keep in mind from what the videos show to come up with some info you have to have apps like yelp installed. so you have the siri stuff doing its thing while bringing up the other app to do its thing. I am betting it is using the dual core more of apple being lazy then anything else.
ON my iPhone 4 i cannot listen to music on the iPod app while downloading songs from iTunes app . (the music stops every time a song finishes downloading and goes to processing. I am thinking that sure requires probably more cpu time and apple rather just sperate the siri and 3rd party apps on their own cores then actually making it to run on the 4.
Like i said I think its more of a lazy developer thing .
keep in mind from what the videos show to come up with some info you have to have apps like yelp installed. so you have the siri stuff doing its thing while bringing up the other app to do its thing. I am betting it is using the dual core more of apple being lazy then anything else.
ON my iPhone 4 i cannot listen to music on the iPod app while downloading songs from iTunes app . (the music stops every time a song finishes downloading and goes to processing. I am thinking that sure requires probably more cpu time and apple rather just sperate the siri and 3rd party apps on their own cores then actually making it to run on the 4.
Like i said I think its more of a lazy developer thing .
With playing music and downloading songs it quits because you are writing to the music storage area. That doesn't have anything to do with the A4, or the A5. It's been this way since the very first iOS device. I have a jailbroken iPhone that allows me to use the phone while it's syncing to iTunes and I can't view pictures while putting photo albums onto it. The app won't open or it says "rebuilding library, please wait." It force closes the photos/iPod apps until it's done syncing and even then you have to restart the photos\\iPos apps after it's done. That's true of any Apple app that syncs data to the phone. The photos/iPod apps do this every time you sync content to it, the icon is greyed out when you disconnect and open the multitasking drawer. That's a read/write issue and all computers do this to some extent. You can't write firmware or other critical software updates in OS X while it's running either, you have to restart and it updates it then. That's also why a non-jailbroken iPhone locks the screen while syncing. All of that behavior prevents the user from terminating the process mid-write and corrupting the data, not Apple being lazy.
I think Siri is amazing, especially if it works as smooth as the demo, but touting this as helping the blind, on a touchscreen device, is a bit much don't you think? For drivers it will help immensely since more and more states are making it illegal to physically hold your phone while driving. Helping the blind? A bit of a stretch.
Interesting how the trolls never learn. The same arguments every time Apple release new iProduct and specially iPhone. Every year we hear "didn't live to the hype", "greedy Apple limiting x feature to new iPhone", "only fanboys will upgrade".. etc.
I have news for you. Saying these things will not make them come true. Maybe in your mind they are true but reality is something else.
This may have more to do about the scope of Siri context for searches services. A design assumption may have been made that the search context assumes you are always connected. This way, Siri does not need to burden itself with carefully limiting its search service scope to only local resources in case the device is offline.
It works over wifi and 3G, there's always a connection. Unless you are on AT&T of course. There's nothing mentioned that 3G restricts it's ability to function because 3G is connected to the internet and through clever tunneling it could easily connect quickly to Apple servers. I just don't think they'd build servers to make an app work if they weren't going to keep them. Even in a short term. He also said it's in beta specifically so they can test and add new languages, not because they could offload the work onto the phone itself. But that doesn't mean they won't of course. If Apple is going to invest in server support for this feature that tells me it's required. Apple doesn't spend money frivolously.
sorry, but I disagree. AI is key technology in Siri.. Translation is not in Siri's domain.
Siri figures out your true intention from random text that gets passed to it by some external STT translation engine like Nuance or Apple STT legacy Mac OS engine.. Its not about matching against pre-determined phrases.
for your reference below:. Differentiation and complementation between TTS and SST translation (Nuance licensing) and AI interpretation of textual input (Siri) in iOS5.
to my ear in today's demo it didnt sounds like Nuance engine was in there, it seem more similar to the TTS technology that has been on Mac OS for a very long time. Maybe it will be licensed in time for Siri 1.0.
