Yeah, I'm not understanding why a proprietary 8-pin connector would be any better for iPhone users
I think that you may be asking the wrong question.
The only relevant question is what makes the most money for Apple? A new connector will cause mucho licensing fees to come rolling in. Given that, the move to a new connector which needs to be licensed makes perfect sense.
We never really knew how many pins, anyway. "19" was pulled out of the freaking air.
But at least it made sense when you removed the FW, iPod Photo, and other unused or obsolesced pins from the current line up. Unless you have some very advanced HW inside to switch pins at will, which seems like overkill, 8 just isn't cutting it.
Even iff they add USB3 support you still won't get those speeds. Even now the transfers are still bottlenecked by the NAND.
One thing I'd like to see, but don't know if it's possible, is using the TB connector for data transfer and charging. I'm still talking about the USB protocol over TB but having 2x the wattage for charging. This would be especially great for the iPad. That said, it's still only 5W with the wall unit and it does mean a hotter unit and parts that wear faster so I'm guessing that simply isn't feasible.
I wish it was a mag-safe+data connector. In other words: magnetic. Sadly.
No way! I don't want my keys or other items to start sticking to my iPhone in my pocket or bag. The whole reason for MagSafe is to protect against accidentally tripping the cord and having the machine go flying off and get damaged. I just don't see how that is an issue with a smartphone. If anything they need a reverse MagSafe for the headphone jack, but that's for another discussion.
I think that you may be asking the wrong question.
The only relevant question is what makes the most money for Apple? A new connector will cause mucho licensing fees to come rolling in. Given that, the move to a new connector which needs to be licensed makes perfect sense.
Why are 8 pins instead of 7 or 9 or 19 pins better for Apple to license? Why do the pin numbers matter at all over the design oft the connector itself?
The dock connector needs to be able to support USB data transfer in both directions (5 pins?), power (3 pins?), line-out audio (5 pins?), video-out (1 pin?) for a total of at least 14 pins?
They better darn well not try to tell us to only sync over Wi-Fi. I'll laugh in their faces.
If Apple gets everything upgraded to 802.11ac next year, we would certainly be a good step closer to being able to sync wirelessly including music and video transfer. I would still rather plug in a TB cable and have the transfer done so much faster
If Apple gets everything upgraded to 802.11ac next year, we would certainly be a good step closer to being able to sync wirelessly including music and video transfer. I would still rather plug in a TB cable and have the transfer done so much faster
That probably won't happen. Note the iPhone is still doesn't have 5GHz 802.11n. It's also lacking in the spatial streams, and probably the QAMs and channel width. Maybe 802.11ac can push it ahead but at this point I'd wager the HW simply is not ready for it. Then there is still the NAND read/write bottleneck which could make it all moot.
Because USB can't do what the Dock Connector can? How many times does this need to be said?
Could you explain what exactly, please? With wifi becoming more and more the most elegant and natural way of synching, what's left is mainly charging, and mini USB would be perfect for that, the hole size seems compatible with it.
It is mostly a legacy thing, but look at what all the pins are used for. You have line in/out for audio, and a mechanism to communicate with accessories. These accessories include things like heart rate monitors, stereos, magnetic stripe and laser scanners, etc. USB is more work to make an accessory for. Much less today than it was 10 years ago, but still more work. More work means more power consumption.
It is mostly a legacy thing, but look at what all the pins are used for. You have line in/out for audio, and a mechanism to communicate with accessories. These accessories include things like heart rate monitors, stereos, magnetic stripe and laser scanners, etc. USB is more work to make an accessory for. Much less today than it was 10 years ago, but still more work. More work means more power consumption.
Ok, but it's annoying to imagine that stuff that a minority of people use may be hindering the work they are doing in redesigning the pin.
I've thought about this a lot and I don't think it will be "the new iPhone". They had good reasons for calling the iPad 3 that way. I think this is going to be the iPhone 5.
