Samsung warns of massive 60% decline in profits for Q3, cites stiff smartphone competition

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  • Reply 161 of 222
    jfc1138jfc1138 Posts: 3,090member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post





    Apple doesn't build a big phone if it weren't for the competition.



    Apple has offered variety in many of their lines so that they would eventually in their phones is rather probable. Competition or no, choice is what can grow your customer base .

  • Reply 162 of 222
    thepixeldocthepixeldoc Posts: 2,257member
    dasanman69 wrote: »
    So what's the alternative? Do you really think that it's feasible for every manufacturer to make its own OS, and ecosystem, and have the market support all of them?

    A realistic look at the numbers indicate that making your own OS will most likely result in failure, Symbian, WebOS are dead, and BB is dying.

    The difference is that Apple built its OS on top of an already thriving ecosystem, and every new device on the shoulders of a successful one. It's way too late in the game for anyone to follow that same road map to success.

    I agree and said so in a different post. There's barely room for a number 3 OS.

    Regardless... the OS is the problem, and I don't think Samsung will see any profits anytime soon in the same capacity as they once did. Apple did it right, and the only other company that might get it right some day, is Microsoft. Goggle may stick it out though until all devices are mobile, or simple internet terminals.

    Samsung has nowhere to go but down.
  • Reply 163 of 222
    brucemcbrucemc Posts: 1,541member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

     

     

    Precisely. And THIS is where the "love" for Samsung has stemmed, at least from online communities and nerds- their hatred of Apple, and jumping on whatever OEM has shown the most success against them. 

     

    Samsung's problem now, is that their entire stregy was creating short term whiz-bang- they've never had any long term vision, nor the patience of skill to executive it. Meanwhile, Apple has been making plenty of long term moves in the last few years, that did not bear fruit instantly (much to the chagrin of ADHD forum dwellers) but have no converged in a perfect storm which is very difficult to compete against. Killer specs, killer hardware, an option of screen sizes, Touch ID, Apple Pay, an insanely healthy ecosystem, high integration with OSX platform and the upcoming Apple Watch- All which increase desirability and strengthen the halo effect, and all which are impossible to compete with, if you're an OEM without full control of your platform. Now, with iOS8, through extensions they've taken away any reason that 99% of people would choose Android for the "freedom", and with larger screen sizes, 99% of the reason people might choose a phone from Samsung.

     

    There's nothing in Samsung's DNA that shows it has what it takes to recover from this. It will only get worse as the media piles on, and decides it's bored of Samsung. They literally have nothing to fight back with. They have no valuable, exclusive technologies, software, services, hardware (unless you count touchwiz, which most see as a liability). Oh, and no brand loyalty. Noone I know that has a Samsung phone particularly cares about the company or its products. It's just the shiny thing the carrier pushed on them, they saw in ads, or they liked screen size. And I will have zero pity, as Samsung has been digging this grave for a while, and is one of the most corrupt, tactless, and classless companies I've ever had the displeasure of witnessing. I hope some other OEMs can take this opportunity to excel. I have no problem with HTC, Sony, LG, etc and I wish them success in this space. 


    Well said - great post!  Right now, I am not sure what the differentiator that most other mobile phone OEMs will use against Apple, other than price.  That includes of course Samsung, but also HTC, Moto/Lenovo, LG, and the Chinese OEMs.  Price is of course a huge factor in choice & affects overall market share (see: any other industry), so I am not predicting any large movements in Apple vs. "the Android world" in total market share (though some).  And of course, there will be those invested in Android ecosystem, and those that dislike anything Apple, and they need to find a home.  It just doesn't look like the last few years, where there was at least some early adopter technology/factor that was pushed by those OEMs as a reason to get them vs. an iPhone (LTE, bigger screen, the more freedom tag-line).

     

    Differentiating primarily on price does lead to unhappy outcomes for majority of the players in that space.  Is that a short Samsung and go long Xiaomi strategy?

