"We don't know how to make a $500 computer that's not a piece of junk, and our DNA will not let us ship that."
That's interesting because the low-end Mac Mini is $100 over priced and I agree that it is a piece of junk. Integrated graphics, no keyboard or mouse, and 1Gb of memory standard makes it over priced and a weak offering at $599.
A new Mac Mini with the 2GB RAM, 120Gb hard drive, the NVIDIA M9400 chipset, and a keyboard and mouse at $499 on the other hand is not a piece of junk. That is a value packed system with enough margins for Apple to justify selling them. Substitute the superdrive for a blu-ray drive and that's worth an extra $200 at $699 alone.
Of course. The purchase of P.A Semi has Netbook written all over it and Apple's newfound love for the "Cloud" is another. I expect a $699-799 Apple "netbook" to hit within 18 months.
You can say that again! Have you seen the latest iPhone hybrid-puter? The mousepad is an iPhone!
I never know what investors are going to think about Apple's earnings. I quit guessing years ago. There were certainly things in this report that could have caused it to tank like in past quarters but I think SJ came to talk positively about some things going on so it wouldn't again. The market is too volatile right now.
You can never predict the future by what Mr. Jobs says either. He has changed course too many times. He may hate something one day and love it the next. I don't think that's bad. It shows he has an open mind and is persuadable.
As for TV, I think games are the natural thing that will push to over the top. There are enough possibilities there and enough moves in that direction to make it a very interesting hobby. A lot of people are making games for iPhone now and could move to a full fledged Mac games. There are programs that use iPhone and Touch as controllers over your network and they could control games on TV.
I don't see it totally replacing game consoles, especially for those who already have them, but with a Safari browser and some games, TV could become a big point of interest for a lot of people.
Looking forward to MacWorld to see if there are any surprises.
"I wasn't alive then, but from everything I've heard, Babe Ruth only had one home run. He just kept hitting it over and over again."
Well, this seems to be the key to Apple's recent success. Make one high valued product, make it desirable so people pay a premium price over it and make billions.. It works. But it only works because the Apple brand is hot at the moment. It's a win-win for both consumers and Apple. Consumers get the cool gadgets, Apple makes (a lot of) money.
I am worried though for the creative artists who need FW to get their work done, or need a matte screen because looking at a mirror screen for 9 hours non-stop is no fun.. I am in that category and for the last few days I've been surfing the net looking at prices for Windows PC's. I already know my next display will be not a new glossy Cinema Display but a matte Eizo and my new netbook will be a MSI Wind .. This 500 dollar netbook has a 2,5 inch 160GB harddrive!!!!!! Plus 3x USB 2.0, ethernet etc... runs on a stable Windows XP OS. In fact, I prefer a cheaper netbook so I can take it on holidays. If it gets stolen the loss is not so high, plus without the Apple logo it doesn't get stolen so easily..
If Apple decides to release iWorks Touch or perhaps Microsoft develops an Office Touch, it'll be a decent productivity tool. Peripherals can be sorted out by adding Wireless USB instead of space consuming physical ports.
This is the direction I'd like to see. I use my itouch more as a mobile internet netbook than as an iPod. Peripherals connecting with wifi would make sense given they haven't allowed bluetooth in the itouch.
[re] "Apple added another $3.7 billion in cash during the quarter, so it now has $24.5 billion "safely in the bank, and zero debt" Jobs noted. He spoke of "extraordinary opportunities" for companies in a time of economic downturn "with the cash to take advantage of them, like Apple does," but wouldn't clarify how that might relate to any specific strategies, including new efforts to acquire other companies." [/re]
Apple's saving up their pennies for the big Yahoo acquisition
I hope not! MobileMe has proven that Apple has a lot to learn about running any sort of online services. Yahoo would be a quagmire that would drown Apple. Apple would in no way benefit from such an acquisition, and Apple has nothing to contribute to Yahoo's operations that what make them better. So what would be the point?
using their own numbers when they were claiming to be number 3 phone vendor on a revenue basis...$4.6B/6.9Mphones = $667 per phone sold on average. Pretty sweet.
