Just how long do you think it would take to list, much less demonstrate 275,000 iPad apps?
It would take so long, in fact, that Google would have reached "Z" in Android releases, fracturing the Android market into 26 slices on a pie chart. Which will probably happen around February 2014.
... And the market did not like the price. AAPL dropped $10 when the mini price was revealed. ...
Not to pick on you but I'm getting so tired of this comment. Everyone who thinks they know something about finance says this after every Apple event.
In fact, stock (not just Apple stock but *all* stock), generally "drops on news." The saying is "rises on rumours, drops on news." This works regardless of whether it's good news, bad news, or in-between news.
The stock will (almost) always drop right after any big announcement. It has nothing to do with "what the market thinks" about what was just announced. It happens when record sales are announced, and it happens when record losses are announced.
Unless the drop is really, really precipitous, it means precisely ... nothing.
Maybe. But Apple products are starting to have A LOT of overlap, now that they've kept:
iPhone 4S, iPod Touch (4th gen), iPad 2 (9.7"), the iPod Classic, MacBook Pro (non-Retina). I was pretty sure Apple was going to thin things out, but they're just one step removed from consumer confusion.
I think they should replace the iPod Shuffle and Nano with something like the 6th-Gen Nano (with the clip). Drop the 4th-Gen iPod Touch, Drop the Classic and offer an 128GB option on the iPod Touch. Also, drop the iPad 2. But that's my opinion.
look at the redesigned Store page on Apple website
Apple doesn't do that. If you look through their pricing history, they don't drop anything for Black Friday or Holidays. Apple only drop price when new generation of the device is available.
When is the last time they refreshed a [EDIT: major] product 6 months out? Let's face it, we are in new territory.
Besides, Apple only controls the price on its own web site. Nothing is to stop Best Buy or Walmart from dropping the iPad mini to $299 for a day to get people in the door. Except for perhaps some contract with Apple, which I bet includes exceptions for days like Black Friday.
I just think the price is such that Apple could easily drop it down to the $299 point most people were expecting without much fuss. That was my main point. The question of "when" is irrelevant, though I gave my personal opinion.
Apple doesn't do that. If you look through their pricing history, they don't drop anything for Black Friday or Holidays. Apple only drop price when new generation of the device is available.
Absolutely not true, last Black Friday, November 25th, 2011, here were the discounts:
A5 is being used in iPad that's 2 generations behind, if you really like to keep your point correct. I'm sorry, but A5 is still underwhelming no matter how you spin it.
My iPhone 4S is awesome, it has an A5.
The new iPod touch is incredible, it has an A5.
The iPad 2 has an A5... it runs just fine.
The iPad 3 has an A5X, it's beautiful.
The only device with an A6 is the iPhone 5, which just came out a month ago - and in two weeks it will also be in the newest iPad.
So all of Apple's current iOS devices, except the iPhone 5, use the A5... I'm not sure what you're basing "underwhelming" on when the fact is, they all are all great devices that run exceptionally well.
It can't be understated how wrong it is that the mini will ship with a 1024x768 display. Apple created the Retina ideal, they marketed it, they made it something people expect in their devices. Now Apple's closest competitor is absolutely blowing them away on the all important PPI measure. Forget that the iPad mini can't touch the Nexus 7, in a week Google's 10 inch Nexus tablet is going to embarrass the actually-"Retina" iPad as well. The last figure I read was 2560x1600 and >300 PPI. What makes me sad is that consumers won't the glaring omission in the iPad mini, because of the cache Apple built for itself and because most people are generally ignorant.
Ignorant? Let's try this for size. What is good with >300 ppi when you only have enlarged phone app on your tablet. Now who's ignorant?
Absolutely not true, last Black Friday, November 25th, 2011, here were the discounts:
Some examples include:
$101 off MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and iMac
$41 off iPad 2
$21 off iPod Touch
Well I am glad someone else remembered that. I wasn't going to go there because I wasn't sure but I was pretty sure I had seen deals on Apple products...especially iPod Touch.
"same exact hardware"? The mini's display area is a lot larger and for many that user experience is the differentiator. 15" television "the same" as a 32? Nope.
