For all Google's apparent benevolence, they are only after 1 thing...everything there is to know about you...so that they can push advertising and either directly or indirectly sell your personal information. Period.
Every little app and/or tool that Google shares provides them a little more information about you, what you are interested in (Google search), who you communicate with (gmail, googletalk, android, etc) and what you say, what you buy (google checkout), where you live (google maps), what you do for a living (google docs), what you and your friends look like (Picasa web albums), what amuses you (YouTube), etc., etc., etc. Go to the Google home page and Google labs and open your brain a little and you can imagine all the different ways that Google gathers information about you.
Personally, although a devout Apple enthusiast, if forced to make a choice other than Apple, I'd take Microsoft over Google any day.
I agree totally, JD. I mentioned this on a previous topic:
You guys should check out the free App "Ghostery." It blocks all this data mining crap including Google Analytics and Google Adsense! It was recommended by MacWorld last week! http://www.ghostery.com/
On a laptop people expect a complete OS not a browser. They really should've just focused on Android. Google is just throwing spaghetti on the wall to see what sticks at this point.
Schools aren't just going to switch over. That costs a ton of money and training. When administrators realize how little features are available to them, they won't consider it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by guch20
Jesus, Google is going after schools now too? They're just attacking Apple on all fronts and with their momentum, I don't see how they can be stopped.
I agree totally, JD. I mentioned this on a previous topic:
You guys should check out the free App "Ghostery." It blocks all this data mining crap including Google Analytics and Google Adsense! It was recommended by MacWorld last week! http://www.macworld.com/article/1596...extension.html
For all Google's apparent benevolence, they are only after 1 thing...everything there is to know about you...so that they can push advertising and either directly or indirectly sell your personal information. Period.
Of course they are. That's what their business is built on. Nearly every company is after maximized profits. Apple's comes from a closed loop of hardware/software/applications. Microsoft's from software and services, with a bit of Xbox hardware throw in. And Google makes it's living from advertising.
4) What do you get that is worth a $20 month subscription?
5) Is a carrier contract or additional monthly charge for cell access?
How does this compete with an iPad at $499 (no subscription, no contract, month-by-month cell)
It might make sense in it were offered a package (hardware, software, subscription, cell data) for, say $20 up front and a 23 month contract at $20/month.
Thanks for the extension. Appears to be working fine in Safari in Lion.
You're welcome, solipsism! I have it working in Safari SL and have had no problems....a little purple bubble shows up with all the tracking software listed, but "lined-out!" Pretty cool.
I agree totally, JD. I mentioned this on a previous topic:
You guys should check out the free App "Ghostery." It blocks all this data mining crap including Google Analytics and Google Adsense! It was recommended by MacWorld last week! http://www.ghostery.com/
It's really sad when people let their inner fanboy blind them from technological advances.
Solipsism got it right. He sees the value in this.
As do I. For the average high schooler or non-science/engineering student, what is the need for a laptop that costs on average $500-%700...or if you go Apple, closer to $1000? Do they really need that kind of processing or graphics power to surf the web, write essays and check Facebook? And then there's the cost of all the Office software you have to buy. You're never spending just $500.
Tablets are not a decent solution. Nobody is going to sit down and work on an essay for hours on an iPad. The iPad is also severely limited by onboard storage.
Now bring in a thin client connected to the cloud. It's perfect for any student that doesn't have to do CAD or graphics work. No need for MS Office. Just work off Google Docs. And given that many universities are now switching their e-mail systems over to Google (Google Apps), and given that most campuses have great wifi, the next logical step is to deploy these kinds of thin clients.
And even better if Google is offering a total solution for hardware and software and if they will manage it all for $20 per month. It's an attractive proposition for universities. Costs are low. Capital budgets are preserved. And Google manages the whole thing for them.
As for competition with Apple. It's not the same thing. Apple sells computers to schools and students. They haven't cared much for actually taking the whole responsibility for IT, out of the hands of university CIOs.
It might take off. It might not. Too early to tell. But I don't think the idea should be dismissed off-hand just because it came from Google.
4) What do you get that is worth a $20 month subscription?
5) Is a carrier contract or additional monthly charge for cell access?
[6)] How does this compete with an iPad at $499 (no subscription, no contract, month-by-month cell)
It might make sense in it were offered a package (hardware, software, subscription, cell data) for, say $20 up front and a 23 month contract at $20/month.
