Not as good as it could. Component out is still analog. That is the haters complaint, that a 500 dollar machine will not have the latest technology and best quality. It has also not been decieded if non HDCP compliant video out (everything other than HDMI right now) connections will support full 1080p output for HD movies or will be downgraded to prevent piracy.
I think you all missed the point. It's not a question of bluray vs hddvd, its a question of 'new dvd format' vs online distribution.
I really doubt consumers are itching to buy a new dvd player and new dvd library. If the industry is smart, they'll realize the real threat to their new hard media of choice is itunes.
Apple still has a few years to get things right before one format or another even has a chance of taking over and making the other one look like betamax. I give them a 3 year window of opportunity- to get the codec, service, content and price right. When that happens, DVD, our current DVD, will end up becoming the last truly successful physical media format. Nobody will even care about these new dvd formats, being relegated to consoles and niche high end video use on pc's. You wont be buying software on it, and you certainly wont be buying your movies on it.
Bluray will go down in history as 'that custom format the ps3 used and a few geeked out pc boxes had it too'. HDDVD will be that 'interesting addon for the xbox that could play a few available movies'.
Really I think the days of competing physical media formats are just about over. Sad thing is these companies probably dont even realize it, and while they're trying to outdo their competitors with exclusive deals, licensing and whathaveyou, digital distribution is gonna come right on up from behind and surpass them both. How many billions have they wasted R@D'ing and marketing their dead formats? They're each gonna put forth huge lies in order to claim victory where none is possible.
I personally HATE the idea of physical media going the way of the dinosaur.
I love having something to hold that I can put away and catalouge etc. Something I don't need to worry out crashing or a hard drive wipe.
Physical media is stable, safe and always there.
Sure some people may not want to re-buy their library but online distribution does the same thing unless your suggesting I rip every dvd I own and then upconvert it when watching it on a tv..........
..............or unless your suggesting free downloads of all the movie everyone already owns.
Otherwise people are going to have to re-gather everything no matter the format because people's current libraries aren't hd, irregardless of format.
That's true, but the PS3 at E305 was just a case, with no innards. Sony, much like Apple, seems to be cooling its love of Firewire/iLink. Current PS2s lack it too sadly.
Gates has even stated the war is almost pointless, yet they continue pushing Hd_DVD.
a lot of the times i believe its for marketing mumbo jumbo in order to look competitive against the PS3
Not just to compete in marketing terms, but with MS behind HD-DVD it really makes the industry take notice and it will stall Blu-Ray adoption as there really are two standards with heavyweights behind each. When few were behind HD-DVD, Blu-Ray was a shoe-in. But now, the game is just getting started.
Another point is that physical media probably isn't going anywhere for at least 10 years. There are people who don't have broadband internet, and even then digital distribution of HD video content requires fatter pipes. YouTube pays $1 million a month in bandwidth bills and I doubt companies really want to pay that.
Thus the Apple BitTorrent rumor. And you know, if it's true, it'll go in iTunes and not Mac OS.
May 11, 2004, Gran Turismo was announced for the PSP. A movie was shown, it was incredible, much like the movie shown on Monday for Gran Turismo HD.
Guess what? Here we are almost 2 years to the day that the game was first shown to us and we know *nothing* about it.
At E3 2005, PSP gamers were looking to see the advances Sony had made and possibly get a release date. It was not even at the show.
So now it's E3 2006 and once again, the game is missing in action. Sony won't comment on the status of the game or give any indication on when it might see the light of day.
That's why I have no faith in Sony delivering a new Gran Turismo any time soon.
MY point was that the PS3 HAS GT HD and the 360 dont.
Not just to compete in marketing terms, but with MS behind HD-DVD it really makes the industry take notice and it will stall Blu-Ray adoption as there really are two standards with heavyweights behind each. When few were behind HD-DVD, Blu-Ray was a shoe-in. But now, the game is just getting started.
I've only done minimal research on this whole thing, but it seems a big difference here is that, at least as far as the 360 goes, MS is only supporting HD-DVD as a viewing medium. PS3 is making it the primary format for all of its software, ensuring a market for the medium even if the HD theater aspect doesn't take off. HD-DVD doesn't have the same safety net.