I really hope Apple doesn't do Netbooks. I think that they will re-invent the category with a tablet (a bigger iPhone) in the future.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison
I believe that Netbooks are a fantastic idea and that Apple will eventually be forced to serve this market.
iPhone is nice but there is a substantial market for a real keyboard and larger screen. Apple's current USB only Macbook strengthens the netbook appeal because if USB is good enough for Apple's laptops as the primary connectivity then Netbooks need not offer that much more connectivity either.
So the original G4 Mac mini, which was $499, was a piece of junk? Gotcha.
I heard the whole thing and he said that in the context of notebook computers.
I happen to agree.
That said, I think an $899 model from Apple should be possible, or a better value for the $999 price point.
The mini was never really a $500 computer, anyway. You needed to add the monitor, keyboard, and mouse. About $800 in a cheap configuration, more like $1000 in a good one. I love the mini and I hope they don't drop it. But I don't see it exactly as an ultra cheap machine. It's only inexpensive by Apple standards.
Rather, I see it as a wonderfully compact, quiet, and flexible desktop. Good as a media center, for children's rooms, for small apartments, and for school classrooms.
Don't be disheartened; Apple are just holding their cards close to their chest with all this "hobby" talk. It's all just misdirection.
I agree, I think Apple have lots more up their sleeves. Timing would be bad for an expansion of the Apple living room goodies just now with the economy in the tank but the wait just gives them more time to get it right for the up-turn. Meanwhile many of Apple's future competition in the entertainment products arena must be hurting financially at the moment.
... runs on a stable Windows XP OS. In fact, I prefer a cheaper netbook so I can take it on holidays. If it gets stolen the loss is not so high, plus without the Apple logo it doesn't get stolen so easily..
XP is indeed stable. It can run for days with no problem. It's also old and clunky. And you can't run it without anti-virus, anti-spyware, and various maintenance apps from Symantec and so forth. If you do, within six months to a year the computer will be filled with junk.
If your time costs money, XP will cost you money. It will also cost you because of the utilities you need to add to it (I call it the Norton tax). The overall experience is just less pleasant, and the built-in software is much poorer. Plus you can't get iWork for a PC. Only Office, and it costs more too.
I agree about the glossy screens, but the PC world is all glossy these days as well. I think this is an industry-wide trend. I hope Apple reconsiders, at least for it's pro stuff, but I'm not expecting that to happen soon.
I am worried though for the creative artists who need FW to get their work done, or need a matte screen because looking at a mirror screen for 9 hours non-stop is no fun.. I am in that category and for the last few days I've been surfing the net looking at prices for Windows PC's. I already know my next display will be not a new glossy Cinema Display but a matte Eizo and my new netbook will be a MSI Wind .. This 500 dollar netbook has a 2,5 inch 160GB harddrive!!!!!! Plus 3x USB 2.0, ethernet etc... runs on a stable Windows XP OS. In fact, I prefer a cheaper netbook so I can take it on holidays. If it gets stolen the loss is not so high, plus without the Apple logo it doesn't get stolen so easily..
Your equipment wish-list seems strange for a creative artist spending "9 hours non-stop" in front of a computer. My 24" EIZO monitor cost $300 more than my MacBook Pro 2.33GHz, let alone a cheap PC that I woudn't mind being stolen on holiday. You could have close to three of the new glossy Cinema displays for the price of a good EIZO. True, EIZO makes smaller, cheaper ones, but why bother when they don't offer the color performance and certified screens useful for graphics work? Comparing a business-use monitor to an Apple 24" Cinema display because it has a matte screen vs. glossy is silly -- you can still buy a matte finish Apple monitor if doing graphics, and it will outperform an EIZO designed for office work. And if I'm doing creative graphics work for 9 hours a day, I don't want it to be because I'm using an underpowered Atom processor with 1gb RAM and a SATA1 4400RPM hard drive to run hefty Adobe applications on an OS as unlikeable as XP.
