You must keep in mind also that there are legal reasons Apple's CEO cannot simply come out swinging and attack everyone in the press. Jobs did it the right way, all behind the scenes, cursing at reporters and berating them off the record.
He does not need to attack anyone (that would backfire quite badly), just give some indication that he is on top of things. At the moment there is none.
Apple's stock has been in a downward spiral for a while. Valuation is always about the future. The future is the only thing that matters. Since the release of iPhone 5, the market has started to question the future of Apple as the world’s leading innovator. In the 1980s, DEC was at the top, but the brand is dead. RIM was the leader in early 2000s but is increasingly irrelevant. You can also add the 1990s hotshots Palm, Yahoo!, and AOL. Apple itself was close to bankruptcy in the mid 1990s. Apple keeps a whopping $140 billion in cash. It sounds sweet if you are a naive investor. But, shrewd investors should question the rationale. After all, you didn’t invest in a bank. Why is Apple using your investment to just save in bank deposits earning 2%? The stock decline needs to be halted and hopefully reversed to a growth stock again.
Most analysts are asshats and have a lot of ulterior motives for running down AAPL. So yeah, I do think this will be an extremely important year for Apple and we will see if Tim Cook is the man with the plan and vision for the future or will just be conservative and rest on the laurels of past glory trying to maintain current marketshare.
A drop from a high of $705 to $397 today in such a short amount of time is extreme. I used to be a big Tim Cook supporter but he seems more suited to his former job than CEO. Long term, short of a brand new product line with the success of the iPad or massively increased sales for current product lines like the iPhone which generates more than 50% of their revenue I don't see the stock breaking $500 again anytime soon. Short term band aids like stock buy backs and higher dividends would help for a while but Apple has to do something to break this downward spiral. If rumors are to be believed about a 5S then I don't see any upward momentum in shares this year.
Ah, great post.
Apple is missing a tech visionary. Tim Cook is not a visionary.
No vision, no go.
Insanely great is now gone and the next insanely great leader for Apple needs to be found.
A tech leader and not a manager, like Tim. Although you need both.
I gotta tell you... Sometimes I think Apple should hire Bob Iger for CEO and give Tim back his old job. It really is all about perception with these Wall Street dirtbags.
Looks like Apple is buying back shares right now as there seems to be a constant but limited buy order just pennies above $400.
Nah! It's Michael Dell
Whoever it was they seemed to really want to close on an up tick but there was a 350K share sell right at the closing bell which resulted in a down tick. But they managed to keep it above $400 until the end of the day. I'm anxious to see what happens after hours..
I can't imagine the mental gymnastics it takes to look a company that turns a profit and then claim they are "sitting on their cash" despite nearly daily news of huge investments. In the last year along Apple has spent more of its profits than Amazon has ever made in its entire history as a company, private or public.
You can say they should do more but to claim they aren't doing anything but sitting on it is complete BS.
They could be working on the apps they have neglected and need work. Numbers is one of them, based on what I've read.
I don't think has anything to do with Cirrus reports, especially when they claim that the "Supplier" had migrated to a newer component. Apple opened lower along with the market and this stupid news drove frantic investors to dump the stock as they could not take one more round of blood bath. The support levels at $420 range were broken and that was enough for the downward spiral.
Now, for Apple's strategy with new product introduction, I think they have learnt their lesson to not announce it much ahead of the actual product being available as this has killed sales of current products. I think going forward, their strategy would be announce a new product and make it available in a very short period of time and perhaps they will also stop attaching number to iphone, such as 5s, 6 etc. It will simply be New iPhone and let the product speak for itself as to how new it is.
The stock is bound to make a come back later this year, and I believe that would happen with a new Product (perhaps an iWatch or an iWallet) that could eat into current payment processing markets. The opportunity is huge and Apple has the cash, technology and user base.
But, then again, this is me being very optimistic about this company. If by October, they don't make a brand new product line announcement, or the stock hits $260 a share, I will dump the stock.
Apple should float a $200B bond and buy back over 50% of the company. By the end of 2014 they will have $200B and can easily pay off the bond. The EPS will blow up to $85. With a paltry 8 P/E the stock would be at $700.
Isn't that a variation on a theme used by Jimmy Ling in the 1960's?