That's true, I only meant completly blind because the lady in the video had to search for her phone by touch. I just didn't see this as being targeted towards the completely blind because it's main form of interaction is on sight. I can see just fine and I only use the home button to figure out which end of the phone is up. I don't mean to come across as this isn't useful for the vision impared among us, just that I didn't see the iPhone as a device that fits their needs very well. Siri changes that to a big degree but I don't think this is a massive pull for blind/almost blind people. Then again, I have no experience being vision impaired, other than what I need contacts for, so I'm probably way off base.
One thing I wished they would do for me, because I work around loud aircraft as my profession, I'd like a louder phone because I can't hear this phone that well (even wearing double hearing protection). The phone is simply not loud enough for my taste. The speaker size is dictated by the formfactor, I just wish they'd manufacture louder speakers. I have about average hearing, but my phone is always at max volume. I can't hear the text message sounds when the thing is in my pocket very well. Even in a room that has conversational background level noise, showing a youtube video to someone is a pain because the speakers just don't have the power. Other phones I've seen have an abundance of sound output but mine is always at maximum to be adequate. It would be nice to have the iPhone as a much louder phone but formfactor size would suffer and I'm not sure if that would be a worthy tradeoff.
This afternoon I read the updates on the intro as they were announced. I wasn't sure what I thought. I finished my work and read that some of the so-called "experts" where "underwhelmed". I went to the Apple site and had a look for myself at the presentation first hand. At the end I was wondering what these people wanted? It is by far the most impressive phone I have seen so far and I have seen most of them. This phone is going to rock. And with the other stuff coming this month it is good to have Apple products. Here we have the most successful smartphone in the iPhone 4 and Apple takes care of the antenna problems, gives it much more power, adds great graphs, a great new camera for both still and video, and adds SIRI, which no one else has and this is underwhelming? Add to this allowing it to use the cloud and all of its features included there and people are "underwhelmed". I wonder if people take a look at the entire system when they look at this. Looks to me that the "experts" did not. I am very happy with what I saw and look forward to having one.
Apple should let people chose what their personal assistant looks like and how they speak.
Let's say that I don't like the voice in the demo, and I'd rather have a 19 year old redhead with an English accent to be my personal assistant. I should be able to input those preferences and the voice and tone will adjust accordingly to suit my needs.
Let's say that I want a hot looking African American chick, who is 25 year olds as an assistant the next day. Again, I should be able to input that data, and the voice should adapt to that, changing in accent, timbre and tone.
What if some chick wants a male assistant?
It's still in Beta, so in the future, I expect to see these options included.
Wow! You're outdoing all of your previous posts! ...and I thought your posts about women making phones while nude was bad!
Tell me, do you want your phone to talk dirty to you in that '19 year old red head' voice? I'm guessing you don't do well with girls. You're as bad as my little brother that has Lara Croft walking around naked on his computer! If you're the same age then some of your previous posts make more sense.
Interesting how the trolls never learn. The same arguments every time Apple release new iProduct and specially iPhone. Every year we hear "didn't live to the hype", "greedy Apple limiting x feature to new iPhone", "only fanboys will upgrade".. etc.
I have news for you. Saying these things will not make them come true. Maybe in your mind they are true but reality is something else.
Yep. And Apple will sell millions of them. I could probably sell quite a few tin foil hats here as well, judging by the same old conspiracy theories every year.
sorry, but I disagree. This is the key point of Siri.. not translation. If you think Siri is about TTS and STT you missed the whole reason for Siri.
Siri figures out your true intention by random text that gets passed to it. Its not about matching against pre-determined phrases. The TTS and STT part may even be licensed from Nuance. That is not the IP of interest here.
