Piracy problems undermine Android's growth against iPhone

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  • Reply 81 of 217
    Deleted
  • Reply 82 of 217
    mennomenno Posts: 854member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FreeRange View Post


    Hey Menno - go FK yourself! Daniel hit the nail on the head and you have no clue what you are talking about. The fact of the matter is that it is the techtards that are gravitating to Android and are trying to beat the system and steal the content. Your description of what has been going on exactly reinforces that point. Who are you a paid shill for anyway?



    Oh really? So if I made a post and posted it on "android insider" about how the iphone can't multi-task and has a low resolution screen, I would be hitting the nail on the head even though I completely missed the apple announcement that addressed the very things I was talking about?



    He is talking about android app security, but misses the latest news about... wait for it... ANDROID APP SECURITY. The update Google announced DIRECTLY addresses the issue Daniel mentioned and was literally on every android blog and most tech blogs over a week ago.



    He also said that apple gets around this by having app purchases linked to an itunes id.. how do you think paid apps are tracked in the marketplace?



    If I am a paid shill, you're Steve Jobs. I'm an android, and macOSX user who's getting sick and tired of having AI android-trash "news" posts show up in my Android News RSS feed instead of them writing about the company that's in their name. This is APPLE INSIDER. Not "we bash anything but apple" insider. How long will it be before they report on the apple news that happened today (I'll give you a hint, it's about the dangers of the new jailbreaking exploit)



    The guy saw a potential smear campaign against android and he jumped for it without even doing a google/bing/whatever search to make sure he had the most accurate information. His article was poorly researched, has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with this website's theme, and completely omits data to make their point.
  • Reply 83 of 217
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 6,110member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Menno View Post


    Oh really? So if I made a post and posted it on "android insider" about how the iphone can't multi-task and has a low resolution screen, I would be hitting the nail on the head even though I completely missed the apple announcement that addressed the very things I was talking about?



    He is talking about android app security, but misses the latest news about... wait for it... ANDROID APP SECURITY. The update Google announced DIRECTLY addresses the issue Daniel mentioned and was literally on every android blog and most tech blogs over a week ago.



    He also said that apple gets around this by having app purchases linked to an itunes id.. how do you think paid apps are tracked in the marketplace?



    If I am a paid shill, you're Steve Jobs. I'm an android, and macOSX user who's getting sick and tired of having AI android-trash "news" posts show up in my Android News RSS feed instead of them writing about the company that's in their name. This is APPLE INSIDER. Not "we bash anything but apple" insider. How long will it be before they report on the apple news that happened today (I'll give you a hint, it's about the dangers of the new jailbreaking exploit)



    The guy saw a potential smear campaign against android and he jumped for it without even doing a google/bing/whatever search to make sure he had the most accurate information. His article was poorly researched, has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with this website's theme, and completely omits data to make their point.



    Well Menno, as a very happy iP4 owner, and Mac fan, I have to say that I'm a bit humbled by your point of view. Well said. Certainly gave me a different perspective.



    It seriously irritates me that the the X-haters (on BOTH sides) have turned this into some kind of mob-scene where there has to be one winner. You want your Android RSS-feeds "clean", well I would like the same for my Apple-feeds too. There are just as many Apple fanboys that are as guilty as the Phandroids in displaying absolute child-like behavior. I blame the media on both sides for flaming this to be some kind of holy-war and spinning their stories to further their propoganda cause. It seriously sickens me.



    On a more positive note, here we are in what is basically a wireless revolution. I believe there should be gratitude to Apple for successfully throwing a crowbar into the stodgy machinery called the "wireless industry" and opening up a new field for other players. I'm very impressed with the race-car pace of innovation going on from both sides.



    But like some sports, these forums are infested (on both sides) by the sports-version of "Hooligans" that take it too far.



    So I do side with you. I want my news unbiased and given as simple news. I long for those days. Unfortunately, the media salivates and the quick-and-easy web-hits to bring in the crowds. Sadly, I don't see that changing any time soon.
  • Reply 84 of 217
    shadashshadash Posts: 470member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Excellent platform for whom? The average consumer? I don?t think so. For tinkering youth it seems great but so is a jailbroken iOS device and other platforms.



