Don't expect more then a new G4 at 1.25ghz, 1.3ghz, 1.4ghz probably all duals. FSB may be higher and we may get true DDR now. The case won't change too much because the vents on the MDD were meant for the new G4 mobo because it runs rather hot.
<strong>The outrageous predictions are starting already.
Don't expect more then a new G4 at 1.25ghz, 1.3ghz, 1.4ghz probably all duals. FSB may be higher and we may get true DDR now. The case won't change too much because the vents on the MDD were meant for the new G4 mobo because it runs rather hot.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So now we are getting 'real' DDR ? How with the 7457 g4? Motorola has implied NO DDR BUS FOR G4 UNTIL 2004 AT THE EARLIEST! If then even! According to the PDF that the leaked on their site. Don't fool yourselves into think it 'might' happen. 970 is our only way out of the bus bottleneck we face.
So now we are getting 'real' DDR ? How with the 7457 g4? Motorola has implied NO DDR BUS FOR G4 UNTIL 2004 AT THE EARLIEST! If then even! According to the PDF that the leaked on their site. Don't fool yourselves into think it 'might' happen. 970 is our only way out of the bus bottleneck we face.</strong><hr></blockquote>
<a href="http://www.macrumors.com"; target="_blank">www.macrumors.com</a> has a story on upcoming PowerMacs that will have up to 1.43GHz G4. I can't for the life of me figure out what the bus speed would be.
That macrumors rumor look about right. The last speed bump was 250 MHz. This is even less so it looks very Motorolian. By less I mean that if they want to keep up with half the clock speed of the P4 they need to do more. Currently they are 1810 MHz behind the P4 to close that gap to "only" 1530 MHz they need the speedbump to be 280 MHz not 180 MHz as the 1.43 would entail.
<strong>So now we are getting 'real' DDR ? How with the 7457 g4? Motorola has implied NO DDR BUS FOR G4 UNTIL 2004 AT THE EARLIEST! If then even! According to the PDF that the leaked on their site. Don't fool yourselves into think it 'might' happen. 970 is our only way out of the bus bottleneck we face.</strong><hr></blockquote>
The last (and only) statement from Motorola about the MPX bus was that it would never go DDR, and probably wouldn't exceed 167 MHz. I could see Apple pushing the envelop to 200 MHz, but they couldn't add DDR unless Motorola did it... and adding DDR basically makes it a new bus, breaking compatibility with their other customers who have MPX compatible devices in the embedded market. When & if Motorola brings the memory controller into the G4 itself, then we will see DDR memory support.
On the topic of initial 970 speeds, remember that IBM is generally conservative. I'd expect 1.8 GHz to be the lowest top speed that we might see on introduction, and its possible that they'll have enough faster ones to let Apple ship an "Ultimate" model... if Apple's chipset can run that fast!
<strong>A few years later, they attempted to create the first 64-bit PowerPC, only to suffer a total design failure. The result is that IBM created a 64-bit Power4 series chip with
Power ISA only, which wasn't compatible with 32-bit PowerPC.</strong><hr></blockquote>
This is wrong...
The PowerPC 620 wasn't a "design failure" because of the 32-bit / 64-bit thing, it had problems because it was pushing the envelop of what was possible at the time. And it did ship eventually, and it did work. It was expensive, didn't significantly outperform the 604e, and didn't attract a customer base.
The POWER4 has a 32-bit compatibility mode, just like the 970 -- it was not added for the 970. Only AltiVec was added.
The other points in the article are more correct though. The 64-bit version of MacOS X shouldn't be a "big deal" for Apple to build and ship, and they've probably been working toward it since they started on MacOS X a few years ago. There are numerous 64-bit Unixes out there to lead the way. It will be significantly easier than Microsoft's transition, and they've been working on it at least as long.
The last (and only) statement from Motorola about the MPX bus was that it would never go DDR, and probably wouldn't exceed 167 MHz. I could see Apple pushing the envelop to 200 MHz, but they couldn't add DDR unless Motorola did it... and adding DDR basically makes it a new bus, breaking compatibility with their other customers who have MPX compatible devices in the embedded market. When & if Motorola brings the memory controller into the G4 itself, then we will see DDR memory support.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I was referring to the leaked PDF on Motorolas site that they eventually took down. it made reference to a 7457-RM that utilized a DDR bus. I don't know the nature of the bus (MPX or something new) but it was a tentative schedule. And it was slated for 2004, that's why I said IF even then. Personally i don't think we'll EVER see the 7457-RM, especially if Apple goes all 970 on the PowerMac.
When & if Motorola brings the memory controller into the G4 itself, then we will see DDR memory support.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I could be wrong but here but it looks like Motorola already has an integrated memory controller on the mpc8540. Check out this link and click on the block diagram:
<strong>The outrageous predictions are starting already.