Why does anyone care? iDVD (iBlueRay) wont get any new video media technology until it's been in common use for a few years. Apple is SLOW adopting new drive technology. How long did ATA-100 take, again?
Apple wont be the deciding factor in the media wars.
And YES, there will be a new media type.
I don't know which media type will win, but I can tell you this much:
I understand that there will be a built in 'Blu-Ray' market from those that buy the PS3. The problem is, however, not everyone buying a PS3 will want the PS3 to watch Blu-Ray movies. HD Movies are still going to be a very small market until the majority of Americans have HDTVs. That's probably 5-6 years away.
I disagree, I think you'll find a lot of people will want the PS3 to watch Blu-ray movies, regardless of the percentage HDTVs out there. Granted, the percantage of HDTVs out there is small, but it is growing rapidly and will continue as the onslaught of HD content will be provided.
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I have a PSP. It's supposed to be a gaming handheld first and a media center second. Guess what? *It is*. Can I put movies on a memory stick and watch them? Yes. Do I? *No.* Can I buy UMD movies and watch them? Yes. Do I? *No*. Can I put Music, pictures, and other media onto a memory stick to listen or look at them later? Yes. Do I? *No*. GPS, Web Browsing, watching TV via 802.11, and every other feature on the PSP to make it a 'media center' are used by a very small percentage of the user base. Heck, I don't doubt that the only reason some people with PSPs have upgraded beyond Firmware 1.5 was that Grand Theft Auto required it.
"Used by a very small percentage of the user base" based on what? Your subjective opinion. That's fine, I respect your opinion, but at the same time your PSP habits might be radically different from others. To assume because you use a PSP in one way for the majority of the time, doesn't mean all others do as well. Same goes for the PS3. Just because you would mostly do gaming on the PS3 doesn't mean I would too. I for one would probably watch movies and play games just about equally. In my opinion, there are many, many more who will do the same.
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Consoles are for games first and everything else second. You buy a console because you want to play the next Metal Gear Solid, Metroid, or Halo, not because you want to watch Mission Impossible 3 in High Definition. Is it an added bonus that you can watch movies in HD? Sure. But will the majority of the market use their consoles for that purpose? No. We've seen the PS3 media center and it's just not happening.
Again this is your paradigm. Much like the iPod was in a paradigm for just music as well, but we know we can watch video on it now don't we? And, getting more capable as time goes on. The battle for the living room is going to be a big one, and I think the PS3 will give Sony a great start. To say that "No" the majority of market won't use their consoles for HD movie viewing is based upon just your opinion--as there is no statistical evidence to prove this. On the other hand, my opinion, that users would and will indeed watch movies on their PS3s quite regurlarly I would think--since Sony is taking this risk with the PS3 (assuming) based on some sort of data or feedback--has more plausability. Again, my opinion, but I think it is a bit more rational than just "PS3 media center...just not happening."
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I have a 360, it's a 'next gen' gaming console. Do games look a hell of a lot better on a HDTV? Of course. There is a limit to what Standard TVs can do. But do games on the 360 look better on a standard TV than games on the original Xbox? I think that they do. The 360 also has extra 'next gen' features such as a better online service (Xbox Live arcade, well managed content downloads), the wireless controllers are great, and you still have those 'media PC' type options that you mention above (I don't use them here either).
The main purpose of the Xbox 360 is to play games, I think we can agree on that. That being said, how does the lack of a HD-DVD drive change that? The HD-DVD drive is optional because Microsoft didn't want to cram it down everyone's throats. So while it means HD-DVD doesn't get the market share, the 360 will. MS wants the 360 to gain market share while Sony wants Blu-Ray to gain market share, it's 2 completely different strategies.
I'll agree with you here on your gaming markethare outlook for the 360. Indeed, Microsoft will most likely garner a few percenatage points in marketshare from a gaming market perspective, but I don't think it will be even close in comparison to what Sony will continue to garner or maintain with the PS3 overall. 3.2 million Xbox units have been sold thus far, and it is expected that 4 million units of the PS3 will be sold by December 31st. 6 million by March for the PS3. I just don't see where some of you think that because the PS3 is $100 more (and more capable from a graphics, storage, and movie standpoint) than the Xbox 360, that all of a sudden there will be this huge defection to the Xbox 360. I just don't buy it. I think consumers will see that the PS3 is more capable, and will be more than willing to pay the $100 extra.
