Yes, but you made a blanket statement that Apple has zero dominance in the smartphone market. You also ignored their dominance over other smartphone companies in marketshare and unit sales.
If you were only looking at one aspect of one metric then you should have stated so instead of simply using the word "dominate" and "smartphone market" to ONLY indicate unit marketshare. RiM, Nokia, Apple, Android, and surely others are all dominate share of the market in some way.
We were discussing a topic: iPhone market penetration and the resulting antitrust implications. I commented on the topic. I did not specify that my comment may not apply to a different topic.
Today Apple holds a lead with phone apps, but between their limited carriers, offering a single phone model, and the one-two punch to developers of SDK 4.0 and the growing number of arbitary AppStore purgings, we can safely expect that to level off within a year, ceding the majority of development investment to Android.
We keep hearing this. But all we're seeing is evidence to the contrary.
I think the only demographic that matters is smart (although the article only mentions education, not intelligence).
Note: My friend has Verizon, so I recommended the Droid Incredible, the latest smartphone released at the time on that network. He was so excited to show it to me when he received it from pre-order. The saddest moment, 5 people in the office couldn't figure out how to take a photo with the photo app. They could manipulate the camera in any other way, features purportedly lacking on the iPhone, but they couldn't figure out how to take a photo. Saddest thing ever.
5 people couldn't figure out how to click on the icon which looks like a camera and says Camera under it. And then when the app starts, couldn't figure out how to click on the biggest button in the app that looks like a shutter? Yeah. That's the saddest thing indeed!
It's a common part of the Windows fan meme. ("Rich kids and celebs use Macs, real people use Windows", that sort of thing) Are you being passive aggressive, or did you really not know this. Just asking.
Very sad. It is good that such folk have the iPhone to use.
But your friend with the Droid needs to download a few different camera programs and pick one that he likes better. If he were to Google "Android Camera App" he will have plenty of recommended choices available to him.
So the Android market is going to be full of Apps like this camera app that suck, and you'll have to cross your fingers whenever you buy one. Sounds a lot like PC software. That's what happens when you provide a cheep, lazy, open forum to toss anything you want into.
The fact that Android phones can be had for cheep and on just about any platform means that there will be a certain amount of market success for Android. But it certainly isn't for me.
So the Android market is going to be full of Apps like this camera app that suck, and you'll have to cross your fingers whenever you buy one. Sounds a lot like PC software. That's what happens when you provide a cheep, lazy, open forum to toss anything you want into.
The fact that Android phones can be had for cheep and on just about any platform means that there will be a certain amount of market success for Android. But it certainly isn't for me.
Thompson
Bingo. I think that Apple has identified a large demographic, and those people love Apple's products.
And yes, just like any platform, many (most?) of the apps will suck. But nobody I know buys them by crossing their fingers. Usually, they read reviews like this one:
The Best Android Apps [Part 1]: The Android Network Award Winners
Isn't that exactly what people do when they buy software for their Mac? Or do they just cross their fingers? Does Apple provide a cheap, lazy way to allow devs to make crappy Mac apps? My understanding is that anybody can make a horrible app for Macs, and Apple allows them to do so and to distribute it. Do you think that is bad?
Which is it? You've consumed too much lead paint as a kid or you are trolling? The growth rate of a single product when excluding it from the entire market is irrelvant with the entire market.
I wasn't aware that Nielsen was monitoring the entire world and that AI has chosen to just use the US stats to make the iPhone look better.
How about some accurate market growth.
Android
07% — Q4-09
09% — Q1-10
02% — Market Share Growth
iPhone
26% — Q4-09
28% — Q1-10
02% — Market Share Growth
My 12yo can understand this, why can't you?
Your personal attacks do not distract the astute reader from the absence of merit in your words:
As I noted in the post you're replying to, the Nielsen stats you're citing are for a selective subset of sales, the portion that occur in the US. The stats I provided included those in the superset of the entire world.
Very sad. It is good that such folk have the iPhone to use.
But your friend with the Droid needs to download a few different camera programs and pick one that he likes better. If he were to Google "Android Camera App" he will have plenty of recommended choices available to him.
Based on Stevie's statement advertising stats and app downloads should be considerably higher on Android than on iPhone per unit by virtue of the fact that mundane apps for simply taking a photo with the included camera HW are oddly not included.
What I think many people forget is, that there are many iPod touch users that are very likely to get an iPhone because of all the Apps (Productivity+Games) they already own. Also most existing iPhone owners already made a financial commitment to their platform by buying apps and Android users are less likely to buy apps. So I think most iPhone owners will not change their platform.