Otherwise... I must really be missing somethin'
1) Both.
2) Raw computing power, it’s not. But since it’s an OS designed for Atom and ARM — much like iOS is ideal for ARM’s performance but Mac OS is not — the tasks it’s designed for could work very well, just like Safari on iOS/ARM as opposed to running Safari on Windows XP on an Atom netbook which has much more raw performance than an ARM CPU.
3) They are notebooks, which means a clamshell with a keyboard and trackpad where the screen is vertically placed when open. There is no reason you can’t put ARM CPUs in a notebook form. We even have Atom CPUs in a tablets.
4) I believe you get the device, services and support for that price. Whether that is month-to-month, part of a single or bulk contract I don’t know.
5) I doubt that would include any 3G service for that price when a smartphone is $30/month just fo unlimited internet access.
6) To be clear, the iPad with month-to-month cellular starts at $629. For $499 the iPad is a great deal and for many users a Chrome OS device couldn’t possibly replace their iPad as their chosen satellite computer. But it does have its place. If you are running a workshop where you need to control the access to the LAN for a seminar where there will be plenty of typing I don’t think a tablet with a docking station and keyboard are going to cut it.. and will be pricer.
For schools they can rent these for 9 months of the year and don’t have to buy any additional components to make them work. Students can type reports on these things and they can use it for listening to music, downloading files, and even reading/copying files from/to a HDD via USB. The iPad can’t do that and therefore wouldn’t be a suitable replacement for such activities.
But I ask why are people comparing this to the iPad or Apple? Why aren’t you looking at its intended target, cheap as Windows machines where Apple doesn’t play. We can’t assume that a poor family in a poor country should get an iPad over renting a computer on the cheap from their ISP. The emerging market arena is vast and this has great potential. I want the whole world connected but that isn’t going to happen with a premium product.
Remember, WebOS is pretty much the same thing for a smartphone. It’s a Linux kernel with an OS UI made from WebKit.
PS: I’ve been a fan of Chrome OS since the beginning. I hoped that Google’s I/O on it today would get more posters here seeing what I see but i guess we’ll have to wait another day on that.
Schools aren't just going to switch over. That costs a ton of money and training. When administrators realize how little features are available to them, they won't consider it.
I'd argue that schools will switch over, precisely because they'll figure out they've been buying computing power they don't need. Why does a high school or elementary student or even a non-science/engineering college student need a laptop with the latest processor, graphics card and stuffed to the gills with RAM?
I don't think the subscription model has ever worked for computers. First thing that comes to mind is all the predator companies that try to sell computers on credit.
Is there really any motivation to buy software for this if you will lose it if google decides to cancel the service (because it flops) or if you need to pay a monthly charge to use your own software?
I can really only see this working if the service and hardware were separate and if most services were free.
this is a real threat to Windows/Office Home Edition in the low-end consumer market. and that is a big deal by itself. assuming it works well and is not just another Google beta product. it is a huge threat to MS if Google can also offer an effective replacement to Exchange. we'll see.
but no clamshell product is a threat to any tablet, including the iPad. different markets. except for education, but even then entertainment use at home is a factor. you don't want to use a clamshell while sitting on the sofa. neither do your kids.
but i suppose some kind of hybrid Android/Chrome tablet might be possible in the next year. we'll see.
for Apple and other brands' laptops, users who require powerful, specialized, or enterprise applications will not be interested in Chrome (until it can do all that too). these users are less price sensitive. they are probably most of the laptop Mac market, tho much less so for the other OEM's.
a question for Apple is how much of iOS to merge into OS X Lion. iOS apps, being a combination of local and web, are are much more powerful than just websites. some would work well on a touchpad laptop/desktop too, others would not. we'll see about that next month at WWDC.
I'd argue that schools will switch over, precisely because they'll figure out they've been buying computing power they don't need. Why does a high school or elementary student or even a non-science/engineering college student need a laptop with the latest processor, graphics card and stuffed to the gills with RAM?
Yep I agree with this. I think it's a good gamble by Google. I wonder how much people are willing ot have google tracking everything they do and say.
Woah, guys, this isn't meant to be competing against iPads. It's barely competing against Netbooks. The two Chromebooks being released both have full sized keyboards like the Macbook Air.
