How many more videos do you need to show this is commonplace, but it took a phone people actually care about to make it known?
And how many of those other phones be fixed with a piece of duct tape? An inherent RF interaction with body mass is a different issue than one resulting from skin contact, which can be avoided with a proper coating or cladding of the bezel.
Mask the unit carefully, including the buttons and dock opening, leaving only the bezel exposed.
Using Plasti-Dip(tm) spray in the color of your choice, apply thin coats until a coating of sufficient thickness is achieved.
Result - an attractive and durable solution. If I can do it in my garage, Apple can do better in their factory.
It's not absurd at all. The real bottom line is, the cell makers are getting called out on something they were hoping the average consumer would just ignore. They are concerned now because Apple, not being part of the "old boys network" of cell makers (who have agreed amongst themselves to not draw attention to the attenuation issue), being the disruptive "new kid on the block", has called them out when they thought it was safe to let Apple hang for a common issue. And they had a vested interest to do so - Apple came into their sandbox with a new toy that made theirs look dumb, and became very popular. So much so they all felt they had to produce lookalike touch phones to compete with the very company they said would fail miserably. And didn't.
lol it sure does seem that way doesn't it? But there's no evidence to support that notion just yet. I believe it though. I think there's a very good probability that attenuation issues are something none of the other cell phone manufacturers would bring up (in attack ads for instance) because they knew their own phones could be placed in those ads.
As far as everyone producing lookalike touch phones, I've had this discussion to death already. It's a misconception that without Apple, phones wouldn't resemble what they are today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysBlackmore
Moreover, Jobs in his addressing of the issue was fairly explicit that Apple would resolve any real issues via replacement, or refund within 30 days. So no consumer has to tolerate an iPhone that doesn't perform to expectation. So, for example if the antenna performance is not what you require - you either get it replaced (after which your return window is advanced ANOTHER 30 days btw), or you get a refund and go get another cellphone, like geekdad and northern did. They seem to be happy, and I don't see Steve Jobs hiding around the corner to go "neener-neener" at them for doing so - do you?
You're saying exactly what I've been saying which equates to "shit or get off the pot."
If someone's having issues with reception to the point where a bumper or case can't fix it and they don't return it, then they can't continue to complain about this rationally. After a certain point, you have to wonder what people are still complaining about when the most practical solution is staring them in the face.
Good point. I'll be interested to see a counterpoint.
Then keep reading, because the person he's talking about had already said he never experienced these issues with their previous iphones. You'll see that a few posts back.
Get a ZAGG, and it will put a barrier between your skin and the antenna and solve these problems. It's a shame that Apple won't put some sort of non conductive coating on the antenna, but it's something iP4 users will have to live with. The ZAGG Invisible Shield is 25 bucks, its clear, and it will protect your iP4 from scratches.
Bullshit, you just don't like the fact that I'm right. He said he had previous versions of the iphone that wouldn't drop his calls, so it wasn't a network thing. I could have pointed this out, but after your snooty little remark about how it was a no-brainer, I decided to be a little annoying.
Your bias is clear as day, and if anything, you could be the one labeled as a troll since your comments draw in more replies than mine do.
Well, you might have an argument, if you were right, but you aren't. As usual, all you are doing is confounding facts to misrepresent issues.
Can we not have any more antenna "news" ie, it's beyond boring, it's insufferable.
I totally agree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz
I have used mobile phones for years and every single handset has issues depending on where you hold them. As soon as you hold them you attenuate the signal. They still work, no big deal, right?
Wrong, these mobile companies are shitting themselves. They have to release statements like this to cover their asses. If they don't? Lawsuits. Guaranteed some little prick who thinks the world owes him a living will launch a lawsuit agains these companies for shitty antennas etc.
I remember when GSM phones were first used everyone was freaked out that they cause interference with radios and TVs speaker. I used to have Ericsson phone back in 1995 and everyone with a Nokia phone demonstrated to me how a cigarette lighter can attach to the phone earpiece magnet and how this will give me a brain tumor if I don't switch to a Nokia phone.
