Apple orders aluminum 13-inch MacBook shells, 3G iPhone chips

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  • Reply 81 of 149
    matt_smatt_s Posts: 299member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ShawnJ View Post


    I don't know.



    Apple does what it can. Notebook design is a mature category at this point. Apple has contributed (1) magnetic latches (although the latchless magnetic design would be nice on the next MBP revision); (2) backlit keyboard with ambient lighting sensors; (3) large multi-touch trackpad; (4) integrated isight camera; (5) magnetic power-cord; (6) slot-loading drives; (7) sturdy, low-standing hinge design; (8) thin form-factors; (9) next generation display backlights; (10) Sudden Motion Sensor.



    Even the MacBook Air, Apple's most revolutionary notebook product in years, is only "evolutionary" because technology has evolved to the point where Apple could reduce the thinness of the device. I don't see notebook design changing all that much for the foreseeable future.



    What you're looking for, it seems, is a revolutionary new product type.



    Your response is very thoughtful, thank you. But I think you may be confusing features with design.



    Over these many years of stultified laptop design, Apple has elected to add features and benefits to the product line but has kept the exact same body and color.



    If the latch is magnetic or not, the PowerBook and/or the MacBook Pro looks just like it did before the new latch as it does after the new latch.



    Even the MacBook Air looks just like the MBP product line. Why do we all have to have the exact same looking laptops? It's like we have some corporate uniform or something.



    I don't want anything revolutionary, that's not what I'm asking for. All I'm asking for is something bare bones simple to do. A different color maybe. Something - anything new and different. All I want is for Apple to get off their lazy designing butts and give us something new. A new look. No more silver shit, please!
  • Reply 82 of 149
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 31,787member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    I've added a lot here. Unlike you, I'm not looking for allies, I could care less if anyone agrees with me or not.



    All I want is a Mac laptop that doesn't look exactly like the Mac laptop I bought before that Mac laptop, and exactly like the one I bought before that one, and exactly like the one I bought before that one.



    You see, when I buy a new laptop, I'd like to think I'm actually buying a new laptop for my $3000, and not the same old same old same old thing we've all been force fed for the many years that have dragged on for this never ending product line.



    I'm not sure I understand what the problem is. You know that the machine has been upgraded, updated, rejuvenated, etc, several times. That's what matters isn't it?



    The more often Apple changes cases, the more it costs them, and guess who pays?



    Are you really more interested in a machine looking different than being a better machine?
  • Reply 83 of 149
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    I've added a lot here. Unlike you, I'm not looking for allies, I could care less if anyone agrees with me or not.



    All I want is a Mac laptop that doesn't look exactly like the Mac laptop I bought before that Mac laptop, and exactly like the one I bought before that one, and exactly like the one I bought before that one.



    You see, when I buy a new laptop, I'd like to think I'm actually buying a new laptop for my $3000, and not the same old same old same old thing we've all been force fed for the many years that have dragged on for this never ending product line.



    I see, you want something that shows off that you have a new Mac but care little for the new technology inside.



    There are plenty of things you can do to make it different:

    — TechShell - adds protection and a colour to your notebook

    — Paint it like your favourite car - but watch out for Ferrari and Lambo, as people might think you have an Acer

    — Laser etching - not terribly expensive and can yield some nifty designs

    — Carbon fiber sticky paper - this will give you machine a poor carbon fiber look. On the plus side, you still get to retain the rigidity of aluminum at that thickness

    — Have a new case custom made - this can be quite expensive

    — Stick the internals of a modern Mac into the shell of something old - classic mods are popular these days and can get you some coin on eBay when you sell it
  • Reply 84 of 149
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 31,787member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    Your response is very thoughtful, thank you. But I think you may be confusing features with design.



    Over these many years of stultified laptop design, Apple has elected to add features and benefits to the product line but has kept the exact same body and color.



    If the latch is magnetic or not, the PowerBook and/or the MacBook Pro looks just like it did before the new latch as it does after the new latch.



    Even the MacBook Air looks just like the MBP product line. Why do we all have to have the exact same looking laptops? It's like we have some corporate uniform or something.



    I don't want anything revolutionary, that's not what I'm asking for. All I'm asking for is something bare bones simple to do. A different color maybe. Something - anything new and different. All I want is for Apple to get off their lazy designing butts and give us something new. A new look. No more silver shit, please!



    You still haven't given a real reason for this other than you're tired of it, and that the WiFi reception is not quire as good (which has been improving with each revision), which is not much of a reason.