Moreover concerning you statement of a "better online service," we'll just have to wait and see as the jury is still out on this one--PS3s online service is supposed to be pretty sweet.
So, while you may consider your Xbox 360 'next gen,' I would consider it 'semi next-gen' when comparing technical details.
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Heck, the Nintendo Wii (Revolution) doesn't have any kind of High Definition movie drive. Does that mean it's not 'next gen' too?
Ditto with the Wii. Semi. No HD drive, lower resolution, cmon we're entering the HD era, Nintendo better get on board in a hurry.
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Madden 2007 is coming out for PS3, Wii, Xbox 360, and the 'last gen' consoles. What 'special' content is going to take up the other 20 GB of space on that Blu-Ray disk? What content will we be missing out on since the standard disks in the Wii and 360 won't have that much storage space? I'm betting we don't miss out on much.
You keep implying that extra storage will never seem to quantify better games. I think your wrong. If you took a look at the PS3 conference, they had a bit of information there that was eye-opening. Back with the PS2 in the beginning, 75% or so games came on just CD while the others came on DVD. Currently, now 95% of the games come on DVD. See a pattern? Need more storage. Just because HD DVD proponents lack foresight doesn't mean we ought to throw the blinders on as well. Developers always want more, and with a forward-looking format such as Blu-ray, it ought to provide the storage needed for years to come.
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I never questioned that they would sell out, I even said it would be extremely hard to find. This is going to push people into the 360 camp this Christmas because people don't want to go away empty handed.
Maybe some, but not as many as a lot of you are trying to make it out to be. I think people who desire a PS3 for the most part will wait until they can get their hands on one.
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There were 2 HDMI ports on the back of the PS3 pictures that Sony originally released and Sony had maintained, until yesterday, that the PS3s would have dual HDMI out ports. To not even have one on the lower end PS3 will prevent people who have a HDTV but can't find a $600 PS3 from buying one.
Speaking of fallicious, as another poster had cleared up, you'll still be able to play games on an HDTV with the $499 PS3 over component at 1080i.
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The Dreamcast never had a DVD add on drive. Sony's hype machine was what killed the DC despite the fact that Sega had superior games and totally outclassed the PS2 at launch. But Sony was able to appeal to people with DVD playback. People could see the difference between DVDs and VHS on their standard TVs back then and it was enough to push the PS2 over the top. The circumstances are different now, however, since people won't see the difference from Blu-Ray or HD-DVD without a HDTV. Sony also tried to market the DC as a competitor to the PS1 and N64, despite the fact that the Dreamcast games were more polished and online before the PS2 even hit store shelves.
My apologies, I believe the console I didn't refer to correctly last was the Sega Genesis / Sega Mega Drive. The add-on was called the Sega CD / Sega Mega-CD and as you can probably infer, it was a CD based add-on which was a failure. Much like I think the HD DVD add-on drive will be. You can read more here if you like...
Furthermore, people will indeed see the difference when they walk into their local Best Buy, Circuit City, etc. and see a side by side comparison between Blu-ray / HD DVD and regular DVD for those who don't own an HDTV themselves. Don't fool yourself, marketing will take care of that in a hurry.
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I think there is little doubt that Sony is placing all of their eggs in one basket here. They want Blu-Ray to succeed and are willing to go so far as to put their dominance of the console world in jeopardy. Nintendo has a unique system coming out that looks like it will appeal to a large audience. The people I'm talking to seem to all want a Wii, thinking it will be cheap to buy, and are trying to decide between a 360 or a PS3. After talking to them after the conferences last night and earlier today, people who were really gung ho about the PS3 are now leaning towards the 360.
Well, talk is cheap, but content from gaming studios, the majority of hollywood studios, and the majority of hardware vendors is not and they are behind Blu-ray. Making it appear that Sony is the only one behind Blu-ray is as deceptive as you can be, because it is quite obvious that Blu-ray is much, much more than Sony with the likes of the giants in the BDA.
