Just checked MacSales/OWC and their RAM for this model costs $169.99 vs the $200 upgrade price Apple charges ($188 if you qualify for their EPP and (possibly) educational discounts). I use MacSales all the time but regardless of the warranty, the price difference doesn't make sense to me considering the lack of ease in replacing it. Using cheaper RAM is not something I do or recommend so for those who just have to be able to change or upgrade RAM, good luck.
disclaimer: OWC charges $1079.99 for a full 64GB of RAM vs Apple's $1316 (EPP price) so it might be worth it if you really want to spend that much money on a Mac mini.
from https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT205041 Couldn't quickly find actual warranty but when Apple says something like this, it sounds to me like they aren't allowing it.
We asked. We're also very clear in our warning about the procedure.
The fact you have to put back Apple's RAM if you need to go in for a repair should ring alarm bells here! That's also called deception in my book. What is the 'guidance' here on what to say if the Apple tech asks if you have replaced the RAM and put the Apple RAM back ... lie?
I always have upgraded my RAM (and internal storage) on any Mac I own (I keep them all a long time) where it is feasible even if difficult. However, never until my extended warranty is out. In my case, I make sure I purchase a Mac with the correct configuration for my needs for the two years under coverage. If you figure out what it costs to take out Apple's RAM and replace within those two years you have to add the two sets of RAM together to get the true cost unless you can get a trade in. I don't see how that can ever make mathematical sense otherwise. Two or three years later the cost of RAM has usually fallen enough to make that upgrade cost effective but even then you have to do the math. For my 2013 Mac Pro, it was nearly four years before that RAM was worth the cost and only then thanks to a trade in. It obviously varies but Apple never use cheap RAM so the calculations have to take that into account. On several Mac Mini 2012 models I have, it was a no-brainer to upgrade RAM and HDD to SSD at four years old, same with a 2010 MBP i7 15".
So the bottom line is this is a great article to file away for reference in two to three years.
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Exactly. I'm sure those who know how to do their own car repairs/upgrades complain about the specialized tools and difficulty these days compared the days where you could store extra luggage under the hood of cars there was so much space. For the rest of us, it's much nicer to drive smaller cars which are far more efficient, less noisy, etc.
Exactly where are these smaller, more efficient cars? Everywhere I look, the roads are filled with massive, gas guzzling SUVs.
Check Europe where cities were designed before cars were invented (i.e. there just isn't space for big cars), and gas prices are much higher. Not everyone in the world lives the North American suburban dream of big big big. And that dream is already failing as the average person goes deeper and deeper into debt to finance it.
auxio said: [...] Turned out that the RAM I bought didn't have error correction/ECC and the heat sinks on it were much smaller, one of which was the cause of my crashes. This was the reason that the RAM Apple used was a lot more expensive. The devil is in the details.
Good point.
Of course the comparisons in this thread ARE for identical RAM. Apple is charging almost twice as much as Crucial et al for exactly the same component.
And so you're either paying for the extra assembly line needed to build the machine, or you're paying for a service technician's time to install it. You do understand that, when you get someone else to do something for you, it's always going to cost a fair bit more than if you do it yourself right? People don't seem to have a problem paying extra for home renos/repairs, car repairs, etc. But they'll scream from the rooftops if it's for their computer.
Why would I upgrade the RAM on the new mac mini? It's new. Follow up question would be why does Apple sell a device that needs a RAM upgrade?
It's for people who can't afford max out all the RAM now but want to upgrade later. More RAM helps open 10+ applications at the same time without slowing down Mac. Especially Photoshop, Illustrator, After Effects and Premiere are RAM hungry.
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Dunno why people are backing Apple on this one, it's a lazy implementation of a premium product and a crappy user experience. They managed to block more tinkerers from attempting to upgrade their own RAM. Fewer people will buy it and Apple will end-up discontinuing it.
Does anyone know if the ram sticks need to be of the same capacity each? Or can I have one slot with 8GB and the other with 16GB?
Also, has anyone ordered the 8GB configuration? Was it a pair of 4GB modules or a single 8GB stick leaving the other slot free?
Based on past history with every other Mac mini, I'm nearly certain that the answers are "For best performance, don't mix sizes of memory modules. Install two identical memory modules" and "pair of 4GB." Having said that, I wonder what the performance hit is if they don't match.
Does anyone know if the ram sticks need to be of the same capacity each? Or can I have one slot with 8GB and the other with 16GB?
Also, has anyone ordered the 8GB configuration? Was it a pair of 4GB modules or a single 8GB stick leaving the other slot free?