    Case in point, I was asked just today for an Android app that would facilitate moving pics from the phone to a PC. I?d expect it to built in feature but the fact that it?s not simple enough that I was even asked is telling.



    So Android has some major issues. It?s not acceptable for corporate use nor consumer friendly like other mobile OSes that are designed by vendors, and now you say its greatest asset, being a modern App Phone, is the weakest part of the entire Android setup when i thought it was the strongest thing it had going for it. That pretty much makes it?s use and popularity based on the fact that it?s free.



    Android's popularity is based primarily on one thing - it is on Verizon and iOS devices aren't. And I don't think you can say Android is consumer friendly with 800+ percent growth. Consumers have adapted to the mess that is Windows. Comparatively Android is a piece of cake.
  • Reply 85 of 217
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post


    Jailbreaking has a legitamate place. The android term ("becomming root?") is more appropriate to what most people want to do-- increase their control over the look, feel, and function of the device. There is nothing wrong with these goals, and it should be officially encouraged. (It will never be a dominant part of the population.)



    Other activities, such as SIM unlocks, pirating of games, unfettered application control, etc., are considerably less cut and dry. Then the aspect of Apple's control over the platform comes in. How would we feel if Adobe started contributing to the Dev Team, and made a Flash app repository? If there is Flash on the iPhone, web applications have less pressure on them to improve platform independence. Is that good or bad..?



    The thing is, once you jailbreak, it is an absolutely trivial matter to go from that to app piracy. It's literally a few taps away once you jailbreak.



    I appreciate jailbreaking and the non-pirating uses of that, that's cool. Just that the temptation to just whack in you-know-what-Stallous and access all the apps for free, is one big temptation.



    Jailbreaking is a gateway drug, in that sense. For better or worse...? I don't know.
  • Reply 86 of 217
    bsenkabsenka Posts: 801member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Menno View Post


    actually they don't. most people who pirate do so to avoid paying. And those albums would be popular without pirating. they were pirated because those people wanted popular albums



    It's been well documented that people who pirate buy more music than people who don't.



    You should do some reading:



    http://boingboing.net/2007/11/02/p2p...uy-more-m.html

    http://techgeist.net/2009/04/why-pir...es-its-a-fact/

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009...buy-more-music

    http://www.tomsguide.com/us/Pirate-F...news-5001.html

    http://boingboing.net/2009/11/01/hea...al-downlo.html
  • Reply 87 of 217
    Quote:

    In addition to its limited reach globally, Google's Android Market has also come under assault from top Android developers for allowing widespread copyright infringement, sloppy policies regarding app approval, poor security for users' data, and allowing developers to collect inappropriate information from users without their consent.



    The above paragraph, from the original article by DED, contains 3 links. The 2nd and 3rd links are to other articles by DED. They, in turn, contain links to other articles by... wait for it... DED (or his alias Prince McClean). Each article has DED's own unique style of reporting.





    Daisy chain, anyone?



    .
  • Reply 88 of 217
    ckh1272ckh1272 Posts: 107member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Menno View Post


    You keep posting the same trash time and time again.



    Find another tune to sing.



    The android market is hard to monetize on a consumer end as well. It's NOT all users. Seriously. Yes, there are a lot of cheapskates, but what percentage of downloads from the app store (discounting music and movies) are free? People are cheapskates.



    The primary issue with paid apps on the market is the market application itself. It's VERY hard to find quality paid applications unless you know specifically what you're looking for. This is one of the reasons blogs go out of their way to post QR codes for every app they review.





    You slam the user for singing the same old song, but the song is still relevant. It shows (clear as day) that most Android users go for the free stuff, which does lend credence to the piracy angle. Notice as well, that those numbers are provided from AdMob, who (as we all know) is owned by Google. There is no slant to be had when it is as plain as day. The fact that you don't see it or you want to dismiss it, doesn't mean that it is not valid. As far as the Android articles go, it is relevant to this site since that is part of Apple's competition. Just like when I see Apple related articles on an Android site. They are relevant to each other.
  • Reply 89 of 217
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,924member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    ... So Android has some major issues. It?s not acceptable for corporate use nor consumer friendly like other mobile OSes that are designed by vendors, and now you say its greatest asset, being a modern App Phone, is the weakest part of the entire Android setup when i thought it was the strongest thing it had going for it. That pretty much makes it?s use and popularity based on the fact that it?s free.