I experienced drop calls with every phone I used (Ericsson, Sony Ericsson, Nokia, Apple). Cell phones are not perfect. This is why businesses have phone lines in their offices.
Then keep reading, because the person he's talking about had already said he never experienced these issues with their previous iphones. You'll see that a few posts back.
And his response has already been pointed out to be contradicted by actual data and testing more rigorous than his. Yet, oddly, or not so oddly, you reply as though he made an unassailable point.
As I indicated, because of your terminology, it was difficult to determine what you were even trying to say. Let's review:
iPhone 3G (3G) - released by Apple in 2008, works on AT&T in US.
iPhone 3GS (3GS) - released by Apple in 2009, works on AT&T in US.
EVO 4G (EVO) - released by HTC in 2010, works on Sprint in US.
iPhone 4 (iP4) - released by Apple in 2010, works on AT&T in US.
Since the EVO doesn't work on AT&T's network, it's irrelevant. So, you tested 2 phones, although, it's still not clear which 2.
If it was a low signal area, an iP4 may possibly lose enough signal if you bridge the seam to drop a call that a 3G or 3GS might not. In a strong signal area, this would not be the cause of the dropped call.
However, more rigorous tests have shown that an iP4 generally gets better reception than a 3GS, and more rigorous tests have determined exactly how much signal it will drop when the seam is bridged. No one, including Apple, is saying there is no signal loss. What they are saying is that signal loss is not unique to the iP4, and they have demonstrated that this is the case. They have also released data indicating that there is not a big jump in dropped calls using the iP4.
So, that you have some anecdotal evidence that you were able to drop a call with an iP4 is not a significant data point, and doesn't point to some huge issue. The data describe the issue, and the data say that it's not significantly affecting iP4 owners.
LOL you dismiss the points you dont agree with.Then you miss the whole conext of all of my posts....... I am not saying there is some huge issue and Apple is doomed! LOL
I will even call the iPhone 4 iP4 just so you won't get confused.
I only added the EVO to the mix becaused I swithed to the EVO when I returned my iPhone 4...wait iP4. I added that as context to show not all smartphones lose signal when held a certain way. Geezz.......
To recap..here were MY experiences.
iPhone 3G never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 3GS never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 4 (iP4 if you want) would drop calls based on how the phone was held. It did not matter what the signal strength was.
HTC EVO never drops calls no matter how I hold it and it is in the smartphone catagory.....so that is why I added it.....Apple said all smartphone has signal loss. My real world tests do not confirm that for my test. These are just my experiences....
... As far as everyone producing lookalike touch phones, I've had this discussion to death already. It's a misconception that without Apple, phones wouldn't resemble what they are today. ...
And the fallacy and weakness of your argument was pointed out to you at that time.
That's not true. CR used to be a decent magazine which did some good work and published some good results. The started to go downhill about the time they falsified the Suzuki Samurai tests.
You got your hands on an EVO, iPhone 3G, and iPhone 4G and took them all to various locations to test them to see which one worked better? Somehow, that's not very credible.
Besides, it's meaningless. When comparing the EVO and the iPhone, you're comparing both the phone and the network - how do you know how much of the difference is the network?
In addition, there's a major logical fallacy in your argument. Your position is akin to saying that your Yugo is better than a Lexus because 1% (use whatever figure you like) of Lexus cars crash every year (and you actually saw it happen once) while YOUR Yugo hasn't crashed.
you dismiss whatever you don't agree with for what ever reason you want but my tests of my experiences holds true....To recap..here were MY experiences.
iPhone 3G never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 3GS never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 4 (iP4 if you want) would drop calls based on how the phone was held. It did not matter what the signal strength was.
HTC EVO never drops calls no matter how I hold it and it is in the smartphone catagory.....so that is why I added it.....Apple said all smartphone has signal loss. My real world tests do not confirm that for my test. These are just my experiences....
Oh Jeez, AI trying to make a ludicrous comparison between the odd possibility that you grap that HTC Droid Eris by the UPPER extremity of the phone to the -rather natural- BOTTOM left iPhone 4's death grip... I know that the ridicule does not kill, it can just makes you look silly and intellectually dishonest.