To explain quickly, the new iPad was called like that because it looked just like an iPad 2. They couldn't call it the iPad 2S because speed wasn't the only change and they wanted people to focus on the new screen. They couldn't call it the iPad 3 because when turned off people would wonder what's the difference between the 2 and 3 (compared to the iPhone 3G/3GS or 4/4S where people assume that the change is internal thanks to the name). "The new iPad" has a lot of mystery in it, and people who assume that it just has a speed bump of the previous one are left wondering what's so new about it.
On the other hand, the next iPhone doesn't need that, and with his new form factor, will indeed be the iPhone 5, and Apple will sell lots of it.
The only relevant question is what makes the most money for Apple? A new connector will cause mucho licensing fees to come rolling in. Given that, the move to a new connector which needs to be licensed makes perfect sense.
Nonsense. It's about making the best, fastest, reliable, smallest, and versatile port there is. USB alone is simply not good enough.
Why are 8 pins instead of 7 or 9 or 19 pins better for Apple to license? Why do the pin numbers matter at all over the design oft the connector itself?
The dock connector needs to be able to support USB data transfer in both directions (5 pins?), power (3 pins?), line-out audio (5 pins?), video-out (1 pin?) for a total of at least 14 pins?
The absolute number of pins is irrelevant. The fact of a redesign is what makes money.
And line-put audio is handled by the adjacent headphone jack.
Because USB can't do what the Dock Connector can? How many times does this need to be said?
And why can't those functions be done over WiFi/BlueTooth (and 4G/3G in the case of the iPhone/iPad) instead of a connector cable? This is 2012, after all...
Especially this part: "... Palin becomes frustrated with this, insisting that he paid for an argument, and "an argument is an intellectual process, while contradiction is just the automatic gainsaying of anything the other person says.""
Just saying the equivalent of "Oh yeah?" back and forth twenty times is NOT an argument.
And why can't those functions be done over WiFi/BlueTooth (and 4G/3G in the case of the iPhone/iPad) instead of a connector cable? This is 2012, after all...
As limited as most carriers are trying to make your bandwidth for 3G/4G, do you really want to eat up your data plan for your phone to communicate w/your car?
This has nothing to do with the dock connector. I hope they are not "really" going to move the headphone jack to the bottom. It just seems more logical and useful on top. It is for me, anyway.
... Even if they add USB3 support you still won't get those speeds. Even now the transfers are still bottlenecked by the NAND. ...
Well, I'm no engineer but I meant form factor and connector shape/style not USB3 per se.
USB3 has eight or nine pins, why re-invent a new shape and connector style when they could use a USB3 plug and just use the same pins for different uses (as well as possibly using actual USB3)?
I still don't really believe this rumour at all.
Quick, someone ask Jim Dalrymple whether it's 8 or 19. :-)
And why can't those functions be done over WiFi/BlueTooth (and 4G/3G in the case of the iPhone/iPad) instead of a connector cable? This is 2012, after all...
And it's embarrassing that wireless cannot replace wired, you're right. But that's the case. It can't be replaced.
A minority of people connect their iDevices to cars, speakers, and accessories in general? Really?
I think you've lost it.
No…
No… that's not a consideration at all.
No… it says exactly what the product is.
The 6th iPhone, running iOS 6 and having 4G telephony will be "iPhone 5". Really. Really. This makes sense to you?
What do you think? That I wrote it and it doesn't make sense to me?
Saying no, no, no is hardly an argument.
And I don't see why I have to be talked to like that by a moderator. What authorizes you to say that "I lost it?". Pfff learn to do your job.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B
Yeah, I'm not understanding why a proprietary 8-pin connector would be any better for iPhone users
I think that you may be asking the wrong question.
The only relevant question is what makes the most money for Apple? A new connector will cause mucho licensing fees to come rolling in. Given that, the move to a new connector which needs to be licensed makes perfect sense.