  • Reply 164 of 222
    thepixeldocthepixeldoc Posts: 2,257member
    I agree with your points, but I don't agree with your first point and your summary.

    My TL;DR:  <span style="line-height:1.4em;">Phones work because they are part of a synergistic system.</span>

    <span style="line-height:1.4em;">SmartPhones work  because they are part of a synergistic ecosystem.  Once you get the 'phone part' working, it's all about the integrated experience.  Support, HW capabilities, HW/SW integration, InterSW integration, and cohesive UI, and most importantly, the the physical UX.</span>


    Strange as it is, most people buy 'experience' (look at beer, car, airlines, diamond, watch, cologne).  Phones are no different.
    Apple gets this.  Few tech companies do.

    === cut here =====

    With Apple there is one primary provider of experience... Apple.
    with all other phones, there are 2 if not 3 players in providing the primary services:  The carrier (e.g. SW updates), Google, and the phone manufacturer.  <span style="line-height:1.4em;">This is worse than the WinTel environment.</span>


    <span style="line-height:1.4em;">Samsung grew up in the spec wars of technology.  More Pixels, blacker blacks, faster nets, louder </span>
    louds, 1.25JigaWatts
    As is everyone else in the Android camp.  If you buy into Android, you as a device maker are saying, 'the experience doesn't matter'
    And if that is the case, then the design doesn't matter.   Specs do.  And when specs converge/blur, then the number one spec, cost, is the differentiator.

    Thanks for adding what I would have liked to have said, but the post was lengthy to begin with. I agree fully.

    Apple STILL must work hard at getting the kinks out though. It's tough... and we're a tough bunch to please because we've had it rather good for so long. Don't want to see that change or be the cause of a public and personal perception of not "just working" as expected. I love perfectionism and the pursuit of it... regardless if it is "almost" impossible to achieve.
  • Reply 165 of 222
    thepixeldocthepixeldoc Posts: 2,257member
    cali wrote: »
    guys the iHaters are back at it!!

    Samsung's next ad?

    HairGate

    https://fortune.com/2014/10/07/hairgate-iphone-hit-by-new-social-media-storm/

    So now we have to tell people to get their heads out of their a** too before they sit on their iPhones? This is getting ridiculous! :no:
  • Reply 166 of 222
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member
    Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post

    So now we have to tell people to get their heads out of their a** too before they sit on their iPhones? This is getting ridiculous! image

     

    Just goes to show the intelligence of the people who accept money from Samsung.

  • Reply 167 of 222
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

     

    Kind of amusing to see the allegiance switching going on in the FanDroid army. Check out c|net for example. How quickly they went from “Samsung Rules!” to “Samsung Sucks!” as they search for the next iPhone killer. That’s a problem Apple doesn’t have. The FanDroid army will jump from one OEM to another based on the perception of the OEM’s ability to destroy Apple. It’s hilarious to watch. They make their buying decisions based on their hatred of Apple, not the quality of the platform they choose.


     

    aw, they haven't all given up! the Verge, certainly an AA bastion, actually manged to print this final paragraph in its quickly-buried post about Samsung's bad news:

     

    "Of course slightly slower profit growth is far from the worst problem a company can have. To a degree, the blaring Bloomberg headline is a narrative for professional investors, not a warning to consumers. Apple has been dinged in the past for the same issues — when you're booking record profits, dips like this are entirely possible. Samsung should release its final Q3 2014 financials by the end of the month."

     

    see - getting "dinged" happens to Apple too! 20% YOY revenue drop, 60% YOY profit drop = "slightly slower" - no big deal!

     

    they got their head so far up SS's butt they'll never see the light of reason.

  • Reply 168 of 222
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,924member
    dasanman69 wrote: »
    Apple doesn't build a big phone if it weren't for the competition.

    Bullshit. You know it.
  • Reply 169 of 222
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 13,002member
    jungmark wrote: »
    Bullshit. You know it.

    http://www.theverge.com/2014/4/4/5571926/apple-document-shows-concern-for-iphone-sales-decline-need-for-bigger-iPhone

    Who had what consumers wanted when it was said "consumers want what we don't have"?
  • Reply 170 of 222
    analogjackanalogjack Posts: 1,073member

    They need to release a breakthough Refridgeroaster. 