Yeah... but I thought that the antenna was supposed to be at the bottom-- farthest away from the head/brain when held to the ear.
LOL you dismiss the points you dont agree with.Then you miss the whole conext of all of my posts....... I am not saying there is some huge issue and Apple is doomed! LOL
I will even call the iPhone 4 iP4 just so you won't get confused.
I only added the EVO to the mix becaused I swithed to the EVO when I returned my iPhone 4...wait iP4. I added that as context to show not all smartphones lose signal when help a certain way. Geezz.......
Well, if you still don't understand why the EVO is irrelevant in the context of the point you are trying to make, I doubt that you can be made to understand it with further explanation.
Quote:
To recap..here were MY experiences.
iPhone 3G never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 3GS never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 4 (iP4 if you want) would drop calls based on how the phone was held. It did not matter what the signal strength was.
HTC EVO never drops calls no matter how I hold it and it is in the smartphone catagory.....so that is why I added it.....Apple said all smartphone has signal loss. My real world tests do not confirm that for my test. These are just my experiences....
Exactly, these are your experiences. But they aren't meaningful data by themselves. The testing and data show that there is no big issue with the iP4, and that it can, in fact, hang on to calls in low signal areas when other phones, specifically the 3GS, cannot. So, since your experience conflicts with the results of more rigorous testing and the conclusions derived from more extensive data sets, which should we put more weight on? Which is more likely to give the most correct picture of the situation?
Bullshit, you just don't like the fact that I'm right. He said he had previous versions of the iphone that wouldn't drop his calls, so it wasn't a network thing. I could have pointed this out, but after your snooty little remark about how it was a no-brainer, I decided to be a little annoying.
Your bias is clear as day, and if anything, you could be the one labeled as a troll since your comments draw in more replies than mine do.
No more clear than yours dear chronster. You're not right and you fail utterly to admit that fact when you are in fact wrong - as demonstrated on countless other threads comments. Once you get an idea fixee, you cannot ever do a mea culpa. ever. Trolling has little to do with responses to your commentary as it does with being inflammatory (which you do well) and/or excessively argumentative in foras which are openly aligned to a subject matter. And by excessively argumentative, obviously in ways that refuse any ground to a counter-argument, in spite of supporting and proven evidence.
The actual issues are problematic for geekdad - his iPhone 4 may in fact have had actually reception issues, which may, or may not have had anything to do with the antenna. It may have been a baseband issue on the Iphone 4, it may have been a processor instruction issue for the baseband, Apple changed a series of the phone components to upgrade general performance in regular use. Any of those changes could be the root cause for his issues. All that is known is that it did not work correctly, nor to his expectation. Against which he exercised his right to return it for failure to perform, and chose a different phone (and a different carrier apparently). Please note that I am giving full acceptance to his narrative around his decision, and do not question his sanity, manual dexterity or commonsense. He exercised his right as a consumer to change at will from one product to another. I can choose to accept at face value his decision as being valid, or question the details, but what he did was the right thing to do. Whether a year down the road is is as happy as now needs to be proven, but there will be copious other things to discuss in the meantime. Besides his needs, wants and desires probably vary widely from ours anyway - diversity and variety being the cornerstone of viability for the human race, so this is a good thing as well.
Well, if you still don't understand why the EVO is irrelevant in the context of the point you are trying to make, I doubt that you can be made to understand it with further explanation.
Exactly, these are your experiences. But they aren't meaningful data by themselves. The testing and data show that there is no big issue with the iP4, and that it can, in fact, hang on to calls in low signal areas when other phones, specifically the 3GS, cannot. So, since your experience conflicts with the results of more rigorous testing and the conclusions derived from more extensive data sets, which should we put more weight on? Which is more likely to give the most correct picture of the situation?
again...you missed the whole point of my posts....go back and read what started the whole thing........
I am not saying here are my experience are what EVERYONE else is having or even there is some huge issue. Someone commected on why I switched to the EVO. I then posted why i did so.......