Don't expect more then a new G4 at 1.25ghz, 1.3ghz, 1.4ghz probably all duals. FSB may be higher and we may get true DDR now. The case won't change too much because the vents on the MDD were meant for the new G4 mobo because it runs rather hot.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Count on dual 1GHz, 1.25GHz and 1.43 GHz in the current enclosures without true DDR.
<strong>Don't get your hopes up. I have been told no Power Mac update till April....</strong><hr></blockquote>
But who told you? More like early February since Apple has a history of evenly spacing their tower speedbumps. Unless, of course, you don't expect the 970s until MWSF 04.
I could be wrong but here but it looks like Motorola already has an integrated memory controller on the mpc8540. Check out this link and click on the block diagram:
If the 7457 is shipping later than (we) expected, and the 970 is shipping earlier than (some of us) expect, I can see why Apple would delay. They'd have barely ramped up production on a mediocre speed bump before they had to switch to an all-new CPU.
I can't imagine Apple delaying the 970 introduction in order to milk the 7457 for one more generation.
If the '57 was coming off the lines now, they could speed bump the PM and get a mild sales boost for a few months. If it's going to be more than 30 days, though, there's no real harm in waiting a few months for the big change. PM sales will suffer, but what's new? And, would a bump to 1.43GHz impact that in any significant way?
I think that the iMac and eMac introductions were delayed along with the 7457. Those will be able to jump up and over 1GHz in a month or two, and the PowerBook shortly thereafter. With the introduction of the 12" PB, I don't really know what Apple will do with the iBook CPU-wise.
[QB]Don't get your hopes up. I have been told no Power Mac update till April....[QB]<hr></blockquote>
Well, that could possibly fit with news that the 970 will start volume production in March. Anounce in April, maybe ship one before the end of the month, then ramp up for the next couple of months (as has been done before).
[quote]Originally posted by gfeier:
[QB]
The first commandment of ALL religions is to provide a comfortable living for the priesthood.
[QB]<hr></blockquote>
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" /> Or is it just a joke?
Comments
Don't expect more then a new G4 at 1.25ghz, 1.3ghz, 1.4ghz probably all duals. FSB may be higher and we may get true DDR now. The case won't change too much because the vents on the MDD were meant for the new G4 mobo because it runs rather hot.
<strong>The outrageous predictions are starting already.
Don't expect more then a new G4 at 1.25ghz, 1.3ghz, 1.4ghz probably all duals. FSB may be higher and we may get true DDR now. The case won't change too much because the vents on the MDD were meant for the new G4 mobo because it runs rather hot.</strong><hr></blockquote>
So now we are getting 'real' DDR ? How with the 7457 g4? Motorola has implied NO DDR BUS FOR G4 UNTIL 2004 AT THE EARLIEST! If then even! According to the PDF that the leaked on their site. Don't fool yourselves into think it 'might' happen. 970 is our only way out of the bus bottleneck we face.
<strong>
So now we are getting 'real' DDR ? How with the 7457 g4? Motorola has implied NO DDR BUS FOR G4 UNTIL 2004 AT THE EARLIEST! If then even! According to the PDF that the leaked on their site. Don't fool yourselves into think it 'might' happen. 970 is our only way out of the bus bottleneck we face.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I said 'may'.
[ 01-08-2003: Message edited by: KidRed ]</p>
That comes up alot in conversation about Motorola.
Lemon Bon Bon
That sucks.
[Edit]
12%. Still sucks.
That's what I get for trying to do math in my head when I've just woken up!
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: NukemHill ]</p>
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: DrBoar ]</p>
<strong>So now we are getting 'real' DDR ? How with the 7457 g4? Motorola has implied NO DDR BUS FOR G4 UNTIL 2004 AT THE EARLIEST! If then even! According to the PDF that the leaked on their site. Don't fool yourselves into think it 'might' happen. 970 is our only way out of the bus bottleneck we face.</strong><hr></blockquote>
The last (and only) statement from Motorola about the MPX bus was that it would never go DDR, and probably wouldn't exceed 167 MHz. I could see Apple pushing the envelop to 200 MHz, but they couldn't add DDR unless Motorola did it... and adding DDR basically makes it a new bus, breaking compatibility with their other customers who have MPX compatible devices in the embedded market. When & if Motorola brings the memory controller into the G4 itself, then we will see DDR memory support.
On the topic of initial 970 speeds, remember that IBM is generally conservative. I'd expect 1.8 GHz to be the lowest top speed that we might see on introduction, and its possible that they'll have enough faster ones to let Apple ship an "Ultimate" model... if Apple's chipset can run that fast!