How about a 32" 1080p LED vs a 40" 720p cheap quality LCD. And you get to pay $33% more for the inferior screen'd one... yet it's "bigger"
Maybe. But Apple products are starting to have A LOT of overlap, now that they've kept:
iPhone 4S, iPod Touch (4th gen), iPad 2 (9.7"), the iPod Classic, MacBook Pro (non-Retina). I was pretty sure Apple was going to thin things out, but they're just one step removed from consumer confusion.
I think they should replace the iPod Shuffle and Nano with something like the 6th-Gen Nano (with the clip). Drop the 4th-Gen iPod Touch, Drop the Classic and offer an 128GB option on the iPod Touch. Also, drop the iPad 2. But that's my opinion.
I agree with you. There is definitely confusion.
BUT:
The iPhone 4 and 4S are considered an iPhone with lower specs.
The iPad 2 is considered an iPad with lower specs.
The iPod touch 4th gen is considered an iPod touch with lower specs.
The non-retina MacBook Pro's are considered MacBook Pro's with lower specs.
Fortunately, Apple's different categories and lines have very strong brand names, so it is not too hard to understand what is going on. They are keeping the lower-spec'ed devices for developing markets and customers who are less "well-off."
Not claiming the mini isn't probably a better overall device than the Nexus7 for many buyers (it better be for the much higher price), but you're selling the Nexus way short on shell quality IMHO. FWIW that "cheap plastic" weathered drop tests and water immersion better than the iPad aluminum shell. Unlike Apple's product which lost sound, the Nexus7 was pulled from the water with both audio and video still playing fine. Several drops on concrete left no more than a some slight blemishes on the Nexus7, but cracked and chipped screens on the iPad.
For everyone complaining about the pricing of $329. I am willing to bet this... Apple will sell exactly every single iPad mini that they can manage to make until the end of the year. Once supply exceeds demand, they can lower the price to $299 if necessary. $30 is not such a big deal that people will go crazy (like when the original iPhone dropped from $599 to $399), plus people have an expectation in general that prices will drop after the holidays. This way Apple gets maximum revenue from people willing to pay, with very little risk down the road should they want to drop the price a little.
Apple doesn't do that. If you look through their pricing history, they don't drop anything for Black Friday or Holidays. Apple only drop price when new generation of the device is available.
When will you chicken littles get it? SPECS DON'T MATTER.
Let me fix this for you. "When will you chicken littles get it? SPECS DON'T MATTER. Unless they are in Apple's favor. Then they are the most important thing ever and we must use them to mock everyone else."
The extra cost is for all the sand paper that is included with the iPad Mini. Because, in order to use an iPad that small you would need to sand your fingers down to 1/4 of the size. It's the truth. There have been studies.
A couple of points. Google's $199 offering 1) only comes with 8 GB, and a 1.2 MB front facing camera. Apple's device ships with 16 GB, and both a 1.2 GB front facing camera and a 5 GB rear camera. ...
Yes, but Google has already said they are going to change the memory on the Nexus from 8/16 GB to 16/32 GB for the same price. So this will come down to one camera versus two cameras.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell
... is built using aluminum not cheap plastic. The extra $140 dollars seems worth it to me for the quality Apple is offering. ...
I think the point here is that aluminium is not necessarily any better than plastic and a lot of people (me included) would rather have the $140 instead. Why is plastic always "cheap plastic" when people don't want it, but the same plastic is "precision engineered" or something similar when it *is* wanted? Is aluminium going to become "cheap aluminium" when the next better material is discovered?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell
... A retina display would be nice, but Apple is offering a more cost conscious option and people didn't mind the iPad 2 that lacked the retina display. ...
Yes, but they aren't offering a retina display and yet this still isn't really a "cost conscious option" either.
The new iPad mini is great and it's a form factor I've been waiting for since before the first iPad launched so I will be in line to buy one on the very first day. Making it seem like its' some fantastic inexpensive miracle however isn't true and isn't really helpful at all.
This is a re-working of the iPad 2 internals into a smaller form factor. It isn't anything really new and no miracles or deities were involved in it's creation. The bottom model should really have been cheaper IMO, even if they had to go for that 8GB option that everyone was horrified over yesterday.