I tested 4 phones in the same locations and the same locations while making and recieving a simple phone call. ONLY the iPhone 4G(iP4) would drop calls based on how it was held. That is my real world expeiences and that is why I switched to the EVO.
I am not here stating one is better than the other or my new phone is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel. Please read my posts again. You can dismiss it for whatever reasons you want but that is what happen to me. That was my experience and testing......Geeezzz you guys are so fanatical in defending this........issue.
now shut the hell up and don't turn this discussion into another "Apple changed the game and everyone's just a wanna be" bullshitfest.
The video seems to show that their phone were evolving from a design based on Palm devices, until they abruptly changed direction in 2007. I wonder what that could mean?
Funny that we both felt the need for a disclaimer.
I'm not sure what it says, though, that people come up with these atrociously bad analogies. Here's a tip for those wishing to make analogies. It's not enough to just come up with something that involves, say, a company and a product. The situation involving the product has to actually be... wait for it... analogous.
Well! If you want a meaningful analog, consider the story of the turtle and the hare, where the momma bear finds that....
No more clear than yours dear chronster. You're not right and you fail utterly to admit that fact when you are in fact wrong - as demonstrated on countless other threads comments. Once you get an idea fixee, you cannot ever do a mea culpa. ever. Trolling has little to do with responses to your commentary as it does with being inflammatory (which you do well) and/or excessively argumentative in foras which are openly aligned to a subject matter. And by excessively argumentative, obviously in ways that refuse any ground to a counter-argument, in spite of supporting and proven evidence.
The actual issues are problematic for geekdad - his iPhone 4 may in fact have had actually reception issues, which may, or may not have had anything to do with the antenna. It may have been a baseband issue on the Iphone 4, it may have been a processor instruction issue for the baseband, Apple changed a series of the phone components to upgrade general performance in regular use. Any of those changes could be the root cause for his issues. All that is known is that it did not work correctly, nor to his expectation. Against which he exercised his right to return it for failure to perform, and chose a different phone (and a different carrier apparently). Please note that I am giving full acceptance to his narrative around his decision, and do not question his sanity, manual dexterity or commonsense. He exercised his right as a consumer to change at will from one product to another. I can choose to accept at face value his decision as being valid, or question the details, but what he did was the right thing to do. Whether a year down the road is is as happy as now needs to be proven, but there will be copious other things to discuss in the meantime. Besides his needs, wants and desires probably vary widely from ours anyway - diversity and variety being the cornerstone of viability for the human race, so this is a good thing as well.
Really? So by saying that a bumper and the 4.01 update is enough to squash this whole thing, I'm being inflammatory and argumentative?
Even as I type this, geekdad is trying to explain in the plainest language possible that he had previous iphones that didn't have the issue the new one did, and yet he's being told he doesn't understand the issue (even though there IS NO issue right?.)
It's amazing how people like you and anonymouse think this whole thing is some sort of gotcha game, where by admitting there's a design flaw in the iphone 4, you've lost!
Get over yourself. If you really thought I was a troll rather than someone who brings a decent discussion to the table, I'd be on your ignore list.
again...you missed the whole point of my posts....go back and read what started the whole thing........
I am not saying here are my experience are what EVERYONE else is having or even there is some huge issue. Someone commected on why I switched to the EVO. I then posted why i did so.......
I tested 4 phones in the same locations and the same locations while making and recieving a simple phone call. ONLY the iPhone 4G(iP4) would drop calls based on how it was held. That is my real world expeiences and that is why I switched to the EVO.
I am not here stating one is better than the other or my new phone is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel. Please read my posts again. You can dismiss it for whatever reasons you want but that is what happen to me. That was my experience and testing......Geeezzz you guys are so fanatical in defending this........issue.
Well, fine, it was your experience and you switched to EVO based on it. But what relevance does that have to the discussion? What does it add to the understanding of the issues?
I would say it doesn't add anything meaningful, in and of itself.
Comments
How many more videos do you need to show this is commonplace, but it took a phone people actually care about to make it known?
And how many of those other phones be fixed with a piece of duct tape? An inherent RF interaction with body mass is a different issue than one resulting from skin contact, which can be avoided with a proper coating or cladding of the bezel.