They could be working on the apps they have neglected and need work. Numbers is one of them, based on what I've read.
1) In no way does that mean they are simply sitting on all their money with neither desire nor interest in investing for the future.
2) I'd like a lot of HW and SW updates to be released today, including the iWork suite of apps, but not having evidence of them working on their products is no proof that they aren't.
You must keep in mind also that there are legal reasons Apple's CEO cannot simply come out swinging and attack everyone in the press. Jobs did it the right way, all behind the scenes, cursing at reporters and berating them off the record.
Why does anyone have to "come out swinging" or "attack everyone in the press" over anything?! Over what?
Nothing could be further from what I am trying to get at. I am simply suggesting that Apple needs to be seen as being pro-active and aggressive in its product/market strategy and it financial strategy. Currently, it is probably seen as passive and paralyzed.
Interesting thought... in re to appearances: reactive > paralyzed
Read the annual "letter to shareholders" that Bezos writes: http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=97664&p=irol-reportsannual. Some of it may be pap, but the point is, he does communicate more. (Apple does not -- and did not need to, as long as SJ was around -- do anything similar).
Cook et. al are unknown quantities. They have to make their case to the market. The market needs to get a sense of who they are, what they stand for, and what their strategy is, going forward. Not platitudes like "we have an amazing pipeline."
You may not like it, I may not like it, Apple may not like it, but it is simply the case right now that the negative sentiment is overwhelming, and Apple looks paralyzed. There's no way around it.
I have tremendous faith in Apple's long-run value-creation abilities, and I have little worry that the stock will rebound handsomely over a 3 - 5 year horizon. I am not selling (in fact, I bought some more today). But this kind of bloodbath needs a very strong, effective management response, or a poor reputation (which has clearly been created) will stick. And if that happens, my (cheap) prediction is that it may not end well for Cook. I sincerely hope that I am proved wrong.
So you think Apple needs to start releasing an annual report?
1) In no way does that mean they are simply sitting on all their money with neither desire nor interest in investing for the future.
2) I'd like a lot of HW and SW updates to be released today, including the iWork suite of apps, but not having evidence of them working on their products is no proof that they aren't.
The current generation of iWork is three years old, during which time MSFT has been doing a lot of development on Office (particularly the cloud component). Is the product orphaned? Or what? Makes one pine for the days of Claris (since iWork is not a substantial revenue generator compared to, say, the iPhone, it is not getting much attention from the management, so spinning it out might fix that).
Their current buyback is a pittance - $2 billion a year to counter dilution from employee stock options. That is it. The company effectively has no real buyback program
Why not? I have no clue. Ask Buffett if he thinks it would be a good idea
You're original comment stated that Apple "does not buy its own stock back." You can opine that it should be more but to say that they don't do it at all simply isn't accurate, regardless of why they are doing it.
Read the annual "letter to shareholders" that Bezos writes: http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=97664&p=irol-reportsannual. Some of it may be pap, but the point is, he does communicate more. (Apple does not -- and did not need to, as long as SJ was around -- do anything similar).
Cook et. al are unknown quantities. They have to make their case to the market. The market needs to get a sense of who they are, what they stand for, and what their strategy is, going forward. Not platitudes like "we have an amazing pipeline."
You may not like it, I may not like it, Apple may not like it, but it is simply the case right now that the negative sentiment is overwhelming, and Apple looks paralyzed. There's no way around it.
I have tremendous faith in Apple's long-run value-creation abilities, and I have little worry that the stock will rebound handsomely over a 3 - 5 year horizon. I am not selling (in fact, I bought some more today). But this kind of bloodbath needs a very strong, effective management response, or a poor reputation (which has clearly been created) will stick. And if that happens, my (cheap) prediction is that it may not end well for Cook. I sincerely hope that I am proved wrong.
So you think Apple needs to start releasing an annual report?
Uh? No.
I was simply responding to your claim that Bezos does not communicate all that much.
You're original comment stated that Apple "does not buy its own stock back." You can opine that it should be more but to say that they don't do it at all simply isn't accurate, regardless of why they are doing it.
Actually I was mistaken when I suggested that Apple was probably buying back shares today.