Another problem is that if you use your Phone for work it is not excusable if it becomes unstable, leaks private data or fails to function in any other way and a lousy battery is a real no go. I had a HTC patched WinMobile phone a year ago which broke and which was everything but reliable. Also the privacy issue is a big one with Google since it seems, that they want to know everything about everybody. This is why I will not buy an Android.
As an example, I am a medical student (4 weeks to go and I am finished hurray!) and during my practical training I have seen a lot of doctors praising their iPhones (or better the Appdevelopers for the platform). The App Store offers an great amount of really high quality medical apps that are expensive but do their job very well.
I had the time to test some of those apps on my iPod touch and I have saved those €700 to get myself an iPhone 4 this summer.
So despite the new data from polls, stats, graphs, and trends the only thing you took from the entire article was that iPhone was still bigger? WTF, indeed!
I kind of agree. Do we not expect the iPhone market to be a good bit larger then the Android market?
By they way I had a chance to use the new EVO 4G yesterday. That phone is about as close to perfect as you can get. What I really like about it is an 8 megapixel cam which will take 720p video and 1.3 front mounted cam for video chatting. Being in ATL I have full 4G coverage so the download speeds were really nice.
Not sure how its going to stack up against the new iPhone but it was the best Android phone I have used by far.
Likely it is because your 12 year old is not capable of more sophisticated analysis.
It would be unremarkable, for example, if a product went from 76 to 78 percent of a market. But if a new product goes from, say 8, percent to 10 percent, it shows something much more significant.
If you stop your analysis at "they are both 2%", without thinking any further, then you miss much.
Exactly what do you miss? That Android has a small share? And that it's market share has grown only by the same amount (and volume by a smaller amount) compared to Apple despite the latter's much larger share share? This despite the fact that Android is presumably in its 'early growth' phase?
I think Apple's numbers are remarkable.
You should be lucky to have the brains of that 12-year old!
As I noted in the post you're replying to, the Nielsen stats you're citing are for a selective subset of sales, the portion that occur in the US.
It's not a subset of Neilsen's stats if that is the only stats they monitor. Again, show us proof that Neilsen monitors stats for the entire world's phones.
By your reckoning we can't use just smartphones or all handsets, but have to keep using a superset of every sale from everything in order to keep it from invalidating itself. Perhaps you should look into what Neilsen does, as a company, and why these stats are usual to their customers before commenting again.
It's not a subset of Neilsen's stats if that is the only stats they monitor. Again, show us proof that Neilsen monitors stats for the entire world's phones
Straw man: no one but you has suggested the notion that Nielsen's US stats measure anything other than the US.
Fully acknowledging that, the global stats I provided were not from Nielsen, but from a source that doesn't limit its data to only the US market.
Exactly what do you miss? That Android has a small share? And that it's market share has grown only by the same amount (and volume by a smaller amount) compared to Apple despite the latter's much larger share share? This despite the fact that Android is presumably in its 'early growth' phase?
I think Apple's numbers are remarkable.
You should be lucky to have the brains of that 12-year old!
What you are saying is all true. Apples numbers on the iPhone are remarkable, however it looks pretty clear that Google is not only making a very good OS with Android but the Android based phones are really getting good. Phones like the Evo and Incredible are really solid HTC phones. I used the EVO yesterday for about an hour and it was by far the best Android phone I have ever used.
Blackberry is going to be hurt by Android and I simply don't see Windows mobile going anywhere.
Like everyone I am not sure what the new iPhone will offer but at least in my opinion which of course is subjective the EVO blows away the current iPhone. That of course could change this coming week.
So the Android market is going to be full of Apps like this camera app that suck, and you'll have to cross your fingers whenever you buy one. Sounds a lot like PC software. That's what happens when you provide a cheep, lazy, open forum to toss anything you want into.
That's the remarkable thing about Apple's AppStore: even with Apple's unprecedented control over every aspect of development down to dictating which languages can be used, all the way to limiting deployment to a single store they control from which they regularly purge even apps they've approved multiple times before, their store still has somewhere between 20 and 200 variants of iFart and thousands of other copy-cat programs, not to mention a host of medical scams:
And what does wading through this quagmire do for developers? Out of 200,000 apps, 199,900 of them are earning less than if the developer shut down their Mac and flipped burgers instead:
It's not a subset of Neilsen's stats if that is the only stats they monitor. Again, show us proof that Neilsen monitors stats for the entire world's phones.
By your reckoning we can't use just smartphones or all handsets, but have to keep using a superset of every sale from everything in order to keep it from invalidating itself. Perhaps you should look into what Neilsen does, as a company, and why these stats are usual to their customers before commenting again.
Actually the graph says it is National poll.
Also the Nokia numbers clearly show the survey is US only.
Comments
Yes, but you made a blanket statement that Apple has zero dominance in the smartphone market. You also ignored their dominance over other smartphone companies in marketshare and unit sales.
