    The post above is chock full of misinformation.
    Given the many times that I have countered George since he has been here, I'll spare you the details. Do your own searches on the details.
    It's actually entertaining whenever GBM speaks. I always wonder how he's going to defend brutal dictatorships, and he always manages. I would like to have seen him defend the dictatorships back around 1940.

    I wish websites like this would have a way we could block certain users from being seen by us. I know a few people would block me, but I think GBM would take top spot.

    I don;t defend "brutal dictatorships".
    But I do object to instigating totally unnecessary wars.

    All we have to do is guarantee that NATO will not threaten Russia by moving into (another of) its neighbor(s).
    But, we instead favor war.   Economic war (at least for us).  But still, war.

    Who is going to pay for this war of ours?   As usual, it will be us.

    But, I am sorry if the truth does not support your war mongering imperialism.  Perhaps it is YOU that should be blocked?
    Firstly, I never said your posts should be blocked from anyone else but myself. I said I wanted to be able to block your posts so that I don't have to see them. Your constant stream of defending dictators is very tiring to me.

    And yes, I would fully support your desires to block me from your own view. In fact, I'd be happy to do it myself if this website allowed me to do that.
    9secondkox2drdavidJapheyqwerty52
Sign In or Register to comment.