I think people need to stop wearing buckles on their hats. Fvcking puritans. Fvcking mock outrage. Gah. I hate this bull.
I defer to Bunge:
Quote:
Originally posted by bunge
I don't know. I wouldn't say this is 'everything'. Your opinion appears to be close to saying people can't be offended about anything, and that's too extreme.
I think Shawn's original assessment was rather rational. Self-deprecating humor is awesome. Making fun of a false motive for killing lots of people is not. That's actually one sign of a sociopath.
I'm asking someone to support their claims, and they can't. That means their hyperbolic claim is worthless and should be removed from the argument.
Wow bunge, now you've really lept off the cliff of intellectual dishonesty. Anyone that cannot agree that Saddam was a brutal, murderous dicatator right up until his final days cannot be taken seriously in this discussion.
Well... the media has focused on WMDs... so people think that they are the ONLY reason the US is involved. It is NOT the only reason. When WMDs are one area that has not been resolved, then Bush's enemies are rewriting history to claim that WMDs were the only reason, to paint the Iraq II war as a failure. WMDs were NOT THE ONLY REASON FOR ACTION IN IRAQ.
US action has set millions free from a brutal dictatorship. That is plenty of justification for me.
Nonsense. It wasn't the media. The admin. fed us the WMDs BS. All the admin. people were going on every show,as many times as they could talking about WMDs,IMMINENT THREAT, the Brits tell us they're ready to launch in 45 minutes, WMDs here, there, "nukulear" weapons, mushroom clouds over the US. Come on.
Yeah. Blame the media for "focusing" on the "mushroom clouds" and the imminent threat that the administration pushed ad nauseum.
He said it was "one sign" of a sociopath. Not an especially strong point considering the number of "signs" you can attribute to anyone. But still- you don't miss an opportunity to mischaracterize another person's post, do you? Let's get back on topic, SDW: "Self-deprecating humor is awesome. Making fun of (your own) false motive for killing lots of people is not.". What's your rationale? (I'm assuming you think nothing's wrong).
He said it was "one sign" of a sociopath. Not an especially strong point considering the number of "signs" you can attribute to anyone. But still- you don't miss an opportunity to mischaracterize another person's post, do you? Let's get back on topic, SDW: "Self-deprecating humor is awesome. Making fun of (your own) false motive for killing lots of people is not.". What's your rationale? (I'm assuming you think nothing's wrong).
It's only offensive to you because it's BUSH. If this was a liberal Democrat, the media would be gushing about his "cunning wit in the face of adversity".
Give me a break, Shawn. This is as BR says: "Mock Outrage". You're upset because it's politically advantageous to be so.
It's only offensive to you because it's BUSH. If this was a liberal Democrat, the media would be gushing about his "cunning wit in the face of adversity".
Give me a break, Shawn. This is as BR says: "Mock Outrage". You're upset because it's politically advantageous to be so.
"...liberal media
...mock outrage
...political advantage"
Do you think there was anything wrong with the President's *joke?*
It's only offensive to you because it's BUSH. If this was a liberal Democrat, the media would be gushing about his "cunning wit in the face of adversity".
Give me a break, Shawn. This is as BR says: "Mock Outrage". You're upset because it's politically advantageous to be so.
I think you have an interesting point though. I might agree that the only reason the joke was offensive to me (and perhaps to others) is that it was President Bush who told the joke. I've laughed at many cartoons skewering the administration's now defunct rationale for going to war. The joke of those cartoons centered on the same idea- how we could not find WMD. But I think the point was to ridicule the administration for its lies and incompetence. It doesn't offend me because it sheds light on those lies.
But for President Bush to tell a similar joke in a similarly light-hearted and inconsequential manner...about its own lies? I've used the words reprehensible and unconscionable- how else could I describe it?
I think you have an interesting point though. I might agree that the only reason the joke was offensive to me (and perhaps to others) is that it was President Bush who told the joke. I've laughed at many cartoons skewering the administration's now defunct rationale for going to war. The joke of those cartoons centered on the same idea- how we could not find WMD. But I think the point was to ridicule the administration for its lies and incompetence. It doesn't offend me because it sheds light on those lies.
But for President Bush to tell a similar joke in a similarly light-hearted and inconsequential manner...about its own lies? I've used the words reprehensible and unconscionable- how else could I describe it?