Mask the unit carefully, including the buttons and dock opening, leaving only the bezel exposed.
Using Plasti-Dip(tm) spray in the color of your choice, apply thin coats until a coating of sufficient thickness is achieved.
Result - an attractive and durable solution. If I can do it in my garage, Apple can do better in their factory.
Other phones don't enter into it.
It's not absurd at all. The real bottom line is, the cell makers are getting called out on something they were hoping the average consumer would just ignore. They are concerned now because Apple, not being part of the "old boys network" of cell makers (who have agreed amongst themselves to not draw attention to the attenuation issue), being the disruptive "new kid on the block", has called them out when they thought it was safe to let Apple hang for a common issue. And they had a vested interest to do so - Apple came into their sandbox with a new toy that made theirs look dumb, and became very popular. So much so they all felt they had to produce lookalike touch phones to compete with the very company they said would fail miserably. And didn't.
lol it sure does seem that way doesn't it? But there's no evidence to support that notion just yet. I believe it though. I think there's a very good probability that attenuation issues are something none of the other cell phone manufacturers would bring up (in attack ads for instance) because they knew their own phones could be placed in those ads.
As far as everyone producing lookalike touch phones, I've had this discussion to death already. It's a misconception that without Apple, phones wouldn't resemble what they are today.
Moreover, Jobs in his addressing of the issue was fairly explicit that Apple would resolve any real issues via replacement, or refund within 30 days. So no consumer has to tolerate an iPhone that doesn't perform to expectation. So, for example if the antenna performance is not what you require - you either get it replaced (after which your return window is advanced ANOTHER 30 days btw), or you get a refund and go get another cellphone, like geekdad and northern did. They seem to be happy, and I don't see Steve Jobs hiding around the corner to go "neener-neener" at them for doing so - do you?
You're saying exactly what I've been saying which equates to "shit or get off the pot."
If someone's having issues with reception to the point where a bumper or case can't fix it and they don't return it, then they can't continue to complain about this rationally. After a certain point, you have to wonder what people are still complaining about when the most practical solution is staring them in the face.
Good point. I'll be interested to see a counterpoint.
Then keep reading, because the person he's talking about had already said he never experienced these issues with their previous iphones. You'll see that a few posts back.
http://gizmodo.com/5590782/zaggs-iph...=Google+Reader
Bullshit, you just don't like the fact that I'm right. He said he had previous versions of the iphone that wouldn't drop his calls, so it wasn't a network thing. I could have pointed this out, but after your snooty little remark about how it was a no-brainer, I decided to be a little annoying.
Your bias is clear as day, and if anything, you could be the one labeled as a troll since your comments draw in more replies than mine do.
Well, you might have an argument, if you were right, but you aren't. As usual, all you are doing is confounding facts to misrepresent issues.
Can we not have any more antenna "news" ie, it's beyond boring, it's insufferable.
I totally agree.
I have used mobile phones for years and every single handset has issues depending on where you hold them. As soon as you hold them you attenuate the signal. They still work, no big deal, right?
Wrong, these mobile companies are shitting themselves. They have to release statements like this to cover their asses. If they don't? Lawsuits. Guaranteed some little prick who thinks the world owes him a living will launch a lawsuit agains these companies for shitty antennas etc.
I remember when GSM phones were first used everyone was freaked out that they cause interference with radios and TVs speaker. I used to have Ericsson phone back in 1995 and everyone with a Nokia phone demonstrated to me how a cigarette lighter can attach to the phone earpiece magnet and how this will give me a brain tumor if I don't switch to a Nokia phone.
I experienced drop calls with every phone I used (Ericsson, Sony Ericsson, Nokia, Apple). Cell phones are not perfect. This is why businesses have phone lines in their offices.
Then keep reading, because the person he's talking about had already said he never experienced these issues with their previous iphones. You'll see that a few posts back.
And his response has already been pointed out to be contradicted by actual data and testing more rigorous than his. Yet, oddly, or not so oddly, you reply as though he made an unassailable point.