    As I've mentioned earlier, when a design has reached a certain level, it's difficult to find something much different that's not only better, but even as good. I'm sure Apple is working on it, but I surely hope it's not because they want it to LOOK different. It must be an improvement in function, reliability, etc. Looks should come last at this point, as the cases look very good now.
  • Reply 85 of 149
    mzaslovemzaslove Posts: 519member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    I'm not sure I understand what the problem is. You know that the machine has been upgraded, updated, rejuvenated, etc, several times. That's what matters isn't it?



    The more often Apple changes cases, the more it costs them, and guess who pays?



    Are you really more interested in a machine looking different than being a better machine?



    I think some people like change for the sake of change, which is cool, I guess... but it's a fine line between fashion (which changes with the seasons) and redesigning in technology (can take longer, and one runs the risk of messing a whole line up).



    Me, I think it's a sexy design the way the laptops are now (MBP's I'm talking about), and evolutionary changes are fine (especially as they keep making the interiors better and better). But some people just want a change for the sake of being different. But, as has been pointed out, the sales are pretty darn good as is, so I don't see Apple doing anything major to mess with that. There's always the possibility they design something that people don't like as much (going from the 328 Ferrari's to the 348's -- horrible transitions, and I didn't buy another new one till the 355's came out -- comes to mind) and that would effect sales.
  • Reply 86 of 149
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 31,787member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    I think some people like change for the sake of change, which is cool, I guess... but it's a fine line between fashion (which changes with the seasons) and redesigning in technology (can take longer, and one runs the risk of messing a whole line up).



    Me, I think it's a sexy design the way the laptops are now (MBP's I'm talking about), and evolutionary changes are fine (especially as they keep making the interiors better and better). But some people just want a change for the sake of being different. But, as has been pointed out, the sales are pretty darn good as is, so I don't see Apple doing anything major to mess with that. There's always the possibility they design something that people don't like as much (going from the 328 Ferrari's to the 348's -- horrible transitions, and I didn't buy another new one till the 355's came out -- comes to mind) and that would effect sales.



    We can look at one Apple fashion change that worked. The change from the while plastic iMac to the aluminum one with the glass and black bezel. That resulted in much better sales. Now the truth is that the older machines, while almost revolutionary when they first came out, got old looking fast, and looked cheap. The new ones do look much better, though some here hate them.



    I can still see some messing with that design, as it's not finished.



    But the MBP's are classic. Simple, with no extraneous junk. True Bauhaus design. The Air adds non functional parts to the case edges. I predict that they will disappear after a while, though we might see a bit of it elsewhere in Apple's designs for a time, though I hope not.
  • Reply 87 of 149
    mzaslovemzaslove Posts: 519member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    We can look at one Apple fashion change that worked. The change from the while plastic iMac to the aluminum one with the glass and black bezel. That resulted in much better sales. Now the truth is that the older machines, while almost revolutionary when they first came out, got old looking fast, and looked cheap. The new ones do look much better, though some here hate them.



    I can still see some messing with that design, as it's not finished.



    But the MBP's are classic. Simple, with no extraneous junk. True Bauhaus design. The Air adds non functional parts to the case edges. I predict that they will disappear after a while, though we might see a bit of it elsewhere in Apple's designs for a time, though I hope not.



    Yeah, I'm with you. I really like the MBP's looks. I can see tinkering (for good or bad going on), but I wouldn't mess with such a great design too much. But the MBA does show where they're experimenting, and as most everyone have said, that will no doubt trickle into the other laptops.



    And, if Apple came up with something totally new and wonderful, I'd never complain... but change for the sake of change in design has never been something I've subscribed to. I'd much rather see them a little thinner, a little better insides, faster, etc.
  • Reply 88 of 149
    matt_smatt_s Posts: 299member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    Yeah, I'm with you. I really like the MBP's looks. I can see tinkering (for good or bad going on), but I wouldn't mess with such a great design too much. But the MBA does show where they're experimenting, and as most everyone have said, that will no doubt trickle into the other laptops.



    And, if Apple came up with something totally new and wonderful, I'd never complain... but change for the sake of change in design has never been something I've subscribed to. I'd much rather see them a little thinner, a little better insides, faster, etc.



    I'm happy you folks don't expect too much from Apple... that way, you'll never be disappointed.



    The last 5 automobiles I bought were all different... perhaps similar brands, but they looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last 3 houses I purchased were all very different, and looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last five suits I bought all had trousers and jackets but they all looked different. I didn't buy the same grey suit over and over and over again, even if the pockets were new and improved.



    The last five Mac laptops I bought - with the sole exception of the BlackBook - were different but they all looked the same, and personally, I'm tired of it.
  • Reply 89 of 149
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    I'm happy you folks don't expect too much from Apple... that way, you'll never be disappointed.