Based on past history with every other Mac mini, I'm nearly certain that the answers are "For best performance, don't mix sizes of memory modules. Install two identical memory modules" and "pair of 4GB." Having said that, I wonder what the performance hit is if they don't match.
In the past, it can be up to 20 percent on big time memory bandwidth intensive tasks. Apple sells them as matched pairs, and that's what we're recommending as well.
Does anyone know if the ram sticks need to be of the same capacity each? Or can I have one slot with 8GB and the other with 16GB?
Also, has anyone ordered the 8GB configuration? Was it a pair of 4GB modules or a single 8GB stick leaving the other slot free?
Based on past history with every other Mac mini, I'm nearly certain that the answers are "For best performance, don't mix sizes of memory modules. Install two identical memory modules" and "pair of 4GB." Having said that, I wonder what the performance hit is if they don't match.
In the past, it can be up to 20 percent on big time memory bandwidth intensive tasks. Apple sells them as matched pairs, and that's what we're recommending as well.
Interesting. I wasn't aware of the performance hit.
I have mixed modules in an older 2011 mini, but it just does home theater duties so I can't comment on performance issues. I guess I was wondering if I could get the base 8GB config (likely dual rgb modules), then purchase a single 16GB module to upgrade the total memory to 20GB. That would be plenty for my needs now (currently running 16GB in `12 server). And if Apple somehow used a single 8GB module instead of dual 4GB sticks, that would be a bonus. But it seems like it needs dual sticks to run. Would be nice to have an official answer on this and the performance hit if mixing modules capacities.
Does anyone know if the ram sticks need to be of the same capacity each? Or can I have one slot with 8GB and the other with 16GB?
Also, has anyone ordered the 8GB configuration? Was it a pair of 4GB modules or a single 8GB stick leaving the other slot free?
Based on past history with every other Mac mini, I'm nearly certain that the answers are "For best performance, don't mix sizes of memory modules. Install two identical memory modules" and "pair of 4GB." Having said that, I wonder what the performance hit is if they don't match.
In the past, it can be up to 20 percent on big time memory bandwidth intensive tasks. Apple sells them as matched pairs, and that's what we're recommending as well.
Interesting. I wasn't aware of the performance hit.
I have mixed modules in an older 2011 mini, but it just does home theater duties so I can't comment on performance issues. I guess I was wondering if I could get the base 8GB config (likely dual rgb modules), then purchase a single 16GB module to upgrade the total memory to 20GB. That would be plenty for my needs now (currently running 16GB in `12 server). And if Apple somehow used a single 8GB module instead of dual 4GB sticks, that would be a bonus. But it seems like it needs dual sticks to run. Would be nice to have an official answer on this and the performance hit if mixing modules capacities.
Also as the forum software doesn't always catch all of the main site's images, if you're following along, you're best off doing so with the video or from the main page.
Is the forum software ever going to be fixed over this? Because I don't like the homepage; too many ads. I prefer to simply enter the date, like so: https://appleinsider.com/archives/18/11/08/
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Dunno why people are backing Apple on this one, it's a lazy implementation of a premium product and a crappy user experience. They managed to block more tinkerers from attempting to upgrade their own RAM. Fewer people will buy it and Apple will end-up discontinuing it.
Look, I'm someone who has done very difficult tinkering with computers in the past. For example, to get more performance out of an old G4 TiBook, I moved one of the resistors on the motherboard which controlled the CPU speed (the hardware equivalent of BIOS overclocking on PCs).
However, I also am open minded enough to see that I'm in a very small group of people who knows how to do this, cares about it, and/or is willing to spend my time doing it. And I also understand that it requires extra product design, engineering, and assembly line complexity to include a RAM access panel or similarly easy access. If this was an Arduino or Raspberry Pi type of device targeted at tinkerers, then I'd definitely question the decision. But because it's a device targeted at the mass market, I completely understand why it was made.
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Dunno why people are backing Apple on this one, it's a lazy implementation of a premium product and a crappy user experience. They managed to block more tinkerers from attempting to upgrade their own RAM. Fewer people will buy it and Apple will end-up discontinuing it.
Look, I'm someone who has done very difficult tinkering with computers in the past. For example, to get more performance out of an old G4 TiBook, I moved one of the resistors on the motherboard which controlled the CPU speed (the hardware equivalent of BIOS overclocking on PCs).