If you were only looking at one aspect of one metric then you should have stated so instead of simply using the word "dominate" and "smartphone market" to ONLY indicate unit marketshare. RiM, Nokia, Apple, Android, and surely others are all dominate share of the market in some way.
We were discussing a topic: iPhone market penetration and the resulting antitrust implications. I commented on the topic. I did not specify that my comment may not apply to a different topic.
Sorry. My bad.
Today Apple holds a lead with phone apps, but between their limited carriers, offering a single phone model, and the one-two punch to developers of SDK 4.0 and the growing number of arbitary AppStore purgings, we can safely expect that to level off within a year, ceding the majority of development investment to Android.
We keep hearing this. But all we're seeing is evidence to the contrary.
I think the only demographic that matters is smart (although the article only mentions education, not intelligence).
Note: My friend has Verizon, so I recommended the Droid Incredible, the latest smartphone released at the time on that network. He was so excited to show it to me when he received it from pre-order. The saddest moment, 5 people in the office couldn't figure out how to take a photo with the photo app. They could manipulate the camera in any other way, features purportedly lacking on the iPhone, but they couldn't figure out how to take a photo. Saddest thing ever.
5 people couldn't figure out how to click on the icon which looks like a camera and says Camera under it. And then when the app starts, couldn't figure out how to click on the biggest button in the app that looks like a shutter? Yeah. That's the saddest thing indeed!
As an Apple enthusiast, their being a leader in their field is important. To me, anyway.
Fair enough. I just wondered why.
Who calls them that?
It's a common part of the Windows fan meme. ("Rich kids and celebs use Macs, real people use Windows", that sort of thing) Are you being passive aggressive, or did you really not know this. Just asking.
Very sad. It is good that such folk have the iPhone to use.
But your friend with the Droid needs to download a few different camera programs and pick one that he likes better. If he were to Google "Android Camera App" he will have plenty of recommended choices available to him.
So the Android market is going to be full of Apps like this camera app that suck, and you'll have to cross your fingers whenever you buy one. Sounds a lot like PC software. That's what happens when you provide a cheep, lazy, open forum to toss anything you want into.
The fact that Android phones can be had for cheep and on just about any platform means that there will be a certain amount of market success for Android. But it certainly isn't for me.
Thompson
As an app provider, software maker, phone manufacturer, service provider, advertiser, etc., I know which one I'd rather have.
So the Android market is going to be full of Apps like this camera app that suck, and you'll have to cross your fingers whenever you buy one. Sounds a lot like PC software. That's what happens when you provide a cheep, lazy, open forum to toss anything you want into.
The fact that Android phones can be had for cheep and on just about any platform means that there will be a certain amount of market success for Android. But it certainly isn't for me.
Thompson
Bingo. I think that Apple has identified a large demographic, and those people love Apple's products.
And yes, just like any platform, many (most?) of the apps will suck. But nobody I know buys them by crossing their fingers. Usually, they read reviews like this one:
The Best Android Apps [Part 1]: The Android Network Award Winners
http://androinica.com/2009/08/18/the...s-androidapps/
Isn't that exactly what people do when they buy software for their Mac? Or do they just cross their fingers? Does Apple provide a cheap, lazy way to allow devs to make crappy Mac apps? My understanding is that anybody can make a horrible app for Macs, and Apple allows them to do so and to distribute it. Do you think that is bad?
Which is it? You've consumed too much lead paint as a kid or you are trolling? The growth rate of a single product when excluding it from the entire market is irrelvant with the entire market.
I wasn't aware that Nielsen was monitoring the entire world and that AI has chosen to just use the US stats to make the iPhone look better.
How about some accurate market growth.My 12yo can understand this, why can't you?
Your personal attacks do not distract the astute reader from the absence of merit in your words:
As I noted in the post you're replying to, the Nielsen stats you're citing are for a selective subset of sales, the portion that occur in the US. The stats I provided included those in the superset of the entire world.
Very sad. It is good that such folk have the iPhone to use.
But your friend with the Droid needs to download a few different camera programs and pick one that he likes better. If he were to Google "Android Camera App" he will have plenty of recommended choices available to him.
Based on Stevie's statement advertising stats and app downloads should be considerably higher on Android than on iPhone per unit by virtue of the fact that mundane apps for simply taking a photo with the included camera HW are oddly not included.
Who calls them that?
The great unwashed who are not Apple users.
Another problem is that if you use your Phone for work it is not excusable if it becomes unstable, leaks private data or fails to function in any other way and a lousy battery is a real no go. I had a HTC patched WinMobile phone a year ago which broke and which was everything but reliable. Also the privacy issue is a big one with Google since it seems, that they want to know everything about everybody. This is why I will not buy an Android.