This is competing against all the crappy XP computers out there that are being given out by businesses or schools which people use almost entirely just for the web browser. Have you ever worked in a call centre or been a sales rep? 9 times out of 10 you are working with web based forms that input into the company database. Few businesses are going to hand out iPads which don't have a physical keyboard.
Most companies lease these computers anyway. For $28 / $20 a month per seat a company can distribute a fleet of these Chrome books. Even if there is internet down time and a file has not been cached on the computer (Which Google Docs and gmail do on Chrome OS), this is more than made up for by the lack of down time from Viruses, software updates and broken Hardware.
If a Chromebook breaks down, all IT has to do is swap the hardware over and the employee just logs into their account and they pick up from where they left off.
$28 per seat for businesses or $20 for schools is insanely cheap compared to the costs of running a Windows fleet of computers. Microsoft is crapping themselves.
I'd argue that schools will switch over, precisely because they'll figure out they've been buying computing power they don't need. Why does a high school or elementary student or even a non-science/engineering college student need a laptop with the latest processor, graphics card and stuffed to the gills with RAM?
I?d argue the training is limited since it?s the most used app in the world, the web browser. Chrome browser, Google docs, etc. can even be practiced and accessed from other devices.
You can use this device offline.
You can copy files to a HDD/USB stick.
You can read files from a HDD/USB stick.
I bet the WebKit version will also render Apple and MS? online versions of iWork and Office just fine, too.
PS: This does make Google?s music storage more useful. I?ve wondered if Apple will make a complete WebKit-based version of iTunes for users to access their digital iTunes lockers. I think it would be remiss not to have that as perfectly represented as they have done to Mail for iPad and Mail for me.com.
All out of the goodness of their little black hearts...
The idea is fine although limited in capability because it all relies on a limited bandwidth limited data capacity pipe. The question is, are you willing to sell your soul to google (whether you consciously acknowledge it or not...)? Again, there is no such thing as a free lunch. Where is google going to extract it's pound of flesh? How does google make this attractive to google's shareholders?
Comments
For all Google's apparent benevolence, they are only after 1 thing...everything there is to know about you...so that they can push advertising and either directly or indirectly sell your personal information. Period.
Every little app and/or tool that Google shares provides them a little more information about you, what you are interested in (Google search), who you communicate with (gmail, googletalk, android, etc) and what you say, what you buy (google checkout), where you live (google maps), what you do for a living (google docs), what you and your friends look like (Picasa web albums), what amuses you (YouTube), etc., etc., etc. Go to the Google home page and Google labs and open your brain a little and you can imagine all the different ways that Google gathers information about you.
Personally, although a devout Apple enthusiast, if forced to make a choice other than Apple, I'd take Microsoft over Google any day.
I agree totally, JD. I mentioned this on a previous topic:
You guys should check out the free App "Ghostery." It blocks all this data mining crap including Google Analytics and Google Adsense! It was recommended by MacWorld last week! http://www.ghostery.com/
PS. No Affiliation: Just like the App.
Best
Jesus, Google is going after schools now too? They're just attacking Apple on all fronts and with their momentum, I don't see how they can be stopped.
I agree totally, JD. I mentioned this on a previous topic:
You guys should check out the free App "Ghostery." It blocks all this data mining crap including Google Analytics and Google Adsense! It was recommended by MacWorld last week! http://www.macworld.com/article/1596...extension.html
PS. No Affiliation: Just like the App.
Best
Your link is busted.
Here is the direct link to their site: http://www.ghostery.com/
Nice that they cover all major web browsers.
For all Google's apparent benevolence, they are only after 1 thing...everything there is to know about you...so that they can push advertising and either directly or indirectly sell your personal information. Period.
Of course they are. That's what their business is built on. Nearly every company is after maximized profits. Apple's comes from a closed loop of hardware/software/applications. Microsoft's from software and services, with a bit of Xbox hardware throw in. And Google makes it's living from advertising.
Your link is busted.
Here is the direct link to their site: http://www.ghostery.com/
Nice that they cover all major web browsers.
Drats! Thanks Solipsism!
Drats! Thanks Solipsism!
Thanks for the extension. Appears to be working fine in Safari in Lion.