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I really think that Sony might have really made a mistake with their $600 price tag. Yes, the consoles will initially all sell out and we'll probably see an installed world wide user base of 5 million at the end of January 2007. But the real question is, how many more people will be that anxious to drop $500 or $600 on what is primarily going to be used as a gaming console? It will be interesting to see.
Let's be clear here, once again...with their...say it with me...$499 AND $599 price tag. In addition, I think the answer to your question is that millions MORE will be dropping $499 to $599 after the initial 6 million sell for a multimedia device like the PS3 that plays games and plays HD movies. Again, huge numbers of consumers purchase $399 iPods, $599 to $799 mac minis, and 100s of dollars for TiVo's, but somehow $499 or $599 just breaks the bank when you consider what the PS3 can do? Sure doesn't in my mind, and I'm sure it doesn't to others as well.
[B]Not just to compete in marketing terms, but with MS behind HD-DVD it really makes the industry take notice and it will stall Blu-Ray adoption as there really are two standards with heavyweights behind each. When few were behind HD-DVD, Blu-Ray was a shoe-in. But now, the game is just getting started.
What do you mean "when few were behind HD DVD?" There still are few behind HD DVD. Granted, you can consider Microsoft a heavyweight, but they are a software company and don't actually make the hardware for HD DVD drives. Yes they will have and HD DVD add-on for the Xbox, but I'm not sure who is making them and with an output of 720P isn't going to be ehhhhwwwing and ahhhhwing anyone anytime soon. Also, with the big added bonus that Microsoft was supposed to or perceived to provide rather with native HD DVD support in Vista won't have legs until sometime in late January 2007 or later. So in essence, I fail to see where Microsoft makes the industry take notice and will somehow stall Blu-ray adoption.
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Another point is that physical media probably isn't going anywhere for at least 10 years. There are people who don't have broadband internet, and even then digital distribution of HD video content requires fatter pipes. YouTube pays $1 million a month in bandwidth bills and I doubt companies really want to pay that.
That would put it at exactly the $599 price tag of the higher end PS3 but with the Blu-ray drive built-in.
difference is microsoft is offering it as an add on. if you dont want it, dont buy it. you'll still have a great gaming machine regardless.
sony could take a HUGE hit with blu-ray. they aren't giving u an option, they are saying "hey i think u want this , hell i know u want so i'll force it on you"
haha most of their statements even go something like that.
remember the boomerang controller? that stupid kutagri or whatever his name is didn't want to take it back, he swore it was a good remote. i heard people had to pull his hairs to change his mind on it.
their cocky, let them be cocky, their competitors are on the ball this time.
difference is microsoft is offering it as an add on. if you dont want it, dont buy it. you'll still have a great gaming machine regardless.
Indeed, don't buy it. Please, do us this favor, as Blu-ray drive after Blu-ray drive continues to saturate the market in the form of the PS3 while those not wanting an add-on sit and watch idly as Blu-ray becomes the de facto HD format. Thanks.
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sony could take a HUGE hit with blu-ray. they aren't giving u an option, they are saying "hey i think u want this , hell i know u want so i'll force it on you"
Usually, this is what you do when you are agressive and want your format in Blu-ray to win and capture marketshare and mindshare--very basic really. Not to mention provide technology that will provide you with future proof games in terms of storage. Funny how you resemble a person who is anti-mac when you say this, because those types of individuals say the same thing about the iMac sometimes as well as iTunes--Apple is forcing it on me, what if I don't want this graphics card, what if I don't want the monitor, what if I want to get music elsewhere, what if I want to use another MP3 player, etc. Quite simply, Sony has provided the PS3 in one elegant solution, much like the iMac or the iPod.
Comments
Originally posted by MacSuperiority
non HDCP compliant video out (everything other than HDMI right now)
DVI supports HDCP.
Originally posted by MacSuperiority
Not as good as it could.
That wasn't my point.
I was demonstrating that it's specious to say that a lack of an HDMI port means that HDTV owners won't be able to play games in HD on the low-end PS3.
I really doubt consumers are itching to buy a new dvd player and new dvd library. If the industry is smart, they'll realize the real threat to their new hard media of choice is itunes.