    Well, why should it be different than anything else Google does? Actually, I don't think 'free' is accurate. I'm pretty sure that Google pays handset makers, and maybe carriers, to use Android.
  • Reply 90 of 217
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,924member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chopper View Post


    ... The Android platform is measured by the number of HW devices running Android. The iPhone platform is measured by the number of iPhones running iOS. Quite simple really...



    Interesting discrepancy here. So, for Android, we count 'devices', but for iOS (that's the platform name) we only count iPhones? Why don't we count iOS 'devices'? We are after all talking about developer issues here, not carrier wars, or something where it matters whether a 'device' is a phone or not.
  • Reply 91 of 217
    Android has only been around for a fraction of the time the iPhone has been around, and look how much market share they've already taken in that short amount of time.



    Does their app store have some problems? Sure, and so does Apple's. But again, Android has only been around as a serious smart phone contender for a fraction of the amount of time that the iPhone has been around.



    Give it more time and they'll fix things. This article is just pointing out a problem at a specific point in time, it doesn't mean the death of Android by any means.



    Do you really think Google doesn't know about this issue? They're constantly making improvements to their OS and its entire environment. It's just going to get better and better, and has the potential to be just as big as if not bigger than anything else. But then again, it also has a chance NOT to. You just don't know what's going to happen, you can't fortell the future.



    But while these articles are informative a lot of you take them to mean "Well, Android will never be as good as Apple, ha ha!" If you think this way you're a fool.
  • Reply 92 of 217
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,924member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jbelkin View Post


    Google is ONLY interested in shoveling out as many android licesnses as possible to get the Google search bar out there - beyond that, they don't care, does it matter that every Android phoen has a different OS & OS face? Is the Google search bar working? DONE. People grabbing your personal info? Sure, we'll remotely shut them down AFTERWARDS ... hey, you're running a free Linux OS - you get what you pay for.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Menno View Post


    Maybe you should actually pick up and android phone, or at least read about it from someone who knows what android does (aka, not this site) before you shove your other foot in your mouth.



    Yeah, he has no idea what he's talking about. Google uses Android to spy on you in all sorts of ways, not just search!
  • Reply 93 of 217
    It's a good article I think. I certainly enjoyed reading it and it confirmed my suspicions.



    Google don't care about anyone else making money. If anything they want everything to be free, or rather paid for by their advertising. I.e., they make the money and no-one else does.



    Seems to me you'd have to be mad to invest in an Android app.



    I think we'll see the real quality stuff coming out on the Apple platform, with everyone else drowning in a sea of mediocre home-made apps.



    I'd be tempted to have a look at Android but it looks too messy to me and it's not going to pay the bills.
  • Reply 94 of 217
    rindrind Posts: 66member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Menno View Post


    So you make a post about this...



    But you completely ignore the post what? a WEEK ago? Where Google created a new anti-piracy measure (free for devs) for their apps, allowing them to "sign" them, and have those purchases checked against Android Market Records. Seriously, if you're going to report about android piracy, at least report what android is doing to prevent it.



    Seriously, this is an APPLE BLOG. Stop posting about stuff not apple as 1) it has nothing to do with your products 2) you arn't taking the time to research the content, so you're making yourself look bad.



    And Android apps have ALWAYS been linked to their gmail/google checkout account. The reason why piracy (up till now) was so easy for android was because of Google return policy, and the ability of android phones to install third party applications via sideloading. So an asshole could purchase an app on a phone, use a program like astro to "back it up." and then refund the purchase and install from the backup.



    They then take the .apk (the app) and upload it to a warez site for others to install the same way.



    This is negated by the new measure, which gives app authors the ability to make the app check the store at given intervals to make sure the Google account it's running on actually has a purchased version of the app.