1) Does it run an Atom chip or an ARM chip?
2) If Atom, how is it different from a netbook?
3) If ARM how is it different from a tablet?
4) What do you get that is worth a $20 month subscription?
5) Is a carrier contract or additional monthly charge for cell access?
How does this compete with an iPad at $499 (no subscription, no contract, month-by-month cell)
It might make sense in it were offered a package (hardware, software, subscription, cell data) for, say $20 up front and a 23 month contract at $20/month.
Otherwise... I must really be missing somethin'
Thanks for the extension. Appears to be working fine in Safari in Lion.
You're welcome, solipsism! I have it working in Safari SL and have had no problems....a little purple bubble shows up with all the tracking software listed, but "lined-out!" Pretty cool.
AAPL down .63%
GOOG down 1.50%
in a down market
I agree totally, JD. I mentioned this on a previous topic:
You guys should check out the free App "Ghostery." It blocks all this data mining crap including Google Analytics and Google Adsense! It was recommended by MacWorld last week! http://www.ghostery.com/
PS. No Affiliation: Just like the App.
Best
Nice. Thanks!
Solipsism got it right. He sees the value in this.
As do I. For the average high schooler or non-science/engineering student, what is the need for a laptop that costs on average $500-%700...or if you go Apple, closer to $1000? Do they really need that kind of processing or graphics power to surf the web, write essays and check Facebook? And then there's the cost of all the Office software you have to buy. You're never spending just $500.
Tablets are not a decent solution. Nobody is going to sit down and work on an essay for hours on an iPad. The iPad is also severely limited by onboard storage.
Now bring in a thin client connected to the cloud. It's perfect for any student that doesn't have to do CAD or graphics work. No need for MS Office. Just work off Google Docs. And given that many universities are now switching their e-mail systems over to Google (Google Apps), and given that most campuses have great wifi, the next logical step is to deploy these kinds of thin clients.
And even better if Google is offering a total solution for hardware and software and if they will manage it all for $20 per month. It's an attractive proposition for universities. Costs are low. Capital budgets are preserved. And Google manages the whole thing for them.
As for competition with Apple. It's not the same thing. Apple sells computers to schools and students. They haven't cared much for actually taking the whole responsibility for IT, out of the hands of university CIOs.
It might take off. It might not. Too early to tell. But I don't think the idea should be dismissed off-hand just because it came from Google.
I don't think I understand.
1) Does it run an Atom chip or an ARM chip?
2) If Atom, how is it different from a netbook?
3) If ARM how is it different from a tablet?
4) What do you get that is worth a $20 month subscription?
5) Is a carrier contract or additional monthly charge for cell access?
[6)] How does this compete with an iPad at $499 (no subscription, no contract, month-by-month cell)
It might make sense in it were offered a package (hardware, software, subscription, cell data) for, say $20 up front and a 23 month contract at $20/month.
Otherwise... I must really be missing somethin'
1) Both.
2) Raw computing power, it’s not. But since it’s an OS designed for Atom and ARM — much like iOS is ideal for ARM’s performance but Mac OS is not — the tasks it’s designed for could work very well, just like Safari on iOS/ARM as opposed to running Safari on Windows XP on an Atom netbook which has much more raw performance than an ARM CPU.
3) They are notebooks, which means a clamshell with a keyboard and trackpad where the screen is vertically placed when open. There is no reason you can’t put ARM CPUs in a notebook form. We even have Atom CPUs in a tablets.
4) I believe you get the device, services and support for that price. Whether that is month-to-month, part of a single or bulk contract I don’t know.
5) I doubt that would include any 3G service for that price when a smartphone is $30/month just fo unlimited internet access.
6) To be clear, the iPad with month-to-month cellular starts at $629. For $499 the iPad is a great deal and for many users a Chrome OS device couldn’t possibly replace their iPad as their chosen satellite computer. But it does have its place. If you are running a workshop where you need to control the access to the LAN for a seminar where there will be plenty of typing I don’t think a tablet with a docking station and keyboard are going to cut it.. and will be pricer.
For schools they can rent these for 9 months of the year and don’t have to buy any additional components to make them work. Students can type reports on these things and they can use it for listening to music, downloading files, and even reading/copying files from/to a HDD via USB. The iPad can’t do that and therefore wouldn’t be a suitable replacement for such activities.
