I've got to say, on the whole, I am not very impressed with leopard -- although there are some specific things that I am impressed with: Time Machine, and Screen Sharing in iChat. Spaces could be very useful if done right, or it could be unessesary, cluttering, and confusing.
I still have hope that there will at least be a new finder VISUALLY (brushed metal killed). Although, as long as brushed metal is only applied in finder windows, that might not be too bad. I don't think we will have a under-the-hood new finder. But visually, a lot still can happen.
I don't buy this secret-feature-keep-away-from-MS thing. Paired with all the anti-MS banners and jokes pervading the conference, the "sneak peak" smacks of gimmickiness. Apple has always chugged merrily on their way with innovations, regardless of what MS is up to...I really doubt they're suddenly paranoid about "Redmond." Apple is really coming into its own now, and is in the position to take some more aggressive shots at windows.
Which is all just to say that these "secret features" are hopefully pretty cool, cuz I wasn't too impressed with Leopard thusfar. The backup app was alright, different app tweaks may be handy, but there really was't a whole lot there. As for "spaces"...how many more features can they possibly add to shuffle windows around? Command-H and command-tab are pretty much all you need anyway....
But no to be too hard on ol' Steve. The only reason Leopard might look lackluster is that 10.4 is such an effortless, refined OS at this point...anything new is just icing on the cake. I feel as though the last big step is getting windows apps to run "natively" within OS X...if apple makes that happen, they really will have created "the only computer you'll ever need."
I'm disappointed it won't be released into the wild until Spring '07. I was hoping for a Christmas release. I guess they need time to swallow up what few advantages Vista will have.
I wanted a baby Leopard for Christmas.
Don't worry, Leopard Preview will be leaked in a week.
I feel as though the last big step is getting windows apps to run "natively" within OS X...if apple makes that happen, they really will have created "the only computer you'll ever need."
Luckily apple knows better than that...
The horror of all those apps with
- a layout designed to work with windows...
- windows keyboard shortcuts
- No integration whatsover with osX technologies (address book, core-image, etc, etc)
because that is what will happen once developers lose their main incentive to dedicate precious development costs to make osX-specific apps.
I've got to say, on the whole, I am not very impressed with leopard -- although there are some specific things that I am impressed with: Time Machine, and Screen Sharing in iChat. Spaces could be very useful if done right, or it could be unessesary, cluttering, and confusing.
I still have hope that there will at least be a new finder VISUALLY (brushed metal killed). Although, as long as brushed metal is only applied in finder windows, that might not be too bad. I don't think we will have a under-the-hood new finder. But visually, a lot still can happen.
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
I'm disappointed it won't be released into the wild until Spring '07. I was hoping for a Christmas release. I guess they need time to swallow up what few advantages Vista will have.
I wanted a baby Leopard for Christmas.
I just don't know how some guys kept thinking that this would be out by Christmas. There was no way that would have happened. There were hints that it would be later for a while now. The moving back of the dev conf shopuld have been enough warning.
Only non-developers would think that from August to Christmas would be enough time.
I'm sure the only reason for the delay was so MS wouldn't steal features at the last minute. MS has no problem delaying their OS, and they know it takes them half a decade to release a new one. Therefore, if leopard came out at xmas, MS would rush to copy anything it could during spring.
I'm sure that wasn't the reason. This is all theater. That's the major reason why some features are "top secret".
I just wonder exactly what it is that the developers are getting. If Apple is real about keeping some features secret, then how can they give the preview away? If they lock out certain, major features, any attempted development will be almost impossible.
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
Because, while the new major features were impressive, there were many more that we have waited for. For years!
And what about technology that was expected for Tiger that didn't make it, such as Quartz Extreme? No mention at all! And that's by no means a secret.
I'm sure that wasn't the reason. This is all theater. That's the major reason why some features are "top secret".
I just wonder exactly what it is that the developers are getting. If Apple is real about keeping some features secret, then how can they give the preview away? If they lock out certain, major features, any attempted development will be almost impossible.
Information handed out at WWDC is under NDA. Simple as that. Leak it, and get targeted. What, you think those copies aren't keyed in some way?
I wasn't overwhelmed, but I wasn't *underwhelmed* either.
That's from a user POV.
From a dev POV? Xcode 3/Xray?? OMFG *DROOL*. *Non-linear* debugging?!? Never would have thought of it. Yet they make it seem so *obvious*.
Doesn't it seem rather conspicuous that Apple (I know we haven't seen much of Leopard yet, but still) didn't mention .Mac? Now with Time Machine, the need for Backup is mitigated. Flickr plug-ins allow you to put your iphoto pictures onto flickr. Gmail can be "integrated" into your work environment. What other compelling reason does Apple have to push people toward .mac?