An admission of failure and a funny one at that. That's how you describe it.
An admission of failure and a funny one at that. That's how you describe it.
I allready went on record as not caring that much
However, it isn't merely 'an admission of failure' it is a callous miscalculation . . If my son were dead in a war that was fought because Bush and admin said repeatedly that they KNEW there were WMD, and, it in turn began to appear that perhaps not only was the information as to the existence of those WMD wrong but may have been "sexed-up," then I might feel that the leader is laughing it up without taking mys son's death seriously . . . I mean, do I really need to explain how that could be worse than just self-deprecating humor?
I know that you BR like to pretend to be some stone and bone cold dude as if you were super tough, an affectation that I find silly, but still you should be able to see the lack of tact involved if not the outright smack-in the face of all those who put real sacrifices on the line for those non-existent WMD
However, it isn't merely 'an admission of failure' it is a callous miscalculation . . If my son were dead in a war that was fought because Bush and admin said repeatedly that they KNEW there were WMD, and, it in turn began to appear that perhaps not only was the information as to the existence of those WMD wrong but may have been "sexed-up," then I might feel that the leader is laughing it up without taking mys son's death seriously . . . I mean, do I really need to explain how that could be worse than just self-deprecating humor?
I know that you BR like to pretend to be some stone and bone cold dude as if you were super tough, an affectation that I find silly, but still you should be able to see the lack of tact involved if not the outright smack-in the face of all those who put real sacrifices on the line for those non-existent WMD
I can see a lack of tact. I don't see cause for the kind of mock outrage SPJ and others are demonstrating.
By the way, I'm not pretending to be anything. WYSIWYG. I'm not super tough nor am I some "stone adn bone cold dude." I don't see where the hell you are getting that from.
Sure maybe the partisan in us takes things that way and plays them up a little . .
However, I am feeling very outraged at many things in politics these days and I gaurantee you it is in no way "mock" . . . and I think that perhaps many people are beginning to feel that way, and perhaps they are feeling outraged, real outrage, and any little thing tips them off
. . . hell . . . its a wonder that more people aren't feeling that way
I can see a lack of tact. I don't see cause for the kind of mock outrage SPJ and others are demonstrating.
By the way, I'm not pretending to be anything. WYSIWYG. I'm not super tough nor am I some "stone adn bone cold dude." I don't see where the hell you are getting that from.
Well, an administration shouldn't lie about its main reason for going to war...that's bad....even you object to "lies and the presidency"...... but then to take that lie and treat it as if it's one big joke.... I don't see why that isn't a problem. .....and uh "mock outrage" really doesn't describe much here i think...
Sure maybe the partisan in us takes things that way and plays them up a little . .
However, I am feeling very outraged at many things in politics these days and I gaurantee you it is in no way "mock" . . . and I think that perhaps many people are beginning to feel that way, and perhaps they are feeling outraged, real outrage, and any little thing tips them off
. . . hell . . . its a wonder that more people aren't feeling that way
I want bush out of office possibly more than you do. I just think his little joke here was rather funny.
I can see a lack of tact. I don't see cause for the kind of mock outrage SPJ and others are demonstrating.
By the way, I'm not pretending to be anything. WYSIWYG. I'm not super tough nor am I some "stone adn bone cold dude." I don't see where the hell you are getting that from.
Wrong. I have immense sympathy for those troops in Iraq right now. I have the utmost respect for them. At the same time I can see the humor in Bush's joke. That doesn't make me a monster. That makes me someone who is capable of holding two conflicting ideas in my head at the same time without bursting into flames like some people on these boards.
You've characterized the opposition to Bush's *joke* as Puritanical and angry to the point of spontaneous combustion. I don't think you're doing yourself a favor here in the accuracy of perception department...
Comments
Originally posted by Jubelum
I don't know how many.
GOOGLE is your friend.
Originally posted by BR
I think people need to stop wearing buckles on their hats. Fvcking puritans. Fvcking mock outrage. Gah. I hate this bull.
I defer to Bunge:
Originally posted by bunge
I don't know. I wouldn't say this is 'everything'. Your opinion appears to be close to saying people can't be offended about anything, and that's too extreme.
I think Shawn's original assessment was rather rational. Self-deprecating humor is awesome. Making fun of a false motive for killing lots of people is not. That's actually one sign of a sociopath.