As I indicated, because of your terminology, it was difficult to determine what you were even trying to say. Let's review:
- iPhone 3G (3G) - released by Apple in 2008, works on AT&T in US.
- iPhone 3GS (3GS) - released by Apple in 2009, works on AT&T in US.
- EVO 4G (EVO) - released by HTC in 2010, works on Sprint in US.
- iPhone 4 (iP4) - released by Apple in 2010, works on AT&T in US.
Since the EVO doesn't work on AT&T's network, it's irrelevant. So, you tested 2 phones, although, it's still not clear which 2.If it was a low signal area, an iP4 may possibly lose enough signal if you bridge the seam to drop a call that a 3G or 3GS might not. In a strong signal area, this would not be the cause of the dropped call.
However, more rigorous tests have shown that an iP4 generally gets better reception than a 3GS, and more rigorous tests have determined exactly how much signal it will drop when the seam is bridged. No one, including Apple, is saying there is no signal loss. What they are saying is that signal loss is not unique to the iP4, and they have demonstrated that this is the case. They have also released data indicating that there is not a big jump in dropped calls using the iP4.
So, that you have some anecdotal evidence that you were able to drop a call with an iP4 is not a significant data point, and doesn't point to some huge issue. The data describe the issue, and the data say that it's not significantly affecting iP4 owners.
LOL you dismiss the points you dont agree with.Then you miss the whole conext of all of my posts....... I am not saying there is some huge issue and Apple is doomed! LOL
I will even call the iPhone 4 iP4 just so you won't get confused.
I only added the EVO to the mix becaused I swithed to the EVO when I returned my iPhone 4...wait iP4. I added that as context to show not all smartphones lose signal when held a certain way. Geezz.......
To recap..here were MY experiences.
iPhone 3G never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 3GS never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 4 (iP4 if you want) would drop calls based on how the phone was held. It did not matter what the signal strength was.
HTC EVO never drops calls no matter how I hold it and it is in the smartphone catagory.....so that is why I added it.....Apple said all smartphone has signal loss. My real world tests do not confirm that for my test. These are just my experiences....
... As far as everyone producing lookalike touch phones, I've had this discussion to death already. It's a misconception that without Apple, phones wouldn't resemble what they are today. ...
And the fallacy and weakness of your argument was pointed out to you at that time.
That's not true. CR used to be a decent magazine which did some good work and published some good results. The started to go downhill about the time they falsified the Suzuki Samurai tests.
You got your hands on an EVO, iPhone 3G, and iPhone 4G and took them all to various locations to test them to see which one worked better? Somehow, that's not very credible.
Besides, it's meaningless. When comparing the EVO and the iPhone, you're comparing both the phone and the network - how do you know how much of the difference is the network?
In addition, there's a major logical fallacy in your argument. Your position is akin to saying that your Yugo is better than a Lexus because 1% (use whatever figure you like) of Lexus cars crash every year (and you actually saw it happen once) while YOUR Yugo hasn't crashed.
you dismiss whatever you don't agree with for what ever reason you want but my tests of my experiences holds true....To recap..here were MY experiences.
iPhone 3G never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 3GS never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 4 (iP4 if you want) would drop calls based on how the phone was held. It did not matter what the signal strength was.
HTC EVO never drops calls no matter how I hold it and it is in the smartphone catagory.....so that is why I added it.....Apple said all smartphone has signal loss. My real world tests do not confirm that for my test. These are just my experiences....
So what tests have YOU done???????
Oh Jeez, AI trying to make a ludicrous comparison between the odd possibility that you grap that HTC Droid Eris by the UPPER extremity of the phone to the -rather natural- BOTTOM left iPhone 4's death grip... I know that the ridicule does not kill, it can just makes you look silly and intellectually dishonest.
Yeah... but I thought that the antenna was supposed to be at the bottom-- farthest away from the head/brain when held to the ear.
I wonder how these phones got FCC approval???
.
LOL you dismiss the points you dont agree with.Then you miss the whole conext of all of my posts....... I am not saying there is some huge issue and Apple is doomed! LOL
I will even call the iPhone 4 iP4 just so you won't get confused.