It is translation. It has to know the sentence structure of French and German to decipher what you've told it. This is pretty similar to the IBM thing they had on Jeopardy. It hears the words and their places in the sentence and then decides what you've said. It compares words to the ones before and after to it confirm what it heard and what you've meant. I'm not saying it's sole function is rigid command response but there is some of that in there. "Weather", "today", "forecast", "rain", "umbrella", "NASDAQ", "meeting", "tomorrow" "(contact name)", "(time)" are all forms of commands that it can separate, or combine, and decide context. If you can figure out what context they are in then that is a form of STT, but much more seamless and intuitive. You and I do this every day. We separate words and phrases into chunks and decide context. If I tell you I'm meeting Sally on Saturday for coffee at 9 AM, you pick out the meat of that sentence. Sally is the person, Saturday is the day, coffee is the event and 9 AM is the time I'm meeting her. This works too with words spelled incorrectly. You can decipher the word needing only the letters and they don't have to be spelled correctly. Translating this brain function into code has to be a bitch I'm sure.
Siri is far better at understanding. It’s a gifted natural language AI technology that knows the myriad of ways people express intent. Siri knows that by “book” you don’t mean a paperback novel but the action to “reserve” a table.
With clever programming it'll look at "book", "table", "Il Fornaio" find out what they are and see that is a restaurant. It'll understand that's a restaurant and you want reservations through OpenTable. Which seems to be an extremely tied in service for it to work as well as it does. This is table lookup but in an extremely fast and clever way. Another reason why I think that Siri is supported by off site servers and not the A5.
It's alot more complicated than that from what I've seen of it, and this presentation and function is amazing, but it is based in command words that can be easily recognized. Why I believe that this is restricted to the 4S is to drive sales. It was working on lesser hardware than the 4S in the form of an app and it works beautifully in the tech demo. Phil Schiller saying that it's supported by off site servers tells me that it is process intensive and the A5 isn't the only thing used to make it work. I'm not trying to down play the awesomenes that it is, but words in there can be figured out by their order and a clear instruction made from them. Wolfram Alpha does this too, and it's not in a phone. I think Siri is amazing, but there are basic fundamentals that make it work. Making it work system wide is where the A5 comes into play is what I guess. One core can chew on what was heard and the other works on getting to the information and presenting it to you.
I'm probably completely wrong though. Just my opinion of course. I sincerely hope it'll be included in iOS5 for the iPhone 4 because it looks really awesome.
It most certainly has been Apple's MO in the past:
- iPhone 3G had MMS, original iPhone did not
- iPhone 3GS had video recording built in, iPhone 3G did not
- iPhone 4 had FaceTime, iPhone 3GS did not
- iPhone 4s will now have Siri integration, iPhone 4 will not
All but the FaceTime change were software features that Apple chose to limit to the latest and greatest model as a selling feature.
The lack of FaceTime on 3GS is what almost made me buy a iPhone 4 this summer, after my contract was up, because I could really have used it during some cross-country trips.
Glad I waited for the 4S now, though...
What's even worse, the FaceTime camera was the only real hardware change in that list besides the i4 to i4S. The original iPhone and the 3G had the exact same hardware except for a 3G radio. The 3GS was a small CPU bump and the camera wasn't that much better performance-wise. It had autofocus and autoexposure but the photos weren't that much better and the video taken with Cycorder on the original iPhone was just as good as what the 3GS would capture.
I had Cycorder on my OG iPhone and it took video that was as good quality as the 3GS video except for about 5-10FPS less framerate. Quality just as good though. Cycorder was written and distributed for free by a dude (Jay Freeman/Saurik) with a pretty awesome neck beard, not an Apple engineer. Jailbreakers had MMS AND video recording running on hardware that Apple said it wasn't possible on. FaceTime I can understand from Apples point of view because it was a big hardware improvement and change, you can't make hardware out of software after all, the others were lies to sell more hardware. Which I can also see from Apples point of view but it doesn't make it any less of a dick move on their part.
DED Spin. After a lack luster Tim Cook presentation and a warmed up iPhone, DED is hoping this will be the kicker that gets people ligned up for this new phone.
I DOUBT it, just because I cant see people jabbering away in fron of other people. I see this being banned in many locations, especially if texting was already banned in a location.
I bet the iPhone 4S has the WORST sales of any iPhone so far. Everyone will hold out for the iPhone 5. 3G owners will pickup a $99 iPhone 4.