But at least it made sense when you removed the FW, iPod Photo, and other unused or obsolesced pins from the current line up. Unless you have some very advanced HW inside to switch pins at will, which seems like overkill, 8 just isn't cutting it.
Even iff they add USB3 support you still won't get those speeds. Even now the transfers are still bottlenecked by the NAND.
One thing I'd like to see, but don't know if it's possible, is using the TB connector for data transfer and charging. I'm still talking about the USB protocol over TB but having 2x the wattage for charging. This would be especially great for the iPad. That said, it's still only 5W with the wall unit and it does mean a hotter unit and parts that wear faster so I'm guessing that simply isn't feasible.
No way! I don't want my keys or other items to start sticking to my iPhone in my pocket or bag. The whole reason for MagSafe is to protect against accidentally tripping the cord and having the machine go flying off and get damaged. I just don't see how that is an issue with a smartphone. If anything they need a reverse MagSafe for the headphone jack, but that's for another discussion.
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Unless you have some very advanced HW inside to switch pins at will, which seems like overkill, 8 just isn't cutting it.
They better darn well not try to tell us to only sync over Wi-Fi. I'll laugh in their faces.
Even now the transfers are still bottlenecked by the NAND.
So they can make faster NAND! That shouldn't even be a consideration!
Why are 8 pins instead of 7 or 9 or 19 pins better for Apple to license? Why do the pin numbers matter at all over the design oft the connector itself?
The dock connector needs to be able to support USB data transfer in both directions (5 pins?), power (3 pins?), line-out audio (5 pins?), video-out (1 pin?) for a total of at least 14 pins?
I don't see them doing that. On that same token, even when inductive charging becomes a reality they will offer both methods in their devices.
If anyone will offer it I think it' Apple. Hopefully their Anobit purchases yields results sooner rather than later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
They better darn well not try to tell us to only sync over Wi-Fi. I'll laugh in their faces.
If Apple gets everything upgraded to 802.11ac next year, we would certainly be a good step closer to being able to sync wirelessly including music and video transfer. I would still rather plug in a TB cable and have the transfer done so much faster
That probably won't happen. Note the iPhone is still doesn't have 5GHz 802.11n. It's also lacking in the spatial streams, and probably the QAMs and channel width. Maybe 802.11ac can push it ahead but at this point I'd wager the HW simply is not ready for it. Then there is still the NAND read/write bottleneck which could make it all moot.
It is mostly a legacy thing, but look at what all the pins are used for. You have line in/out for audio, and a mechanism to communicate with accessories. These accessories include things like heart rate monitors, stereos, magnetic stripe and laser scanners, etc. USB is more work to make an accessory for. Much less today than it was 10 years ago, but still more work. More work means more power consumption.
Ok, but it's annoying to imagine that stuff that a minority of people use may be hindering the work they are doing in redesigning the pin.
I've thought about this a lot and I don't think it will be "the new iPhone". They had good reasons for calling the iPad 3 that way. I think this is going to be the iPhone 5.
To explain quickly, the new iPad was called like that because it looked just like an iPad 2. They couldn't call it the iPad 2S because speed wasn't the only change and they wanted people to focus on the new screen. They couldn't call it the iPad 3 because when turned off people would wonder what's the difference between the 2 and 3 (compared to the iPhone 3G/3GS or 4/4S where people assume that the change is internal thanks to the name). "The new iPad" has a lot of mystery in it, and people who assume that it just has a speed bump of the previous one are left wondering what's so new about it.
On the other hand, the next iPhone doesn't need that, and with his new form factor, will indeed be the iPhone 5, and Apple will sell lots of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26
The only relevant question is what makes the most money for Apple? A new connector will cause mucho licensing fees to come rolling in. Given that, the move to a new connector which needs to be licensed makes perfect sense.