As for PC notebooks being stolen less frequently than MacBooks, I'd have to see statistics to back that up. And even if they were, it's because they have higher value and desirability. I personally never had any kind of laptop stolen, but I'm vigilant about protecting them, especially when on holiday. It's a lame argument, akin to saying, "this year we're going on vacation to a tiny farm town in Kansas instead of DisneyWorld because there's less chance we'll have our luggage stolen." To me, the experience of a quality OS on Apple equipment the rest of the year far outweighs the threat of loss during one or two weeks away from home. If not, buy insurance and backup your holiday photos daily in case of theft.
XP is indeed stable. It can run for days with no problem. It's also old and clunky. And you can't run it without anti-virus, anti-spyware, and various maintenance apps from Symantec and so forth. If you do, within six months to a year the computer will be filled with junk.
If your time costs money, XP will cost you money. It will also cost you because of the utilities you need to add to it (I call it the Norton tax). The overall experience is just less pleasant, and the built-in software is much poorer. Plus you can't get iWork for a PC. Only Office, and it costs more too.
I agree about the glossy screens, but the PC world is all glossy these days as well. I think this is an industry-wide trend. I hope Apple reconsiders, at least for it's pro stuff, but I'm not expecting that to happen soon.
Yep, we tried a Windows XP and a Mac low end laptop on a vacation with a slow internet connection recently. The updates, virus checking and so on made the PC unusable. On the Mac we could do all we needed, read mail, reply and check web sites we needed to etc. and be ready to go hiking by the time the PC had restarted after its updates and was still loading mail. The PC was more powerful than the old G4 iBook too. We gave up on the XP machine after a few days.
Oh, I get it, $500 is too cheap, but for $99 more you can buy a GREAT MacMini, which hasn't been updated in over a year, and for that matter, didn't even receive new technology in that update!
Your equipment wish-list seems strange for a creative artist spending "9 hours non-stop" in front of a computer. My 24" EIZO monitor cost $300 more than my MacBook Pro 2.33GHz, let alone a cheap PC that I woudn't mind being stolen on holiday. You could have close to three of the new glossy Cinema displays for the price of a good EIZO. True, EIZO makes smaller, cheaper ones, but why bother when they don't offer the color performance and certified screens useful for graphics work? Comparing a business-use monitor to an Apple 24" Cinema display because it has a matte screen vs. glossy is silly -- you can still buy a matte finish Apple monitor if doing graphics, and it will outperform an EIZO designed for office work. And if I'm doing creative graphics work for 9 hours a day, I don't want it to be because I'm using an underpowered Atom processor with 1gb RAM and a SATA1 4400RPM hard drive to run hefty Adobe applications on an OS as unlikeable as XP.
As for PC notebooks being stolen less frequently than MacBooks, I'd have to see statistics to back that up. And even if they were, it's because they have higher value and desirability. I personally never had any kind of laptop stolen, but I'm vigilant about protecting them, especially when on holiday. It's a lame argument, akin to saying, "this year we're going on vacation to a tiny farm town in Kansas instead of DisneyWorld because there's less chance we'll have our luggage stolen." To me, the experience of a quality OS on Apple equipment the rest of the year far outweighs the threat of loss during one or two weeks away from home. If not, buy insurance and backup your holiday photos daily in case of theft.
Good summation . I do about 7 or 8 hours a day in front of a Mac and the 30" ACD plus 23" ADC are wonderful, just wish I could afford the second 30". My point is, if you spend that much time and are in graphics arts you'd be better with a Mac Pro not a laptop. Then get an old MacBook for vacations. If anyone spends 8 or 9 hours in front of it on vacation perhaps not going on vacation would be a good idea to save money?
p.s. Maybe it wouldn't take 9 hours a day with a Mac Pro either
When's the last time anyone saw an Apple TV advertisement; a year ago?