But I ask why are people comparing this to the iPad or Apple? Why aren’t you looking at its intended target, cheap as Windows machines where Apple doesn’t play. We can’t assume that a poor family in a poor country should get an iPad over renting a computer on the cheap from their ISP. The emerging market arena is vast and this has great potential. I want the whole world connected but that isn’t going to happen with a premium product.
Remember, WebOS is pretty much the same thing for a smartphone. It’s a Linux kernel with an OS UI made from WebKit.
PS: I’ve been a fan of Chrome OS since the beginning. I hoped that Google’s I/O on it today would get more posters here seeing what I see but i guess we’ll have to wait another day on that.
Schools aren't just going to switch over. That costs a ton of money and training. When administrators realize how little features are available to them, they won't consider it.
I'd argue that schools will switch over, precisely because they'll figure out they've been buying computing power they don't need. Why does a high school or elementary student or even a non-science/engineering college student need a laptop with the latest processor, graphics card and stuffed to the gills with RAM?
Is there really any motivation to buy software for this if you will lose it if google decides to cancel the service (because it flops) or if you need to pay a monthly charge to use your own software?
I can really only see this working if the service and hardware were separate and if most services were free.
but no clamshell product is a threat to any tablet, including the iPad. different markets. except for education, but even then entertainment use at home is a factor. you don't want to use a clamshell while sitting on the sofa. neither do your kids.
but i suppose some kind of hybrid Android/Chrome tablet might be possible in the next year. we'll see.
for Apple and other brands' laptops, users who require powerful, specialized, or enterprise applications will not be interested in Chrome (until it can do all that too). these users are less price sensitive. they are probably most of the laptop Mac market, tho much less so for the other OEM's.
a question for Apple is how much of iOS to merge into OS X Lion. iOS apps, being a combination of local and web, are are much more powerful than just websites. some would work well on a touchpad laptop/desktop too, others would not. we'll see about that next month at WWDC.
I'd argue that schools will switch over, precisely because they'll figure out they've been buying computing power they don't need. Why does a high school or elementary student or even a non-science/engineering college student need a laptop with the latest processor, graphics card and stuffed to the gills with RAM?
Yep I agree with this. I think it's a good gamble by Google. I wonder how much people are willing ot have google tracking everything they do and say.
This is competing against all the crappy XP computers out there that are being given out by businesses or schools which people use almost entirely just for the web browser. Have you ever worked in a call centre or been a sales rep? 9 times out of 10 you are working with web based forms that input into the company database. Few businesses are going to hand out iPads which don't have a physical keyboard.
Most companies lease these computers anyway. For $28 / $20 a month per seat a company can distribute a fleet of these Chrome books. Even if there is internet down time and a file has not been cached on the computer (Which Google Docs and gmail do on Chrome OS), this is more than made up for by the lack of down time from Viruses, software updates and broken Hardware.
If a Chromebook breaks down, all IT has to do is swap the hardware over and the employee just logs into their account and they pick up from where they left off.
$28 per seat for businesses or $20 for schools is insanely cheap compared to the costs of running a Windows fleet of computers. Microsoft is crapping themselves.
I'd argue that schools will switch over, precisely because they'll figure out they've been buying computing power they don't need. Why does a high school or elementary student or even a non-science/engineering college student need a laptop with the latest processor, graphics card and stuffed to the gills with RAM?
I?d argue the training is limited since it?s the most used app in the world, the web browser. Chrome browser, Google docs, etc. can even be practiced and accessed from other devices.
You can use this device offline.
You can copy files to a HDD/USB stick.
You can read files from a HDD/USB stick.
I bet the WebKit version will also render Apple and MS? online versions of iWork and Office just fine, too.
PS: This does make Google?s music storage more useful. I?ve wondered if Apple will make a complete WebKit-based version of iTunes for users to access their digital iTunes lockers. I think it would be remiss not to have that as perfectly represented as they have done to Mail for iPad and Mail for me.com.
The idea is fine although limited in capability because it all relies on a limited bandwidth limited data capacity pipe. The question is, are you willing to sell your soul to google (whether you consciously acknowledge it or not...)? Again, there is no such thing as a free lunch. Where is google going to extract it's pound of flesh? How does google make this attractive to google's shareholders?