Count on dual 1GHz, 1.25GHz and 1.43 GHz in the current enclosures without true DDR.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't think so. They would drop the 1ghz and the 1.25ghz would be the low end. If they can get up to 1.4ghz, they can get a 1.3ghz. The highend usually becomes the low end.
I don't think so. They would drop the 1ghz and the 1.25ghz would be the low end. If they can get up to 1.4ghz, they can get a 1.3ghz. The highend usually becomes the low end.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Besides keeping the 1 ghz (although it would be nice, at a lower price point) would kind of exclude the iMac/eMac getting a 1ghz CPU, or? If that were the case the 1ghz machines would get cheaper for Apple to make though, since it would be the iMac, PowerBook and PowerMacs using the same chip, which means higher volumes and cheaper per CPU price to Apple.
Besides keeping the 1 ghz (although it would be nice, at a lower price point) would kind of exclude the iMac/eMac getting a 1ghz CPU, or? If that were the case the 1ghz machines would get cheaper for Apple to make though, since it would be the iMac, PowerBook and PowerMacs using the same chip, which means higher volumes and cheaper per CPU price to Apple.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yea, we're over the 1ghz barrior so let's be over it by following the same pattern and dropping the 1ghz as the low end. The iMac/eMac and iBook will get it next. The desktops need to appear to be the fastest and thus justify their price tag.
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? Or is it just a joke? hehe
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I was just wondering if he believed that, or if it was just a jab. Just curious is all.
Oh, and my sig is a line from TMBG, but maybe you knew that :cool:
[quote]
<strong>
They start production in march yes sure but no way in hell are they getting in macs by april.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Why not? Surely Apple's had samples to design around for quite a while now. I think it is possible for the 970 to be in a privately owned mac by the end of April. I don't, for the record, believe that they will be widely available, however. Didn't Apple do this kind of thing with the iMac2? Thought they sent out a handful of machines around 11PM on the last day of the month so that Steve could stay true to his word of 'shipping in such-and-such month'.
Whatever. I just desperately need to upgrade from my 7.5 year old 7500, so I'm really hopeful. (I really want to start using X.)
<strong>Don't get your hopes up. I have been told no Power Mac update till April....</strong><hr></blockquote>
Bodhi, shirley they will at least get airport extweeemme and firewire 2 berfore April. I mean, some people have to upgrade between now and then, at least Apple should throw them a bone( even if it has no marrow in it).
[quote]Originally posted by Transcendental Octothorpe:
<strong>
Originally posted by gfeier:
The first commandment of ALL religions is to provide a comfortable living for the priesthood.
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" /> Or is it just a joke?</strong><hr></blockquote>
More than 40 years of studying history. Try it some time.
More than 40 years of studying history. Try it some time.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Wow, 40 years of studying, and you've never read this?
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment."
Whether people follow it is another matter entirely.
Sorry to bring this thread OT, I'll stop now.
Will the PM be updated before April? My gut still says yes, even though my sources say no. I am begining to think that my sources are limited in the same way as the Mot website doesn't list 7455s over 1GHz, but clearly they do exist.
<strong>The PowerPC 620 wasn't a "design failure" because of the 32-bit / 64-bit thing, it had problems because it was pushing the envelop of what was possible at the time. And it did ship eventually, and it did work. It was expensive, didn't significantly outperform the 604e, and didn't attract a customer base.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Wouldn't you consider it a design failure if it didn't out-produce a 604e?
[quote]Originally posted by Transcendental Octothorpe:
<strong>
Why not? Surely Apple's had samples to design around for quite a while now. I think it is possible for the 970 to be in a privately owned mac by the end of April. I don't, for the record, believe that they will be widely available, however.</strong><hr></blockquote>
More than likely Apple will wait for full production, I believe, and I'm guessing now that Apple is selling around 250,000 to 300,000 PowerMacs per quarter. I could see that number tripling easy, so around 1,000,000 per quarter. I'm sure that whatever sample parts IBM would be giving Apple are not enough to scratch this number. Not to mention that IBM probably has sent Apple a few hundred or a few thousand chips for evaluation. They were probably given for free, the big money is in the contract. IBM would have real issues with Apple putting any of these evaluation chips in a production model, which would be covered in a NDA between IBM and Apple. It would also be improper for Apple to sell anything given to them in good faith for evaluation purposes.