Quote: From Wikipedia
Companies trading in the U.S. are required to preannounce stock buyback programs before they begin buying shares, and then to report on such programs in their quarterly and annual filings
So many pathetic posts. Apple's growth off the iPhone and iPad is mostly over, but they can still be a successful company selling just those products. Maybe they can monetize the expanding iOS system, but it really needs a new product if the share price is going to recover. Until then a dividend increase would provide support for the stock and be good for investors. My guess is they increase the buybacks to try and let the execs sell at a higher price. If they go that direction I would suggest selling on the next pop because buybacks favor sellers, not investors.
Someone just made a strange trade in After Hours. They bought 10,742 shares at $426 when the stock was trading at $403 then one minute later someone picked up 11,800 shares at $402.80
I was simply responding to your claim that Bezos does not communicate all that much.
Bezos communicates what he wants ans when he wants to and Wall Street laps it up. Hence Amazon can have a no profit quarter, say nothing, basically give Wall Street the middle finger on their earnings calls and their stock jumps. 5% e next day.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich
You must keep in mind also that there are legal reasons Apple's CEO cannot simply come out swinging and attack everyone in the press. Jobs did it the right way, all behind the scenes, cursing at reporters and berating them off the record.
He does not need to attack anyone (that would backfire quite badly), just give some indication that he is on top of things. At the moment there is none.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmac
Apple's stock has been in a downward spiral for a while. Valuation is always about the future. The future is the only thing that matters. Since the release of iPhone 5, the market has started to question the future of Apple as the world’s leading innovator. In the 1980s, DEC was at the top, but the brand is dead. RIM was the leader in early 2000s but is increasingly irrelevant. You can also add the 1990s hotshots Palm, Yahoo!, and AOL. Apple itself was close to bankruptcy in the mid 1990s. Apple keeps a whopping $140 billion in cash. It sounds sweet if you are a naive investor. But, shrewd investors should question the rationale. After all, you didn’t invest in a bank. Why is Apple using your investment to just save in bank deposits earning 2%? The stock decline needs to be halted and hopefully reversed to a growth stock again.
Most analysts are asshats and have a lot of ulterior motives for running down AAPL. So yeah, I do think this will be an extremely important year for Apple and we will see if Tim Cook is the man with the plan and vision for the future or will just be conservative and rest on the laurels of past glory trying to maintain current marketshare.
A drop from a high of $705 to $397 today in such a short amount of time is extreme. I used to be a big Tim Cook supporter but he seems more suited to his former job than CEO. Long term, short of a brand new product line with the success of the iPad or massively increased sales for current product lines like the iPhone which generates more than 50% of their revenue I don't see the stock breaking $500 again anytime soon. Short term band aids like stock buy backs and higher dividends would help for a while but Apple has to do something to break this downward spiral. If rumors are to be believed about a 5S then I don't see any upward momentum in shares this year.
Ah, great post.
Apple is missing a tech visionary. Tim Cook is not a visionary.
No vision, no go.
Insanely great is now gone and the next insanely great leader for Apple needs to be found.
A tech leader and not a manager, like Tim. Although you need both.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich
I gotta tell you... Sometimes I think Apple should hire Bob Iger for CEO and give Tim back his old job. It really is all about perception with these Wall Street dirtbags.
This is actually not a bad idea at all!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone
Looks like Apple is buying back shares right now as there seems to be a constant but limited buy order just pennies above $400.
Nah! It's Michael Dell
Whoever it was they seemed to really want to close on an up tick but there was a 350K share sell right at the closing bell which resulted in a down tick. But they managed to keep it above $400 until the end of the day. I'm anxious to see what happens after hours..
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
I can't imagine the mental gymnastics it takes to look a company that turns a profit and then claim they are "sitting on their cash" despite nearly daily news of huge investments. In the last year along Apple has spent more of its profits than Amazon has ever made in its entire history as a company, private or public.
You can say they should do more but to claim they aren't doing anything but sitting on it is complete BS.
They could be working on the apps they have neglected and need work. Numbers is one of them, based on what I've read.
I don't think has anything to do with Cirrus reports, especially when they claim that the "Supplier" had migrated to a newer component. Apple opened lower along with the market and this stupid news drove frantic investors to dump the stock as they could not take one more round of blood bath. The support levels at $420 range were broken and that was enough for the downward spiral.