Right? I rarely use mine - I prefer airtunes from the desktop for playing music because the ATV interface sucks. You can't even search your own music library on it. It needs a major overhaul.
Comments
That's interesting because the low-end Mac Mini is $100 over priced and I agree that it is a piece of junk. Integrated graphics, no keyboard or mouse, and 1Gb of memory standard makes it over priced and a weak offering at $599.
A new Mac Mini with the 2GB RAM, 120Gb hard drive, the NVIDIA M9400 chipset, and a keyboard and mouse at $499 on the other hand is not a piece of junk. That is a value packed system with enough margins for Apple to justify selling them. Substitute the superdrive for a blu-ray drive and that's worth an extra $200 at $699 alone.
Of course. The purchase of P.A Semi has Netbook written all over it and Apple's newfound love for the "Cloud" is another. I expect a $699-799 Apple "netbook" to hit within 18 months.
You can say that again! Have you seen the latest iPhone hybrid-puter? The mousepad is an iPhone!
You can never predict the future by what Mr. Jobs says either. He has changed course too many times. He may hate something one day and love it the next. I don't think that's bad. It shows he has an open mind and is persuadable.
As for TV, I think games are the natural thing that will push to over the top. There are enough possibilities there and enough moves in that direction to make it a very interesting hobby. A lot of people are making games for iPhone now and could move to a full fledged Mac games. There are programs that use iPhone and Touch as controllers over your network and they could control games on TV.
I don't see it totally replacing game consoles, especially for those who already have them, but with a Safari browser and some games, TV could become a big point of interest for a lot of people.
Looking forward to MacWorld to see if there are any surprises.
Well, this seems to be the key to Apple's recent success. Make one high valued product, make it desirable so people pay a premium price over it and make billions.. It works. But it only works because the Apple brand is hot at the moment. It's a win-win for both consumers and Apple. Consumers get the cool gadgets, Apple makes (a lot of) money.
I am worried though for the creative artists who need FW to get their work done, or need a matte screen because looking at a mirror screen for 9 hours non-stop is no fun.. I am in that category and for the last few days I've been surfing the net looking at prices for Windows PC's. I already know my next display will be not a new glossy Cinema Display but a matte Eizo and my new netbook will be a MSI Wind .. This 500 dollar netbook has a 2,5 inch 160GB harddrive!!!!!! Plus 3x USB 2.0, ethernet etc... runs on a stable Windows XP OS. In fact, I prefer a cheaper netbook so I can take it on holidays. If it gets stolen the loss is not so high, plus without the Apple logo it doesn't get stolen so easily..
If Apple decides to release iWorks Touch or perhaps Microsoft develops an Office Touch, it'll be a decent productivity tool. Peripherals can be sorted out by adding Wireless USB instead of space consuming physical ports.
This is the direction I'd like to see. I use my itouch more as a mobile internet netbook than as an iPod. Peripherals connecting with wifi would make sense given they haven't allowed bluetooth in the itouch.
[re] "Apple added another $3.7 billion in cash during the quarter, so it now has $24.5 billion "safely in the bank, and zero debt" Jobs noted. He spoke of "extraordinary opportunities" for companies in a time of economic downturn "with the cash to take advantage of them, like Apple does," but wouldn't clarify how that might relate to any specific strategies, including new efforts to acquire other companies." [/re]
Apple's saving up their pennies for the big Yahoo acquisition
I hope not! MobileMe has proven that Apple has a lot to learn about running any sort of online services. Yahoo would be a quagmire that would drown Apple. Apple would in no way benefit from such an acquisition, and Apple has nothing to contribute to Yahoo's operations that what make them better. So what would be the point?
I believe that Netbooks are a fantastic idea and that Apple will eventually be forced to serve this market.
iPhone is nice but there is a substantial market for a real keyboard and larger screen. Apple's current USB only Macbook strengthens the netbook appeal because if USB is good enough for Apple's laptops as the primary connectivity then Netbooks need not offer that much more connectivity either.
http://www.amazon.com/Acer-8-9-inch-...4636851&sr=8-1
I have got to say that the Acer Netbook is really ugly. If Apple did enter this category, at least it would look good.