  • Reply 171 of 222
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,388member
    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post

    Bullshit. You know it.

     

    I don’t think you can say that about the 5.5”, but I agree with the rest of your sentiment.

  • Reply 172 of 222
    pokepoke Posts: 506member

    Samsung had the opportunity to make the most of its Android dominance and it blew it. It had to fork. It could've stolen Android from Google. Instead it let Google take Android back and now it's paying the price. However, it's doubtful that Android will ever find another Samsung and the platform is probably facing pronounced decline. The Android manufacturers that are gaining ground are Chinese and don't even use Google's services in their home territory. No non-Chinese manufacturer has Samsung's clout.

  • Reply 173 of 222
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 13,002member
    poke wrote: »
    Samsung had the opportunity to make the most of its Android dominance and it blew it. It had to fork. It could've stolen Android from Google. Instead it let Google take Android back and now it's paying the price. However, it's doubtful that Android will ever find another Samsung and the platform is probably facing pronounced decline. The Android manufacturers that are gaining ground are Chinese and don't even use Google's services in their home territory. No non-Chinese manufacturer has Samsung's clout.

    How would forking it have made a difference?
  • Reply 174 of 222
    analogjackanalogjack Posts: 1,073member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by cali View Post



    Samsung's next ad?



    HairGate

     

     

     

    I'm waiting for electron-microscope-gate, where a 28 nanometer crack is discovered in an iPhone case.

  • Reply 175 of 222

    They'll be fine. Lots of numbers after "5".

  • Reply 176 of 222
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post





    How would forking it have made a difference?

     

    Yeah, I don't see Samsung bringing any improvements and innovation to Android that would outpace what Google is doing. They'd have forked and fallen apart.

  • Reply 177 of 222
    tbell wrote: »
    I was in Sears the other day and saw a really nice looking GE refrigerator. Then I saw a Samsung refrigerator that looked just like the GE refrigerator. Go figure.

    Hmmm. Apart from SMEG, I think that pretty much every fridge I've seen in my life looks like every other fridge - a white metal box with a door and a handle. 8-)
  • Reply 178 of 222
    dasanman69 wrote: »
    Apple doesn't build a big phone if it weren't for the competition.

    Apple didn't have WiFi because of the competition. Or remove the floppy. Or the touch screen phone. Or the DVD. Or end removable batteries. Or 64-bit. Or ...

    What you say is true technically, but I'd imagine that watching people not buying your phones in droves because your existing tech is unavailable in a larger screen size must be annoying. It would be foolish to not take what you have already innovated and simply enlarge it. Not so much competition as simply what people were buying.

    Making a larger screen doesn't really qualify as innovation any more than making a 21" and 27" iMac.
  • Reply 179 of 222
    dasanman69dasanman69 Posts: 13,002member
    Apple didn't have WiFi because of the competition. Or remove the floppy. Or the touch screen phone. Or the DVD. Or end removable batteries. Or 64-bit. Or ...

    What you say is true technically, but I'd imagine that watching people not buying your phones in droves because your existing tech is unavailable in a larger screen size must be annoying. It would be foolish to not take what you have already innovated and simply enlarge it. Not so much competition as simply what people were buying.

    Making a larger screen doesn't really qualify as innovation any more than making a 21" and 27" iMac.

    How do we really know that people were buying bigger phones in droves? Samsung only reports shipments, not sales numbers, and the other manufacturers numbers are pitiful.
  • Reply 180 of 222
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by KiltedGreen View Post



    Making a larger screen doesn't really qualify as innovation any more than making a 21" and 27" iMac.

     

    Would you be saying that if Samsung was just now catching up to a larger iPhone? I think this forum would be bashing them for copying that too, which would be true, just as it's true now, of Apple.

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