I guess I was expecting that Apple would announce some really cool collaborative, integrated widget that required .mac and I would have to sigh, take a deep breath, sigh again and pony up for it.
I'm sure that wasn't the reason. This is all theater. That's the major reason why some features are "top secret".
I just wonder exactly what it is that the developers are getting. If Apple is real about keeping some features secret, then how can they give the preview away? If they lock out certain, major features, any attempted development will be almost impossible.
I think the only major thing that Apple didn't show was the Finder level changes. Apple will have another Leopard preview at MacWorld SF at which time they can do so. This is possible since Finder UI-level changes don't have a significant impact on other applications. If demoed in Jan, other developers can still make mods following. Other than that, I think Apple showed the major items that use under-the-hood changes that other apps will be expected to use or link into.
I don't know I think some of you guys are taking a prematurely negative view.
Timemachine is snapshots and that's pretty damn cool to have this in your OS. It doesn't require .mac and allows for versioning and user restore. Not bad
Spaces- I personally love the idea of work spaces and Apple has added it to the OS and that can't be bad. Once you've used this before you can't imagine life without it. Plus with virtualization taking off you may want to utilize a full screen VMware/Paralles environment and dedicate a space to it. Bam ...one button and you're in your windows/linux environs.
Core Animation- The demo doesn't show enough but any ability to animate that is core to the system is bound to be used and I think there will be some creative uses in the future.
Spotlight- now has the searching abilities we've wanted.
I'm willing to bet that the hidden stuff will center around a new UI for the Finder which will likely include Rez Independence. I'm enouraged by what we see so far in Leopard. It's really the little things that define an OS and I'm sure there are plenty of little nuggets.
Information handed out at WWDC is under NDA. Simple as that. Leak it, and get targeted. What, you think those copies aren't keyed in some way?
I wasn't overwhelmed, but I wasn't *underwhelmed* either.
That's from a user POV.
From a dev POV? Xcode 3/Xray?? OMFG *DROOL*. *Non-linear* debugging?!? Never would have thought of it. Yet they make it seem so *obvious*.
Love it, love it, love it.
Sure it's under NDA. And because of that, no copies of the preview Intel Tiger version EVER got out to those trying to install it into a PC, right?
Well, I hate to tell you this, but computers, OS's, and other software aren't built, or written, for developers, but for end users.
Developers might be happy, but if we don't buy the machines or software, no matter how much you may like it, you're still out of a job.
so, what matters is that we end users like it. Developers will develop if they can make money from it.
That doesn't mean that I'm not happy about X Code 3, etc, I am.
But, you know we've been waiting, and hoping, for more. And why an important feature from Tigerthat wasn't functional, wasn't even mentioned, well, that's just worrisome.
I think the only major thing that Apple didn't show was the Finder level changes. Apple will have another Leopard preview at MacWorld SF at which time they can do so. This is possible since Finder UI-level changes don't have a significant impact on other applications. If demoed in Jan, other developers can still make mods following. Other than that, I think Apple showed the major items that use under-the-hood changes that other apps will be expected to use or link into.
That's true. I thought of that. But, I have to say, if that's it...
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
In almost all software roadmaps features get cut down on, not added on to.
Yes we do *not* know Apple's roadmap for leopard, however, I wouldn't expect any secret suprises. Mac OS X (and all OS systems, Vista includded) is the one peice of hardware and software more than anything else that is least secret. Generally there are not many features that are not released in a preview and/or beta that will not be in the final version. That wouldn't be very good if Apple dropped in a suprise feature (like Windows virtualization), because this feature will most likely have a large amount of bugs both technical and logical. There is the hope, that Boot Camp is being developed outside of Mac OS X however -- such as, iTunes compared with iLife for example.
I think Apple really should drop the brushed metal, and could do so easily, but at this point in the game, why wouldn't they have done so already if they were going to do it for the final version? Espessially since betas/previews are heavily based on looks rather than actually usability.
If anything was not demoed, lets hope that at least one thing that was not demoed is major, and just not demoed because it was not ready.
Generally though, what you see in the beta/preview is what you get in the final version -- that is -- idea wise.
The concept of Quartz Extreme may not be secret, perhaps how it specifically works is a secret.
No, it's not. It's well documented. AR's had a very good, detailed article about it when it was announced, along with the Core technologies. Sigh, but finding it\
Information handed out at WWDC is under NDA. Simple as that. Leak it, and get targeted. What, you think those copies aren't keyed in some way?