Apple still has a few years to get things right before one format or another even has a chance of taking over and making the other one look like betamax. I give them a 3 year window of opportunity- to get the codec, service, content and price right. When that happens, DVD, our current DVD, will end up becoming the last truly successful physical media format. Nobody will even care about these new dvd formats, being relegated to consoles and niche high end video use on pc's. You wont be buying software on it, and you certainly wont be buying your movies on it.
Bluray will go down in history as 'that custom format the ps3 used and a few geeked out pc boxes had it too'. HDDVD will be that 'interesting addon for the xbox that could play a few available movies'.
Really I think the days of competing physical media formats are just about over. Sad thing is these companies probably dont even realize it, and while they're trying to outdo their competitors with exclusive deals, licensing and whathaveyou, digital distribution is gonna come right on up from behind and surpass them both. How many billions have they wasted R@D'ing and marketing their dead formats? They're each gonna put forth huge lies in order to claim victory where none is possible.
Gates has even stated the war is almost pointless, yet they continue pushing Hd_DVD.
a lot of the times i believe its for marketing mumbo jumbo in order to look competitive against the PS3
I love having something to hold that I can put away and catalouge etc. Something I don't need to worry out crashing or a hard drive wipe.
Physical media is stable, safe and always there.
Sure some people may not want to re-buy their library but online distribution does the same thing unless your suggesting I rip every dvd I own and then upconvert it when watching it on a tv..........
..............or unless your suggesting free downloads of all the movie everyone already owns.
Otherwise people are going to have to re-gather everything no matter the format because people's current libraries aren't hd, irregardless of format.
Originally posted by ecking
Physical media is stable, safe and always there.
Unless your kid gets to it. Or you forget to put a DVD away and it slips into some abyss behind your TV.
Digital media is stable, safe, and with the internet, always everywhere.
anyways, i was going to show how last year at E3 sony's ps3 prototype had a gazzilion holes in the back for usb, firewire, this and that
but now it has virtually none.
its hilarious.
damnit, i wish this would work.
Originally posted by Elixir
Gates has even stated the war is almost pointless, yet they continue pushing Hd_DVD.
a lot of the times i believe its for marketing mumbo jumbo in order to look competitive against the PS3
Not just to compete in marketing terms, but with MS behind HD-DVD it really makes the industry take notice and it will stall Blu-Ray adoption as there really are two standards with heavyweights behind each. When few were behind HD-DVD, Blu-Ray was a shoe-in. But now, the game is just getting started.
Another point is that physical media probably isn't going anywhere for at least 10 years. There are people who don't have broadband internet, and even then digital distribution of HD video content requires fatter pipes. YouTube pays $1 million a month in bandwidth bills and I doubt companies really want to pay that.
Thus the Apple BitTorrent rumor. And you know, if it's true, it'll go in iTunes and not Mac OS.
Originally posted by Fran441
May 11, 2004, Gran Turismo was announced for the PSP. A movie was shown, it was incredible, much like the movie shown on Monday for Gran Turismo HD.
Guess what? Here we are almost 2 years to the day that the game was first shown to us and we know *nothing* about it.
At E3 2005, PSP gamers were looking to see the advances Sony had made and possibly get a release date. It was not even at the show.
So now it's E3 2006 and once again, the game is missing in action. Sony won't comment on the status of the game or give any indication on when it might see the light of day.
That's why I have no faith in Sony delivering a new Gran Turismo any time soon.
MY point was that the PS3 HAS GT HD and the 360 dont.
Originally posted by Xool
Not just to compete in marketing terms, but with MS behind HD-DVD it really makes the industry take notice and it will stall Blu-Ray adoption as there really are two standards with heavyweights behind each. When few were behind HD-DVD, Blu-Ray was a shoe-in. But now, the game is just getting started.
I've only done minimal research on this whole thing, but it seems a big difference here is that, at least as far as the 360 goes, MS is only supporting HD-DVD as a viewing medium. PS3 is making it the primary format for all of its software, ensuring a market for the medium even if the HD theater aspect doesn't take off. HD-DVD doesn't have the same safety net.
Maybe I'm not thinking it through all the way.
jebus.
Why does anyone care? iDVD (iBlueRay) wont get any new video media technology until it's been in common use for a few years. Apple is SLOW adopting new drive technology. How long did ATA-100 take, again?