However, I also am open minded enough to see that I'm in a very small group of people who knows how to do this, cares about it, and/or is willing to spend my time doing it. And I also understand that it requires extra product design, engineering, and assembly line complexity to include a RAM access panel or similarly easy access. If this was an Arduino or Raspberry Pi type of device targeted at tinkerers, then I'd definitely question the decision. But because it's a device targeted at the mass market, I completely understand why it was made.
Also as the forum software doesn't always catch all of the main site's images, if you're following along, you're best off doing so with the video or from the main page.
Is the forum software ever going to be fixed over this? Because I don't like the homepage; too many ads. I prefer to simply enter the date, like so: https://appleinsider.com/archives/18/11/08/
and read whatever article I like from there.
Hi Phil, just posted on our Slack board's General section a note referencing you
Does anyone know if the ram sticks need to be of the same capacity each? Or can I have one slot with 8GB and the other with 16GB?
Also, has anyone ordered the 8GB configuration? Was it a pair of 4GB modules or a single 8GB stick leaving the other slot free?
Based on past history with every other Mac mini, I'm nearly certain that the answers are "For best performance, don't mix sizes of memory modules. Install two identical memory modules" and "pair of 4GB." Having said that, I wonder what the performance hit is if they don't match.
Having matched pairs enables dual-channel memory. Which, in theory, doubles the amount of memory which the CPU can access at the same time, and thus should make your computer faster for memory-intensive tasks. In practice however, the benefit you get really depends on what you're doing with your computer.
Here's a good real-world test of a few different tasks and the benefit of dual vs single channel memory:
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Dunno why people are backing Apple on this one, it's a lazy implementation of a premium product and a crappy user experience. They managed to block more tinkerers from attempting to upgrade their own RAM. Fewer people will buy it and Apple will end-up discontinuing it.
Look, I'm someone who has done very difficult tinkering with computers in the past. For example, to get more performance out of an old G4 TiBook, I moved one of the resistors on the motherboard which controlled the CPU speed (the hardware equivalent of BIOS overclocking on PCs).
However, I also am open minded enough to see that I'm in a very small group of people who knows how to do this, cares about it, and/or is willing to spend my time doing it. And I also understand that it requires extra product design, engineering, and assembly line complexity to include a RAM access panel or similarly easy access. If this was an Arduino or Raspberry Pi type of device targeted at tinkerers, then I'd definitely question the decision. But because it's a device targeted at the mass market, I completely understand why it was made.
So you're saying that for a device to be user upgradable it must to fall in the category of an Arduino. Gotcha! Apple could've easily made the bottom twistable, or require a standard screwdriver, or even better, no screws at all, no hidden access points. Any combination of these efforts, which Apple has done beautifully in the past, would've kept the same circuitry yet made the RAM accessible.
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Dunno why people are backing Apple on this one, it's a lazy implementation of a premium product and a crappy user experience. They managed to block more tinkerers from attempting to upgrade their own RAM. Fewer people will buy it and Apple will end-up discontinuing it.
Look, I'm someone who has done very difficult tinkering with computers in the past. For example, to get more performance out of an old G4 TiBook, I moved one of the resistors on the motherboard which controlled the CPU speed (the hardware equivalent of BIOS overclocking on PCs).
However, I also am open minded enough to see that I'm in a very small group of people who knows how to do this, cares about it, and/or is willing to spend my time doing it. And I also understand that it requires extra product design, engineering, and assembly line complexity to include a RAM access panel or similarly easy access. If this was an Arduino or Raspberry Pi type of device targeted at tinkerers, then I'd definitely question the decision. But because it's a device targeted at the mass market, I completely understand why it was made.
So you're saying that for a device to be user upgradable it must to fall in the category of an Arduino. Gotcha! Apple could've easily made the bottom twistable, or require a standard screwdriver, or even better, no screws at all, no hidden access points. Any combination of these efforts, which Apple has done beautifully in the past, would've kept the same circuitry yet made the RAM accessible.
Quit whining...the video doesn't look hard and you only need to do this maybe once.
To start, you need a few things including a TR6 Torx security screwdriver, T9 Torx screwdriver, P5 screwdriver, a plastic spudger, a pair of DDR4-2666, 1.2V, PC4-21300, unbuffered, non-ECC RAM sticks, and an anti-static wrist strap that you know how to use properly.
Apparently owning and knowing how to use the strap is sufficient. Actually using it is not necessary. At least that's what I observe in the video.
Previous version: soldered RAM, people complain. New version: slotted RAM, people complain.