    The last 5 automobiles I bought were all different... perhaps similar brands, but they looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last 3 houses I purchased were all very different, and looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last five suits I bought all had trousers and jackets but they all looked different. I didn't buy the same grey suit over and over and over again, even if the pockets were new and improved.



    The last five Mac laptops I bought - with the sole exception of the BlackBook - were different but they all looked the same, and personally, I'm tired of it.



    That is a very, very weak argument.
  • Reply 90 of 149
    mzaslovemzaslove Posts: 519member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    I'm happy you folks don't expect too much from Apple... that way, you'll never be disappointed.



    The last 5 automobiles I bought were all different... perhaps similar brands, but they looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last 3 houses I purchased were all very different, and looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last five suits I bought all had trousers and jackets but they all looked different. I didn't buy the same grey suit over and over and over again, even if the pockets were new and improved.



    The last five Mac laptops I bought - with the sole exception of the BlackBook - were different but they all looked the same, and personally, I'm tired of it.



    You don't have to sound condescending about it. Not a matter of "don't expect too much," simply a different emphasis on what's important. I have nothing against you wanting change... we're just discussing a subjective call on buying decisions. You want change and it doesn't come... you don't buy. Me, when they changed the Ferrari's in a way I didn't like, I didn't buy. I completely understand that. No big deal. People are simply hazarding the guess that there may not be a gigantic change in style in the near future. But since none of us know anything truly about Apple's plans, it's all just guesswork. I'd be more than happy with a revolutionary design that I liked... but I'm quite happy with what they have now as well. My computers tend to be bought for practical purposes first (I need them to write with), and looks second (though I did buy my first PowerBook out of the sheer sexiness of the design). Each to his own.
  • Reply 91 of 149
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 31,787member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    I'm happy you folks don't expect too much from Apple... that way, you'll never be disappointed.



    The last 5 automobiles I bought were all different... perhaps similar brands, but they looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last 3 houses I purchased were all very different, and looked different. Thank heavens design still exists in that market!



    The last five suits I bought all had trousers and jackets but they all looked different. I didn't buy the same grey suit over and over and over again, even if the pockets were new and improved.



    The last five Mac laptops I bought - with the sole exception of the BlackBook - were different but they all looked the same, and personally, I'm tired of it.



    You're missing the entire point.



    Cars are bought mostly on fashion. Even those who say otherwise, buy their cars for the looks, and prestige, that one way or the other, they think they will get from them.



    That's one reason why the car arguments normally fall flat.



    As far as houses go, that's also a non starter as far as an argument goes. One thing alone kills it. Do you buy another house every year or two just to have a different look? And is it always a new, unique, design? I doubt that very much!



    How you can even think to bring these up in a discussion about potable computers, is well beyond my understanding.



    Why don't you just spray the case bright pink? That will get you all the attention you would want.
  • Reply 92 of 149
    mzaslovemzaslove Posts: 519member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Why don't you just spray the case bright pink? That will get you all the attention you would want.





    Hee-hee-hee. That made me laugh. Believe me, in L.A. we get a lot of that... like Angelyne and her pink Corvette.
  • Reply 93 of 149
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    Hee-hee-hee. That made me laugh. Believe me, in L.A. we get a lot of that... like Angelyne and her pink Corvette.

  • Reply 94 of 149
    matt_smatt_s Posts: 299member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    You don't have to sound condescending about it. Not a matter of "don't expect too much," simply a different emphasis on what's important. I have nothing against you wanting change... we're just discussing a subjective call on buying decisions. You want change and it doesn't come... you don't buy. Me, when they changed the Ferrari's in a way I didn't like, I didn't buy. I completely understand that. No big deal. People are simply hazarding the guess that there may not be a gigantic change in style in the near future. But since none of us know anything truly about Apple's plans, it's all just guesswork. I'd be more than happy with a revolutionary design that I liked... but I'm quite happy with what they have now as well. My computers tend to be bought for practical purposes first (I need them to write with), and looks second (though I did buy my first PowerBook out of the sheer sexiness of the design). Each to his own.



    I apologize if I sounded condescending, that was not what I intended. I just get tired when folks give Apple a free pass when they've plainly sat back on their laurels. They made a great design but that was 6, 7, 8 years ago. Enough is enough. Get on with it!



    Am I the only one who finds it strange that the company noted for their industrial design dishes out the same laptop design year after year after year? How is this innovative design practice? Don't confuse features with design.



    If you like it - fine - no worries. Buy it, enjoy it. But that still doesn't halt the undeniable fact that the Aluminum PowerBook I bought in 2003 looks pretty much exactly like the Aluminum laptop I bought in 2004, the Aluminum laptop I bought in 2006, and all the Aluminum laptops they've introduced since then. It just goes on and on.