Originally posted by bunge
I'm asking someone to support their claims, and they can't. That means their hyperbolic claim is worthless and should be removed from the argument.
Wow bunge, now you've really lept off the cliff of intellectual dishonesty. Anyone that cannot agree that Saddam was a brutal, murderous dicatator right up until his final days cannot be taken seriously in this discussion.
Originally posted by ShawnJ
I defer to Bunge:
Oh boy. Now that's a new one. Bush is now a sociopath. This is getting fun!
Originally posted by SDW2001
Wow bunge, now you've really lept off the cliff of intellectual dishonesty.
I've asked someone to support their claim. That's the pinnacle of intellectual honesty.
Originally posted by Jubelum
Well... the media has focused on WMDs... so people think that they are the ONLY reason the US is involved. It is NOT the only reason. When WMDs are one area that has not been resolved, then Bush's enemies are rewriting history to claim that WMDs were the only reason, to paint the Iraq II war as a failure. WMDs were NOT THE ONLY REASON FOR ACTION IN IRAQ.
US action has set millions free from a brutal dictatorship. That is plenty of justification for me.
Nonsense. It wasn't the media. The admin. fed us the WMDs BS. All the admin. people were going on every show,as many times as they could talking about WMDs,IMMINENT THREAT, the Brits tell us they're ready to launch in 45 minutes, WMDs here, there, "nukulear" weapons, mushroom clouds over the US. Come on.
Yeah. Blame the media for "focusing" on the "mushroom clouds" and the imminent threat that the administration pushed ad nauseum.
Originally posted by SDW2001
Bush is now a sociopath.
He said it was "one sign" of a sociopath. Not an especially strong point considering the number of "signs" you can attribute to anyone. But still- you don't miss an opportunity to mischaracterize another person's post, do you? Let's get back on topic, SDW: "Self-deprecating humor is awesome. Making fun of (your own) false motive for killing lots of people is not.". What's your rationale? (I'm assuming you think nothing's wrong).
Originally posted by ShawnJ
He said it was "one sign" of a sociopath. Not an especially strong point considering the number of "signs" you can attribute to anyone. But still- you don't miss an opportunity to mischaracterize another person's post, do you? Let's get back on topic, SDW: "Self-deprecating humor is awesome. Making fun of (your own) false motive for killing lots of people is not.". What's your rationale? (I'm assuming you think nothing's wrong).
It's only offensive to you because it's BUSH. If this was a liberal Democrat, the media would be gushing about his "cunning wit in the face of adversity".
Give me a break, Shawn. This is as BR says: "Mock Outrage". You're upset because it's politically advantageous to be so.
Originally posted by SDW2001
It's only offensive to you because it's BUSH. If this was a liberal Democrat, the media would be gushing about his "cunning wit in the face of adversity".
Give me a break, Shawn. This is as BR says: "Mock Outrage". You're upset because it's politically advantageous to be so.
"...liberal media
...mock outrage
...political advantage"
Do you think there was anything wrong with the President's *joke?*
Originally posted by SDW2001
It's only offensive to you because it's BUSH. If this was a liberal Democrat, the media would be gushing about his "cunning wit in the face of adversity".
Give me a break, Shawn. This is as BR says: "Mock Outrage". You're upset because it's politically advantageous to be so.
I think you have an interesting point though. I might agree that the only reason the joke was offensive to me (and perhaps to others) is that it was President Bush who told the joke. I've laughed at many cartoons skewering the administration's now defunct rationale for going to war. The joke of those cartoons centered on the same idea- how we could not find WMD. But I think the point was to ridicule the administration for its lies and incompetence. It doesn't offend me because it sheds light on those lies.
But for President Bush to tell a similar joke in a similarly light-hearted and inconsequential manner...about its own lies? I've used the words reprehensible and unconscionable- how else could I describe it?
Originally posted by ShawnJ
I think you have an interesting point though. I might agree that the only reason the joke was offensive to me (and perhaps to others) is that it was President Bush who told the joke. I've laughed at many cartoons skewering the administration's now defunct rationale for going to war. The joke of those cartoons centered on the same idea- how we could not find WMD. But I think the point was to ridicule the administration for its lies and incompetence. It doesn't offend me because it sheds light on those lies.