Those NDAs: Who does Apple not want you to release it to? It can't be from Microsoft, as they're also a developer. Does MS have a firewall between the MBU and Windows divisions? Did Apple ensure that no one from the Windows division of MS was allowed in?
Comments
I still have hope that there will at least be a new finder VISUALLY (brushed metal killed). Although, as long as brushed metal is only applied in finder windows, that might not be too bad. I don't think we will have a under-the-hood new finder. But visually, a lot still can happen.
Which is all just to say that these "secret features" are hopefully pretty cool, cuz I wasn't too impressed with Leopard thusfar. The backup app was alright, different app tweaks may be handy, but there really was't a whole lot there. As for "spaces"...how many more features can they possibly add to shuffle windows around? Command-H and command-tab are pretty much all you need anyway....
But no to be too hard on ol' Steve. The only reason Leopard might look lackluster is that 10.4 is such an effortless, refined OS at this point...anything new is just icing on the cake. I feel as though the last big step is getting windows apps to run "natively" within OS X...if apple makes that happen, they really will have created "the only computer you'll ever need."
I'm disappointed it won't be released into the wild until Spring '07. I was hoping for a Christmas release. I guess they need time to swallow up what few advantages Vista will have.
I wanted a baby Leopard for Christmas.
Don't worry, Leopard Preview will be leaked in a week.
8)
I feel as though the last big step is getting windows apps to run "natively" within OS X...if apple makes that happen, they really will have created "the only computer you'll ever need."
The horror of all those apps with
- a layout designed to work with windows...
- windows keyboard shortcuts
- No integration whatsover with osX technologies (address book, core-image, etc, etc)
because that is what will happen once developers lose their main incentive to dedicate precious development costs to make osX-specific apps.
I've got to say, on the whole, I am not very impressed with leopard -- although there are some specific things that I am impressed with: Time Machine, and Screen Sharing in iChat. Spaces could be very useful if done right, or it could be unessesary, cluttering, and confusing.
I still have hope that there will at least be a new finder VISUALLY (brushed metal killed). Although, as long as brushed metal is only applied in finder windows, that might not be too bad. I don't think we will have a under-the-hood new finder. But visually, a lot still can happen.
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
I'm disappointed it won't be released into the wild until Spring '07. I was hoping for a Christmas release. I guess they need time to swallow up what few advantages Vista will have.
I wanted a baby Leopard for Christmas.
I just don't know how some guys kept thinking that this would be out by Christmas. There was no way that would have happened. There were hints that it would be later for a while now. The moving back of the dev conf shopuld have been enough warning.
Only non-developers would think that from August to Christmas would be enough time.
I'm sure the only reason for the delay was so MS wouldn't steal features at the last minute. MS has no problem delaying their OS, and they know it takes them half a decade to release a new one. Therefore, if leopard came out at xmas, MS would rush to copy anything it could during spring.
I'm sure that wasn't the reason. This is all theater. That's the major reason why some features are "top secret".
I just wonder exactly what it is that the developers are getting. If Apple is real about keeping some features secret, then how can they give the preview away? If they lock out certain, major features, any attempted development will be almost impossible.
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
I was disappointed with the keynote!
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
Because, while the new major features were impressive, there were many more that we have waited for. For years!
And what about technology that was expected for Tiger that didn't make it, such as Quartz Extreme? No mention at all! And that's by no means a secret.
I'm sure that wasn't the reason. This is all theater. That's the major reason why some features are "top secret".
I just wonder exactly what it is that the developers are getting. If Apple is real about keeping some features secret, then how can they give the preview away? If they lock out certain, major features, any attempted development will be almost impossible.
Information handed out at WWDC is under NDA. Simple as that. Leak it, and get targeted. What, you think those copies aren't keyed in some way?
I wasn't overwhelmed, but I wasn't *underwhelmed* either.
That's from a user POV.
From a dev POV? Xcode 3/Xray?? OMFG *DROOL*. *Non-linear* debugging?!? Never would have thought of it. Yet they make it seem so *obvious*.
Love it, love it, love it.
I guess I was expecting that Apple would announce some really cool collaborative, integrated widget that required .mac and I would have to sigh, take a deep breath, sigh again and pony up for it.
Maybe .mac is going the way of eworld?
I'm sure that wasn't the reason. This is all theater. That's the major reason why some features are "top secret".
I just wonder exactly what it is that the developers are getting. If Apple is real about keeping some features secret, then how can they give the preview away? If they lock out certain, major features, any attempted development will be almost impossible.