Or if you'd watch the keynote, you'd see that it works for all sorts of crap.
Another failed trolling experience. Brought to you by The Whines Foundation. And viewers like you.
I'll pass final judgement when I actually see it in my own hands, but I do agree. It worked with everything Forstall threw at it and that's extremely impressive. I can't wait to try it out.
Comments
ON my iPhone 4 i cannot listen to music on the iPod app while downloading songs from iTunes app . (the music stops every time a song finishes downloading and goes to processing. I am thinking that sure requires probably more cpu time and apple rather just sperate the siri and 3rd party apps on their own cores then actually making it to run on the 4.
Like i said I think its more of a lazy developer thing .
keep in mind from what the videos show to come up with some info you have to have apps like yelp installed. so you have the siri stuff doing its thing while bringing up the other app to do its thing. I am betting it is using the dual core more of apple being lazy then anything else.
ON my iPhone 4 i cannot listen to music on the iPod app while downloading songs from iTunes app . (the music stops every time a song finishes downloading and goes to processing. I am thinking that sure requires probably more cpu time and apple rather just sperate the siri and 3rd party apps on their own cores then actually making it to run on the 4.
Like i said I think its more of a lazy developer thing .
With playing music and downloading songs it quits because you are writing to the music storage area. That doesn't have anything to do with the A4, or the A5. It's been this way since the very first iOS device. I have a jailbroken iPhone that allows me to use the phone while it's syncing to iTunes and I can't view pictures while putting photo albums onto it. The app won't open or it says "rebuilding library, please wait." It force closes the photos/iPod apps until it's done syncing and even then you have to restart the photos\\iPos apps after it's done. That's true of any Apple app that syncs data to the phone. The photos/iPod apps do this every time you sync content to it, the icon is greyed out when you disconnect and open the multitasking drawer. That's a read/write issue and all computers do this to some extent. You can't write firmware or other critical software updates in OS X while it's running either, you have to restart and it updates it then. That's also why a non-jailbroken iPhone locks the screen while syncing. All of that behavior prevents the user from terminating the process mid-write and corrupting the data, not Apple being lazy.
I think Siri is amazing, especially if it works as smooth as the demo, but touting this as helping the blind, on a touchscreen device, is a bit much don't you think? For drivers it will help immensely since more and more states are making it illegal to physically hold your phone while driving. Helping the blind? A bit of a stretch.
Obviously not all sighted persons are not blind.
http://behindthecurtain.us/2011/10/0...-to-the-blind/
I have news for you. Saying these things will not make them come true. Maybe in your mind they are true but reality is something else.
This may have more to do about the scope of Siri context for searches services. A design assumption may have been made that the search context assumes you are always connected. This way, Siri does not need to burden itself with carefully limiting its search service scope to only local resources in case the device is offline.
It works over wifi and 3G, there's always a connection. Unless you are on AT&T of course.
There is no AI here though. It's translation.
sorry, but I disagree. AI is key technology in Siri.. Translation is not in Siri's domain.
Siri figures out your true intention from random text that gets passed to it by some external STT translation engine like Nuance or Apple STT legacy Mac OS engine.. Its not about matching against pre-determined phrases.
for your reference below:. Differentiation and complementation between TTS and SST translation (Nuance licensing) and AI interpretation of textual input (Siri) in iOS5.
http://www.xconomy.com/san-francisco...ance-in-ios-5/
to my ear in today's demo it didnt sounds like Nuance engine was in there, it seem more similar to the TTS technology that has been on Mac OS for a very long time. Maybe it will be licensed in time for Siri 1.0.
Obviously not all sighted persons and not blind.
http://behindthecurtain.us/2011/10/0...-to-the-blind/
That's true, I only meant completly blind because the lady in the video had to search for her phone by touch. I just didn't see this as being targeted towards the completely blind because it's main form of interaction is on sight. I can see just fine and I only use the home button to figure out which end of the phone is up. I don't mean to come across as this isn't useful for the vision impared among us, just that I didn't see the iPhone as a device that fits their needs very well. Siri changes that to a big degree but I don't think this is a massive pull for blind/almost blind people. Then again, I have no experience being vision impaired, other than what I need contacts for, so I'm probably way off base.