So the original G4 Mac mini, which was $499, was a piece of junk? Gotcha.
I heard the whole thing and he said that in the context of notebook computers.
I happen to agree.
That said, I think an $899 model from Apple should be possible, or a better value for the $999 price point.
The mini was never really a $500 computer, anyway. You needed to add the monitor, keyboard, and mouse. About $800 in a cheap configuration, more like $1000 in a good one. I love the mini and I hope they don't drop it. But I don't see it exactly as an ultra cheap machine. It's only inexpensive by Apple standards.
Rather, I see it as a wonderfully compact, quiet, and flexible desktop. Good as a media center, for children's rooms, for small apartments, and for school classrooms.
Don't be disheartened; Apple are just holding their cards close to their chest with all this "hobby" talk. It's all just misdirection.
It is misdirection. It's code for "AppleTV sales still suck."
Don't be disheartened; Apple are just holding their cards close to their chest with all this "hobby" talk. It's all just misdirection.
I agree, I think Apple have lots more up their sleeves. Timing would be bad for an expansion of the Apple living room goodies just now with the economy in the tank but the wait just gives them more time to get it right for the up-turn. Meanwhile many of Apple's future competition in the entertainment products arena must be hurting financially at the moment.
... runs on a stable Windows XP OS. In fact, I prefer a cheaper netbook so I can take it on holidays. If it gets stolen the loss is not so high, plus without the Apple logo it doesn't get stolen so easily..
XP is indeed stable. It can run for days with no problem. It's also old and clunky. And you can't run it without anti-virus, anti-spyware, and various maintenance apps from Symantec and so forth. If you do, within six months to a year the computer will be filled with junk.
If your time costs money, XP will cost you money. It will also cost you because of the utilities you need to add to it (I call it the Norton tax). The overall experience is just less pleasant, and the built-in software is much poorer. Plus you can't get iWork for a PC. Only Office, and it costs more too.
I agree about the glossy screens, but the PC world is all glossy these days as well. I think this is an industry-wide trend. I hope Apple reconsiders, at least for it's pro stuff, but I'm not expecting that to happen soon.
I am worried though for the creative artists who need FW to get their work done, or need a matte screen because looking at a mirror screen for 9 hours non-stop is no fun.. I am in that category and for the last few days I've been surfing the net looking at prices for Windows PC's. I already know my next display will be not a new glossy Cinema Display but a matte Eizo and my new netbook will be a MSI Wind .. This 500 dollar netbook has a 2,5 inch 160GB harddrive!!!!!! Plus 3x USB 2.0, ethernet etc... runs on a stable Windows XP OS. In fact, I prefer a cheaper netbook so I can take it on holidays. If it gets stolen the loss is not so high, plus without the Apple logo it doesn't get stolen so easily..
Your equipment wish-list seems strange for a creative artist spending "9 hours non-stop" in front of a computer. My 24" EIZO monitor cost $300 more than my MacBook Pro 2.33GHz, let alone a cheap PC that I woudn't mind being stolen on holiday. You could have close to three of the new glossy Cinema displays for the price of a good EIZO. True, EIZO makes smaller, cheaper ones, but why bother when they don't offer the color performance and certified screens useful for graphics work? Comparing a business-use monitor to an Apple 24" Cinema display because it has a matte screen vs. glossy is silly -- you can still buy a matte finish Apple monitor if doing graphics, and it will outperform an EIZO designed for office work. And if I'm doing creative graphics work for 9 hours a day, I don't want it to be because I'm using an underpowered Atom processor with 1gb RAM and a SATA1 4400RPM hard drive to run hefty Adobe applications on an OS as unlikeable as XP.