I don't think TO is talking about Apple shipping boxen with preproduction chips. That's madness.
However, as with the MPC7450, supply might be constrained enough for Apple to ship the 970 only in the top end of the line initially, and stagger the other releases like they did with the LCD iMac. This way Apple gets the 970 out as soon as possible (and makes a lot of money off the premium for the top of the line PM), while purging the G4 from the line and giving IBM time to crank them out in earnest.
If they do this, the most delayed PowerMac 970 should ship right about the time that Apple stops selling the Dual 1.25GHz to Mac OS 9 customers. Perfect.
I'm still not expecting the 970 before MWNY or Seybold, but I'm willing to be surprised.
[quote]Originally posted by Transcendental Octothorpe:
<strong>
Whatever. I just desperately need to upgrade from my 7.5 year old 7500, so I'm really hopeful. (I really want to start using X.)</strong><hr></blockquote>
Holy smokes just get anything, even ibook 700 will be a vast improvement over that. trust me.
[quote]Originally posted by Transcendental Octothorpe:
<strong>
Wow, 40 years of studying, and you've never read this?
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment."
Whether people follow it is another matter entirely.
Sorry to bring this thread OT, I'll stop now.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I wasn't talking about God, I was talking about organized religion (especially the senior members of their hierarchies). Ever seen the Pope's house? Do you have any idea what rabbis make these days? How about those Baptist leaders with their mansions? I could go on and on, but you're right, it's OT so:
quote:
Originally posted by KidRed:
I don't think so. They would drop the 1ghz and the 1.25ghz would be the low end. If they can get up to 1.4ghz, they can get a 1.3ghz. The highend usually becomes the low end.
1.25, 1.3 and 1.4? No way - it would hurt sales of the fastest box (which has the highest profit margin). A dual 1GHz tower at the low end is still quite a bit more powerful than a single 1GHz iMac so there's no problem there.
<strong>I don't think TO is talking about Apple shipping boxen with preproduction chips. That's madness.</strong><hr></blockquote>
My appologies that is what I thought I was reading. I was also attempting to show that preproduction and production are two seperate things.
<strong> [quote]
However, as with the MPC7450, supply might be constrained enough for Apple to ship the 970 only in the top end of the line initially, and stagger the other releases like they did with the LCD iMac. This way Apple gets the 970 out as soon as possible (and makes a lot of money off the premium for the top of the line PM), while purging the G4 from the line and giving IBM time to crank them out in earnest.
If they do this, the most delayed PowerMac 970 should ship right about the time that Apple stops selling the Dual 1.25GHz to Mac OS 9 customers. Perfect.
I'm still not expecting the 970 before MWNY or Seybold, but I'm willing to be surprised.
Agreed, I'm hoping for June or July. I'm not however attempting to argue my way into being right. In fact I hope I'm wrong and they arrive much earlier. Egg on the face I can take, but to be honest I'll wait for round two, hopefully the kinks will be worked out.
Just because the 970 is ready to ship doesn't mean Apple can ships machines with it in them. There is still quite a bit of work to do on the support chips and the board design and changes to OS X that all need to be done before a machine can be sent out the door. I am sure Apple has had some chips for a while to help with this testing and design but changes to the 970 would require changes to the work Apple has completed.
I think that the second half of the year is probably pretty accurate before we see a real machine shipping.
this year's outlook is really good, let them take their sweet ass time getting the 970's ready, it would be nice to have a rev.1 machine without problems for once!
I wasn't talking about God, I was talking about organized religion (especially the senior members of their hierarchies).
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ah, then I have no quarel with you, good sir.
Kurt and Brendon
No, I didn't mean pre-production chips. I just believe that Apple has had enough samples to do the bulk of the design work, and the design in frozen now (acording to my sources) and Apple would definately get samples from the final design versions, so they may have them already. If the 970 really does enter production in March, then they could concievably have a few chips to slap 'n' ship by the last day of April. ('course there can always be problems in production forcing an additional design change. Hope not).
All I'm saying: I hear production starts in March, and I believe that Steve could possibly annouce and (only technically) ship some boxes before April is out.
But I could be wrong.
All
And, I must say, for all involved in this thread: it is refreshing to have such a civil conversation in AI. The last several posts have been excellent in that regard (no, I don't mean mine).