One thing I wished they would do for me, because I work around loud aircraft as my profession, I'd like a louder phone because I can't hear this phone that well (even wearing double hearing protection). The phone is simply not loud enough for my taste. The speaker size is dictated by the formfactor, I just wish they'd manufacture louder speakers. I have about average hearing, but my phone is always at max volume. I can't hear the text message sounds when the thing is in my pocket very well. Even in a room that has conversational background level noise, showing a youtube video to someone is a pain because the speakers just don't have the power. Other phones I've seen have an abundance of sound output but mine is always at maximum to be adequate. It would be nice to have the iPhone as a much louder phone but formfactor size would suffer and I'm not sure if that would be a worthy tradeoff.
Apple should let people chose what their personal assistant looks like and how they speak.
Let's say that I don't like the voice in the demo, and I'd rather have a 19 year old redhead with an English accent to be my personal assistant. I should be able to input those preferences and the voice and tone will adjust accordingly to suit my needs.
Let's say that I want a hot looking African American chick, who is 25 year olds as an assistant the next day. Again, I should be able to input that data, and the voice should adapt to that, changing in accent, timbre and tone.
What if some chick wants a male assistant?
It's still in Beta, so in the future, I expect to see these options included.
Wow! You're outdoing all of your previous posts! ...and I thought your posts about women making phones while nude was bad!
Tell me, do you want your phone to talk dirty to you in that '19 year old red head' voice? I'm guessing you don't do well with girls. You're as bad as my little brother that has Lara Croft walking around naked on his computer! If you're the same age then some of your previous posts make more sense.
Interesting how the trolls never learn. The same arguments every time Apple release new iProduct and specially iPhone. Every year we hear "didn't live to the hype", "greedy Apple limiting x feature to new iPhone", "only fanboys will upgrade".. etc.
I have news for you. Saying these things will not make them come true. Maybe in your mind they are true but reality is something else.
Yep. And Apple will sell millions of them. I could probably sell quite a few tin foil hats here as well, judging by the same old conspiracy theories every year.
sorry, but I disagree. This is the key point of Siri.. not translation. If you think Siri is about TTS and STT you missed the whole reason for Siri.
Siri figures out your true intention by random text that gets passed to it. Its not about matching against pre-determined phrases. The TTS and STT part may even be licensed from Nuance. That is not the IP of interest here.
It is translation. It has to know the sentence structure of French and German to decipher what you've told it. This is pretty similar to the IBM thing they had on Jeopardy. It hears the words and their places in the sentence and then decides what you've said. It compares words to the ones before and after to it confirm what it heard and what you've meant. I'm not saying it's sole function is rigid command response but there is some of that in there. "Weather", "today", "forecast", "rain", "umbrella", "NASDAQ", "meeting", "tomorrow" "(contact name)", "(time)" are all forms of commands that it can separate, or combine, and decide context. If you can figure out what context they are in then that is a form of STT, but much more seamless and intuitive. You and I do this every day. We separate words and phrases into chunks and decide context. If I tell you I'm meeting Sally on Saturday for coffee at 9 AM, you pick out the meat of that sentence. Sally is the person, Saturday is the day, coffee is the event and 9 AM is the time I'm meeting her. This works too with words spelled incorrectly. You can decipher the word needing only the letters and they don't have to be spelled correctly. Translating this brain function into code has to be a bitch I'm sure.
From the article you posted:
Siri is far better at understanding. It’s a gifted natural language AI technology that knows the myriad of ways people express intent. Siri knows that by “book” you don’t mean a paperback novel but the action to “reserve” a table.
With clever programming it'll look at "book", "table", "Il Fornaio" find out what they are and see that is a restaurant. It'll understand that's a restaurant and you want reservations through OpenTable. Which seems to be an extremely tied in service for it to work as well as it does. This is table lookup but in an extremely fast and clever way. Another reason why I think that Siri is supported by off site servers and not the A5.