    If you're going to post a story, actually post a story. Don't just find the worst tidbit and harp on that while ignoring the actions ALREADY TAKEN to try and close the exploit you're talking on.



    Please , Go to the Android Sites. Tell them the same thing.

    Tell them to stop posting about the iPhone and completely ignoring the truth.

    A few examples are below:

    Phandroid

    ancroidcentral

    droidforums.net



    The Phone bashing is really getting out of control its sad that people just read

    something on a forum and dont look at the device themselves.

    I am using an iPhone 3G now but migrating to a Droid X simply becuase we are moving to Verizon.

    Im really Hoping the iPhone makes its way to Verizon.
  • Reply 95 of 217
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,787member
    I'd say to those that are critical of 'anti Android articles' (their terminology not mine ... and various other products we love to hate) need to remember as with Windows, Apple enthusiasts have a totally legitimate right to by critical of and poke fun at things that are total rip off of Apple products but fail in so many ways. No iPod no Zune and the same will apply to any new Microsoft 'Slate" aka rip off of iPad. Had there been no Mac OS there would be no Winblows, had there been no iPhone there would be no Android and we all know what a heap of crap MS had planned for their tablet, so bad even they scrapped it. There is no negative mention of products that are original on AI be they good or bad but anything simply copied from Apple is totally fair game and in context IMHO. Heck even movies made by Pixar were copied asap by rival film studios. I can't imagine what a boring world this would be without good old Steve. So keep the articles like this coming they help offset the annoyance at the rip off merchants that dilute AAPL. (Please spare me the "AAAPL benefits from the competition" line)
  • Reply 96 of 217
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member


    I've done lots of reading. Now you should do some thinking.



    Those figures are irrelevant. All they show is that the same people who steal music are (as a group) the same people who buy CDs. So younger people are the ones who buy CDs and also the ones who steal CDs. BFD.



    It says nothing about how many CDs those people would be buying if they DIDN'T steal.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bangtickboom View Post


    Android has only been around for a fraction of the time the iPhone has been around, and look how much market share they've already taken in that short amount of time.



    That's true. The fraction is about 9/10.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Soulbearer View Post


    Don't forget this apple forum site; we have to help apple and comment about how apple products are just better. It really doesn't matter the Android is becoming better or more attractive choice or if it keeps growing in market share.

    That's what the author of this post is doing. This is not an objective discussion.

    ?The IPhone 4 is the best phone?



    That's absolutely untrue. Reasoned discussion is welcome. Just not the mindless, shrill "Apple sux" nonsense that most of the trolls here spew.
  • Reply 97 of 217
    irnchrizirnchriz Posts: 1,617member
    Google don't care about its android store. They don't care about charging anyone for the Android license.





    What do they care about? They want millions of devices running their OS so that they can feed those millions adverts and data mine those users and sell their data.
  • Reply 98 of 217
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Menno View Post


    Actually he's not informed. He missed a key release about android app security (that works for all OS releases out there right now) that addresses the piracy issue.



    And we're not talking about those other articles, because those articles are invariably on an android centric site. this is an APPLE site, why do they continuously post crap about android?



    to see what this site is saying about Android - and then take issue with?
  • Reply 99 of 217
    dmarcootdmarcoot Posts: 191member
    This reminds me of a cool game for iOS ?Epic Win? which is yet to be released within weeks. Of course Android users want it on their Android phones, but from their posts to developers website, it is clear me to they don?t want to PAY for anything. More than half of them say make it a free web app.



    This is the problem Android faces, users who are happier stealing content, or simply don?t want to pay for anything. I believe it is a cultural, generational problem and I think it beyond Googles ability to solve.
  • Reply 100 of 217
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post


    I'm wondering why DED is talking so much about Android piracy instead of trying to focus on how Apple's security was breached to allow the jailbreak exploit.



    John Gruber has some musings from Charlie Miller on the subject:







    http://daringfireball.net/linked/2010/08/02/jailbreakme



    according to the latest posting - perhaps Flash isn't the only "bag of hurt" that Adobe creates for the mobile platforms.
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