Comments
<strong>
Keyword:MPC8540
Thats not a g4 and don't even suggests that its the g5
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I know. I was just pointing out that Motorola has an intergrated memory controller on a chip.
<strong>
The people are so happy now, their heads are caving in.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? Or is it just a joke? hehe
They start production in march yes sure but no way in hell are they getting in macs by april.
<strong>
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? Or is it just a joke?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Must be a joke since I know of at least one religion whose main priority is to supply the priesthood with children and protect them afterwards.
<strong>
Count on dual 1GHz, 1.25GHz and 1.43 GHz in the current enclosures without true DDR.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't think so. They would drop the 1ghz and the 1.25ghz would be the low end. If they can get up to 1.4ghz, they can get a 1.3ghz. The highend usually becomes the low end.
<strong>
I don't think so. They would drop the 1ghz and the 1.25ghz would be the low end. If they can get up to 1.4ghz, they can get a 1.3ghz. The highend usually becomes the low end.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Besides keeping the 1 ghz (although it would be nice, at a lower price point) would kind of exclude the iMac/eMac getting a 1ghz CPU, or? If that were the case the 1ghz machines would get cheaper for Apple to make though, since it would be the iMac, PowerBook and PowerMacs using the same chip, which means higher volumes and cheaper per CPU price to Apple.
<strong>
Besides keeping the 1 ghz (although it would be nice, at a lower price point) would kind of exclude the iMac/eMac getting a 1ghz CPU, or? If that were the case the 1ghz machines would get cheaper for Apple to make though, since it would be the iMac, PowerBook and PowerMacs using the same chip, which means higher volumes and cheaper per CPU price to Apple.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yea, we're over the 1ghz barrior so let's be over it by following the same pattern and dropping the 1ghz as the low end. The iMac/eMac and iBook will get it next. The desktops need to appear to be the fastest and thus justify their price tag.
<strong>
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? Or is it just a joke? hehe
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I was just wondering if he believed that, or if it was just a jab. Just curious is all.
Oh, and my sig is a line from TMBG, but maybe you knew that :cool:
[quote]
<strong>
They start production in march yes sure but no way in hell are they getting in macs by april.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Why not? Surely Apple's had samples to design around for quite a while now. I think it is possible for the 970 to be in a privately owned mac by the end of April. I don't, for the record, believe that they will be widely available, however. Didn't Apple do this kind of thing with the iMac2? Thought they sent out a handful of machines around 11PM on the last day of the month so that Steve could stay true to his word of 'shipping in such-and-such month'.
Whatever. I just desperately need to upgrade from my 7.5 year old 7500, so I'm really hopeful. (I really want to start using X.)
<strong>Don't get your hopes up. I have been told no Power Mac update till April....</strong><hr></blockquote>
Bodhi, shirley they will at least get airport extweeemme and firewire 2 berfore April. I mean, some people have to upgrade between now and then, at least Apple should throw them a bone( even if it has no marrow in it).
<strong>
Originally posted by gfeier:
The first commandment of ALL religions is to provide a comfortable living for the priesthood.
What in the heck are you basing that statement on??? <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" /> Or is it just a joke?</strong><hr></blockquote>
More than 40 years of studying history. Try it some time.
<strong>
More than 40 years of studying history. Try it some time.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Wow, 40 years of studying, and you've never read this?
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment."
Whether people follow it is another matter entirely.
Sorry to bring this thread OT, I'll stop now.
Will the PM be updated before April? My gut still says yes, even though my sources say no. I am begining to think that my sources are limited in the same way as the Mot website doesn't list 7455s over 1GHz, but clearly they do exist.
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: Transcendental Octothorpe ]</p>
<strong>The PowerPC 620 wasn't a "design failure" because of the 32-bit / 64-bit thing, it had problems because it was pushing the envelop of what was possible at the time. And it did ship eventually, and it did work. It was expensive, didn't significantly outperform the 604e, and didn't attract a customer base.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Wouldn't you consider it a design failure if it didn't out-produce a 604e?
<strong>
Why not? Surely Apple's had samples to design around for quite a while now. I think it is possible for the 970 to be in a privately owned mac by the end of April. I don't, for the record, believe that they will be widely available, however.</strong><hr></blockquote>
More than likely Apple will wait for full production, I believe, and I'm guessing now that Apple is selling around 250,000 to 300,000 PowerMacs per quarter. I could see that number tripling easy, so around 1,000,000 per quarter. I'm sure that whatever sample parts IBM would be giving Apple are not enough to scratch this number. Not to mention that IBM probably has sent Apple a few hundred or a few thousand chips for evaluation. They were probably given for free, the big money is in the contract. IBM would have real issues with Apple putting any of these evaluation chips in a production model, which would be covered in a NDA between IBM and Apple. It would also be improper for Apple to sell anything given to them in good faith for evaluation purposes.