People have it in their heads that a smaller tablet like this is roughly $200 and all the competition currently sells theirs for roughly that amount. If instead you pick this thing, by the time you leave the store and have paid the taxes and fees you will be very close to $400.
For everyone complaining about the pricing of $329. I am willing to bet this... Apple will sell exactly every single iPad mini that they can manage to make until the end of the year. Once supply exceeds demand, they can lower the price to $299 if necessary. $30 is not such a big deal that people will go crazy (like when the original iPhone dropped from $599 to $399), plus people have an expectation in general that prices will drop after the holidays. This way Apple gets maximum revenue from people willing to pay, with very little risk down the road should they want to drop the price a little.
I'm with you. I said it was weird but I didn't fuss or complain about an extra $30. I was just making an observation. I didn't expect rants over $30. I'm with you and I think that it makes pretty good business sense.
Then again, some people are loosing their minds over the fact that Apple refreshed the iPad after 6 months. So I don't know why anything surprises me anymore...
There's also nothing to indicate it's simply cheap plastic and thus automatically inferior....
and weight has nothing to do with speaker loss on the iPad, unless you can think of some tie-in. I can't.
I'm talking about this: "Several drops on concrete left no more than a some slight blemishes on the Nexus7, but cracked and chipped screens on the iPad" Cheap IS cheap. And it is inferior in many aspects, hence the cheap price.
Let me fix this for you. "When will you chicken littles get it? SPECS DON'T MATTER. Unless they are in Apple's favor. Then they are the most important thing ever and we must use them to mock everyone else."
The extra cost is for all the sand paper that is included with the iPad Mini. Because, in order to use an iPad that small you would need to sand your fingers down to 1/4 of the size. It's the truth. There have been studies.
Sandpaper is only necessary for use with 7" tablets, 8" tablets (like the iPad mini) do not have this requirement.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveH
Just how long do you think it would take to list, much less demonstrate 275,000 iPad apps?
It would take so long, in fact, that Google would have reached "Z" in Android releases, fracturing the Android market into 26 slices on a pie chart. Which will probably happen around February 2014.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasenj1
... And the market did not like the price. AAPL dropped $10 when the mini price was revealed. ...
Not to pick on you but I'm getting so tired of this comment. Everyone who thinks they know something about finance says this after every Apple event.
In fact, stock (not just Apple stock but *all* stock), generally "drops on news." The saying is "rises on rumours, drops on news." This works regardless of whether it's good news, bad news, or in-between news.
The stock will (almost) always drop right after any big announcement. It has nothing to do with "what the market thinks" about what was just announced. It happens when record sales are announced, and it happens when record losses are announced.
Unless the drop is really, really precipitous, it means precisely ... nothing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
Maybe. But Apple products are starting to have A LOT of overlap, now that they've kept:
iPhone 4S, iPod Touch (4th gen), iPad 2 (9.7"), the iPod Classic, MacBook Pro (non-Retina). I was pretty sure Apple was going to thin things out, but they're just one step removed from consumer confusion.
I think they should replace the iPod Shuffle and Nano with something like the 6th-Gen Nano (with the clip). Drop the 4th-Gen iPod Touch, Drop the Classic and offer an 128GB option on the iPod Touch. Also, drop the iPad 2. But that's my opinion.
look at the redesigned Store page on Apple website
Quote:
Originally Posted by iVlad
Apple doesn't do that. If you look through their pricing history, they don't drop anything for Black Friday or Holidays. Apple only drop price when new generation of the device is available.
When is the last time they refreshed a [EDIT: major] product 6 months out? Let's face it, we are in new territory.
Besides, Apple only controls the price on its own web site. Nothing is to stop Best Buy or Walmart from dropping the iPad mini to $299 for a day to get people in the door. Except for perhaps some contract with Apple, which I bet includes exceptions for days like Black Friday.
I just think the price is such that Apple could easily drop it down to the $299 point most people were expecting without much fuss. That was my main point. The question of "when" is irrelevant, though I gave my personal opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iVlad
Apple doesn't do that. If you look through their pricing history, they don't drop anything for Black Friday or Holidays. Apple only drop price when new generation of the device is available.