It's alot more complicated than that from what I've seen of it, and this presentation and function is amazing, but it is based in command words that can be easily recognized. Why I believe that this is restricted to the 4S is to drive sales. It was working on lesser hardware than the 4S in the form of an app and it works beautifully in the tech demo. Phil Schiller saying that it's supported by off site servers tells me that it is process intensive and the A5 isn't the only thing used to make it work. I'm not trying to down play the awesomenes that it is, but words in there can be figured out by their order and a clear instruction made from them. Wolfram Alpha does this too, and it's not in a phone. I think Siri is amazing, but there are basic fundamentals that make it work. Making it work system wide is where the A5 comes into play is what I guess. One core can chew on what was heard and the other works on getting to the information and presenting it to you.
I'm probably completely wrong though. Just my opinion of course. I sincerely hope it'll be included in iOS5 for the iPhone 4 because it looks really awesome.
Check out the BBC video.
Looks like it works as advertised.
Yeah check out the video, the guy asked it 1 simple question.
Yeah check out the video, the guy asked it 1 simple question.
Or if you'd watch the keynote, you'd see that it works for all sorts of crap.
Another failed trolling experience. Brought to you by The Whines Foundation. And viewers like you.
It most certainly has been Apple's MO in the past:
- iPhone 3G had MMS, original iPhone did not
- iPhone 3GS had video recording built in, iPhone 3G did not
- iPhone 4 had FaceTime, iPhone 3GS did not
- iPhone 4s will now have Siri integration, iPhone 4 will not
All but the FaceTime change were software features that Apple chose to limit to the latest and greatest model as a selling feature.
The lack of FaceTime on 3GS is what almost made me buy a iPhone 4 this summer, after my contract was up, because I could really have used it during some cross-country trips.
Glad I waited for the 4S now, though...
What's even worse, the FaceTime camera was the only real hardware change in that list besides the i4 to i4S. The original iPhone and the 3G had the exact same hardware except for a 3G radio. The 3GS was a small CPU bump and the camera wasn't that much better performance-wise. It had autofocus and autoexposure but the photos weren't that much better and the video taken with Cycorder on the original iPhone was just as good as what the 3GS would capture.
I had Cycorder on my OG iPhone and it took video that was as good quality as the 3GS video except for about 5-10FPS less framerate. Quality just as good though. Cycorder was written and distributed for free by a dude (Jay Freeman/Saurik) with a pretty awesome neck beard, not an Apple engineer. Jailbreakers had MMS AND video recording running on hardware that Apple said it wasn't possible on. FaceTime I can understand from Apples point of view because it was a big hardware improvement and change, you can't make hardware out of software after all, the others were lies to sell more hardware. Which I can also see from Apples point of view but it doesn't make it any less of a dick move on their part.
I DOUBT it, just because I cant see people jabbering away in fron of other people. I see this being banned in many locations, especially if texting was already banned in a location.
I bet the iPhone 4S has the WORST sales of any iPhone so far. Everyone will hold out for the iPhone 5. 3G owners will pickup a $99 iPhone 4.
Or if you'd watch the keynote, you'd see that it works for all sorts of crap.
Another failed trolling experience. Brought to you by The Whines Foundation. And viewers like you.
I'll pass final judgement when I actually see it in my own hands, but I do agree. It worked with everything Forstall threw at it and that's extremely impressive. I can't wait to try it out.
Voice is processed off-site.
[...]
Yes. takes no processing power.
Do you think it's processed or not? Make up your mind.
just because I cant see people jabbering away in fron of other people.
You don't see many people, do you?
I see this being banned in many locations, especially if texting was already banned in a location.
I HAVE A GREAT IDEA LETS BAN TALKING THAT WILL WORK GREAT.
Everyone will hold out for the iPhone 5.
How are you alive? Now you're actively, consciously ignoring reason and logic. You should have stopped breathing a while back.
Fine, I'll change my signature.