I think the only major thing that Apple didn't show was the Finder level changes. Apple will have another Leopard preview at MacWorld SF at which time they can do so. This is possible since Finder UI-level changes don't have a significant impact on other applications. If demoed in Jan, other developers can still make mods following. Other than that, I think Apple showed the major items that use under-the-hood changes that other apps will be expected to use or link into.
such as Quartz Extreme?
The concept of Quartz Extreme may not be secret, perhaps how it specifically works is a secret.
Timemachine is snapshots and that's pretty damn cool to have this in your OS. It doesn't require .mac and allows for versioning and user restore. Not bad
Spaces- I personally love the idea of work spaces and Apple has added it to the OS and that can't be bad. Once you've used this before you can't imagine life without it. Plus with virtualization taking off you may want to utilize a full screen VMware/Paralles environment and dedicate a space to it. Bam ...one button and you're in your windows/linux environs.
Core Animation- The demo doesn't show enough but any ability to animate that is core to the system is bound to be used and I think there will be some creative uses in the future.
Spotlight- now has the searching abilities we've wanted.
I'm willing to bet that the hidden stuff will center around a new UI for the Finder which will likely include Rez Independence. I'm enouraged by what we see so far in Leopard. It's really the little things that define an OS and I'm sure there are plenty of little nuggets.
Don't rush Apple...ship it when it's ready.
Information handed out at WWDC is under NDA. Simple as that. Leak it, and get targeted. What, you think those copies aren't keyed in some way?
I wasn't overwhelmed, but I wasn't *underwhelmed* either.
That's from a user POV.
From a dev POV? Xcode 3/Xray?? OMFG *DROOL*. *Non-linear* debugging?!? Never would have thought of it. Yet they make it seem so *obvious*.
Love it, love it, love it.
Sure it's under NDA. And because of that, no copies of the preview Intel Tiger version EVER got out to those trying to install it into a PC, right?
Well, I hate to tell you this, but computers, OS's, and other software aren't built, or written, for developers, but for end users.
Developers might be happy, but if we don't buy the machines or software, no matter how much you may like it, you're still out of a job.
so, what matters is that we end users like it. Developers will develop if they can make money from it.
That doesn't mean that I'm not happy about X Code 3, etc, I am.
But, you know we've been waiting, and hoping, for more. And why an important feature from Tigerthat wasn't functional, wasn't even mentioned, well, that's just worrisome.
I think the only major thing that Apple didn't show was the Finder level changes. Apple will have another Leopard preview at MacWorld SF at which time they can do so. This is possible since Finder UI-level changes don't have a significant impact on other applications. If demoed in Jan, other developers can still make mods following. Other than that, I think Apple showed the major items that use under-the-hood changes that other apps will be expected to use or link into.
That's true. I thought of that. But, I have to say, if that's it...
What's with all the people "disappointed" with Leopard, who then go on to say that they are impressed by all the parts of Leopard that were shown?? Hell000ooo, it was a "sneak" preview. Not the final thing! The parts of it that were shown are the only things we know about Leopard. You can't be disappointed in something that you don't even know anything about! So if you're impressed by some of the things you saw today, chances are you'll love Leopard in it's completed form...
In almost all software roadmaps features get cut down on, not added on to.
Yes we do *not* know Apple's roadmap for leopard, however, I wouldn't expect any secret suprises. Mac OS X (and all OS systems, Vista includded) is the one peice of hardware and software more than anything else that is least secret. Generally there are not many features that are not released in a preview and/or beta that will not be in the final version. That wouldn't be very good if Apple dropped in a suprise feature (like Windows virtualization), because this feature will most likely have a large amount of bugs both technical and logical. There is the hope, that Boot Camp is being developed outside of Mac OS X however -- such as, iTunes compared with iLife for example.
I think Apple really should drop the brushed metal, and could do so easily, but at this point in the game, why wouldn't they have done so already if they were going to do it for the final version? Espessially since betas/previews are heavily based on looks rather than actually usability.
If anything was not demoed, lets hope that at least one thing that was not demoed is major, and just not demoed because it was not ready.
Generally though, what you see in the beta/preview is what you get in the final version -- that is -- idea wise.
The concept of Quartz Extreme may not be secret, perhaps how it specifically works is a secret.
No, it's not. It's well documented. AR's had a very good, detailed article about it when it was announced, along with the Core technologies. Sigh, but finding it
Information handed out at WWDC is under NDA. Simple as that. Leak it, and get targeted. What, you think those copies aren't keyed in some way?
Those NDAs: Who does Apple not want you to release it to? It can't be from Microsoft, as they're also a developer. Does MS have a firewall between the MBU and Windows divisions? Did Apple ensure that no one from the Windows division of MS was allowed in?
I don't get it.