However, as with the MPC7450, supply might be constrained enough for Apple to ship the 970 only in the top end of the line initially, and stagger the other releases like they did with the LCD iMac. This way Apple gets the 970 out as soon as possible (and makes a lot of money off the premium for the top of the line PM), while purging the G4 from the line and giving IBM time to crank them out in earnest.
If they do this, the most delayed PowerMac 970 should ship right about the time that Apple stops selling the Dual 1.25GHz to Mac OS 9 customers. Perfect.
I'm still not expecting the 970 before MWNY or Seybold, but I'm willing to be surprised.
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
<strong>
Whatever. I just desperately need to upgrade from my 7.5 year old 7500, so I'm really hopeful. (I really want to start using X.)</strong><hr></blockquote>
Holy smokes just get anything, even ibook 700 will be a vast improvement over that. trust me.
<strong>
Wow, 40 years of studying, and you've never read this?
"Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment."
Whether people follow it is another matter entirely.
Sorry to bring this thread OT, I'll stop now.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I wasn't talking about God, I was talking about organized religion (especially the senior members of their hierarchies). Ever seen the Pope's house? Do you have any idea what rabbis make these days? How about those Baptist leaders with their mansions? I could go on and on, but you're right, it's OT so:
quote:
Originally posted by KidRed:
I don't think so. They would drop the 1ghz and the 1.25ghz would be the low end. If they can get up to 1.4ghz, they can get a 1.3ghz. The highend usually becomes the low end.
1.25, 1.3 and 1.4? No way - it would hurt sales of the fastest box (which has the highest profit margin). A dual 1GHz tower at the low end is still quite a bit more powerful than a single 1GHz iMac so there's no problem there.
<strong>I don't think TO is talking about Apple shipping boxen with preproduction chips. That's madness.</strong><hr></blockquote>
My appologies that is what I thought I was reading. I was also attempting to show that preproduction and production are two seperate things.
<strong> [quote]
However, as with the MPC7450, supply might be constrained enough for Apple to ship the 970 only in the top end of the line initially, and stagger the other releases like they did with the LCD iMac. This way Apple gets the 970 out as soon as possible (and makes a lot of money off the premium for the top of the line PM), while purging the G4 from the line and giving IBM time to crank them out in earnest.
If they do this, the most delayed PowerMac 970 should ship right about the time that Apple stops selling the Dual 1.25GHz to Mac OS 9 customers. Perfect.
I'm still not expecting the 970 before MWNY or Seybold, but I'm willing to be surprised.
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: Amorph ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
Agreed, I'm hoping for June or July. I'm not however attempting to argue my way into being right. In fact I hope I'm wrong and they arrive much earlier. Egg on the face I can take, but to be honest I'll wait for round two, hopefully the kinks will be worked out.
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: Brendon ]</p>
I think that the second half of the year is probably pretty accurate before we see a real machine shipping.
Then again, what do I know?
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: Kurt ]</p>
Why should you be any different from the rest of us?
[ 01-10-2003: Message edited by: gfeier ]</p>
<strong>
I wasn't talking about God, I was talking about organized religion (especially the senior members of their hierarchies).
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ah, then I have no quarel with you, good sir.
Kurt and Brendon
No, I didn't mean pre-production chips. I just believe that Apple has had enough samples to do the bulk of the design work, and the design in frozen now (acording to my sources) and Apple would definately get samples from the final design versions, so they may have them already. If the 970 really does enter production in March, then they could concievably have a few chips to slap 'n' ship by the last day of April. ('course there can always be problems in production forcing an additional design change. Hope not).
All I'm saying: I hear production starts in March, and I believe that Steve could possibly annouce and (only technically) ship some boxes before April is out.
But I could be wrong.
All
And, I must say, for all involved in this thread: it is refreshing to have such a civil conversation in AI. The last several posts have been excellent in that regard (no, I don't mean mine).
But, alas, I probably just jinxed it
(BTW, what the heck does that [