As an example, I am a medical student (4 weeks to go and I am finished hurray!) and during my practical training I have seen a lot of doctors praising their iPhones (or better the Appdevelopers for the platform). The App Store offers an great amount of really high quality medical apps that are expensive but do their job very well.
I had the time to test some of those apps on my iPod touch and I have saved those €700 to get myself an iPhone 4 this summer.
So despite the new data from polls, stats, graphs, and trends the only thing you took from the entire article was that iPhone was still bigger? WTF, indeed!
I kind of agree. Do we not expect the iPhone market to be a good bit larger then the Android market?
By they way I had a chance to use the new EVO 4G yesterday. That phone is about as close to perfect as you can get. What I really like about it is an 8 megapixel cam which will take 720p video and 1.3 front mounted cam for video chatting. Being in ATL I have full 4G coverage so the download speeds were really nice.
Not sure how its going to stack up against the new iPhone but it was the best Android phone I have used by far.
Likely it is because your 12 year old is not capable of more sophisticated analysis.
It would be unremarkable, for example, if a product went from 76 to 78 percent of a market. But if a new product goes from, say 8, percent to 10 percent, it shows something much more significant.
If you stop your analysis at "they are both 2%", without thinking any further, then you miss much.
Exactly what do you miss? That Android has a small share? And that it's market share has grown only by the same amount (and volume by a smaller amount) compared to Apple despite the latter's much larger share share? This despite the fact that Android is presumably in its 'early growth' phase?
I think Apple's numbers are remarkable.
You should be lucky to have the brains of that 12-year old!
As I noted in the post you're replying to, the Nielsen stats you're citing are for a selective subset of sales, the portion that occur in the US.
It's not a subset of Neilsen's stats if that is the only stats they monitor. Again, show us proof that Neilsen monitors stats for the entire world's phones.
By your reckoning we can't use just smartphones or all handsets, but have to keep using a superset of every sale from everything in order to keep it from invalidating itself.
It's not a subset of Neilsen's stats if that is the only stats they monitor. Again, show us proof that Neilsen monitors stats for the entire world's phones
Straw man: no one but you has suggested the notion that Nielsen's US stats measure anything other than the US.
Fully acknowledging that, the global stats I provided were not from Nielsen, but from a source that doesn't limit its data to only the US market.
What you may be remembering is a recent quarterly sales report where Android phones sold in greater numbers than the iPhone.
Read again. You overlooked the 2% QoQ increase that Android had in Q12010. How does this stand up against the "skyrocketing" growth of Android?http://forums.appleinsider.com/image...ies/1oyvey.gif
Nielsen's study had more samples and so maybe more reliable statistically.
Exactly what do you miss? That Android has a small share? And that it's market share has grown only by the same amount (and volume by a smaller amount) compared to Apple despite the latter's much larger share share? This despite the fact that Android is presumably in its 'early growth' phase?
I think Apple's numbers are remarkable.
You should be lucky to have the brains of that 12-year old!
What you are saying is all true. Apples numbers on the iPhone are remarkable, however it looks pretty clear that Google is not only making a very good OS with Android but the Android based phones are really getting good. Phones like the Evo and Incredible are really solid HTC phones. I used the EVO yesterday for about an hour and it was by far the best Android phone I have ever used.
Blackberry is going to be hurt by Android and I simply don't see Windows mobile going anywhere.
Like everyone I am not sure what the new iPhone will offer but at least in my opinion which of course is subjective the EVO blows away the current iPhone. That of course could change this coming week.
So the Android market is going to be full of Apps like this camera app that suck, and you'll have to cross your fingers whenever you buy one. Sounds a lot like PC software. That's what happens when you provide a cheep, lazy, open forum to toss anything you want into.
That's the remarkable thing about Apple's AppStore: even with Apple's unprecedented control over every aspect of development down to dictating which languages can be used, all the way to limiting deployment to a single store they control from which they regularly purge even apps they've approved multiple times before, their store still has somewhere between 20 and 200 variants of iFart and thousands of other copy-cat programs, not to mention a host of medical scams:
http://gizmodo.com/5555853/the-apple...+%28Gizmodo%29
And what does wading through this quagmire do for developers? Out of 200,000 apps, 199,900 of them are earning less than if the developer shut down their Mac and flipped burgers instead:
http://appular.com/2010/04/the-ipad-...re-its-a-mess/
It's not a subset of Neilsen's stats if that is the only stats they monitor. Again, show us proof that Neilsen monitors stats for the entire world's phones.
By your reckoning we can't use just smartphones or all handsets, but have to keep using a superset of every sale from everything in order to keep it from invalidating itself.
Actually the graph says it is National poll.
Also the Nokia numbers clearly show the survey is US only.