Absolutely not true, last Black Friday, November 25th, 2011, here were the discounts:
Some examples include:
$101 off MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and iMac
$41 off iPad 2
$21 off iPod Touch
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever
A5 is being used in iPad that's 2 generations behind, if you really like to keep your point correct. I'm sorry, but A5 is still underwhelming no matter how you spin it.
My iPhone 4S is awesome, it has an A5.
The new iPod touch is incredible, it has an A5.
The iPad 2 has an A5... it runs just fine.
The iPad 3 has an A5X, it's beautiful.
The only device with an A6 is the iPhone 5, which just came out a month ago - and in two weeks it will also be in the newest iPad.
So all of Apple's current iOS devices, except the iPhone 5, use the A5... I'm not sure what you're basing "underwhelming" on when the fact is, they all are all great devices that run exceptionally well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJLeuer
It can't be understated how wrong it is that the mini will ship with a 1024x768 display. Apple created the Retina ideal, they marketed it, they made it something people expect in their devices. Now Apple's closest competitor is absolutely blowing them away on the all important PPI measure. Forget that the iPad mini can't touch the Nexus 7, in a week Google's 10 inch Nexus tablet is going to embarrass the actually-"Retina" iPad as well. The last figure I read was 2560x1600 and >300 PPI. What makes me sad is that consumers won't the glaring omission in the iPad mini, because of the cache Apple built for itself and because most people are generally ignorant.
Ignorant? Let's try this for size. What is good with >300 ppi when you only have enlarged phone app on your tablet. Now who's ignorant?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacCentric
Absolutely not true, last Black Friday, November 25th, 2011, here were the discounts:
Some examples include:
$101 off MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and iMac
$41 off iPad 2
$21 off iPod Touch
Well I am glad someone else remembered that. I wasn't going to go there because I wasn't sure but I was pretty sure I had seen deals on Apple products...especially iPod Touch.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfc1138
"same exact hardware"? The mini's display area is a lot larger and for many that user experience is the differentiator. 15" television "the same" as a 32? Nope.
How about a 32" 1080p LED vs a 40" 720p cheap quality LCD. And you get to pay $33% more for the inferior screen'd one... yet it's "bigger"
That's a better argument.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
Maybe. But Apple products are starting to have A LOT of overlap, now that they've kept:
iPhone 4S, iPod Touch (4th gen), iPad 2 (9.7"), the iPod Classic, MacBook Pro (non-Retina). I was pretty sure Apple was going to thin things out, but they're just one step removed from consumer confusion.
I think they should replace the iPod Shuffle and Nano with something like the 6th-Gen Nano (with the clip). Drop the 4th-Gen iPod Touch, Drop the Classic and offer an 128GB option on the iPod Touch. Also, drop the iPad 2. But that's my opinion.
I agree with you. There is definitely confusion.
BUT:
The iPhone 4 and 4S are considered an iPhone with lower specs.
The iPad 2 is considered an iPad with lower specs.
The iPod touch 4th gen is considered an iPod touch with lower specs.
The non-retina MacBook Pro's are considered MacBook Pro's with lower specs.
Fortunately, Apple's different categories and lines have very strong brand names, so it is not too hard to understand what is going on. They are keeping the lower-spec'ed devices for developing markets and customers who are less "well-off."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
Not claiming the mini isn't probably a better overall device than the Nexus7 for many buyers (it better be for the much higher price), but you're selling the Nexus way short on shell quality IMHO. FWIW that "cheap plastic" weathered drop tests and water immersion better than the iPad aluminum shell. Unlike Apple's product which lost sound, the Nexus7 was pulled from the water with both audio and video still playing fine. Several drops on concrete left no more than a some slight blemishes on the Nexus7, but cracked and chipped screens on the iPad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKaPmrXKfO0
That doesn't tell the quality of material, only that iPad is significant heavier.
For everyone complaining about the pricing of $329. I am willing to bet this... Apple will sell exactly every single iPad mini that they can manage to make until the end of the year. Once supply exceeds demand, they can lower the price to $299 if necessary. $30 is not such a big deal that people will go crazy (like when the original iPhone dropped from $599 to $399), plus people have an expectation in general that prices will drop after the holidays. This way Apple gets maximum revenue from people willing to pay, with very little risk down the road should they want to drop the price a little.