    Doesn't anyone except me and a few others here think this is stagnant design practice? I mean, even if you love the look, you must admit it's the same look year after year after year after year after year. Ya might think that's good but still, it's the same damn warmed-over thing all the time.



    Can't they think of anything different? Their slogan was "Think Different." Maybe they need to change that to "Think Same."



    That's all I'm saying.
  • Reply 95 of 149
    mzaslovemzaslove Posts: 519member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    I apologize if I sounded condescending, that was not what I intended. I just get tired when folks give Apple a free pass when they've plainly sat back on their laurels. They made a great design but that was 6, 7, 8 years ago. Enough is enough. Get on with it! ... That's all I'm saying.



    'S cool, I understand. I think it gets harder and harder as Apple gets more and more successful to tempt fate with huge stylistic changes when things are going well in a line. Especially, though around for so long, when the MBP's still look so much better (to me) than the competition. Though, the iMac did change drastically, so who's to say. Now, if they made a laptop that would roll up....
  • Reply 96 of 149
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    Can't they think of anything different? They're slogan was "Think Different." Maybe they need to change that to "Think Same."



    They just released a notebook that has no user-changeable battery and no optical drive. It also has a Merom processor on a 22mm chip and no Ethernet port. It's meant to be very mobile. Is that not Thinking Different from the rest of the industry?



    Quote:

    That's all I'm saying.



    You still haven't said what is wrong with the design. All you've stated is that it doesn't fell as elitist to passerby. Every year Apple adds or takes away from their machines and then we watch as the industry eventually follows suit. This is Apple we're talking about, not a failing Detroit automotive market that thinks adding fins to their automobiles will spark more sales. My notebook bag isn't made to handle a MB with fins.
  • Reply 97 of 149
    matt_smatt_s Posts: 299member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    'S cool, I understand. I think it gets harder and harder as Apple gets more and more successful to tempt fate with huge stylistic changes when things are going well in a line. Especially, though around for so long, when the MBP's still look so much better (to me) than the competition. Though, the iMac did change drastically, so who's to say. Now, if they made a laptop that would roll up....



    Folks are putting words in my mouth and we all know that's unsanitary practice



    A design change to alter the line's stultified look does not need to be radical or revolutionary.It doesn't need to be space age compounds. It doesn't have to be a wedge or a football. We don't need to go from one extreme to another.



    Even a color change would be welcomed. Or simply make the Apple on the cover smaller, put it closer to the top. Go from a gloss to a matte finish. Anything, it's just not that hard. We don't have to look like we all have the same machine, year after year after year.



    That way you could look across the coffee shop, see somebody working over there and say "Hey, he's got one of those cool, new Mac laptops! I gotta get me one of those!"



    Right now, if you look out at 50 people all working on their Aluminum Mac laptops, there's no way to know if it's new or 7 years old.



    To me, that's dead design. Think Same.
  • Reply 98 of 149
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mzaslove View Post


    I think it gets harder and harder as Apple gets more and more successful to tempt fate with huge stylistic changes when things are going well in a line.



    It is harder. We have smaller and more condensed machines. Yet we prefer a certain size in our monitor and keyboard. Aesthetically, the only thing they can do that is still functional is make it smaller and lighter, which they have done.The could remove space from the side of the keyboard and monitor but that would lessen the structural rigidity of the case.



    I think the next major moves we'll see with notebooks is, first, the removal of the optical drive, and, second, the use of an OLED screen which will allow for a thinner, but more importantly reduce the battery usage. It will still be the same basic design that all notebooks have been so matt_s won't be satisfied.
  • Reply 99 of 149
    matt_smatt_s Posts: 299member
    Quote:

    You still haven't said what is wrong with the design. All you've stated is that it doesn't fell as elitist to passerby. Every year Apple adds or takes away from their machines and then we watch as the industry eventually follows suit. This is Apple we're talking about, not a failing Detroit automotive market that thinks adding fins to their automobiles will spark more sales. My notebook bag isn't made to handle a MB with fins.



    You're confusing features with design.
  • Reply 100 of 149
    mzaslovemzaslove Posts: 519member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by matt_s View Post


    Folks are putting words in my mouth and we all know that's unsanitary practice



    A design change to alter the line's stultified look does not need to be radical or revolutionary.It doesn't need to be space age compounds. It doesn't have to be a wedge or a football. We don't need to go from one extreme to another.




    My bad... for some reason I thought you were calling for more than that. (Though now that you mention it a full-on football laptop would be great to bring to the beach and double to play a game of catch with when not working... or that Frisbee-shaped one. I kid... I kid....)
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