The idea of having to change your phone number just to buy an iPhone strikes me as a requirement that would harm sales considerably. If there really isn't a slot to access the sim card I could suggest one where they can insert the whole device.
If THIS is not a SIM card tray that I don't know what it is.
Network or networks? No single network covers Europe. I do wonder a bit about the sim card situation. I thought several European countries legally required that your phone number be transportable between networks. How can that happen if the sim card truly is not accessible?
UK at least it's transferrable between networks. In the UK also the phone can be locked to a particular network but it's not illegal to unlock a phone and some carriers offer unlocking services in the shop. The problem with unlocking smartphones though is that it usually involves re-installing a complete set of generic firmware - ie the whole OS.
In some countries I think it's actually a legal requirement that phones are sold unlocked and some countries they are unlocked for free after a certain amount of time on a contract.
UK at least it's transferrable between networks. In the UK also the phone can be locked to a particular network but it's not illegal to unlock a phone and some carriers offer unlocking services in the shop. The problem with unlocking smartphones though is that it usually involves re-installing a complete set of generic firmware - ie the whole OS.
In some countries I think it's actually a legal requirement that phones are sold unlocked and some countries they are unlocked for free after a certain amount of time on a contract.
I remember Jobs saying that the phone would be unlocked, but that still doesn't mean that it will work with just any sim.
If THIS is not a SIM card tray that I don't know what it is.
The iPhone DOES have a sim tray, or slot. The question is whether it will recognize any other sim than the one from an authorized phone company.
Some question the value of the sim slot if that's true. But, there would still be value to it. This way, Apple wouldn't have to program the phones themselves, thus, guessing how many phones would have to have which phone companies software. The sim cards would be much cheaper to bother with.
Last year's K790/800 replaced the K750 2mp phone mentioned earlier..
Ahhh Ok, I've never seen that phone before. Yes I agree camera wise that is much better than nearly every other camera phone. The bad part of that is that the camera dominates the phone too much. Even though that is a better camera it looks like it would make a worse phone.
Quote:
At 3.2mp or 5mp you're not even up one side of the hump never mind gliding down the other side of the megapixel myth.
The true judge is when you make a print. Not viewing a reduced image on an anti-aliasing computer screen.
I hope it is locked to only the network that its sold with on a contract and even a seperate sim from that company wont work if the phone is bought seperatley.
That beacause you guys are generally behind in the phone market so get charged more.
I must be missing something... Can you (or anyone) explain this more slowly? Why would it be that a cell phone that's 'free with a contract' in the EU sells for upwards of $1000 here in the US? Being 'behind in the phone market' just doesn't make sense.
Question: Let's assume (rightly or wrongly) that it is possible to stick another company's SIM card into the iPhone and make it work. Let's also assume that Apple doesn't try to prevent people from doing this. Would there be any other technical reason that the phone itself wouldn't work? Perhaps the voicemail wouldn't work, but would the phone work?
I would imagine that every mobile phone follows certain guidelines to make them inter operable.
At the very worst, it's a software/firmware blockage.
I couldn't see Apple putting a hardware limitation. For instance, what if AT&T deal goes wrong in the near future and they need to change providers, or, maybe Apple becomes a VNMO, they wouldn't recall hundreds of thousands if not millions of phones.
Question: Let's assume (rightly or wrongly) that it is possible to stick another company's SIM card into the iPhone and make it work. Let's also assume that Apple doesn't try to prevent people from doing this. Would there be any other technical reason that the phone itself wouldn't work? Perhaps the voicemail wouldn't work, but would the phone work?
If what you said were true, then it would work. That's the purpose of sims. You won't get certain phone/network functions, but most things should work.
No, that's not unlocked. That'd be locked, but in a less restrictive way.
In theory, I agree. But, this isn't theory. It's like a warranty. There are limited warranties, unlimited warranties, nontransferable warranties, and transferable warranties. Some last for 30 days, some are lifetime.
This is the same thing. There are unlimited unlocked phones, and ones that have a more limited unlockability.
You might not be happy about that, but it does exist.
This is the same thing. There are unlimited unlocked phones, and ones that have a more limited unlockability.
Not in GSM world there isn't. If the phone has it's SIM lock removed, it's unlocked. There are different kinds of 'locked' where a phone may be locked to a specific provider or country but unlocked is unlocked. Nobody is going to half unlock a phone and nobody sells phones that are 'unlocked' that are still locked to a country or network.
This is a pointless argument though. It costs anywhere from totally free to about $20 to completely unlock a phone in Europe and even replace the firmware with generic unbranded firmware. It's a legal requirement that they can be unlocked or sold completely unlocked in some countries. On smartphones, replacing the firmware is the tricky bit but by the time it reaches Europe I'm sure it will have been cracked and I can't see Apple being keen on having Vodafone/Orange/O2 branding blighting their shiny gadgets.
I wonder how this can be sold by Apple stores (both retail and online) and not be sold unlocked. Is it at all possible that Apple would sell them unlocked and just kind of encourage people to go with AT&T? Is it possible that AT&T has exclusive rights to sell the iPhone at their stores, but not necessarily be the exclusive carrier for it?
This is all a waste of time. We'll see in a few days. Arguing about semantics isn't going to tell us anything. I see dogma everywhere I look, and most of it is wrong.
Comments
The idea of having to change your phone number just to buy an iPhone strikes me as a requirement that would harm sales considerably. If there really isn't a slot to access the sim card I could suggest one where they can insert the whole device.