Nonsense. It's about making the best, fastest, reliable, smallest, and versatile port there is. USB alone is simply not good enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Why are 8 pins instead of 7 or 9 or 19 pins better for Apple to license? Why do the pin numbers matter at all over the design oft the connector itself?
The dock connector needs to be able to support USB data transfer in both directions (5 pins?), power (3 pins?), line-out audio (5 pins?), video-out (1 pin?) for a total of at least 14 pins?
The absolute number of pins is irrelevant. The fact of a redesign is what makes money.
And line-put audio is handled by the adjacent headphone jack.
Originally Posted by ClemyNX
Ok, but it's annoying to imagine that stuff that a minority of people use…
A minority of people connect their iDevices to cars, speakers, and accessories in general? Really?
I think this is going to be the iPhone 5.
I think you've lost it.
…the new iPad was called like that because it looked just like an iPad 2.
No…
They couldn't call it the iPad 3 because when turned off people would wonder what's the difference between the 2 and 3…
No… that's not a consideration at all.
"The new iPad" has a lot of mystery in it…
No… it says exactly what the product is.
On the other hand, the next iPhone doesn't need that, and with his new form factor, will indeed be the iPhone 5, and Apple will sell lots of it.
The 6th iPhone, running iOS 6 and having 4G telephony will be "iPhone 5". Really. Really. This makes sense to you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Because USB can't do what the Dock Connector can? How many times does this need to be said?
And why can't those functions be done over WiFi/BlueTooth (and 4G/3G in the case of the iPhone/iPad) instead of a connector cable? This is 2012, after all...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26
The absolute number of pins is irrelevant. The fact of a redesign is what makes money.
And line-put audio is handled by the adjacent headphone jack.
I am so tired of your idiotic comments on eery single post.
Putting you on permanent ignore in 3, 2, 1 ....
Edit:
Now if only the troll-like "Global Moderator" (:rolleyes:), would stop publishing your every remark with a "no" after it, I'd be safe from the idiocy.
You guys need to look at this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Argument_Sketch
... and really take the lesson to heart.
Especially this part: "... Palin becomes frustrated with this, insisting that he paid for an argument, and "an argument is an intellectual process, while contradiction is just the automatic gainsaying of anything the other person says.""
Just saying the equivalent of "Oh yeah?" back and forth twenty times is NOT an argument.
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B
And why can't those functions be done over WiFi/BlueTooth (and 4G/3G in the case of the iPhone/iPad) instead of a connector cable? This is 2012, after all...
As limited as most carriers are trying to make your bandwidth for 3G/4G, do you really want to eat up your data plan for your phone to communicate w/your car?
This has nothing to do with the dock connector. I hope they are not "really" going to move the headphone jack to the bottom. It just seems more logical and useful on top. It is for me, anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
... Even if they add USB3 support you still won't get those speeds. Even now the transfers are still bottlenecked by the NAND. ...
Well, I'm no engineer but I meant form factor and connector shape/style not USB3 per se.
USB3 has eight or nine pins, why re-invent a new shape and connector style when they could use a USB3 plug and just use the same pins for different uses (as well as possibly using actual USB3)?
I still don't really believe this rumour at all.
Quick, someone ask Jim Dalrymple whether it's 8 or 19. :-)
Originally Posted by John.B
And why can't those functions be done over WiFi/BlueTooth (and 4G/3G in the case of the iPhone/iPad) instead of a connector cable? This is 2012, after all...
And it's embarrassing that wireless cannot replace wired, you're right. But that's the case. It can't be replaced.
What do you think? That I wrote it and it doesn't make sense to me?
Saying no, no, no is hardly an argument.
And I don't see why I have to be talked to like that by a moderator. What authorizes you to say that "I lost it?". Pfff learn to do your job.
Originally Posted by ClemyNX
What do you think? That I wrote it and it doesn't make sense to me?
No, I'm wondering how it makes sense to you.
Saying no, no, no is hardly an argument.
Seemed fitting in response to an argument of nothing but guesses.