Look man, if you're not comfortable using screwdrivers, you're not even a real DIY tinkerer, so why even both complaining since this is something only DIY folks do?
I am an avid tinkerer and maker, thank you. But upgrading RAM shouldn't be this risky for the average user. Apple could've made the RAM easier to access, but they decided otherwise. Which is a dick move.
The average user is NOT messing with this stuff...
Dunno why people are backing Apple on this one, it's a lazy implementation of a premium product and a crappy user experience. They managed to block more tinkerers from attempting to upgrade their own RAM. Fewer people will buy it and Apple will end-up discontinuing it.
Look, I'm someone who has done very difficult tinkering with computers in the past. For example, to get more performance out of an old G4 TiBook, I moved one of the resistors on the motherboard which controlled the CPU speed (the hardware equivalent of BIOS overclocking on PCs).
However, I also am open minded enough to see that I'm in a very small group of people who knows how to do this, cares about it, and/or is willing to spend my time doing it. And I also understand that it requires extra product design, engineering, and assembly line complexity to include a RAM access panel or similarly easy access. If this was an Arduino or Raspberry Pi type of device targeted at tinkerers, then I'd definitely question the decision. But because it's a device targeted at the mass market, I completely understand why it was made.
So you're saying that for a device to be user upgradable it must to fall in the category of an Arduino. Gotcha! Apple could've easily made the bottom twistable, or require a standard screwdriver, or even better, no screws at all, no hidden access points. Any combination of these efforts, which Apple has done beautifully in the past, would've kept the same circuitry yet made the RAM accessible.
Quit whining...the video doesn't look hard and you only need to do this maybe once.
While I don't understand Apple's reasoning for milling a hollow aluminum shell when they could cut costs and make it easier to design, assemble, and repair, this is probably one of the easiest Mac minis with this styling to work on.
I think the earliest ones had RAM bays fully accessible from the bottom without removing the logic board, but as iFixit notes it's easy to remove and doesn't require specialized parts. Access to the RAM is step 5 on their teardown.
Comments
I always have upgraded my RAM (and internal storage) on any Mac I own (I keep them all a long time) where it is feasible even if difficult. However, never until my extended warranty is out. In my case, I make sure I purchase a Mac with the correct configuration for my needs for the two years under coverage. If you figure out what it costs to take out Apple's RAM and replace within those two years you have to add the two sets of RAM together to get the true cost unless you can get a trade in. I don't see how that can ever make mathematical sense otherwise. Two or three years later the cost of RAM has usually fallen enough to make that upgrade cost effective but even then you have to do the math. For my 2013 Mac Pro, it was nearly four years before that RAM was worth the cost and only then thanks to a trade in. It obviously varies but Apple never use cheap RAM so the calculations have to take that into account. On several Mac Mini 2012 models I have, it was a no-brainer to upgrade RAM and HDD to SSD at four years old, same with a 2010 MBP i7 15".
So the bottom line is this is a great article to file away for reference in two to three years.
I have mixed modules in an older 2011 mini, but it just does home theater duties so I can't comment on performance issues. I guess I was wondering if I could get the base 8GB config (likely dual rgb modules), then purchase a single 16GB module to upgrade the total memory to 20GB. That would be plenty for my needs now (currently running 16GB in `12 server). And if Apple somehow used a single 8GB module instead of dual 4GB sticks, that would be a bonus. But it seems like it needs dual sticks to run. Would be nice to have an official answer on this and the performance hit if mixing modules capacities.
https://appleinsider.com/archives/18/11/08/
and read whatever article I like from there.
However, I also am open minded enough to see that I'm in a very small group of people who knows how to do this, cares about it, and/or is willing to spend my time doing it. And I also understand that it requires extra product design, engineering, and assembly line complexity to include a RAM access panel or similarly easy access. If this was an Arduino or Raspberry Pi type of device targeted at tinkerers, then I'd definitely question the decision. But because it's a device targeted at the mass market, I completely understand why it was made.
Here's a good real-world test of a few different tasks and the benefit of dual vs single channel memory:
https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/1349-ram-how-dual-channel-works-vs-single-channel/Page-3
Apple could've easily made the bottom twistable, or require a standard screwdriver, or even better, no screws at all, no hidden access points. Any combination of these efforts, which Apple has done beautifully in the past, would've kept the same circuitry yet made the RAM accessible.
I think the earliest ones had RAM bays fully accessible from the bottom without removing the logic board, but as iFixit notes it's easy to remove and doesn't require specialized parts. Access to the RAM is step 5 on their teardown.