Apple wont be the deciding factor in the media wars.
And YES, there will be a new media type.
I don't know which media type will win, but I can tell you this much:
1) it'll be the size of a DVD
2) it'll hold more stuff than a DVD
Thanks for playing!
Originally posted by Fran441
I understand that there will be a built in 'Blu-Ray' market from those that buy the PS3. The problem is, however, not everyone buying a PS3 will want the PS3 to watch Blu-Ray movies. HD Movies are still going to be a very small market until the majority of Americans have HDTVs. That's probably 5-6 years away.
I disagree, I think you'll find a lot of people will want the PS3 to watch Blu-ray movies, regardless of the percentage HDTVs out there. Granted, the percantage of HDTVs out there is small, but it is growing rapidly and will continue as the onslaught of HD content will be provided.
I have a PSP. It's supposed to be a gaming handheld first and a media center second. Guess what? *It is*. Can I put movies on a memory stick and watch them? Yes. Do I? *No.* Can I buy UMD movies and watch them? Yes. Do I? *No*. Can I put Music, pictures, and other media onto a memory stick to listen or look at them later? Yes. Do I? *No*. GPS, Web Browsing, watching TV via 802.11, and every other feature on the PSP to make it a 'media center' are used by a very small percentage of the user base. Heck, I don't doubt that the only reason some people with PSPs have upgraded beyond Firmware 1.5 was that Grand Theft Auto required it.
"Used by a very small percentage of the user base" based on what? Your subjective opinion. That's fine, I respect your opinion, but at the same time your PSP habits might be radically different from others. To assume because you use a PSP in one way for the majority of the time, doesn't mean all others do as well. Same goes for the PS3. Just because you would mostly do gaming on the PS3 doesn't mean I would too. I for one would probably watch movies and play games just about equally. In my opinion, there are many, many more who will do the same.
Consoles are for games first and everything else second. You buy a console because you want to play the next Metal Gear Solid, Metroid, or Halo, not because you want to watch Mission Impossible 3 in High Definition. Is it an added bonus that you can watch movies in HD? Sure. But will the majority of the market use their consoles for that purpose? No. We've seen the PS3 media center and it's just not happening.
Again this is your paradigm. Much like the iPod was in a paradigm for just music as well, but we know we can watch video on it now don't we? And, getting more capable as time goes on. The battle for the living room is going to be a big one, and I think the PS3 will give Sony a great start. To say that "No" the majority of market won't use their consoles for HD movie viewing is based upon just your opinion--as there is no statistical evidence to prove this. On the other hand, my opinion, that users would and will indeed watch movies on their PS3s quite regurlarly I would think--since Sony is taking this risk with the PS3 (assuming) based on some sort of data or feedback--has more plausability. Again, my opinion, but I think it is a bit more rational than just "PS3 media center...just not happening."
I have a 360, it's a 'next gen' gaming console. Do games look a hell of a lot better on a HDTV? Of course. There is a limit to what Standard TVs can do. But do games on the 360 look better on a standard TV than games on the original Xbox? I think that they do. The 360 also has extra 'next gen' features such as a better online service (Xbox Live arcade, well managed content downloads), the wireless controllers are great, and you still have those 'media PC' type options that you mention above (I don't use them here either).
The main purpose of the Xbox 360 is to play games, I think we can agree on that. That being said, how does the lack of a HD-DVD drive change that? The HD-DVD drive is optional because Microsoft didn't want to cram it down everyone's throats. So while it means HD-DVD doesn't get the market share, the 360 will. MS wants the 360 to gain market share while Sony wants Blu-Ray to gain market share, it's 2 completely different strategies.
I'll agree with you here on your gaming markethare outlook for the 360. Indeed, Microsoft will most likely garner a few percenatage points in marketshare from a gaming market perspective, but I don't think it will be even close in comparison to what Sony will continue to garner or maintain with the PS3 overall. 3.2 million Xbox units have been sold thus far, and it is expected that 4 million units of the PS3 will be sold by December 31st. 6 million by March for the PS3. I just don't see where some of you think that because the PS3 is $100 more (and more capable from a graphics, storage, and movie standpoint) than the Xbox 360, that all of a sudden there will be this huge defection to the Xbox 360. I just don't buy it. I think consumers will see that the PS3 is more capable, and will be more than willing to pay the $100 extra.