I only added the EVO to the mix becaused I swithed to the EVO when I returned my iPhone 4...wait iP4. I added that as context to show not all smartphones lose signal when help a certain way. Geezz.......
Well, if you still don't understand why the EVO is irrelevant in the context of the point you are trying to make, I doubt that you can be made to understand it with further explanation.
To recap..here were MY experiences.
iPhone 3G never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 3GS never had a signal loss issue/dropped calls no matter how you held the phone
iPhone 4 (iP4 if you want) would drop calls based on how the phone was held. It did not matter what the signal strength was.
HTC EVO never drops calls no matter how I hold it and it is in the smartphone catagory.....so that is why I added it.....Apple said all smartphone has signal loss. My real world tests do not confirm that for my test. These are just my experiences....
Exactly, these are your experiences. But they aren't meaningful data by themselves. The testing and data show that there is no big issue with the iP4, and that it can, in fact, hang on to calls in low signal areas when other phones, specifically the 3GS, cannot. So, since your experience conflicts with the results of more rigorous testing and the conclusions derived from more extensive data sets, which should we put more weight on? Which is more likely to give the most correct picture of the situation?
Bullshit, you just don't like the fact that I'm right. He said he had previous versions of the iphone that wouldn't drop his calls, so it wasn't a network thing. I could have pointed this out, but after your snooty little remark about how it was a no-brainer, I decided to be a little annoying.
Your bias is clear as day, and if anything, you could be the one labeled as a troll since your comments draw in more replies than mine do.
No more clear than yours dear chronster. You're not right and you fail utterly to admit that fact when you are in fact wrong - as demonstrated on countless other threads comments. Once you get an idea fixee, you cannot ever do a mea culpa. ever. Trolling has little to do with responses to your commentary as it does with being inflammatory (which you do well) and/or excessively argumentative in foras which are openly aligned to a subject matter. And by excessively argumentative, obviously in ways that refuse any ground to a counter-argument, in spite of supporting and proven evidence.
The actual issues are problematic for geekdad - his iPhone 4 may in fact have had actually reception issues, which may, or may not have had anything to do with the antenna. It may have been a baseband issue on the Iphone 4, it may have been a processor instruction issue for the baseband, Apple changed a series of the phone components to upgrade general performance in regular use. Any of those changes could be the root cause for his issues. All that is known is that it did not work correctly, nor to his expectation. Against which he exercised his right to return it for failure to perform, and chose a different phone (and a different carrier apparently). Please note that I am giving full acceptance to his narrative around his decision, and do not question his sanity, manual dexterity or commonsense. He exercised his right as a consumer to change at will from one product to another. I can choose to accept at face value his decision as being valid, or question the details, but what he did was the right thing to do. Whether a year down the road is is as happy as now needs to be proven, but there will be copious other things to discuss in the meantime. Besides his needs, wants and desires probably vary widely from ours anyway - diversity and variety being the cornerstone of viability for the human race, so this is a good thing as well.
And the fallacy and weakness of your argument was pointed out to you at that time.
Here's a nice video from HTC talking about what they did in the past:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yai2u3nVlN4
now shut the hell up and don't turn this discussion into another "Apple changed the game and everyone's just a wanna be" bullshitfest.
Well, if you still don't understand why the EVO is irrelevant in the context of the point you are trying to make, I doubt that you can be made to understand it with further explanation.
Exactly, these are your experiences. But they aren't meaningful data by themselves. The testing and data show that there is no big issue with the iP4, and that it can, in fact, hang on to calls in low signal areas when other phones, specifically the 3GS, cannot. So, since your experience conflicts with the results of more rigorous testing and the conclusions derived from more extensive data sets, which should we put more weight on? Which is more likely to give the most correct picture of the situation?
again...you missed the whole point of my posts....go back and read what started the whole thing........
I am not saying here are my experience are what EVERYONE else is having or even there is some huge issue. Someone commected on why I switched to the EVO. I then posted why i did so.......
I tested 4 phones in the same locations and the same locations while making and recieving a simple phone call. ONLY the iPhone 4G(iP4) would drop calls based on how it was held. That is my real world expeiences and that is why I switched to the EVO.