But for President Bush to tell a similar joke in a similarly light-hearted and inconsequential manner...about its own lies? I've used the words reprehensible and unconscionable- how else could I describe it?
An admission of failure and a funny one at that. That's how you describe it.
Originally posted by BR
An admission of failure and a funny one at that. That's how you describe it.
No, I don't, BR. I said it wasn't funny.
If he wants to laugh off his admission of failure like it's no big deal, then I have serious problems with it.
Originally posted by BR
An admission of failure and a funny one at that. That's how you describe it.
I allready went on record as not caring that much
However, it isn't merely 'an admission of failure' it is a callous miscalculation . . If my son were dead in a war that was fought because Bush and admin said repeatedly that they KNEW there were WMD, and, it in turn began to appear that perhaps not only was the information as to the existence of those WMD wrong but may have been "sexed-up," then I might feel that the leader is laughing it up without taking mys son's death seriously . . . I mean, do I really need to explain how that could be worse than just self-deprecating humor?
I know that you BR like to pretend to be some stone and bone cold dude as if you were super tough, an affectation that I find silly, but still you should be able to see the lack of tact involved if not the outright smack-in the face of all those who put real sacrifices on the line for those non-existent WMD
Originally posted by pfflam
I allready went on record as not caring that much
However, it isn't merely 'an admission of failure' it is a callous miscalculation . . If my son were dead in a war that was fought because Bush and admin said repeatedly that they KNEW there were WMD, and, it in turn began to appear that perhaps not only was the information as to the existence of those WMD wrong but may have been "sexed-up," then I might feel that the leader is laughing it up without taking mys son's death seriously . . . I mean, do I really need to explain how that could be worse than just self-deprecating humor?
I know that you BR like to pretend to be some stone and bone cold dude as if you were super tough, an affectation that I find silly, but still you should be able to see the lack of tact involved if not the outright smack-in the face of all those who put real sacrifices on the line for those non-existent WMD
I can see a lack of tact. I don't see cause for the kind of mock outrage SPJ and others are demonstrating.
By the way, I'm not pretending to be anything. WYSIWYG. I'm not super tough nor am I some "stone adn bone cold dude." I don't see where the hell you are getting that from.
Sure maybe the partisan in us takes things that way and plays them up a little . .
However, I am feeling very outraged at many things in politics these days and I gaurantee you it is in no way "mock" . . . and I think that perhaps many people are beginning to feel that way, and perhaps they are feeling outraged, real outrage, and any little thing tips them off
. . . hell . . . its a wonder that more people aren't feeling that way
Originally posted by BR
I can see a lack of tact. I don't see cause for the kind of mock outrage SPJ and others are demonstrating.
By the way, I'm not pretending to be anything. WYSIWYG. I'm not super tough nor am I some "stone adn bone cold dude." I don't see where the hell you are getting that from.
Well, an administration shouldn't lie about its main reason for going to war...that's bad....even you object to "lies and the presidency"...... but then to take that lie and treat it as if it's one big joke.... I don't see why that isn't a problem. .....and uh "mock outrage" really doesn't describe much here i think...
Originally posted by pfflam
"mock outrage" is a handy slander du-jour
Sure maybe the partisan in us takes things that way and plays them up a little . .
However, I am feeling very outraged at many things in politics these days and I gaurantee you it is in no way "mock" . . . and I think that perhaps many people are beginning to feel that way, and perhaps they are feeling outraged, real outrage, and any little thing tips them off
. . . hell . . . its a wonder that more people aren't feeling that way
I want bush out of office possibly more than you do. I just think his little joke here was rather funny.
Originally posted by BR
I can see a lack of tact. I don't see cause for the kind of mock outrage SPJ and others are demonstrating.
By the way, I'm not pretending to be anything. WYSIWYG. I'm not super tough nor am I some "stone adn bone cold dude." I don't see where the hell you are getting that from.
Chilling indifference to human suffering.
Originally posted by addabox
Chilling indifference to human suffering.
Wrong. I have immense sympathy for those troops in Iraq right now. I have the utmost respect for them. At the same time I can see the humor in Bush's joke. That doesn't make me a monster. That makes me someone who is capable of holding two conflicting ideas in my head at the same time without bursting into flames like some people on these boards.