As for PC notebooks being stolen less frequently than MacBooks, I'd have to see statistics to back that up. And even if they were, it's because they have higher value and desirability. I personally never had any kind of laptop stolen, but I'm vigilant about protecting them, especially when on holiday. It's a lame argument, akin to saying, "this year we're going on vacation to a tiny farm town in Kansas instead of DisneyWorld because there's less chance we'll have our luggage stolen." To me, the experience of a quality OS on Apple equipment the rest of the year far outweighs the threat of loss during one or two weeks away from home. If not, buy insurance and backup your holiday photos daily in case of theft.
XP is indeed stable. It can run for days with no problem. It's also old and clunky. And you can't run it without anti-virus, anti-spyware, and various maintenance apps from Symantec and so forth. If you do, within six months to a year the computer will be filled with junk.
If your time costs money, XP will cost you money. It will also cost you because of the utilities you need to add to it (I call it the Norton tax). The overall experience is just less pleasant, and the built-in software is much poorer. Plus you can't get iWork for a PC. Only Office, and it costs more too.
I agree about the glossy screens, but the PC world is all glossy these days as well. I think this is an industry-wide trend. I hope Apple reconsiders, at least for it's pro stuff, but I'm not expecting that to happen soon.
Yep, we tried a Windows XP and a Mac low end laptop on a vacation with a slow internet connection recently. The updates, virus checking and so on made the PC unusable. On the Mac we could do all we needed, read mail, reply and check web sites we needed to etc. and be ready to go hiking by the time the PC had restarted after its updates and was still loading mail. The PC was more powerful than the old G4 iBook too. We gave up on the XP machine after a few days.
Great, thanks for not selling "dreck," Apple.
-Clive
Your equipment wish-list seems strange for a creative artist spending "9 hours non-stop" in front of a computer. My 24" EIZO monitor cost $300 more than my MacBook Pro 2.33GHz, let alone a cheap PC that I woudn't mind being stolen on holiday. You could have close to three of the new glossy Cinema displays for the price of a good EIZO. True, EIZO makes smaller, cheaper ones, but why bother when they don't offer the color performance and certified screens useful for graphics work? Comparing a business-use monitor to an Apple 24" Cinema display because it has a matte screen vs. glossy is silly -- you can still buy a matte finish Apple monitor if doing graphics, and it will outperform an EIZO designed for office work. And if I'm doing creative graphics work for 9 hours a day, I don't want it to be because I'm using an underpowered Atom processor with 1gb RAM and a SATA1 4400RPM hard drive to run hefty Adobe applications on an OS as unlikeable as XP.
As for PC notebooks being stolen less frequently than MacBooks, I'd have to see statistics to back that up. And even if they were, it's because they have higher value and desirability. I personally never had any kind of laptop stolen, but I'm vigilant about protecting them, especially when on holiday. It's a lame argument, akin to saying, "this year we're going on vacation to a tiny farm town in Kansas instead of DisneyWorld because there's less chance we'll have our luggage stolen." To me, the experience of a quality OS on Apple equipment the rest of the year far outweighs the threat of loss during one or two weeks away from home. If not, buy insurance and backup your holiday photos daily in case of theft.
Good summation . I do about 7 or 8 hours a day in front of a Mac and the 30" ACD plus 23" ADC are wonderful, just wish I could afford the second 30". My point is, if you spend that much time and are in graphics arts you'd be better with a Mac Pro not a laptop. Then get an old MacBook for vacations. If anyone spends 8 or 9 hours in front of it on vacation perhaps not going on vacation would be a good idea to save money?
p.s. Maybe it wouldn't take 9 hours a day with a Mac Pro either
It is misdirection. It's code for "AppleTV sales still suck."
When's the last time anyone saw an Apple TV advertisement; a year ago?
When's the last time anyone saw an Apple TV advertisement; a year ago?
Right? I rarely use mine - I prefer airtunes from the desktop for playing music because the ATV interface sucks. You can't even search your own music library on it. It needs a major overhaul.
When's the last time anyone saw an Apple TV advertisement; a year ago?
Hobby? Didn't he mean that it's "a bag of hurt"?