Moreover concerning you statement of a "better online service," we'll just have to wait and see as the jury is still out on this one--PS3s online service is supposed to be pretty sweet.
So, while you may consider your Xbox 360 'next gen,' I would consider it 'semi next-gen' when comparing technical details.
Heck, the Nintendo Wii (Revolution) doesn't have any kind of High Definition movie drive. Does that mean it's not 'next gen' too?
Ditto with the Wii. Semi. No HD drive, lower resolution, cmon we're entering the HD era, Nintendo better get on board in a hurry.
Madden 2007 is coming out for PS3, Wii, Xbox 360, and the 'last gen' consoles. What 'special' content is going to take up the other 20 GB of space on that Blu-Ray disk? What content will we be missing out on since the standard disks in the Wii and 360 won't have that much storage space? I'm betting we don't miss out on much.
You keep implying that extra storage will never seem to quantify better games. I think your wrong. If you took a look at the PS3 conference, they had a bit of information there that was eye-opening. Back with the PS2 in the beginning, 75% or so games came on just CD while the others came on DVD. Currently, now 95% of the games come on DVD. See a pattern? Need more storage. Just because HD DVD proponents lack foresight doesn't mean we ought to throw the blinders on as well. Developers always want more, and with a forward-looking format such as Blu-ray, it ought to provide the storage needed for years to come.
I never questioned that they would sell out, I even said it would be extremely hard to find. This is going to push people into the 360 camp this Christmas because people don't want to go away empty handed.
Maybe some, but not as many as a lot of you are trying to make it out to be. I think people who desire a PS3 for the most part will wait until they can get their hands on one.
There were 2 HDMI ports on the back of the PS3 pictures that Sony originally released and Sony had maintained, until yesterday, that the PS3s would have dual HDMI out ports. To not even have one on the lower end PS3 will prevent people who have a HDTV but can't find a $600 PS3 from buying one.
Speaking of fallicious, as another poster had cleared up, you'll still be able to play games on an HDTV with the $499 PS3 over component at 1080i.
The Dreamcast never had a DVD add on drive. Sony's hype machine was what killed the DC despite the fact that Sega had superior games and totally outclassed the PS2 at launch. But Sony was able to appeal to people with DVD playback. People could see the difference between DVDs and VHS on their standard TVs back then and it was enough to push the PS2 over the top. The circumstances are different now, however, since people won't see the difference from Blu-Ray or HD-DVD without a HDTV. Sony also tried to market the DC as a competitor to the PS1 and N64, despite the fact that the Dreamcast games were more polished and online before the PS2 even hit store shelves.
My apologies, I believe the console I didn't refer to correctly last was the Sega Genesis / Sega Mega Drive. The add-on was called the Sega CD / Sega Mega-CD and as you can probably infer, it was a CD based add-on which was a failure. Much like I think the HD DVD add-on drive will be. You can read more here if you like...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sega_CD
Furthermore, people will indeed see the difference when they walk into their local Best Buy, Circuit City, etc. and see a side by side comparison between Blu-ray / HD DVD and regular DVD for those who don't own an HDTV themselves. Don't fool yourself, marketing will take care of that in a hurry.
I think there is little doubt that Sony is placing all of their eggs in one basket here. They want Blu-Ray to succeed and are willing to go so far as to put their dominance of the console world in jeopardy. Nintendo has a unique system coming out that looks like it will appeal to a large audience. The people I'm talking to seem to all want a Wii, thinking it will be cheap to buy, and are trying to decide between a 360 or a PS3. After talking to them after the conferences last night and earlier today, people who were really gung ho about the PS3 are now leaning towards the 360.
Well, talk is cheap, but content from gaming studios, the majority of hollywood studios, and the majority of hardware vendors is not and they are behind Blu-ray. Making it appear that Sony is the only one behind Blu-ray is as deceptive as you can be, because it is quite obvious that Blu-ray is much, much more than Sony with the likes of the giants in the BDA.