Now, for Apple's strategy with new product introduction, I think they have learnt their lesson to not announce it much ahead of the actual product being available as this has killed sales of current products. I think going forward, their strategy would be announce a new product and make it available in a very short period of time and perhaps they will also stop attaching number to iphone, such as 5s, 6 etc. It will simply be New iPhone and let the product speak for itself as to how new it is.
The stock is bound to make a come back later this year, and I believe that would happen with a new Product (perhaps an iWatch or an iWallet) that could eat into current payment processing markets. The opportunity is huge and Apple has the cash, technology and user base.
But, then again, this is me being very optimistic about this company. If by October, they don't make a brand new product line announcement, or the stock hits $260 a share, I will dump the stock.
Isn't that a variation on a theme used by Jimmy Ling in the 1960's?
1) In no way does that mean they are simply sitting on all their money with neither desire nor interest in investing for the future.
2) I'd like a lot of HW and SW updates to be released today, including the iWork suite of apps, but not having evidence of them working on their products is no proof that they aren't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram
This is actually not a bad idea at all!
Has Iger done a particularly good job at DIS?
Interesting thought... in re to appearances: reactive > paralyzed
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
Isn't that a variation on a theme used by Jimmy Ling in the 1960's?
Or an even greater, umm, value builder Bob Vesco.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
1) In no way does that mean they are simply sitting on all their money with neither desire nor interest in investing for the future.
2) I'd like a lot of HW and SW updates to be released today, including the iWork suite of apps, but not having evidence of them working on their products is no proof that they aren't.
The current generation of iWork is three years old, during which time MSFT has been doing a lot of development on Office (particularly the cloud component). Is the product orphaned? Or what? Makes one pine for the days of Claris (since iWork is not a substantial revenue generator compared to, say, the iPhone, it is not getting much attention from the management, so spinning it out might fix that).
You're original comment stated that Apple "does not buy its own stock back." You can opine that it should be more but to say that they don't do it at all simply isn't accurate, regardless of why they are doing it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram
Read the annual "letter to shareholders" that Bezos writes: http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=97664&p=irol-reportsannual. Some of it may be pap, but the point is, he does communicate more. (Apple does not -- and did not need to, as long as SJ was around -- do anything similar).
Cook et. al are unknown quantities. They have to make their case to the market. The market needs to get a sense of who they are, what they stand for, and what their strategy is, going forward. Not platitudes like "we have an amazing pipeline."
You may not like it, I may not like it, Apple may not like it, but it is simply the case right now that the negative sentiment is overwhelming, and Apple looks paralyzed. There's no way around it.
I have tremendous faith in Apple's long-run value-creation abilities, and I have little worry that the stock will rebound handsomely over a 3 - 5 year horizon. I am not selling (in fact, I bought some more today). But this kind of bloodbath needs a very strong, effective management response, or a poor reputation (which has clearly been created) will stick. And if that happens, my (cheap) prediction is that it may not end well for Cook. I sincerely hope that I am proved wrong.
So you think Apple needs to start releasing an annual report?
Uh? No.
I was simply responding to your claim that Bezos does not communicate all that much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
You're original comment stated that Apple "does not buy its own stock back." You can opine that it should be more but to say that they don't do it at all simply isn't accurate, regardless of why they are doing it.
Actually I was mistaken when I suggested that Apple was probably buying back shares today.
Quote: From Wikipedia
Companies trading in the U.S. are required to preannounce stock buyback programs before they begin buying shares, and then to report on such programs in their quarterly and annual filings
So many pathetic posts. Apple's growth off the iPhone and iPad is mostly over, but they can still be a successful company selling just those products. Maybe they can monetize the expanding iOS system, but it really needs a new product if the share price is going to recover. Until then a dividend increase would provide support for the stock and be good for investors. My guess is they increase the buybacks to try and let the execs sell at a higher price. If they go that direction I would suggest selling on the next pop because buybacks favor sellers, not investors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkell31
If they go that direction I would suggest selling on the next pop because buybacks favor sellers, not investors.
LOL. Then why are there buyers? Is Apple holding a gun to their head -- making them an offer they can't refuse?
Someone just made a strange trade in After Hours. They bought 10,742 shares at $426 when the stock was trading at $403 then one minute later someone picked up 11,800 shares at $402.80