I am not here stating one is better than the other or my new phone is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel. Please read my posts again. You can dismiss it for whatever reasons you want but that is what happen to me. That was my experience and testing......Geeezzz you guys are so fanatical in defending this........issue.
Yeah... but I thought that the antenna was supposed to be at the bottom-- farthest await from the head/brain when held to the ear.
I wonder how these phones got FCC approval???
.
Bribes. Ob-V
Here's a nice video from HTC talking about what they did in the past:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yai2u3nVlN4
now shut the hell up and don't turn this discussion into another "Apple changed the game and everyone's just a wanna be" bullshitfest.
The video seems to show that their phone were evolving from a design based on Palm devices, until they abruptly changed direction in 2007. I wonder what that could mean?
Funny that we both felt the need for a disclaimer.
I'm not sure what it says, though, that people come up with these atrociously bad analogies. Here's a tip for those wishing to make analogies. It's not enough to just come up with something that involves, say, a company and a product. The situation involving the product has to actually be... wait for it... analogous.
Well! If you want a meaningful analog, consider the story of the turtle and the hare, where the momma bear finds that....
... Oh... just never mind!!!
.
No more clear than yours dear chronster. You're not right and you fail utterly to admit that fact when you are in fact wrong - as demonstrated on countless other threads comments. Once you get an idea fixee, you cannot ever do a mea culpa. ever. Trolling has little to do with responses to your commentary as it does with being inflammatory (which you do well) and/or excessively argumentative in foras which are openly aligned to a subject matter. And by excessively argumentative, obviously in ways that refuse any ground to a counter-argument, in spite of supporting and proven evidence.
The actual issues are problematic for geekdad - his iPhone 4 may in fact have had actually reception issues, which may, or may not have had anything to do with the antenna. It may have been a baseband issue on the Iphone 4, it may have been a processor instruction issue for the baseband, Apple changed a series of the phone components to upgrade general performance in regular use. Any of those changes could be the root cause for his issues. All that is known is that it did not work correctly, nor to his expectation. Against which he exercised his right to return it for failure to perform, and chose a different phone (and a different carrier apparently). Please note that I am giving full acceptance to his narrative around his decision, and do not question his sanity, manual dexterity or commonsense. He exercised his right as a consumer to change at will from one product to another. I can choose to accept at face value his decision as being valid, or question the details, but what he did was the right thing to do. Whether a year down the road is is as happy as now needs to be proven, but there will be copious other things to discuss in the meantime. Besides his needs, wants and desires probably vary widely from ours anyway - diversity and variety being the cornerstone of viability for the human race, so this is a good thing as well.
Really? So by saying that a bumper and the 4.01 update is enough to squash this whole thing, I'm being inflammatory and argumentative?
Even as I type this, geekdad is trying to explain in the plainest language possible that he had previous iphones that didn't have the issue the new one did, and yet he's being told he doesn't understand the issue (even though there IS NO issue right?.)
It's amazing how people like you and anonymouse think this whole thing is some sort of gotcha game, where by admitting there's a design flaw in the iphone 4, you've lost!
Get over yourself. If you really thought I was a troll rather than someone who brings a decent discussion to the table, I'd be on your ignore list.
again...you missed the whole point of my posts....go back and read what started the whole thing........
I am not saying here are my experience are what EVERYONE else is having or even there is some huge issue. Someone commected on why I switched to the EVO. I then posted why i did so.......
I tested 4 phones in the same locations and the same locations while making and recieving a simple phone call. ONLY the iPhone 4G(iP4) would drop calls based on how it was held. That is my real world expeiences and that is why I switched to the EVO.
I am not here stating one is better than the other or my new phone is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel. Please read my posts again. You can dismiss it for whatever reasons you want but that is what happen to me. That was my experience and testing......Geeezzz you guys are so fanatical in defending this........issue.
Well, fine, it was your experience and you switched to EVO based on it. But what relevance does that have to the discussion? What does it add to the understanding of the issues?
I would say it doesn't add anything meaningful, in and of itself.