If THIS is not a SIM card tray that I don't know what it is.
Network or networks? No single network covers Europe. I do wonder a bit about the sim card situation. I thought several European countries legally required that your phone number be transportable between networks. How can that happen if the sim card truly is not accessible?
UK at least it's transferrable between networks. In the UK also the phone can be locked to a particular network but it's not illegal to unlock a phone and some carriers offer unlocking services in the shop. The problem with unlocking smartphones though is that it usually involves re-installing a complete set of generic firmware - ie the whole OS.
In some countries I think it's actually a legal requirement that phones are sold unlocked and some countries they are unlocked for free after a certain amount of time on a contract.
UK at least it's transferrable between networks. In the UK also the phone can be locked to a particular network but it's not illegal to unlock a phone and some carriers offer unlocking services in the shop. The problem with unlocking smartphones though is that it usually involves re-installing a complete set of generic firmware - ie the whole OS.
In some countries I think it's actually a legal requirement that phones are sold unlocked and some countries they are unlocked for free after a certain amount of time on a contract.
I remember Jobs saying that the phone would be unlocked, but that still doesn't mean that it will work with just any sim.
If THIS is not a SIM card tray that I don't know what it is.
The iPhone DOES have a sim tray, or slot. The question is whether it will recognize any other sim than the one from an authorized phone company.
Some question the value of the sim slot if that's true. But, there would still be value to it. This way, Apple wouldn't have to program the phones themselves, thus, guessing how many phones would have to have which phone companies software. The sim cards would be much cheaper to bother with.
Last year's K790/800 replaced the K750 2mp phone mentioned earlier..
Ahhh Ok, I've never seen that phone before. Yes I agree camera wise that is much better than nearly every other camera phone. The bad part of that is that the camera dominates the phone too much. Even though that is a better camera it looks like it would make a worse phone.
At 3.2mp or 5mp you're not even up one side of the hump never mind gliding down the other side of the megapixel myth.
The true judge is when you make a print. Not viewing a reduced image on an anti-aliasing computer screen.
Bravo Apple!!!!
I remember Jobs saying that the phone would be unlocked, but that still doesn't mean that it will work with just any sim.
Unlocked means it'll work with any SIM.
Oh, please! If any of that were true, Jobs would have jumped on announcing it.
Agreed! It does harken me back to the days of the freaks proclaiming that K78 was **NOT** the GM (aka 10.0 - I think that was the build number)
Dave
That beacause you guys are generally behind in the phone market so get charged more.
I must be missing something... Can you (or anyone) explain this more slowly? Why would it be that a cell phone that's 'free with a contract' in the EU sells for upwards of $1000 here in the US? Being 'behind in the phone market' just doesn't make sense.
Dave
Unlocked means it'll work with any SIM.
Maybe, maybe not.
It could mean that it will work with sims from other authorized companies, and that you could move it around between those.
And you can use it to browse the internet? Mother fucker. Nevermind what I said.
I've had my Nokia N80 with a Nokia developed browser based on.. wait for it.. WebCore.
And yes, it works damn well.
I can only imagine what Apple has done to it since then..
I would imagine that every mobile phone follows certain guidelines to make them inter operable.
At the very worst, it's a software/firmware blockage.
I couldn't see Apple putting a hardware limitation. For instance, what if AT&T deal goes wrong in the near future and they need to change providers, or, maybe Apple becomes a VNMO, they wouldn't recall hundreds of thousands if not millions of phones.
Question: Let's assume (rightly or wrongly) that it is possible to stick another company's SIM card into the iPhone and make it work. Let's also assume that Apple doesn't try to prevent people from doing this. Would there be any other technical reason that the phone itself wouldn't work? Perhaps the voicemail wouldn't work, but would the phone work?
If what you said were true, then it would work. That's the purpose of sims. You won't get certain phone/network functions, but most things should work.
£7.50 a month gets you 120MB. Or you pay £1 a day for up to 15MB. Whilst not 'Unlimited' it's fairly reasonable.
And they also support YouTube on most of the higher end phones already.
http://online.vodafone.co.uk/dispatc...rvletFlag=true
Maybe, maybe not.
It could mean that it will work with sims from other authorized companies, and that you could move it around between those.
No, that's not unlocked. That'd be locked, but in a less restrictive way.
No, that's not unlocked. That'd be locked, but in a less restrictive way.
In theory, I agree. But, this isn't theory. It's like a warranty. There are limited warranties, unlimited warranties, nontransferable warranties, and transferable warranties. Some last for 30 days, some are lifetime.
This is the same thing. There are unlimited unlocked phones, and ones that have a more limited unlockability.
You might not be happy about that, but it does exist.
This is the same thing. There are unlimited unlocked phones, and ones that have a more limited unlockability.
Not in GSM world there isn't. If the phone has it's SIM lock removed, it's unlocked. There are different kinds of 'locked' where a phone may be locked to a specific provider or country but unlocked is unlocked. Nobody is going to half unlock a phone and nobody sells phones that are 'unlocked' that are still locked to a country or network.
This is a pointless argument though. It costs anywhere from totally free to about $20 to completely unlock a phone in Europe and even replace the firmware with generic unbranded firmware. It's a legal requirement that they can be unlocked or sold completely unlocked in some countries. On smartphones, replacing the firmware is the tricky bit but by the time it reaches Europe I'm sure it will have been cracked and I can't see Apple being keen on having Vodafone/Orange/O2 branding blighting their shiny gadgets.