It is comparable to the Tegra 3 the Nexus 7 is using.
Quote:
Originally Posted by matrix07
That doesn't tell the quality of material, only that iPad is significant heavier.
There's also nothing to indicate it's simply cheap plastic and thus automatically inferior....
and weight has nothing to do with speaker loss on the iPad, unless you can think of some tie-in. I can't.
http://www.apple.com/hotnews/openiphoneletter/
Quote:
Originally Posted by saintstryfe
When will you chicken littles get it? SPECS DON'T MATTER.
Let me fix this for you. "When will you chicken littles get it? SPECS DON'T MATTER. Unless they are in Apple's favor. Then they are the most important thing ever and we must use them to mock everyone else."
The extra cost is for all the sand paper that is included with the iPad Mini. Because, in order to use an iPad that small you would need to sand your fingers down to 1/4 of the size. It's the truth. There have been studies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell
A couple of points. Google's $199 offering 1) only comes with 8 GB, and a 1.2 MB front facing camera. Apple's device ships with 16 GB, and both a 1.2 GB front facing camera and a 5 GB rear camera. ...
Yes, but Google has already said they are going to change the memory on the Nexus from 8/16 GB to 16/32 GB for the same price. So this will come down to one camera versus two cameras.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell
... is built using aluminum not cheap plastic. The extra $140 dollars seems worth it to me for the quality Apple is offering. ...
I think the point here is that aluminium is not necessarily any better than plastic and a lot of people (me included) would rather have the $140 instead. Why is plastic always "cheap plastic" when people don't want it, but the same plastic is "precision engineered" or something similar when it *is* wanted? Is aluminium going to become "cheap aluminium" when the next better material is discovered?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell
... A retina display would be nice, but Apple is offering a more cost conscious option and people didn't mind the iPad 2 that lacked the retina display. ...
Yes, but they aren't offering a retina display and yet this still isn't really a "cost conscious option" either.
The new iPad mini is great and it's a form factor I've been waiting for since before the first iPad launched so I will be in line to buy one on the very first day. Making it seem like its' some fantastic inexpensive miracle however isn't true and isn't really helpful at all.
This is a re-working of the iPad 2 internals into a smaller form factor. It isn't anything really new and no miracles or deities were involved in it's creation. The bottom model should really have been cheaper IMO, even if they had to go for that 8GB option that everyone was horrified over yesterday.
People have it in their heads that a smaller tablet like this is roughly $200 and all the competition currently sells theirs for roughly that amount. If instead you pick this thing, by the time you leave the store and have paid the taxes and fees you will be very close to $400.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacCentric
For everyone complaining about the pricing of $329. I am willing to bet this... Apple will sell exactly every single iPad mini that they can manage to make until the end of the year. Once supply exceeds demand, they can lower the price to $299 if necessary. $30 is not such a big deal that people will go crazy (like when the original iPhone dropped from $599 to $399), plus people have an expectation in general that prices will drop after the holidays. This way Apple gets maximum revenue from people willing to pay, with very little risk down the road should they want to drop the price a little.
I'm with you. I said it was weird but I didn't fuss or complain about an extra $30. I was just making an observation. I didn't expect rants over $30. I'm with you and I think that it makes pretty good business sense.
Then again, some people are loosing their minds over the fact that Apple refreshed the iPad after 6 months. So I don't know why anything surprises me anymore...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
There's also nothing to indicate it's simply cheap plastic and thus automatically inferior....
and weight has nothing to do with speaker loss on the iPad, unless you can think of some tie-in. I can't.
I'm talking about this: "Several drops on concrete left no more than a some slight blemishes on the Nexus7, but cracked and chipped screens on the iPad" Cheap IS cheap. And it is inferior in many aspects, hence the cheap price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by malta
Let me fix this for you. "When will you chicken littles get it? SPECS DON'T MATTER. Unless they are in Apple's favor. Then they are the most important thing ever and we must use them to mock everyone else."
The extra cost is for all the sand paper that is included with the iPad Mini. Because, in order to use an iPad that small you would need to sand your fingers down to 1/4 of the size. It's the truth. There have been studies.
Sandpaper is only necessary for use with 7" tablets, 8" tablets (like the iPad mini) do not have this requirement.