I really think that Sony might have really made a mistake with their $600 price tag. Yes, the consoles will initially all sell out and we'll probably see an installed world wide user base of 5 million at the end of January 2007. But the real question is, how many more people will be that anxious to drop $500 or $600 on what is primarily going to be used as a gaming console? It will be interesting to see.
Let's be clear here, once again...with their...say it with me...$499 AND $599 price tag. In addition, I think the answer to your question is that millions MORE will be dropping $499 to $599 after the initial 6 million sell for a multimedia device like the PS3 that plays games and plays HD movies. Again, huge numbers of consumers purchase $399 iPods, $599 to $799 mac minis, and 100s of dollars for TiVo's, but somehow $499 or $599 just breaks the bank when you consider what the PS3 can do? Sure doesn't in my mind, and I'm sure it doesn't to others as well.
Originally posted by Xool
[B]Not just to compete in marketing terms, but with MS behind HD-DVD it really makes the industry take notice and it will stall Blu-Ray adoption as there really are two standards with heavyweights behind each. When few were behind HD-DVD, Blu-Ray was a shoe-in. But now, the game is just getting started.
What do you mean "when few were behind HD DVD?" There still are few behind HD DVD. Granted, you can consider Microsoft a heavyweight, but they are a software company and don't actually make the hardware for HD DVD drives. Yes they will have and HD DVD add-on for the Xbox, but I'm not sure who is making them and with an output of 720P isn't going to be ehhhhwwwing and ahhhhwing anyone anytime soon. Also, with the big added bonus that Microsoft was supposed to or perceived to provide rather with native HD DVD support in Vista won't have legs until sometime in late January 2007 or later. So in essence, I fail to see where Microsoft makes the industry take notice and will somehow stall Blu-ray adoption.
Another point is that physical media probably isn't going anywhere for at least 10 years. There are people who don't have broadband internet, and even then digital distribution of HD video content requires fatter pipes. YouTube pays $1 million a month in bandwidth bills and I doubt companies really want to pay that.
I'm in total agreement with you here. Well said.
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...dd-On_Price/65
That would put it at exactly the $599 price tag of the higher end PS3 but with the Blu-ray drive built-in.
Originally posted by marzetta7
Just found this...rumor that the HD DVD add-on for the Xbox 360 will be $199....
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...dd-On_Price/65
That would put it at exactly the $599 price tag of the higher end PS3 but with the Blu-ray drive built-in.
p.s. you mean the one with HDMI built-in
Originally posted by marzetta7
Just found this...rumor that the HD DVD add-on for the Xbox 360 will be $199....
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...dd-On_Price/65
That would put it at exactly the $599 price tag of the higher end PS3 but with the Blu-ray drive built-in.
difference is microsoft is offering it as an add on. if you dont want it, dont buy it. you'll still have a great gaming machine regardless.
sony could take a HUGE hit with blu-ray. they aren't giving u an option, they are saying "hey i think u want this , hell i know u want so i'll force it on you"
haha most of their statements even go something like that.
remember the boomerang controller? that stupid kutagri or whatever his name is didn't want to take it back, he swore it was a good remote. i heard people had to pull his hairs to change his mind on it.
their cocky, let them be cocky, their competitors are on the ball this time.
Originally posted by Elixir
difference is microsoft is offering it as an add on. if you dont want it, dont buy it. you'll still have a great gaming machine regardless.
Indeed, don't buy it. Please, do us this favor, as Blu-ray drive after Blu-ray drive continues to saturate the market in the form of the PS3 while those not wanting an add-on sit and watch idly as Blu-ray becomes the de facto HD format. Thanks.
sony could take a HUGE hit with blu-ray. they aren't giving u an option, they are saying "hey i think u want this , hell i know u want so i'll force it on you"
Usually, this is what you do when you are agressive and want your format in Blu-ray to win and capture marketshare and mindshare--very basic really. Not to mention provide technology that will provide you with future proof games in terms of storage. Funny how you resemble a person who is anti-mac when you say this, because those types of individuals say the same thing about the iMac sometimes as well as iTunes--Apple is forcing it on me, what if I don't want this graphics card, what if I don't want the monitor, what if I want to get music elsewhere, what if I want to use another MP3 player, etc. Quite simply, Sony has provided the PS3 in one elegant solution, much like the iMac or the iPod.