<strong>1.4 GH on the high-end? Only a 10% increase in 6 months?
That sucks.
[Edit]
12%. Still sucks.
That's what I get for trying to do math in my head when I've just woken up!
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I'd wait for the 970 before getting your hopes up.
<strong>A few years later, they attempted to create the first 64-bit PowerPC, only to suffer a total design failure. The result is that IBM created a 64-bit Power4 series chip with
Power ISA only, which wasn't compatible with 32-bit PowerPC.</strong><hr></blockquote>
This is wrong...
The PowerPC 620 wasn't a "design failure" because of the 32-bit / 64-bit thing, it had problems because it was pushing the envelop of what was possible at the time. And it did ship eventually, and it did work. It was expensive, didn't significantly outperform the 604e, and didn't attract a customer base.
The POWER4 has a 32-bit compatibility mode, just like the 970 -- it was not added for the 970. Only AltiVec was added.
The other points in the article are more correct though. The 64-bit version of MacOS X shouldn't be a "big deal" for Apple to build and ship, and they've probably been working toward it since they started on MacOS X a few years ago. There are numerous 64-bit Unixes out there to lead the way. It will be significantly easier than Microsoft's transition, and they've been working on it at least as long.
<strong>
The last (and only) statement from Motorola about the MPX bus was that it would never go DDR, and probably wouldn't exceed 167 MHz. I could see Apple pushing the envelop to 200 MHz, but they couldn't add DDR unless Motorola did it... and adding DDR basically makes it a new bus, breaking compatibility with their other customers who have MPX compatible devices in the embedded market. When & if Motorola brings the memory controller into the G4 itself, then we will see DDR memory support.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I was referring to the leaked PDF on Motorolas site that they eventually took down. it made reference to a 7457-RM that utilized a DDR bus. I don't know the nature of the bus (MPX or something new) but it was a tentative schedule. And it was slated for 2004, that's why I said IF even then. Personally i don't think we'll EVER see the 7457-RM, especially if Apple goes all 970 on the PowerMac.
Thats also what I've been hearing, with 970 comming in fall.
<strong>
When & if Motorola brings the memory controller into the G4 itself, then we will see DDR memory support.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I could be wrong but here but it looks like Motorola already has an integrated memory controller on the mpc8540. Check out this link and click on the block diagram:
<a href="http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=MPC8540&nodeId=018rH3bTdG865 5" target="_blank">http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=MPC8540&nodeId=018rH3bTdG865 5</a>
It shows a 20GB/s bandwidth for the DDR SDRAM memory interface.
<strong>The outrageous predictions are starting already.
Don't expect more then a new G4 at 1.25ghz, 1.3ghz, 1.4ghz probably all duals. FSB may be higher and we may get true DDR now. The case won't change too much because the vents on the MDD were meant for the new G4 mobo because it runs rather hot.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Count on dual 1GHz, 1.25GHz and 1.43 GHz in the current enclosures without true DDR.
<strong>Don't get your hopes up. I have been told no Power Mac update till April....</strong><hr></blockquote>
But who told you? More like early February since Apple has a history of evenly spacing their tower speedbumps. Unless, of course, you don't expect the 970s until MWSF 04.
<strong>
I could be wrong but here but it looks like Motorola already has an integrated memory controller on the mpc8540. Check out this link and click on the block diagram:
<a href="http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=MPC8540&nodeId=018rH3bTdG865 5" target="_blank">http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=MPC8540&nodeId=018rH3bTdG865 5</a>
It shows a 20GB/s bandwidth for the DDR SDRAM memory interface.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Keyword:MPC8540
Thats not a g4 and don't even suggests that its the g5
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: O and A ]</p>
I can't imagine Apple delaying the 970 introduction in order to milk the 7457 for one more generation.
If the '57 was coming off the lines now, they could speed bump the PM and get a mild sales boost for a few months. If it's going to be more than 30 days, though, there's no real harm in waiting a few months for the big change. PM sales will suffer, but what's new? And, would a bump to 1.43GHz impact that in any significant way?
I think that the iMac and eMac introductions were delayed along with the 7457. Those will be able to jump up and over 1GHz in a month or two, and the PowerBook shortly thereafter. With the introduction of the 12" PB, I don't really know what Apple will do with the iBook CPU-wise.
[QB]Don't get your hopes up. I have been told no Power Mac update till April....[QB]<hr></blockquote>
Well, that could possibly fit with news that the 970 will start volume production in March. Anounce in April, maybe ship one before the end of the month, then ramp up for the next couple of months (as has been done before).
[quote]Originally posted by gfeier:
[QB]
The first commandment of ALL religions is to provide a comfortable living for the priesthood.
[QB]<hr></blockquote>
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" /> Or is it just a joke?